I joked about a coworker’s slowness … and he overheard

by Alison Green on August 21, 2024

A reader writes:

I am the manager of a small group. I sometimes work with non-management staff outside my group, one of whom is an exceedingly capable, but idiosyncratic, person, “Karl.” He is very focused and will go far above and beyond to make sure that everything is clear, organized, and exactly right. This is great if that’s what you want, and is perfect for his primary work responsibilities (which often involve planning and executing tasks that could be unsafe if done improperly), but he can be a bit slow in getting things finalized and his intensity for his work can be a bit off-putting sometimes.

A few days ago, I was discussing some work with “Bill,” who manages Karl’s supervisor, in a meeting in his office. I was telling Bill what a great job that Karl had done on a project, and how Karl’s thoroughness had led to a good result. I also commented that it took longer than expected, which caused Bill to smile and laugh a bit, knowingly, since he knows Karl well.

I then did something foolish and unprofessional: In parting, I made a joking comment about not expecting speedy work from Karl (something like, “Well, Karl’s who you go to when you want thorough, but definitely not when you want fast!”). I then turned around to leave and saw Karl nearby, speaking to the admin. Karl looked up at me, looked away, and left. I wasn’t sure if he had heard me, but he has rather obviously dodged me in the hall several times since. My comment seemed fairly gentle to me at the time, but from Karl’s perspective, I can see why it might have been upsetting.

Prior to this, I had a good working relationship with Karl, and I enjoyed talking to him. I feel terrible that I offended him with my thoughtless, stupid joke.

I would like to try to repair the relationship, apologize to him, and express that I appreciate his work greatly. (Which I do!) Should I try a direct approach, knocking on his office door and apologizing in person? Should I do something less direct, like sending an email to him, copying his manager and expressing my appreciation for his excellent work on the project in question? (Such a letter is justified, regardless of my contrition.) Or should I just let it drop?

I answer this question over at Inc. today, where I’m revisiting letters that have been buried in the archives here from years ago (and sometimes updating/expanding my answers to them). You can read it here.

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{ 58 comments }

{ 58 comments… read them below }

  1. Dimitry*

    Karl has to know this about himself at this point. It’s strange that he would be surprised by it.

    1. Reebee*

      It was an insensitive comment, though, and fortunately, LW realizes that. Also, the letter doesn’t indicate Karl was “surprised.” Not sure I understand that as a takeaway.

    2. Heidi*

      A lot of people are aware of their not-awesome qualities. It doesn’t mean it won’t sting if someone you thought you had a good relationship with points it out to other people who have influence over your professional prospects.

      1. Ellie*

        Also, OP alludes to the fact that there’s a safety element to what Karl does. Lots of people denigrate safety and it can be frustrating to have to be the wet blanket who rains on everyone’s parade by insisting that the proper steps are followed.

        1. Paint N Drip*

          +10
          Probably a lifetime of being too slow in a high-productivity world and a ‘wet blanket’ (Karls of the world we thank you for keeping us alive/in the air/on the road/etc.) makes this an open wound for him. I feel for the OP having genuine appreciation for Karl’s work and also trying to navigate a warm and collegial relationship with the boss through banter, but OP missed the mark this time unfortunately.

    3. tina turner*

      The TIME to discuss it w/him is right away, ASAP. When memories are fresh. Just tell him you want to be sure he knows you were praising him for his work just now but he may have only heard the part about being “slow.” Say you know he’s “thorough” and you appreciate it. And wouldn’t trade it.

      Always talk to someone ASAP to clarify and apologize or explain if need be. Waiting just magnifies it.

    4. Gray Lady*

      He’s not necessarily surprised.

      I can’t imagine NOT being hurt by having my failings be the subject of a quip like that. Even if I was completely aware of the justice of the comment, it’s unpleasant and it hurts to be joked about in a non-mutual way.

      I’m not saying the LW is a terrible person, I’m just saying being upset is a perfectly normal reaction on Karl’s part. LW made an error of judgment, but not a crime. And I’d like to think that if I were Karl, I’d eventually let the sting wear off and be able to resume a normally cordially working relationship. Without remembering specifics, I’m fairly sure I’ve had experiences similar to that and was able to get past them. But a short term negative reaction is wholly understandable, and I also understand LW’s desire to make it right, because it *was* hurtful.

