survey asked about my boss’s mental health, avoiding a bone-crushing handshake, and more

by Alison Green on August 27, 2024

It’s five answers to five questions. Here we go…

1. Survey asked how my boss communicates about her mental health

My supervisor at work is participating in a company-run training program aimed at helping managers improve their management skills. As one of her direct reports, I’ve been invited to take an (anonymous) survey to provide feedback on her managing style. I get along with her and generally think she’s a good supervisor, so I figured it’d be an easy survey — but then I came to the question where I was told to rate how well she “communicates about her own mental health and wellness in an authentic way.”

This is weird, right? I’m not totally off-base on this? We have a good relationship and chat about things in our lives, but I wouldn’t want to share details of my mental health with my supervisor, and would probably be pretty uncomfortable if she started sharing hers with me. It feels more like it would foster bad boundaries than a professional relationship. But how do I respond to a survey where it seems clear that that’s an important metric to evaluate her performance? I do think she’s a good supervisor and want to reflect that — and I also don’t want her to be told she has to talk more about her mental health because I don’t want that to become a part of our meetings. Do I give a middle of the road response? A “not applicable”? Should I mention in the free response section that I don’t think it should be part of the survey?

Yes, that’s a weird and inappropriate question. I would either give her the highest rating (because for you, the way she is handling the topic is working well) or a N/A. And then yes, explain in the free response section that you believe everyone deserves privacy around their health at work and appreciate your manager for respecting appropriate boundaries.

Unfortunately, employers keep going off the rails with this. Yes, it is healthy to acknowledge that we’re humans with a range of emotions, and it is good to destigmatize mental health issues. But expecting managers to communicate about their personal mental health is invasive and inappropriate, and many people really don’t want to be on the receiving end of those communications. Employers who want to promote mental health have lots of non-invasive ways they can do that: offering good mental health coverage as part of their insurance plans, being flexible with time off, building awareness of what types of accommodations are available, offering strong employee assistance programs, and being thoughtful about much stress employees are expected to take on. But that takes real resources, whereas a survey question like this doesn’t.

Related:
forcing employees to talk about their feelings isn’t good for our mental health

2. Can I wear a brace to avoid handshakes?

In a few weeks, I’ll be attending an in-person meeting with my company’s founder and former CEO. I’ve met him twice before and both times, he’s shaken my hand so hard that it hurts. The second time it reactivated a minor hand injury I was dealing with, which had been from another handshake a few weeks prior. (As an aside, why do people ever shake someone’s hand that hard?)

He’s a nice guy, and I’m a woman, and I don’t get the vibe that it’s a power play. It just feels like the legacy of the “firm handshake” advice and a dude not knowing his own strength. I don’t feel like I have the standing to pull the founder aside and ask him not to shake my hand so hard. Plus, he hasn’t remembered me twice, and I’m very low-level at the company — I’m pretty sure he’ll want to re-meet me and shake my hand immediately, before any aside-pulling can happen. But when I was dealing with my handshake injury before, people reacted weirdly to me not shaking their hand when they went offered it. I got puzzled looks, and people weren’t sure what to do with their outstretched hand. Can I wear a hand brace to make it more visible why I might not be shaking? And what’s a good alternative gesture to do when people try to shake my hand?

You can indeed wear a hand brace if you want to! But it’s also fine to just say, “I’d shake your hand but I’m recovering from a hand injury.” If people look a little puzzled, it’s probably not because they think you’re breaking the social contract in some way; it’s likely just their faces processing “oops, I’ve got my hand out and now need to retract it.”

You’re fine! People have hand injuries. Or they’re sick and doing everyone a favor by not shaking hands. It’s not a big deal as long as you’re matter-of-fact about it and make a point of being otherwise reasonably warm.

Related:
chill out with the bone-crushing handshakes

3. I end up doing more work than my less organized coworker

I work in a team of four. My workmate Lucy and I are both part-time, have the same job description, and are paid the same; the other two are full-time and do different jobs.

Our manager, Sarah, often allocates work to me and Lucy without specifying who will do what, e.g., “can the llama groomers pick this up?”

Lucy is a great person and we’re friends outside of work. However, she really struggles with organizational skills (she has ADHD and is very open about it) and I have strong organizational skills. So in practice, when something is assigned to the two of us, I usually end up making it happen. I’ll often ask Lucy to contribute to it in specific ways (“can you order more llama shampoo before Friday?”), but even then I usually have to remind her, sometimes several times. On occasion I’ve just done her part myself (checking with her if that’s okay) because it’s less stressful that way and means the job will happen on time.

