update: working from home with a four-year-old

by Alison Green on December 21, 2022

It’s “where are you now?” month at Ask a Manager, and all December I’m running updates from people who had their letters here answered in the past.

There will be more posts than usual this week, so keep checking back throughout the day.

Remember the letter-writer who was working from home with her partner’s four-year-old? Here’s the update.

My partner and I had plans to move to a different town together because of a very insanely beneficial housing situation. I would move first to start my new job, on a Monday. The Friday before my start date, the job was yanked out from under me, and that made me reconsider my entire life.

I broke up with my boyfriend because things weren’t working out with him for several reasons. He was a really great boyfriend to me and full-time father to his daughter, and he treated both of us really, really well. We were our own little family and loved each other, but he could not get his life together because his mental health was so incredibly bad. He took care of things as they came up in the day-to-day, but bigger picture things like finding a career path, maybe going back to school (he only has a few semesters of undergrad), things of that nature, were too overwhelming for him. I know this is because he’s basically had adverse experiences for his entire life, and I think he did his best, but it became too exhausting to try to keep up with all of my big picture stuff AND all of his big picture stuff. He was very proactive about all his daughter’s big picture stuff. She never missed a medical appointment, and he would have had her in daycare if free childcare hadn’t had a year-long wait-list in the area we were at.

So I let him and his daughter keep the amazing housing opportunity (a mutual friend of ours had offered that we stay for extremely low rent, in a nice rental house he owns in a nice neighborhood with lots of kids and a playground), and I started leasing a room from my close friends who own their home. I decided to get out of the career path that I had been on, because it just wasn’t working for me. I now do something completely unrelated, and I’m a lot happier in this field, as it aligns more with what my brain can/wants to do and has far more opportunities for career growth, especially considering that I’m at the management level for a start up. My ex and I remain on good terms, but no longer speak regularly.

As for the advice offered, I can’t honestly say it was helpful, because the problem wasn’t just that the four year old kept bursting into the room. It was also that I didn’t want to do the extra work, especially after coming home from working all day. My particular job involved driving around for hours each day, and I don’t like driving, so when I would get home the last thing I wanted to do was open my laptop and do…. more work (the WFH aspect of that job came in the form of report-writing, which is also hell for an ADHD-er). This was compounded by the fact that my boss was Not Nice about me missing deadlines for said reports, and my office space in that apartment being cramped and dimly lit. So add in a kiddo bursting in constantly, and I didn’t even want to fight the distraction. Nor did I want to go to the library to do the work. Nor did I want to do it after she went to bed. And it’s like, I so much did not want to write those reports that they felt pretty impossible in a way I can’t explain. Maybe it was a discipline issue, maybe it was burnout, but I’ll just call it “that job sucked anyway and my home environment made it even worse.” Maybe I should have included all of those details in the original letter, but I wanted to be brief.

One thing that I didn’t appreciate were people in the comment section bagging on my partner and jumping to the conclusion that he was dumping his daughter on me while he just did whatever. That was definitely not the case. My ex was and is an amazing father, especially given the circumstances (he has been through more than most, and the mother is no help at all), and the reason she would do those things is because he was engaging her! It would have been easy to just stick her in front of a TV–she would have been entertained for hours like that–but we agreed that TV should really not be something she watches for hours at a time. So while they ran around playing Bad Guys or Unicorn Veterinarian or whatever else, she would burst into the office area wanting me to join in. And taking her out of the house only works if you have money for somewhere indoors (we didn’t, and you can only go to the library so many times) or if the weather permits, and we had a miserably, at times dangerously hot summer this year.

Long story short, I broke up with my boyfriend, moved to a new city with a new job and new career path, so the problem has been resolved. And, my ex wasn’t a shitty partner or father to me and his daughter as some commenters assumed. I don’t really blame anyone for the circumstances that prompted me to write the letter, they were just bad circumstances because of trauma histories, neurotypes, energy levels, and mental illnesses that didn’t mix, all living under one roof.

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  1. Lcsa99*

    As someone who has a hard time going past what’s happening right now, because right now is so overwhelming, I find this update incredibly sad. Heartbreaking.

    I am glad it worked out for you.

    1. Jean Pargetter Hardcastle*

      I also feel so sad at this. Best of luck to you, OP – I hope all three of you, wherever you end up, have much happiness and good fortune in your future.

  2. Xavier+Desmond*

    It’s a shame that so many commentors rushed to blame your partner with so little evidence.
    Anyone who thinks it’s easy to control an excitable 4 year old has never met one.

    1. GrooveBat*

      I really didn’t see “so many commenters” doing this. There were one or two questions as to where the BF was while OP was trying to work, but most were very sympathetic to the situation.

      1. Snarky McSnarkerson*

        “so many commenters” is really such a subjective measure. Let’s take the OP and Xavier at their word that the comments suggesting dad wasn’t doing his job were not helpful to this OP.

      2. Wintermute*

        clearly it was enough of us to create a negative impression in the mind of a letter writer, which should ring some alarm bells in my opinion.

      3. Rainy*

        Yeah, I went back and looked because I remember that letter and didn’t remember the “so many” comments, and there really weren’t that many? I’d imagine it was a case of LW feeling kind of defensive about it and those comments looming large as a result.

        1. Food Insecurity Is My New Screen Name*

          Wouldn’t that just mean that Xavier+Desmond, LW and you have a different idea of what “so many” means? It is subjective. That’s okay too.