    6. Coffee break*

      I know I’m awkward, I don’t want to hear my boss joking or laughing about it with someone else at work- it was insensitive and really unfortunate he heard that. No where does it say he was surprised by it.

    7. Wildbow*

      Karl sounds like someone who puts a lot of themselves into their work. That makes it very easy to feel any negativity personally. People like that tend to lie to ourselves to some degree, or tell ourselves that, say, our strengths outweigh the negatives. Give something your all, especially as a perfectionist, and even the mention there is any negative at all can sting.

    8. Also-ADHD*

      He may know it, but it’s weird to hear two other people talking about him that way, and it’s still a kind of rude comment (and I think “joke” is a stretch — there’s no humor in it, really). It’s good LW realizes it was rude.

    9. tiny*

      I mean, I’m a Karl, and slow is relative, so if I was taking the time required to do something important correctly, I wouldn’t consider that slow

    10. Vio*

      There’s a difference between knowing your strengths/weaknesses and hearing somebody talking about them behind your back. Even if you know something is true (and sometimes especially then) it can hurt to hear it being discussed in an insensitive way. Especially if it comes from people you trusted. It’s also very easy for the brain to take only the latter part into account and ignore the prior compliment.
      As usual Alison has given good advice. An honest talk to put it into context and an apology will mean a lot. Hopefully enough to fix things and rebuild.

  2. Cardoons are delicious*

    Oof, yes, for work that has legit safety implications, this is exactly the kind of person you want and the “slowness” is part of their value. You just cannot do safety fast in the vast majority of settings. The fire department in my city, for example, may have their sirens on while responding to a scene, but they actually drive through the busy parts of town noticeable more safely (and slowly) than regular traffic. I’ve spoken to one of them as well as a neighbor who is at the command level in the department and they were like “yup, it’s our responsibility to preserve life” (I paraphrase). There are probably some exceptions, but in general….yeah, you can’t rush safety.

    1. Peanut Hamper*

      Yep. OP said “he can be a bit slow in getting things finalized” and I would bet money that OP doesn’t realize how much is involved in actually finalizing the safety issues.

      I highly recommend that everyone volunteer for their company’s safety committee if they have one. It is an enlightening experience, and you will learn a lot that you didn’t realize you didn’t even know.

    2. Cafe au Lait*

      The point of sirens aren’t so ambulances and fire trucks can go fast; it’s for everyone else to go slow so they can be the fastest.

    3. Maglev to Crazytown*

      Yeah, I slightly resemble Karl, and I am well aware of it — and am in a safety critical role where being accurate is a whole lot more important than being ultra fast. I find though for actual output, I am equivalent to or better performing. While coworkers may beat me on one project phase, I clean up overall.

      For example, of time to generat output, we work out roughly equivalent at first (like to first draft)… the difference is that I spend 90% of time on research/analysis, and am a strong writer who can then do the writing in 10%. So I appear initially behind when the people I work with have more of that 50/50 split. This also means that after review I have either few or minor reworks in response to comments, where as others end up back at the drawing board entirely at times.

      My thoroughness also is helpful to my teammates when they have questions about “Has anyone come across X yet,”? and I can point them to source and page number.

      1. Polly Hedron*

        I’m a Karl too, now retired. I did meticulous work but was slower than everyone else and worked overtime to keep up. I didn’t mind because I loved my work. I never got in trouble for unauthorized overtime because I was exempt.
        But I always wondered how I would have coped if I hadn’t been exempt (maybe sneaked work home?).

        1. allathian*

          Admittedly, in the vast majority of roles, fast and good enough is often better than slow and perfect because management isn’t willing to wait for perfect and most people legit can’t see the difference between good enough and perfect, especially in things like writing reports. As long as the contents are factually correct, managers usually don’t want employees to spend a lot of what they see as extra time on ensuring that the phrasing is just so and writing clearly and concisely, while the writer who is invested in being seen as a good wordsmith feels like they have to produce mediocre work. It takes a toll on the writer’s job satisfaction, if nothing else.