I find myself getting resentful of the situation. I’m paid the same as Lucy but organize much of our work. Sometimes I feel like I’m her de facto manager, but I’m not her manager and I’m not paid to be her manager. Meanwhile, our actual manager is quite hands-off once she’s assigned a job to us (I’m sure she’s aware that so much of it ends up falling to me, but this is never explicitly acknowledged). I think I’m taking on too much responsibility for things, both in terms of work and emotionally. How can I change this?

Is the work usually something where an entire assignment can be handled by one of you rather than each person taking different parts of it? If so, it would be a lot easier for the two of you to switch off who takes the full assignments, rather than splitting them into multiple tasks (which you then end up organizing). Ideally when new tasks come in, you’d be able to reply, “I’ll take this one” or “Lucy will take this one” and then wash your hands of the latter entirely. (Even more ideally, Lucy would be speaking up and say “I’ll take this one” half the time, and you can ask her to do that — but if realistically that won’t happen, ask her if you can coordinate this type of system so it’s clear who’s taking what.)

If that doesn’t work, you should talk to Sarah and ask her to assign projects to one or the other of you but not both. Explain that under the current system, you end up feeling responsible for all the work rather than only your share of it.

If that doesn’t work, make the case that you should be paid for the role you’re playing in managing the work (and ideally given a title that recognizes that too).

4. My coworkers want me to tell them why a colleague was fired

I work in the financial services industry, which is highly regulated by multiple self-regulatory and government bodies.

Recently, a senior teammate was let go for gross misconduct with regard to compliance with regulations, in part because I had to report them. I feel terrible because I don’t want anyone to lose their job, but I am legally required to report the misconduct or I could also be fired plus face criminal and civil penalties, including being barred from the industry.

I’m now responsible for telling clients that this person is no longer with the company (without any details, obviously). That’s tough but manageable, and I’m able to navigate that with minimal management-level interaction, save the occasional client that needs a call from my grandboss, who is expecting and willing to take on those difficult clients as part of the transition process as we replace the former coworker.

The problem I’m facing is that coworkers on other teams are … perhaps too curious and, in some cases, active shit-disturbers, and have attempted to corner me into telling them in detail what happened. I cannot, and would not, tell them any details, and have directed them back to management with any questions they may have. Most have taken the hint but several (more than six) have not and have been calling, emailing, sending IM messages, etc., even calling my personal cell phone after hours to ask invasive and inappropriate questions.

I let my manager know about this and they are taking it seriously. However, it’s only been a week but the questions haven’t stopped and I received a text message on my personal phone at midnight on Saturday asking me for “the hot goss.” Should I also go to HR about this, as well? I’m not responding to these messages at all on my personal devices, and I’m continuing to redirect to management for questions, but what in the world?! Any advice is appreciated.

You don’t need to go to HR, unless you want more back-up. You could! It wouldn’t be weird to. But it would also be fine to ignore the messages that people shouldn’t be sending in the first place, or to respond with, “I’m not allowed to discuss it and you’re putting me in a difficult position by continuing to ask. Please stop.”

5. Candidates say I didn’t call for our schedule phone interview, but I did

I am at my wits’ end. Some of the recruiting I do is high volume. Lately, I have been experiencing an increase in candidates claiming that I did not call them for our scheduled phone interview. When I call, if it goes to voicemail I always leave a message. In the past week or two, I have had several candidates state they did not receive a call or voicemail. I feel like it is an argument. How do I handle this? Sometimes it is the second call I’ve made after we rescheduled and they still do not answer.

First, when multiple people are telling you that an odd technical thing is happening, especially in a short amount of time, it’s always smart to confirm that there’s not actually a problem on your end (including checking your call history for the possibility that you’ve called the wrong person, especially since you’re dealing with lots of calls). But assuming you check and it’s definitely not you, you don’t need to argue with people. You can say, “I’m sorry to hear that! I did log a call to you at 4:30 pm yesterday, but voicemail can be strange. In any case…” What comes next is up to you. If you’re still willing to interview them, suggest a time to reschedule for. If you’ve moved on (or if they’re handling the call in an unprofessional way that leaves you uninterested in rescheduling), you can say, “We’re no longer interviewing for that role, but I’ll reach out if that changes.”

Also, when you confirm a phone interview time, you could include language like: “If you haven’t heard from me by five minutes past the scheduled time, please call me directly at (number).” Or you can ask that they email you, or so forth — just something that lets them know how to handle it if they don’t hear from you when they expect to. That will put a rest to the debate about whether you called or not, since it will move the ball into their court with a clear action and timeline for them to take that action. And if they’re just forgetting about the call, that will make it clear. That might be more complicated than you want or need; if so, just stick with the advice in the first paragraph and ignore this one.