        2. Ellis Bell*

          They loomed fairly large for me; the fact that OP was asking about managing her ADHD with an ADHD child around, completely escaped the vast majority of people. OP was not asking how to manage her relationship. There were comments pointing out that it wouldn’t happen if she were male, dating a female parent, asking OP to get him to downgrade chores for parenting instead of realising that an ADHD kid, at home, being fully and attentively parented is still a pretty big distraction for even a neurotypical. So many of even the very polite comments essentially boiled down to “your partner should have her out of your hair entirely. Here is a way you could broach the topic.” I don’t even think it was intended as a slam on the relationship; it’s just that people didn’t pick up on things that were really clear to me, another person with ADHD and instead concentrated on the things that would bother a neurotypical. The key phrases from OP were “low energy adult”, and “soul-sucking” which are dead giveaways that they wouldn’t be successful at the tasks even in good circumstances (or slightly sub par, like the coffee shop experiment). Yeah, the kid issue needed resolving! However, I don’t think many people realise that without accessible childcare loads of similar problems will just go unsolved. Sometimes that’s just it. Especially for special needs families.

          1. allathian*

            Yes, this. The LW says she has ADHD, and given the father’s inability to get his own life together, except where his daughter is concerned, strongly suggests that he isn’t exactly NT either, especially given that the daughter has ADHD.

            Quite frankly the whole situation was a recipe for disaster. Kudos to the LW and her ex for handling it all so gracefully.

    2. Mme. Briet’s Antelope*

      In fairness to the commentariat, the only information OP provided was that the child kept barging in and – in the comments – that her partner was also doing chores at the time and was unable to watch the kid while he was doing that. “Where is your partner in all this?” is a pretty reasonable question to have, that’s all most people were asking, and the few people who jumped to assuming he was a bad partner got told they were out of line for it.

      1. ecnaseener*

        Yep. I’m very sympathetic to how upsetting it can be to have internet strangers question/criticize your loved ones just because you didn’t think to specify that said loved ones weren’t the problem. It’s impossible to anticipate all possible questions without making the letter a mile long.

        But commenters aren’t doing anything wrong by asking those questions or even by making wrong guesses. It was a very reasonable guess from the info in the letter, it’s not an insult to LW’s partner specifically – he’s a stranger we’re told nothing about.

        There are absolutely times I think the commenters here get unkind, this wasn’t one of them by a long shot.

        1. tamarack etc.*

          I’m about two notches towards the OP from your position. Whenever an OP leaves out important background information, the commenters are bound to explore the options. And we’ve had a lot of cases where the actual proper answer to an OP’s problem went counter to the OP’s original framing of the issue. As in “you don’t have a coworker problem, you have a manager problem” or “you don’t have an in-law problem, you have a husband problem”.

          This said, it’s also good to a) be aware of from what point on we’re conjecturing, and adding some wiggle room to our opinions (ie, putting in hedges, openly marking where we might be wrong etc.) and b) be respectful of what the OP actually asked. Not being unkind is not good enough IMHO.

          (Keeping the outcome in mind, the relationship did indeed not survive, even though probably the precipitating cause was not the one in the letter.)

    3. Zombeyonce*

      I don’t know, OP’s added evidence makes it sound like her ex really wasn’t setting boundaries. I have 2 very excitable children (3 and 6) and they both are almost certainly ADHDers like me. When I work from home and my partner engages with them, we’ve all set the boundary that they aren’t supposed to come into my office when the door is closed. Every once in a while they’ll forget and still come in, but they’re quickly reminded of the boundary and redirected. A 4-year-old is capable of learning boundaries and using ADHD as an excuse for not learning them isn’t going to do them any good in the long run.

      1. Pugetkayak*

        Yeah, you can’t let the kid barge in when the other person is working, and she shouldn’t have to be the one to put a stop to it. Under no circumstances can you disturb the OP when she is trying to work – thats it. And maybe a door lock would have been good.

        1. rebelwithmouseyhair*

          Yes.
          I would see this update as a win. OK we commenters didn’t put our collective finger on the crux of the matter, but, starting with “no that’s not the problem” in reaction to what we said, OP did finally work out what the problem was (that she hated the work she had to do at home), and is in a better place now.

      2. Michael*

        A 4yo is in theory but I know that my 5yo still does it—when the desire for either dad is strong it is really hard to redirect her. And when you really don’t want to be doing the work each time is really disruptive.

        Each kid is different, each parent is different (hell, each house is different! In our current small apt all the rooms are close to each other and kid noise is always audible). Let’s not play the parent blame game. There’s a way to talk about teaching kids to not do X without forgetting that sometimes what ought to be possible just doesn’t work.

    4. Meep*

      I find that for every form of valid criticism someone gets on the internet it gets played up to being 4-5 people with insidious intent. So I am sure she thought it was a lot of commenters criticizing her boyfriend when it was a handful.

      1. Avril Ludgateaux*

        I see it the same way, but from a different angle. When 90% of people are saying one (positive) thing, it can blend together, as if it’s all one borg. Critical comments – even ones written diplomatically or politely – disrupt that uniformity, like a chip in the paint of a brand new car. It doesn’t matter that the rest of the car is pristine. You’re going to hyperfocus on that chip precisely because it stands out. Even if there are 400 comments giving you support and only 4 to 5 comments with any tinge of judgment, those 400 are emotionally perceived as “one” while the 4 to 5 are perceived as, well, 4 to 5.

        The LW also mentions several times that she has diagnosed ADHD and it’s observed that people with ADHD can be extra sensitive to criticism, as well. (reference: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8856522/) Not trying to armchair diagnose, just trying to share some perhaps lesser-known info about a pretty common form of neurodivergence!

        1. ferrina*

          I don’t think that quite applies here.
          Yes, the ADHD experience with criticism is usually different than the neurotypical experience. In general, and ADHD child will have a lot more criticism directed at them than a neurotypical child (by age 10, about 20k more critical messages than their neurotypical peers). And that means that they are primed to have an extra bad experience with criticism. But I’d argue that’s normal for anyone who has been subjected to high amounts of criticism- just look at all the AAM letter writers who have to deal with the psychic aftermath of a hypercritical boss.