          Conscientious, thorough people often get discouraged in roles like this because they feel their contributions aren’t valued, and faster, less thorough coworkers get raises and promotions because their work output is closer to what management wants and needs.

          This obviously shouldn’t apply to safety issues, especially when lives are at stake.

          There’s some truth to the old adage that a work of art is never completed, it’s only abandoned. There’s also a particularly insidious form of procrastination where people keep editing a document long after it’s hit its point of diminishing returns.

          1. amoeba*

            Hah, yes, I’ve read a similar thing about academic works/PhD theses – “You don’t finish a thesis, you stop a thesis”. Important distinction!

            But it seems like Karl has found his niche, anyway, and people know and appreciate his style of working, so that’s great. As LW, yeah, I’d make sure he actually knows that (especially because it’s true – they do actually highly appreciate his work!)

          2. londonedit*

            Yep. People are always shocked! And appalled! when they find an error in a book, but no matter how many proof rounds that book has been through, at some point you have to stop looking at it and approve it for press, because there’s a deadline for doing that, and if you don’t then it’s not going to publish on time. Of course we all do our best to get rid of all the typos before that stage, but you’ve got to hit the press date and that’s more important than going through it all one more time just in case.

            I also have authors who cannot let their book go – there’s a pattern where they’ll have several opportunities to look at it and they’ll be quite relaxed about those, just pointing out a few things here and there, and then I’ll say ‘this is your final chance to read through and flag any remaining errors before press’ and all of a sudden nope, they don’t want to let it go, they cling on to it, they delay, they miss the deadline I’ve given them, and they suddenly want to change X, Y and Z things that they’ve never mentioned before. I get it, it’s scary making the final decision and approving things for press. Totally get it. But at the same time, it’s got to be done, or the book will never exist. Missing a publication date at the last minute is a huge, huge deal that has a massive impact on sales and publicity – we never do it unless there’s a huge unavoidable disaster.

  3. Peanut Hamper*

    This is how you learn the rule “Never say something about a person that you wouldn’t say to that person” when you are trying to make a joke.

    If they overhear, or it gets back to them, there’s usually a high chance that it will land poorly.

    3. BikeWalkBarb*

      I reread emails before sending with this very filter in place. Doesn’t protect me every time but I’ve definitely taken out an adjective or adverb to make a more neutral statement.

      Every time I learn one of my emails was forwarded to the person I mentioned, I’m glad I put in the extra few seconds for that review. Kindness is a professional plus.

      1. Reluctant Mezzo*

        I believe Oscar Wilde had a quip about speaking nicely about people behind their backs.

      3. Michelle Smith*

        They also didn’t apologize. If you look up the original post and look in the comments, the OP updated and said that things went back to normal with Karl and they aren’t sure the comment was actually overheard, so they didn’t apologize.

  5. Unkempt Flatware*

    I was once caught saying a very unkind thing about someone with that someone copied. It was gross, insensitive, embarrassing (for me), painful for them, and a huge learning opportunity. What I learned is that not only do you not say things like that about people, but you do everything you can to eliminate unkind or uncharitable thoughts about people from your inner dialog. You’ll be happier and healthier if you do.

    1. Goldenrod*

      I agree with your suggestion, Unkempt Flatware. Another tactic I suggest is to start making a habit of saying *good* things about people behind their backs.

      If it gets overheard, the person will feel good – and if not, your other co-workers/friends will respect you more.

      1. BikeWalkBarb*

        I like this a lot. You’re also reinforcing your own positive sense of their specific strengths and will bring that into interactions, which should benefit the relationship and the work.

    2. GrooveBat*

      A co-worker of mine once wrote a very nasty Slack message about someone and accidentally sent it to that person instead of its intended recipient. There’s just no coming back from that, ever.

    3. Peanut Hamper*

      do everything you can to eliminate unkind or uncharitable thoughts about people from your inner dialog.

      I wish this were posted at the beginning of the internet.

      Somebody last week said that they always started by assuming good intentions on the part of the other person, and I see that as a correlation to this.

  6. SunriseRuby*

    “…do everything you can to eliminate unkind or uncharitable thoughts about people from your inner dialog. You’ll be happier and healthier if you do.”

    Beautifully phrased.