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{ 383 comments }

{ 383 comments… read them below }

  1. Happy meal with extra happy*

    For number 4, as a CYA, I would make sure your managers know about the personal device communications. Depending on your/their role in financial services, having work communications on personal devices can be a massive no no. (Look up all of the fines being issued due to brokers communicating over WhatsApp.)

    1. Captain dddd-cccc-ddWdd*

      Tread carefully though as why do they have OPs personal number in the first place? Does OP also do company business on there… in which case this needs to stop, but perhaps not push too hard about the compliance aspect of that or they might be asking someone else for gossip about OP one day…

    2. Freya*

      My workplace has a strict policy of all work communications go through work devices and use work emails. Because when employees move on, the office no longer has any means of access to those communications, and the audit trail is cut. When we’re working remotely, our computers have an app that we can log in to to route phone calls through the office phone system (so that we can answer the office phones, and so that our outgoing calls look like they’re coming from the office).

      (also, there’s potential privacy issues with work accessing personal phones, and it’s much easier to sidestep any potential liability by not doing it in the first place AND clients don’t ever call you at home if they don’t have your number)

    3. JSPA*

      And for those reasons, I’d answer the askers (especially at midnight, WTAF?!?) “not an appropriate question. Not an appropriate hour. Not an appropriate use of my personal number.” (And maybe set it to send at 6 a.m.)

      If I had to guess or write fanfic, I’d wonder if there were more going on than simple bad record keeping (that is, the non compliance hid something worse), that a few other people were in on it, and those people are now defecating bricks?

      Or merely that the person who left had been encouraging them to bend rules as far as reporting and compliance?

      But it’s probably just gossip by people with not enough life outside of work.

      More generally, I think it might be both possible and useful to say, via appropriate work channels:

      “There IS no hot take on Jacky’s departure. But I do coincidentally need to remind everyone that record-keeping and formal compliance lapses can be firing-level serious. We should all take full formal compliance seriously. Reaching out for private information outside of work channels is a frowned upon [illegal? unacceptable?] practice.”

      1. Brevity*

        You’re a lot nicer than I am. If I got a text like that from a coworker at midnight Saturday night, I’d likely respond with a text in all caps starting with “where the hell do you get off texting me at midnight on a Saturday you
        m@#!$%f@#$^&ing j@**@$$” and working up from there.

        What is wrong with people…………..

      2. OMG! Bees!*

        Definitely since some texts are around midnight, take some action to let them know to not contact you. I personally avoided any on-call work for this reason. Depending on LW4’s relationship, I would be tempted to block someone who did that, but a simple Do Not Disturb would handle it (at least at the moment)

        1. Seeking Second Childhood*

          I once ran into the situation with somebody emailing me at home.For information they did not need to know. I forwarded it to myself at work and answered them from there to say it’s not my role to share that information.

          She had the nerve to complain I answered from work LOL.

        2. Elizabeth West*

          I love your username, haha.

          I try not to use my personal phone for anything work-related. I’ve been lucky, I guess, not to have any jobs where people would need to or want to reach me after my designated work hours. The exception was having Teams on my phone with NewlyExJob, in case my internet or their VDI went down. Most of my coworkers had that set up since they sometimes had to attend meetings while traveling to worksites, etc.

          My personal number isn’t even on my resume — it’s my Google number. I don’t get many calls on it, and I know to whom I’ve given it out, so if I’m job hunting, I know it’s probably an employer and I should answer it. But no one has ever been so rude as to call it at midnight!

      3. linger*

        Questions like that should get a form response, exactly once:
        “We absolutely cannot and will not comment on any personnel matters. Just as you can rest assured that we will observe the same discretion in the event of any future personnel matters relating to yourself.”

    4. WeirdChemist*

      Also LW4, stop feeling guilty over this person getting fired! They got *themselves* fired by choosing to break federal regulations. If you work in a highly regulated industry, I find it hard to believe that you all weren’t informed/trained on the rules and regulations and what the consequences are for breaking them (especially because it was a “senior teammate”). Your former coworker was absolutely aware that what they were doing could get them fired, and they chose to do it anyways. That’s on them, not on you!

      1. Dust Bunny*

        This.

        You can’t be more concerned about this person losing their job than they apparently were about violating regulations. This wasn’t done to them–they brought in on themselves.