          There are a lot of different reaction for ADHDers to have to criticisms, and a lot of different coping strategies that people use. Generally, these tend to activate when the criticism is directed at the individual, not the individual’s partner.

          tldr; don’t blame the ADHD for one person’s reaction.

        2. Meep*

          I can agree with the first part, but I agree with ferrina for the second half. I think anyone, whether someone with ADHD or not is going to be sensitive to criticism and feel like it is bigger than it is.

    5. WellThatsTheThingJanet*

      I admit that’s how I thought of it, at first – partner needs to get it together and then I read the follow-up and OPs words jumped out at me more.
      “I didn’t want.”
      “I don’t like driving.”
      “The last thing I wanted to do.”
      “I didn’t even want to fight the distraction.”
      “Nor did I want to go to the library”
      “Or after she went to bed.”
      “did not want to write those reports.”

      and now I can’t really blame the partner at all.

      1. Meep*

        I am glad I wasn’t the only one thinking it… Partner may be a mess, but it sounds like OP doesn’t want to do anything to improve her situation. (Including ignoring all of the advice)

        1. WellThatsTheThingJanet*

          Yeah, I truly didn’t/don’t want to be mean and I’m glad OP and partner are in better places and on good terms, but in a case of “I won’t” I have tried to make that horse drink to no avail…with “I can’t” we were able to get to the “why not” and make some adjustments that ended well for everyone.

        2. Just me*

          In fairness, it seems like OP has since done a lot to improve her situation: got a job better suited to her strengths, ended a relationship that wasn’t working, found a new home.

          I don’t know whether OP felt this way, but for me, sometimes I find myself in a situation where I can’t work up the energy to make things marginally better. If there’s a way to try make things *much* better, though, I can push myself to do it even if it takes more effort than a marginal improvement would take.

      2. Your Local Password Resetter*

        That mostly sounded like she was really done with that job and situation to me. Not that she just didn’t want to do anything to improve things.

      3. Tiger Snake*

        The thought I had through the OP’s post is that this family is set up to be the old ’70s dynamic – one stay-at-home parent, one who works and makes the money – but that the OP wasn’t interesting in taking on the rest of the burden that comes from being that traditional sort of ‘patriach’. And that is fair enough. There’s a lot of reasons that’s not what families look like anymore.

        But the limited view of their lives the OP gave us was one where there was a lot she wanted and expected partner to start doing, but not a lot she was willing to compromise on and nothing she wanted to take on herself. It makes me wonder if that the fact 2/3 have ADHD and the third has demons of their own was actually distracting from the real issue to focus on, in a ‘can’t see the forest for the trees’ scenario.

      5. Ellis Bell*

        I’m really proud of the OP of identifying this and vocalising this to themselves more firmly. A huge part of managing your ADHD successfully lies in quickly identifying the conditions which turn off your energy, and quitting those conditions for a better option without trying to talk yourself into being neurotypical, or into just getting on with it. The great upside to ADHD is you will have tonnes more energy than anyone else in the correct conditions. Yet the lure to be neurotypical is strong! That’s why the interruptions from the kid had such a strong allure. Anyone would be distracted by that, so you get to tell yourself it’s an understandable distraction and to feel like everyone else for a while.

  3. fnordpress*

    As someone else with ADHD, I know how you feel. I’m autistic as well and if I get interrupted, it sometimes takes me 20 or 30 minutes to return to the task I was working on. And if you’ve been fighting with your own brain all morning trying to start the drudge-paperwork, the sudden interruption (and a fun interruption, it sounds like) would make me feel incapable of tackling the work at all.

    I wish you all the best, OP. I’m glad your new job is treating you better!

  4. Alpacas Are Not Dairy Animals*

    I actually find this update very uplifting. Two adults were able to part ways without either one being the bad guy, both are in a slightly better though still imperfect place, the kid still has a good housing situation and a loving parent.

    2. Where’s the Orchestra?*

      Agreed. It doesn’t sound like anybody was bad here – just a pair of adults doing the best they could in a situation at the time that wasn’t great.

      Glad it sounds like you are both in better situations now.

      1. The Eye of Argon*

        Yep, people can have family issues without anyone being the villain. Partnerships can split up just because people aren’t right for each other without someone being abusive, neglectful, or otherwise bad.

        OP and their ex also provided a good example for the daughter of how two mature caring adults solve a very difficult situation by considering what’s best for everyone and making sacrifices when necessary, while remaining on good terms throughout.

        As much as I like the comment section here, there is a tendency to make up details instead of just sticking to what’s actually in the letter.

    3. Properlike*

      +1

      There is a level of mature self-reflection that would put Alison out of business if everyone had it. I’m happy for you, OP!

    5. Slow Gin Lizz*

      Agreed! And I’m especially happy that OP found a better career path for her. I had a soul-draining job once that I was absolutely miserable doing and quitting it made me so much happier it was unbelievable. And once you get rid of one bad thing in your life it’s, IME, easier to see what other things aren’t working for you and adjust accordingly. Stinks that OP’s original job offer fell through at the last minute but it sounds like things still worked out well.

    7. All Het Up About It*

      Agree!

      And OP sounds pretty self-aware and externally aware of people’s emotions and circumstances.

      I so much did not want to write those reports that they felt pretty impossible in a way I can’t explain. Maybe it was a discipline issue, maybe it was burnout, but I’ll just call it “that job sucked anyway and my home environment made it even worse.”
      This hit me hard because I feel like there are so many times where I just don’t want to do something and I can’t tell you why, and it’s probably not that hard, but I DON’T. I’m curious how many times there is something underlying like the OP here, where they didn’t want to do it, because they hated their job, and the home situation made it more obvious/worse, but it came out in a different way.