  7. JP*

    This made me think of a story my boyfriend told me from when he was working on a construction site. A lot of the workers onsite were primarily Spanish speaking, which boyfriend was just starting to learn at the time. There was a heavy equipment operator also onsite who ran his machine at an excruciatingly slow pace. Some of the Spanish speaking guys nicknamed him “la tortuga” and boyfriend was so excited that he understood their conversation enough to understand that they were making fun of the guy.

    Anyway, I feel for you OP. We all stick our foot in it sometimes, but at least what you said wasn’t cruel, necessarily. I would initially apologize to him in person, though, rather than through email.

    1. Ready for the weekend*

      Same. At an old job, my longtime computer began to slowly fade out where I couldn’t do in a major file system as fast as I can could. I told my boss but no one took it seriously. My work ended up being super slower that people started making fun of me. It wasn’t until my boss saw firsthand what was going on that she apologized and put a stop to others’ cruel comments.

      1. allathian*

        I hope your boss also authorized getting a new computer for you. Blaming a person for being slow when it’s the fault of the system isn’t fair.

  8. Just me*

    As a perfectionist who likes to double check everything, I appreciated being called meticulous rather than OCD about things.

  9. Some Internet Rando*

    This is an old letter – I wonder if there is an update from that person. OP if you read this, let us know what you decided to do.

  10. Bast*

    Perhaps not the point as it really depends on how this comment made Karl feel (which we won’t know), but considering that for his job being slower and thorough appears to be a GOOD thing, it almost reads like a compliment — and if I were Karl, I’d probably take it as one. “Man, that Karl just BREEZES through his safety checks” isn’t exactly something I’d want to hear if I were Karl, as it would seem to imply carelessness. Sounds like he is in a position where you’d value being thorough over quick.

  11. ARRRGGGG*

    I’ve been on the receiving end of such comments. From people (I thought) I had a really good relationship with. One who knew I overheard him, avoided me for a week and then sent me a weird email apology a week later because he could never catch me. 1.5 years later and I still don’t trust him. With anything.

    I hope the LW found a way to make amends with Karl. Because it sucks when you’re just trying to do you best and get things done and people feel the need to criticize rather than converse.

  12. GrooveBat*

    As a side note, you know you’ve really effed up when Alison begins her response with the dreaded words, “Oh, no…”

  13. Festively Dressed Earl*

    If someone’s work is good enough to warrant praising them to their grandboss, be 100%. Save the negative stuff (even joking) for an overall postmortem with the coworker or their direct supervisor.

  14. I'm just here for the cats!!*

    I have to say I am glad that this is letter did not go the way I thought it was. When I first saw the title on Inc. I thought that it meant that he called the other person slow as in mentally challenged. Slow was often used, and still is by older folx, to refer to someone who has a intellectual disability (formerly called mental retardation).
    So I thought that the OP had joked that their coworker had a disability. I’m glad that he meant physical slowness and not mental

  15. CityMouse*

    This seems pretty innocuous and accompanied by a compliment. I think this is an overreaction. Karl has to know he submitted his work late. if you miss deadlines, you can’t get upset if someone comments on it.

  16. Madre del becchino*

    This happened to my eldest son in his first job out of college as a funeral director — he overheard his manager telling someone on the phone that he was taking longer with embalming than the manager would like. My son did talk to the manager about it and they were able to move on from it and still maintain a good relationship even though my son has moved on to a different job.

  17. Having a Scrummy Week*

    I am a Karl. I am very self-aware that my conscientiousness sometimes slows things down.

    It would still hurt me greatly if a colleague (and a manager especially) said that about me.

  18. borealis*

    A question for Alison: when you re-post an old letter that you respond to elsewhere, would it be relatively simple to also add a link to the original AAM post? If it would add a lot of extra time to the process of posting, it wouldn’t be worth it since it’s always possible for the readers to find it by searching the archives, but otherwise I think it would be helpful to have a link to the old entry at the beginning of the post, similar to the link to the original letter in update posts.

    1. Fanny Price*

      I think this would undercut part of the point of reprising these old posts on another platform – it’s worth paying Alison to do because it drives clicks for them, and doing this would mean that they would get fewer people clicking over to read the column.

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