      2. Observer*

        This times a million.

        This person had to know that they were skating on thin ice, especially since these were not minor infractions like using the wrong color pen or something like that. (And, yes, that used to be a real requirement for some government agencies!)

        1. Tradd*

          CBP (US Customs) has regulations (19CFR, chapter 141, if I remember correctly) that any notations on documents must be in blue or black ink. Back in the day when hard copy documents had to be submitted to CBP, they would make their notations in red (usually on a cover sheet from what I saw). A former coworker (licensed customs broker, which I also am) told me a brokerage company she used to work for once got FINED by Customs during an in-person audit because someone in the brokerage department had a red pen in the pen holder on their desk.

        2. MigraineMonth*

          Specifying pen color makes sense to me; computers used to be terrible at scanning colors other than blue and black (or pencil weights other than #2). I love a nice purple pen more than most, but not enough to make someone re-type all the data.

          1. Orv*

            There used to be a specific light blue color known as “non-photo blue” that was used for making notations on originals that wouldn’t show up on copies. I think the film used in photolithography printing processes was also insensitive to it.

        3. Strange the Librarian*

          We have to make people redo their passport applications if they are written in any color other than black. (It’s on the top of the form and yet…)

    5. Everything Bagel*

      I would be side-eyeing anyone who would go to those links to try to get details out of OP. I’d be really curious why these people are so invested in what happened to the employee who was let go. Were they involved in the same or similar activities? This is all speculation of course, but their behavior is really drawing attention to them that they may not want. Of course, there’s nothing for OP to do in this regard besides tell management about the inappropriate contact, which I would absolutely do.

      2. Dust Bunny*

        That was my first thought, “What are they doing that they’re worried will get found out, too?”

      3. Radioactive Cyborg Llama*

        My reaction was “what is wrong with these people?! I mean, asking once, ok, everyone is curious, but repeatedly? No.

      4. Jennifer Strange*

        Yup. I’ll admit I’d be very curious and ask to begin with, but once the LW made it clear they couldn’t/wouldn’t discuss it I’d drop it. This level of determination is incredibly odd!

      5. Lady Danbury*

        It makes me wonder about the entire company culture, that multiple people think that it’s ok to be so wildly inappropriate! Of course it’s human nature to be curious, but most of us know better than to act on that curiosity, especially in such an unprofessional (and potentially illegal?) manner! At best, it’s a yellow flag to me that something is rotten in Denmark.

      6. Overthinking It*

        I think the point is they don’t know what those activities were. They may not even been told “he broke federal regulations and exposed the company to fines or liability. They could and should be told that much! (But maybe not by the OP)

        OP should just say “you have to ask to (fired person’s supervisor) about that.”

        1. Pastor Petty Labelle*

          No they don’t need details. The nature of the request — asking for the hot gossip means they don’t want to know for business reasons they just want to gossip. OP also classified them as pot stirrers, so again, they just want gossip.

          OP – I would modify the script slightly: You know I can’t talk about that. Stop asking. Turn it back on them by exposing their inappropriateness, and leave out the please. Loop in your boss that it is still continuing. If you weren’t explicit before name the people who are doing it. Don’t just be general about. Be very clear, Sacharissa, Angua, Carrot and Fred all are still asking.

          1. Carit*

            The only person on that list I can see doing this is Fred. Even a journalist wouldn’t do it like this!

        2. Observer*

          I think the point is they don’t know what those activities were

          But actual point is that their deep and inappropriate curiosity raises a red flag that they are also do some possibly inappropriate stuff and may be trying to gauge how much of a risk they are taking.

          They could and should be told that much!

          Not necessarily. These are people in different departments and work groups. And companies, especially in highly regulated industries, often have very tight rules and policies around what is shared, and often for good reasons.

      8. McGovern's the One*

        hmm i saw it the other way, as in the company itself may be troubled or toxic that everyone’s worried about a firing with no information leading to other firings, layoffs, etc.

        1. Observer*

          You could be right. But what is not in question is that the person texting the LW is acting in a wildly inappropriate manner, regardless of the reason.

          Having said that, if you are right, that would be all the more reason to let the manager know what is happening – the LW certainly should not be left holding the bag if stuff hits the fan.

          1. JustaTech*

            Yes, asking a sort of “what happened to Bob” question could indicate a company culture of people just disappearing. But asking for the “hot goss” on Bob, that’s not someone who’s worried that they’ll be next on the chopping block for no reason, that’s someone who wants gossip.
            (My response to the “hot goss” person would probably be something like “are you for real? No.” Which isn’t diplomatic or super professional, but hey, neither is the question.)