      Anyway – I actually say kudos to the OP for handling tough life situations with grace, kindness and honesty. Not every update is a perfect unicorn of an update, but this one still feels positive to me, because sometimes things in life just don’t work out perfectly, but they can still work out okay.

    8. inko*

      I thought this too – just a nice letter about two good people finding some stuff difficult and handling it with kindness.

    9. Jean (just Jean)*

      +1 more! Life has imperfect situations. Sometimes the best we can do is an imperfect solution. If this is imperfect it’s a pretty happy example.

  5. Delta Delta*

    “As for the advice offered, I can’t honestly say it was helpful, because the problem wasn’t just that the four year old kept bursting into the room. It was also that I didn’t want to do the extra work, especially after coming home from working all day.”

    I suspect the advice might have been helpful but in ways you don’t expect. The letter was about the child doing child things (which, nobody can blame her for that) and being disruptive. The fact of writing the letter and seeing the responses likely helped you to realize the problem was different than you initially thought, and there’s some value to that.

    1. Siege*

      This sounds like it was definitely not the Iranian yogurt that was the issue here. I think it’s always useful when asking the wrong question gives us the opportunity to figure out what the right question is.

    2. Where’s the Orchestra?*

      This really is true. Sometimes just clearly stating what you think is the problem can help you find different ways of looking at things and help you find the best solution for you – even if it’s different than what we or Alison suggest.

      1. Rainy*

        I do a workshop on decision-making, and the first thing we do is break down the decision and ask “what’s the real question here” because a lot of times the question they think they’re asking and the question they’re really asking are, not completely different, but different enough that all the information the person is gathering that isn’t helping them decide isn’t helping them decide because it’s the wrong information.

        I absolutely LOVE the light bulbs on that one :)

    3. Annie E. Mouse*

      This is exactly it. It sounds like OP was uninterested or burnt out with the work and was scapegoating distractions as the problem, when the kid wasn’t really the issue at all.

      It does seem like OP is a little defensive about advice not being helpful or asking where the partner was, but no one can respond to a problem that isn’t in the letter.

      1. rebelwithmouseyhair*

        I agree entirely. We could only go on what she said, but then when we came up with suggestions she realised they’re weren’t helpful, but that was because she hadn’t focussed on the actual problems, not because our suggestions were stoopid.

  6. Hlao-roo*

    OP, thanks for the update! I’m glad to hear that (on the work side of things), you were able to identify that your previous job wasn’t a good fit for you and switch to a different career path!

    Also glad to hear that your x-partner is a good person and a great father, even if things didn’t work out between the two of you.

  7. Hills to Die on*

    Sometimes everything just happens at once. I hope it all goes well for all of you. You seem like good people.

  8. Jenna Webster*

    I think you have made some really good choices to get your life on solid ground and have a job and a life that works for you. Sometimes even the people we really love aren’t the ones we’re meant to live with, and I think it’s good that you realized it and that you could stay on good terms with each other as you separated. I’m always so impressed by people who realize they’re not in a situation that works for them and then they fix it!! That is hard work that comes along with all sorts of mixed feelings. I’m so glad to hear you are building a life that can be a good and happy one.

  9. NYC Taxi*

    Glad you found a job that’s a better fit since you don’t like driving or writing which were crucial components to the job. But your boss expecting you to meet deadlines is not unreasonable. That’s generally how jobs work. Hope your ex-boyfriend now has the space to work on strategies to get to a better place.

    1. desdemona*

      She didn’t say it was unreasonable, just that her boss wasn’t nice about it. That could be anything from someone who’s just inflexible to someone who screams and yells.

      1. gmg22*

        Yes, this. I read capital-letter “Not Nice” as basically meaning the boss either yelling or being a passive-aggressive jerk about it, as opposed to straightforwardly discussing the problem with the person he’s supposed to be managing. A good boss might say, firmly but cordially: “OK, I can see you’re struggling to meet these deadlines. What’s going on with that and what can we do to address it?” Tbh, that discussion would as likely as not ended a similar way because of the job being a poor fit, with the LW being let go or a mutual decision for her to leave, but at least it would have been handled with active and thoughtful management.

    2. Just Your Everyday Crone*

      Some deadlines are deadlines and some deadlines are preferences. Not being flexible about the latter during covid may very well have been unreasonable.

  10. RO*

    Glad to hear this situation is better for all involved. But I have to say, I don’t think your ex was respectful of your need to work. You keep defending his parenting skills, but this is different from saying he’s a bad parent (sounds like he’s a great parent!).

    Fact is, he still allowed his daughter to constantly interrupt you, when you were really struggling with the job. That’s not being a good partner to you. I’m glad you moved on and everyone is doing well.

    1. Generic Name*

      I agree. It’s not a bad thing that you still think well of your ex, but I see a lot of contradictions in what you say. It doesn’t really matter in the end because you were able to end things amicably, and you sound like you’re in a much better place. Being a step parent is so hard. It sounded like it was an impossible situation on so many levels.

    3. Yangtze River*

      I picked up on that, too. To be fair, It can be a struggle to really get a kid to understand why another adult isn’t joining in to the playtime. but to also be realistic, moms have been keeping kids away from the working dad for decades now! And if the gender bothers you, stay at home parents have been keeping kids away from the working parent for decades now. So, there’s a lot to balance, but I, too, wonder whether the partner was directing enough effort into some do not disturb hours for the LW.

    4. tessa*

      “I don’t think your ex was respectful of your need to work…Fact is, he still allowed…”
      —

      Possibly because he thought differently about what disruptions look like, and didn’t recognize the signs most other people would.

      I think it’s a bit disingenuous to the OP to insist that the commenters were right about boyfriend. This isn’t a contest.

    5. I should really pick a name*

      I think if the LW was okay with his behaviour, then there’s no problem here.

      The LW basically said that they kind of appreciated the interruptions. I suspect if they’d pushed back on it, their partner would have listened.

      1. allathian*

        Yes, this! I’m as NT as they come, but when I was in a job I really didn’t like, I used every excuse in the book to procrastinate, until the stress of nearly missing a deadline forced me to complete whatever it was. I rushed, and the quality wasn’t anywhere as good as what I know I’m capable of producing when I actually mostly enjoy my job and don’t feel the need to procrastinate. I don’t think I would’ve pushed back on a partner’s kid’s distractions too hard, either, if I hated my job.

        I wouldn’t want to attempt to WFH with a preschooler at home, even if they were NT.

        LW, I’m glad you came back with such a great update, and I’m sorry if I contributed to the “bad partner” talk.

      2. Ellis Bell*

        Thank you. Some people really are not seeing this and the OP was upfront about the battle within from the very first letter.

    6. Where’s the Orchestra?*

      This is very true. He was a pretty good parent (and still is it sounds like), but he was falling down a bit in the respect for others department. Keeping the interruptions to a minimum while OP was working is a great way to teach his daughter about respecting others, and to teach her how other people have different needs at different times as well.

      1. Olivia*

        This is exactly it. Alison hit the nail on the head when she said “This plan only works if he’s 100% committed to protecting your space while you’re working.” The OP is describing a partner who does not appear very committed to that. Just because he’s okay with himself being interrupted doesn’t mean it’s okay to interrupt someone else. The fact that this was often happening while he was playing with her, as opposed to while he was trying to work too, makes it worse, because it means he was available to tamp it down, but he simply didn’t. People set boundaries with kids all the time, and he surely knew that his kid was being very disruptive, but he chose not to set those boundaries and enforce them. It’s hard to read this in any light that doesn’t include the ex not respecting the OP’s need to work as much as he should have. Some interruptions are bound to happen when there is a small child in the house, but OP said they couldn’t go five minutes without an interruption “or three”. And none of this is saying that he’s a bad dad. He sounds like a great dad, but also like someone who didn’t respect his partner’s work/needs as much as he should have. It’s not attacking him or being mean to say that he was falling short in that area.

        1. allathian*

          True, but if the LW also sort of welcomed the distractions, so I’m not sure how hard they pushed back on it…

  11. Casey*

    “I so much did not want to write those reports that they felt pretty impossible in a way I can’t explain.”
    Oof, as a fellow person with ADHD, I find this so relatable. I’m glad you found something that works better for you! And I’m glad you were able to resolve things. Thanks for the update!

    1. Slow Gin Lizz*

      I do not have ADHD (or maybe I do?) but there are definitely things that have felt absolutely impossible to me in ways I can’t explain also. Good for you for realizing that wasn’t the best position for you, OP.

    2. Rainy*

      Yup. If it helps, LW, I think this is more common than you probably think it is–I’ve definitely experienced it as well. And for me, anyway, even though my ADHD coping mechanisms are very good, the time when they fall down is when I’m under stress, so it makes sense that if you dread paperwork AND are under a lot of stress from living situation and its built-in distractions, those coping mechanisms that would ordinarily help you manage this despised task instead broke under the strain of everything else.

    3. Cendol*

      I have ADHD and work reports are the bane of my existence. I am procrastinating on a report right now! Reading OP’s update gave me a little bit of a lightbulb moment…

    4. gmg22*

      Yep. Just diagnosed a month ago, trying to find a treatment plan that works, and this just resonated so much. I have been aware for some time now the degree to which my job is not the best fit for my work style, but I’m stumped about what to do next (in no small part because I don’t want to move, but I live in a small state where most of the jobs my resume would qualify me for feel too similar to the one I have now). LW’s outcome is inspiring!

      1. Rainy*

        I was diagnosed in October, and I am 47, AMA. ;) We’re finding a med dose that works for me, and when we hit that, I’m going to get a referral to an ADHD coach so I can have a few sessions figuring out what’s behavioural so I can put some systems and coping mechanisms in place. :)

        Congrats on your diagnosis and treatment! It has been AMAZING for me.

        1. Sloanicota*

          I’ll take you up on that! Do the meds just – allow you to Do the Thing? Is that feeling of dread-guilt-shame just – gone? And now you can simply sit down and do it? I have wondered if I might have inattentive type and most of the behavioral interventions don’t seem to help me because it seems to be a motivation/stick-to-it type problem.

          1. Rainy*

            YES! :) The effect of the meds was pretty well instant. When I was still on the ramping up dose, one afternoon I needed to be extra productive at work to square everything away for a weekend away, and I just sat down and did it all. No sitting there trying to make my brain feel enough urgency to make the chemicals–the chemicals were *already there*. It really just interrupts that whole shame spiral. Also, at the right dose, *my head got quiet*. No more zillions of thoughts pingponging around at 80 mph, just quiet and ability to say “Self, time to Do The Thing” and then just do it.

              1. Rainy*

                It has really helped with a lot of stuff that I didn’t realize wasn’t the normative human experience, and has reduced a lot of the unseen effort and struggle for me.

            2. socks*

              Yes! This is exactly my experience with ADHD meds. I actually hadn’t realized how loud it was inside my head until I got the right dose and it quieted things down.

              1. Rainy*

                Yeah–my husband is on a higher dose than me and he mentioned the quiet head thing early on, but I just wasn’t getting it, and then we increased my dose a bit and all of a sudden it just happened.

            3. kitryan*

              I’m also in my 40s and was recently screened – I haven’t gotten results yet and I’m a bit desperate to see if meds will do this. Work is currently a nightmare and one of the things that I have a terrible time with are taxes, which is going to be a thing in 2 months or so.
              I just need everything to be less overwhelming so I can breath for a minute and stop guilting myself in order to get anything done. What everyone’s said about just being able to *do* things is exactly everything I want.
              The therapist I started seeing as part of the whole thing is pushing talk therapy/coaching a bit, which I’m not opposed to, but I already have so many coping strategies from 40 years of working on my stuff, they’re just maxed out now.