            1. anon for this*

              “Hot goss” makes me wonder if the rumor mill is that he was fired for a more titillating kind of misconduct.

              Years ago when I was in the industry a similar thing happened with a top producer and his assistant fired for compliance issues. I was her counterpart for other brokers and we were told about the corner-cutting he pressured her into so we could better avoid it. But I’m sure tongues wagged that they were caught having an affair.

      9. Sparkles McFadden*

        There are some people who think they are entitled to everyone’s personal information, so they push until they get an answer or until the person being questioned yells “You need to stop!” in the middle of a hallway. Then the questioners move on to others to ask “Why won’t she answer my questions? What is everybody hiding?” Such people don’t understand anyone keeping things confidential because they take great pride in being “in the know” and blab everything to everyone. I have seen this all along but it has gotten much worse since social media use has become ubiquitous.

      10. Pescadero*

        I’d side eye any financial firm that didn’t inform clients that non-compliance was going on and tried to keep it secret.

    6. Ann Perkins*

      I work in compliance in this industry and yes, those communications need to be forwarded to a work channel and let your manager know. OP, it sucks that you’re being put in this position but I commend you for doing the right thing! Keep ignoring the messages and/or use the script Alison provided and it’ll hopefully blow over soon.

    7. Observer*

      For number 4, as a CYA, I would make sure your managers know about the personal device communications.

      Yes. Even if personal device communications are generally permissible, in this case, it’s a massive over-step and brings that person’s judgement and discretion into question. And let’s be real – in industries that have these kinds of regulation, the ability to keep your mouth shut, and to work without “having” to know all the “hot scoops” is really important.

    8. Tradd*

      I’m not in an industry with regulations about personal device communications, but my question is: would coworkers wanting gossip about why a coworker was fired fall under such regulations? Just curious.

      1. Observer*

        Very possibly yes. There are a lot of regulations about who is allowed to know what, and that could easily include who gets to know about personnel issues, etc.

      2. Ann Perkins*

        In the SEC, FINRA and CFTC world, anything that could even POSSIBLY be construed as business-related is subject to monitoring and recordkeeping requirements. Asking about a termination would 100% be within scope of those requirements. The SEC and CFTC have handed out over $2B in fines over the last few years on this very topic.

        1. a clockwork lemon*

          Lol I work at one of the many firms that got in trouble for off-platform communications and we finally had to get explicit permission from our IT/surveillance people to stop sending policy reminders for people sending their personal cell phone numbers to arrange non-work stuff (happy hour, hobby recommendations, pictures of people’s puppies.)

          I don’t know that people outside the industry know what a big deal this is, but EVERYONE knows the rules…and people are getting their bonuses docked for breaking them.

  2. Isabel Archer*

    For #2, you’re overthinking this. Wearing a hand brace would protect your hand from this one dude, but what about the inconvenience when you just want to use your hand normally the rest of the meeting? Plenty of people don’t shake hands, especially since the pandemic. Place your open palm on your upper chest, smile warmly, and say “I’m taking extra precautions against germs these days, but it’s so nice to meet you/see you again!” No normal person will take offense.

    1. Dahlia*

      Most of the time if you’re wearing a wrist or hand brace, you can still use your hands. In fact, it’s often recommended to wear one WHILE using your hands to protect yourself from repetitive strain from things like drawing or typing or doing certain crafts like knitting.

      1. New laptop who dis*

        If I’m wearing a hand brace and someone goes in for the shake, I just head them off at the pass with a cheery “No shake for me! Fist bump?” as I offer a bump. Works every time.

        1. Nomic*

          This works for me too. It helps prevent awkwardness because they aren’t stuck with their hand sticking out.

      2. Peter*

        Agree, and it depends on the particular brace. I’ve used a thumb brace, and I can still do what I need to do using my hand.
        A different brace I had, both over-the-counter, did interfere with needed function.

        Using a brace to protect myself from my own automatic response of putting my hand out for a shake, is a strategy I use selectively to protect my hand.

    2. ChattyDelle*

      Also, I wear braces on both my hands due to arthritis & trust me it hasn’t stopped people from shaking my hand and squeezing hard, causing me pain. I like the suggestion that you offer that you have a hand injury; I think I’m going to use it too.

      1. The Rafters*

        I was just signing in to say pretty much the same. I broke both wrists at the same time and both were casted / braces. Didn’t stop anyone from squeezing even harder.