              1. Rainy*

                I’m lucky because I see a specialist who is also ADHD and medicated and so the order she typically tackles things in is: medication, dial in dose, now we can see what’s behavioural rather than chemical, refer to an ADHD coach for the behavioural stuff. She’s made some suggestions around talk therapy for other stuff, but her priority is getting the ADHD managed, because unmanaged ADHD can have a lot of knock-on effects, and you could literally waste your life trying to ameliorate symptoms when addressing the ADHD might knock out a bunch of that stuff at once.

                1. kitryan*

                  Thanks- I’ll be noting this as possible talking points for next appointment. It’s a good validation of what I’d been thinking – that knowing one way or another if meds could help at all would be a huge relief. If they did help, it’d be an absolute lifeline when i really need it and if they don’t (simplifying things here I know, as there’s different meds/dosages), at least I would be able to let go of the possibility of a single factor ‘fix’ to address a constellation of things of this and focus on behavior and outlook stuff.

                2. Rainy*

                  I started on the lowest dose and stayed there for six weeks. When I went for my monthly appointment, I said “I think maybe we need to increase, because the magic is gone”, and she immediately knew what I meant. We talked about whether that might be behavioural stuff that I could ameliorate by better coping strategies, but ultimately I didn’t think it was because the wall was back, so we stepped up. I’m still taking a pretty light dose, but not only did the higher dose bring the magic back, but my head is quiet now, and that’s definitely worth it.

                  Some people get physical side effects like sweatiness, racing heart, etc, but that hasn’t happened to me–my husband gets it sometimes but he’s on a higher dose.

                  Another thing the meds interrupt is that thing where your brain resurrects a memory of a time you did something stupid from decades ago or last week and flings it at you in full sensurround so you can once again enjoy the feeling of being a dumbass with absolutely no way to change it and no possible reaction other than shame and dismay. That occasionally happens to me in the early morning before my AM meds now, but pretty much not otherwise.

          2. My Cabbages!*

            I will warn that it is possible to be medication-resistant (shake my tiny fist). For me, it does help with Doing The Thing but there is still a lot of resistance. However, I find it *really* helps keep my emotional volatility in check, which is huge for me, personally.

        2. Avery*

          I was diagnosed with ADHD back in elementary school, I’m 30 now, and I’ll gladly join in this pseudo-AMA to provide my own perspective! While it’s certainly helpful to get the perspective of someone newly diagnosed, I figure potential and/or diagnosed ADHD-ers may want to hear from somebody who’s had the diagnosis and been handling it as such for decades on end as well!
          Though as an aside, while I’m a firm believer in better living through medication as a general principle, my experiences with ADHD medication have been hit or miss, and mostly miss. I know some people have miraculous experiences with them, but I’m not one of those people.

          1. gmg22*

            My very recent experience with meds has been similar — instead of giving me improved focus, the medication we tried just zoned me out (with a side of increasingly jittery anxiety). It was more than a little disappointing. I have mildly elevated blood pressure, so the next option on the list comes with risks I’m not sure I’m up for. This is likely to mean a treatment plan that doesn’t involve meds, and while I’m cautiously optimistic about making a plan like that, it has to work around my job — which presents challenges similar to that experienced by our LW!

            1. Avery*

              Yep, I’ve tried a couple which just led to increased anxiety myself. I’m on one that’s theoretically for a different problem I have (sleep disorder), but might be helping with the ADHD as well… but it’s hard to tell, especially because the sleep problem itself doesn’t help my focus any. Coping techniques and therapy are definitely helpful as well!

        3. LawBee*

          I’m pushing 50 and we’re looking at it for me. It would explain SO MUCH about my EVERYTHING.

          It’s fun being a GenX woman who was growing up when only boys could possibly have ADD. (See also: boys have dyslexia which explains their reading problems, but “girls are bad at math”. No, maybe they have dyscalculia.)

          1. ferrina*

            Yep, when I was growing up only boys had ADHD. And you had to be struggling in school. I was a) a girl and b) scoring ridiculously high on standardized tests, so ADHD wasn’t on the radar. Never mind that my mom constantly described me as “absent minded professor”, or that on any given day, I was guaranteed to forget my lunch/homework/textbook/shoes. It was the curse of “potential” and “if you just decided to do it, you’d be fine” because no one understood that hyperfocus was also an attribute of ADHD (ever been so focused on something that you’re a little scared you can’t pull yourself away? yeah….)

            It wasn’t until I self-diagnosed in grad school that I finally understood why I was so “weird”.

            I recommend Driven to Distraction by Edward Hallowell or watching the How To ADHD YouTube channel- they both have great info on it.

            1. Avery*

              If it helps, being diagnosed early doesn’t always help with that.
              I was diagnosed in elementary school, but since I got great grades, not much was done except first putting me on one ADHD med, which just made me fidget more and killed my appetite to the point where I honestly wonder if my growth was stunted because of it, then years later switching me to another med, which made my already-high heart rate even higher. Neither one did anything to help the ADHD, either.
              And the curse of “potential” and “if you can focus so much on X, why not Y?” haunted me throughout childhood as well, even though my parents and other adults really should have known better. I’m still working through some of that…

              1. Rainy*

                I’ve known more than one person who was diagnosed in childhood and whose parents just…didn’t do anything, so when they get a diagnosis as adults, their parents will say “oh yeah, they told me you had that when you were 8, but I figured, whatever, you’d get a handle on it, you’re smart, and see, you turned out just fine”.