      2. OP #2*

        Oh no! I’m sorry wearing a brace didn’t stop people from shaking your hand or squeezing too hard. I think I was thinking that it would be a good visual reason to help explain why I wouldn’t be shaking. Maybe that’s not the way to go. Thanks for saying that. Other people have suggested a fist bump or a wave, both of which seem like good redirecting gestures.

        1. What_the_What*

          I think a brace is a good idea if you’re comfy with it. I have one that is for carpal tunnel and it covers the back of my hand/wrist, part of my palm and up my fingers most of the way. Nobody has ever grabbed my hand and shook it while wearing my brace. It’s a pretty obvious visual cue, especially if you “waggle” your hand a little and say, “Can’t shake, sorry!” with a smile. I think a LOT of people here are overthinking your question. Can you wear a brace to avoid a hard shaker? Yes. Yes you can.

        2. Pair of Does*

          If you do end up in a bone-crushing handshake, it’s OK to let it show on your face and say “ow!” Not in an angry accusatory way, and you can play it off graciously afterwards with a faux compliment about their grip, but it’s OK to not cover up the fact that they’re hurting people. They made it weird, not you.

        3. Jordan*

          As a person that wears hand braces regularly, it’s sometimes about making the invisible (injury, sensitivity) visible.
          I think a combination of a brace And the above mentioned hand over chest with short explanation/
          acknowledgment would do the trick.

      3. What_the_What*

        They’re reaching for your hand, that you haven’t extended for a shake, and are keeping close to your body while indicating you don’t want to shake hands, and they’re just…grabbing it and shaking it? That’s not cool if even one person does it, but if multiple people are doing it… that’s weird.

    3. coffee*

      I would go for a wave rather than pressing your palm against your chest. Less closed off and it also gives the other person a graceful cue to wave back if they’ve already got their hand out, rather than leaving it awkwardly hanging there.

      You can also go for a pre-emptive wave and not mention germs at all. Saves time for a faster hello.

    4. Agent Diane*

      I have become a huge fan of keeping my hands in my pockets so my social conditioning doesn’t cause me to automatically shake hands when I don’t want to. Then a cheerful smile and a “I don’t shake hands, I’ve got an injury/vulnerable family member” etc. I use “don’t” rather than “won’t” as don’t suggests it’s a rule, not that I’m avoiding this particular person.

      (Although I am. I totally am/i>.

      You do have to commit to the bit though: you can’t dodge this dude, then shake hands with someone else at the same event.

      1. Agent Diane*

        Argh! I failed to close the italics right. I knew it would happen to me one day. The last para is not meant to be emphasised.

      2. 1-800-BrownCow*

        You must be a man. Us women are constantly on the search for pants with actual pockets. Today, my dress pants has fake sewn front pockets, which I realized when I went to put my ear pod case in my front pocket during my lunch walk. Thankfully, these pants do have functional back pockets, not the ones that only go an inch deep. Seriously, I’ve never met a women who states they hate having pockets. Just this past weekend I was clothes shopping and passed up 3 pairs of dress pants only because they did not have pockets.

        My luck if I tried this strategy, if I was OP #2, the day I’m meeting someone new who wants to shake hands, my pants would not have pockets.

        1. coffee*

          I was reading a review of a sewing pattern and the (female) reviewer said she omitted the pocket because she doesn’t like pockets in her clothes, so there’s an alternative data point.

          Personally I really like pockets. I see the cargo pant trend is coming back so maybe I can live the multi-pocket life.

    5. Ann Onymous*

      For what it’s worth, I’ve been in a hand brace for a few weeks due to a thumb injury. It makes people understand faster why I’m not shaking hands but they’re still standing there awkwardly with their hand out (except for one guy who immediately pivoted to a fist bump).

    6. Trout 'Waver*

      100% agree. Since the pandemic, I’ve had a lot of success with just putting my hands up and saying “I’m not shaking hands right now, but it’s a pleasure to meet you/see you again/do business!”

    7. Jackalope*

      I will also add for handshakes in general that I’ve found it useful to return squeezing strength to sender. If someone is shaking my hand and squeezing it I’ll squeeze back with the same amount of firmness. For people who judge character by firm handshakes it pleases them and makes them happy, for people who prefer light handshakes it means I don’t injure them. And most importantly, I’ve discovered that it’s a lot harder for someone to injure my hand if I’m squeezing back really hard; I can’t explain the mechanics of it, but they don’t get the same kind of grip. This may not help the OP now since they already have a hand injury, but in future meetings with this person they can try this and see if it helps.

        1. GenX Enters the Chat*

          Exactly. And if it IS a power move, the other party is going to double down and squeeze harder. It’s a no-win situation. I will literally say “OUCH” if someone squeezes too hard and kind of shake my hand like I’m shaking it off. You might learn something about the person depending on whether they look smug and victorious, or are apologetic.

      2. Grenelda Thurber*

        I remember shaking the hand of an adult man at school when I was in the *eighth grade*. He squeezed so hard that I almost yelped. I don’t remember why I was being introduced to him, but I was a 13 year old girl. I hope it was his brain just being on autopilot; he didn’t have anything to prove to me. I was just confused by it.

        1. bleh*

          It’s purposeful. Every. Time. They want to remind you who is strong and big, even a (often especially a) young girl.

          1. Pair of Does*

            I mean, I wouldn’t guess it’s an individual decision they make every time, more that they made a decision to be Tough Handshake Guy and then didn’t make a decision to modulate that at all based on who they’re shaking with. But I agree, it’s not like they’re incapable of holding an egg without crushing it. They can go easy on kids if they thought to.

    8. rebelwithmouseyhair*

      I have had to wear a hand brace and will sometimes wear it in situations like OP’s when I’m a bit wary or if I think the old pain is about to flare up again. They are easy to slip on and off for washing hands. I wouldn’t want to talk about germs because that’s absolutely not a concern of mine (while totally respecting the position of those who do take germs more seriously) and it would be weird if I were to see the same people a couple of weeks later and be happy to shake hands at that point.

    9. Deborah Vance, Vance Refrigeration*

      Eh, I had to use a brace for a while and it was just to keep my wrist firm in place, so I could use my hand just fine. Some people are just weird about handshakes, so the brace gives OP an easy way out. (And I’ve met some people who did take offense when I refused to shake their hands, go figure)

    10. Jeanine*

      Good plan. With covid still raging and now monkeypox rearing up I won’t shake hands with anyone ever again.

        1. Orv*

          That’s right. The old name was causing people to kill monkeys, mistakenly thinking they were the vector of the current outbreak.

    11. Ineffable Bastard*

      That is similar to how people greet each other in places affected by the Ebola virus, but I think that there they close the hand as it approaches the chest. I personally like both because it means that you hold the other person in very high regard, close to your heart :)

    12. Not A Raccoon Keeper*

      I’ve found that continuing to mask causes people to pause before reaching for a handshake, so that can be another approach for those of you who don’t like handshakes! As a bonus, they’re the thing that actually helps prevent covid spread, which is currently raging.

      As a note, handshakes have very little if any to do with COVID spread, and I continue to shake hands. Another masking bonus is that it’s harder to pass along anything you do get via your hands (norwalk, e coli, mpox, etc) since your mucus membranes are harder to touch.

    13. eeek*

      Since the pandemic, I greatly prefer not to shake hands. I will place my open palm or cupped hand on chest, offer a slight bow and a big smile and say “I am so PLEASED to meet you!” to avoid a handshake. If they look confused or disappointed, I will sadly shake my head and say, “I’m not shaking hands today – better safe than sorry!” (Which is nicely equivocal – I could be sick, or they could be sick, and we’re all better safe, right?)
      But when I’m likely to face a bone crusher, swoop hugger, or weirdly over familiar kisser, I pull out a lovely antique handkerchiefs from pocket, sleeve, or waistband, dab my nose and retain the used fabric in my hand; at that point I can wave, bow, smile, and change subjects.
      Funny how no one wants to shake your hand if you’re holding anything that looks like a used noserag in that hand…
      (Imagine this comment followed by a “The More You Know” gif…)

    14. basically functional*

      It may be true that no normal person will take offense, but so many people are not “normal” in that way. I attended a conference recently with a coworker who doesn’t shake hands for germ-related reasons. People definitely got offended even though she was polite about it.

    15. DE*

      Why is no one suggesting OP tell the truth? Why is lying the only option? Just tell the guy last time it hurt when he shook your hand and he’ll just shake softer. Most people would not push back on something so inconsequential.

      I feel that everyone here is overthinking this for some odd reason.

  3. Might be Jeb*

    For #5, there’s an extra layer to it beyond Allison’s good advice. I have recently learned that some phones will block certain numbers without even ringing, and that it’s possible to get your number listed as spam despite being manifestly not-spam. It’s especially possible if you makea lot of valls that go to voice-mail or just don’t get picked up. Perhaps some basic testing to make sure that your calls are in fact going through is in order?