            2. MM*

              Ah, you and I are the same. I’d finish a standardized test early, spend the rest of the time reading, and score off the charts, but I also more than once was kept after school in something sort of like detention just to force me into finishing assignments. My mom even tried to ask my teachers if I might have ADHD (this was the 90s), and they all waved her off.

              1. ferrina*

                Yep, exactly. I was either ridiculously high achieving, or non-functional. If a class’s grade was based on tests, I would get an A. If it was based on homework, I would get a C. Didn’t matter how tough the class was (I was reading college textbooks by middle school).
                In 6th grade I spent a couple months in Saturday school because I kept forgetting to do my homework. They thought if I just spent all my Saturday mornings at school, I’d do my homework. Nope. I’d just spend my Saturday morning with my teacher, then spend the afternoon working my job (yes, I had a job when I was in 6th grade. The fact that I could do that but not my homework baffled a lot of people). My mom assumed it was a discipline problem and that I was deliberately not doing homework because I already knew the things I was supposed to be practicing, ergo homework wasn’t a good use of my time. (okay, it wasn’t a good use of my time, but it also wasn’t deliberate)

              2. Rainy*

                When I was moved from a private Montessori school to public school, that first year I was sent to the school counsellor to have my hearing screened SIX TIMES, because my teachers were mad that if they said my name I didn’t always respond. I wonder what I was hyperfocusing on at the time :)

          2. My Cabbages!*

            Also a GenX woman, mid40s, diagnosed at 38. I look back and it explains almost everything I thought was “wrong” with me. Hell, when I was a *baby* they thought I might have epilepsy because I would stare off into space at nothing for long periods of time… I wonder what I was hyperfocusing on back then.

          3. Sloanicota*

            I still invert and substitute numbers every day of my life. It was a running joke how often I did it as a child, as well as putting several letters “cutely” backwards. I have asked my folks a few times did they ever consider getting me evaluated for dyscalculia … they laugh and say of course not, I can read just fine. LOL.

            1. Rainy*

              My sister is dyslexic enough that it took her a really long time to learn to read properly, and my parents said frequently that she was just seeking attention by being different and refusing to read. I’m fairly dyslexic as well, but in a different way (the preserved bits of my childhood writing are absolutely rife with cursive letters confidently drawn mirror-image, and I can read and write backwards or upside-down as easily as forwards or right-side-up), and I sometimes think that because I “self-corrected” eventually they assumed she would too, but her dyslexia presents very differently and was a significant bar to reading confidence and speed.

        4. Spooky All Year*

          I got diagnosed in college when pandemic completely killed my coping mechanisms, and then started medication when I graduated and started working. I’m so glad the meds for me mostly wipe out that block. I told my psych it was like everyone around me was doing sit-ups and I would try, but they were just so much harder for me than everyone else. I could do some, but it took much more effort and everyone just thought I was being lazy. Then meds walked over and picked up the invisible weight from my chest, and whaddaya know, sit-ups are a lot easier now!

    5. Yangtze River*

      I don’t even have ADHD, but when I had a job that involved driving around and then coming home to write reports, it was like a Sisyphean task to get those reports out. I only got paid if I submitted the report on time, so motivation was very very high! But oh God, there were times when not getting paid almost seemed like the better option to writing the report.

      1. Sloanicota*

        I truly wonder if, as a society, there is some way to free ourselves from the burden of useless paperwork. I spent so much of my career basically being the human interface between spreadsheets, emails, and databases. I hated it. Every day I thought, “couldn’t there be an app for this?? Couldn’t at least the date and some of the basic information auto-populate itself without me needing to get a PHD in systems, computer engineeering, and project management??” Plus, so often nobody really reads most of the fields that take the longest to deal with, if the report is even useful at all.

        1. Avery*

          It depends on the paperwork itself.
          Some of it is truly necessary and needs to be filled out in its entirety every time, some of it is CYA material that probably won’t matter in the end, and some of it is just utter junk used to justify… something or other. The trouble is separating out those groups and getting rid of the junk and automating what can be automated without touching the useful stuff.
          And, of course, that separation and automation takes time and effort and money that a lot of organizations would rather use to just… keep doing the paperwork regularly, even if it’s useless.

          1. Yangtze River*

            As you note, it depends on the paperwork. In my case, perhaps some details could have been auto filled, like the address of the site that I visited and my own information. That information is easy to fill out, though. If all I was filling out was information like that, it would still have been awful to return from driving and do a report, but not Sisyphean. The painful part was the narrative of what happened during the site visit, which is neither useless nor automatable. Believe me, as soon as there is a way to dump information from my brain directly into a database without the interface of a keyboard and a screen, I will sign right up for that.

    6. daeranilen*

      This is exactly why I quit grad school and left the job I thought would be my lifelong career path. OP, please don’t get down on yourself about discipline. I’m sure you were fighting a massive battle every day to do the work you did get done, because I know I sure was. I’m glad you recognized that there were other opportunities out there that wouldn’t make you feel like Sisyphus pushing the boulder.

  12. Sloanicota*

    “I so much did not want to write those reports that they felt pretty impossible in a way I can’t explain. ” – I just want to say, OP, that I understand this feeling and I’ve been fighting it hard for the past several years. Sometimes I just get – passionately stuck. I don’t think it’s something that other people will necessarily comprehend, but I see you, and I feel you here. We will keep working on it.

  13. Unkempt Flatware*

    As someone who would take care of another person in perpetuity, before caring for myself, and until he leaves me for another woman, I am really really proud of you OP!

    1. WorkingRachel*

      Same. Stayed with a person unable to care for himself until it literally got in the way of my ability to eat. OP, it sounds like you made the right decision and I wish you and your ex (and his daughter!) well.

  14. Happy Little Cog*

    “I so much did not want to write those reports that they felt pretty impossible in a way that I can’t explain.”
    As a neurospicy human, I feel this in my soul. I sat on changing one line of my resume for a week, then another week on writing a cover letter (a giant debt of gratitude to AAM on that one), and three weeks on a blog post that feels overwhelming to write.
    Going to battle with a brain that’s emphatically saying NO is frustrating.

    3. JessB*

      Yeah, that line really hit me in my soul, I’ve certainly felt like that many times. And it creates such a negative loop of guilt and self-loathing for me.
      I’m really happy the OP was able to make some changes, and I hope they’re feeling a lot better. Wishing them all the best.

  15. JelloStapler*

    I am glad that you both decided what was best for you and I wish you the best!! I hope your ex gets the support he needs to improve his mental health and situation.

  16. Observer*

    OP, I think that you would have gotten more useful advice had you included the information you provide here. Because the REAL problem was never the kid. I understand why you didn’t include it. And I agree with the poster who said that reading the responses may have actually helped you figure out what your real problem was.

    In any case, I am sorry that you had a job yanked, but I’m glad that you figured out what you needed to do to move forward.

    I wish you and you ex lots of success going forward. It sounds like you are on a good path.

    1. Meatballs*

      Yea, something about her tone there really rubbed me the wrong way. Allison can only respond to what’s in the letter.

    2. allathian*

      Yes, this. I’m really glad the LW sent in this update, though, because it shows that Alison and the commentariat can only respond to what’s in the letter. I think that the comments on this post have been considerably more sympathetic to the LW than in the previous post.

  17. Keymaster of Gozer*

    Absolutely no shame in ending a relationship. It’s hard enough dealing with your own brain problems let alone trying to deal with someone else’s brain problems. Being able to say ‘this isn’t working, I cannot deal with this’ and leaving takes a lot of wisdom and guts.

    Hope your 2023 is filled with a great job and is more peaceful than your previous!

  18. WiscoKate*

    “… I so much did not want to write those reports that they felt pretty impossible in a way I can’t explain. Maybe it was a discipline issue…” OP – I have ADHD too (recently diagnosed at almost 40) and task initiative and executive functioning can be part of having ADHD. It can be really easy to make this kind of thing feel like a personal failure but it’s not.

    It seems like things worked out the way they were supposed to for everyone. Your ex and his daughter were able to move into a place that sounds really great for them and you are working on your next steps. Good luck!

    1. ferrina*

      Yes! Not being able to do the reports could definitely be a motivation/executive function component of ADHD. ADHD symptoms isn’t a personal failure any more than not being able to jump 10 feet in the air. Your physical self is simply not built for it. ADHD brains don’t have the same dopamine levels as neurotypical brains, which means that our brains (I’m a fellow ADHDer) don’t have the same motivation levels as neurotypical brains. It’s not a character issue; it’s a chemical issue. Here’s a quick explanation: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s_P6sNFjLzI

      I once went on a dopamine re-uptake inhibitor that meant I had more neurotypical dopamine levels. The impact was immediate. I felt different when I started and finished tasks. It was like I had gone through my whole life with weights strapped to my limbs, and suddenly they were removed. I no longer had to climb mental walls before doing things. I think that was the first time I truly felt that it wasn’t that I was lazy or undisciplined, it was that I had to try a lot harder to do the same things as other people, and it was exhausting.

  19. Bookworm*

    I’m sorry it didn’t work out between the two of you but it sounds like it was for the best for everyone. Sending you (and them!) good luck for the future!!

  20. My Cabbages!*

    As a fellow ADHDer, I just want to highlight this line:

    “And it’s like, I so much did not want to write those reports that they felt pretty impossible in a way I can’t explain.”

    and tell you how very, very much I understand. NT people have a hard time understanding the strength and depth of this feeling. It’s so much worse than “I don’t want to”… it’s more like asking a physically disabled person to walk up a flight of stairs-sometimes possible, but always excruciating and extremely draining.

    1. My Cabbages!*

      Haha, I felt the line so much that I commented before reading the comments and I see I’m hardly the only one.

      Funky brains unite!

    2. Rainy*

      I couldn’t even describe what it felt like until I had the experience of that not being my baseline state. Once I had been on meds and experienced something else, I told my pdoc that previously it had felt like there was a huge, impossibly high stone wall between me and some, but not all, tasks. If I could get over the wall, I could ride the momentum for quite a while, but getting over the wall was so, so hard.

      With meds, there’s sometimes still a barrier between me and Doing The Thing, but it’s like wet cotton–I feel it as I reach through it, but it’s not actually there in any meaningful sense.

  21. Olivia*

    I’m really proud of the OP for realizing that this situation wasn’t working out and that things needed to change. You see so many advice column letters from people whose partner has issues through no fault of their own, and it is manifesting in a way that is really putting an unsustainable amount of the burden on the LW, but the LW feels like they have to stay because if they don’t, what will happen to their partner? And the advice usually includes a reminder that this person has survived without the LW before, and the LW does not need to be the sole person meeting their needs, and that their partner has options that are not them.

    Here, it sounds like the situation was really stressful all around. I can imagine some of what it was like because I have ADHD and I used to be in a job where I was constantly putting out fires and there were all kinds of interruptions, and I got so burnt out to the point where it was making me physically sick. Just so utterly exhausting and definitely not sustainable.

    And so I just want to say, props to OP for valuing their own needs. It sounds like the ex is a really good dad, and I’m glad he and the daughter were able to get into the better housing situation. I’m glad the OP was able to take a step back and realize that multiple things about the situation weren’t working for them, and it’s great to hear that they’re now in a job that is much better suited to them.

    Sometimes when I have to do something risky or anxiety-inducing, I remind myself that I can do hard things. I say that to myself and it helps a little. So I hope the OP finds confidence and strength in realizing that they can do hard things. Making this difficult choice and changing up their life in multiple big ways was a really big thing. They should be proud of themselves for it.

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