    1. Recent grad*

      Big agree! Would also say to test by calling someone who doesn’t have your phone number saved in their contacts / ideally someone you haven’t called before at all

      1. Cmdrshprd*

        That could work, but it might also be phone/network dependant, in that for people with carrier A OP might show up as spam, but not for people with carrier B. or mix of carriers and certain phones.

    2. Cmdrshprd*

      That is a very good point.
      Another is I have had the experience candidates mention between my wife and I and family members.

      It has happened when we have been in the same room sometimes.
      Person A says they called me, but the call never came through, person A confirms the call went straight to voicemail. But I don’t get a missed call or VM show up until much later.

      One of the times it happened my wife and I were sitting together looking at something on my phone. A relative then called my wife saying they called me but it went straight to VM, but on my phone the call never came through. sometimes I will have the call/VM show up in my call history hours later, but not always.

      This has happened with my wife and relatives calling me, so numbers I call/text with often and are saved on my contacts and are not spam.

      But I have also had calls/voice mails that all of a sudden show up as missed when a call never came through.

      I suspect it might be an issue with the phone/Wi-Fi calling or the network in general, in that the phone somehow loses connection with the call network. Especially because in most (all?) instances the call goes straight to voicemail.

      So I think it is very possible that candidates are telling the truth.

      If possible I would do Alison’s suggestion of letting them know in advance when setting the time they can call you 5 mins past at x number. or if you call and get their VM, can you text them and ask for a call at X number. sometimes you might get the same issue calling again, but with them calling out it might fix it.

      it has happened to me, wife texts me I just called you call me back, (I have no call that came in) but if I call her it will go through without a problem.

      1. Somehow I Manage*

        This rings so true to me. My phone doesn’t work well in my house, which can be a blessing to be sure, but can also be infuriating when someone I want or need to talk to calls. I won’t even see that a call comes through, and VM will pop up a day or more later. And like you, sometimes I won’t even see the call on my call history.

        I suspect there’s probably something different happening in this letter, though. I also make a fair number of calls for work and it seems that people are more likely to not answer a number they don’t recognize. While it is counterintuitive when you KNOW you’re going to be getting a call for a job interview, I wonder if people are just not answering a call they don’t recognize. Also, a lot of people just don’t check VM, which again is counterintuitive. In this situation, I think the LW should share the number they’re calling from in advance so the interviewee could put it into their phone, as well as stating that if they don’t get a call to reach out to them at whatever number they provide.

        1. AVP*

          Even Tim Walz said he didn’t pick up the phone call from Kamala asking him to be VP!

          But yeah I would check if something like this is happening — I’ve had really weird stuff with missed calls and voicemails both to and from my cell phone. A coworker said she called me and it went right to voicemail, when I was sitting right there waiting for her call and my phone didn’t react at all. Now I just text people first if I’m going to call them or if I’ve been waiting for them to call me, but that’s not always useful in a work situation.

      2. Rock Prof*

        This same thing happens to me all the time, even with numbers I have saved in my phone. For some reason, it happens most with my mom’s number which I not only have saved in my phone but also have set up to ring even when my phone is in do not disturb.

        1. MigraineMonth*

          I have a weird thing where a call from one of my contacts will go through, but the contact information isn’t associated with the number. Most memorably when my brother-in-law called and said, “She’s just given birth!” and I answered, “Who’s this?”

          (In my defense, my nibling was a month early and in a big hurry for a first birth.)

      4. Butterfly Counter*

        This literally just happened to me.

        I was playing on my phone when the voicemail icon came up. I went to voicemail, but there wasn’t any notification. In “missed calls” I saw that it was my sister and I called her back. This was on Friday.

        Only this morning (Tuesday) did the voicemail message come through.

      5. Waltzing Matilda*

        First, Cmdrshprd, love your screen name

        Second, I work for an alarm company. The amount of times I’ve had a customer call us to complain that the alarm dispatcher did not call their home or their cell when they did is incalculable. Or calling to say they *just* got a message from the day before (or later, one person I recall didn’t get the message for like three days). Even if they have the correct number listed as a contact in their phones. It’s very hit & miss. Sometimes they’ll go through just fine, & the next it won’t. (It appears to happen mostly with one particular large national company, but I cannot confirm that.)

        There’s little to nothing that we can do about it and it’s so frustrating to all parties.

      6. e271828*

        The invisible call phenomenon happens to me frequently, even with WiFi assist turned on. Verizon doesn’t handle mobile calls well, which is pretty sad. [They are slightly less bad than the local alternatives.]

    3. Coverage Associate*

      I have had not spam calls come up on my phone as spam risk, and the caller knew this was a frequent thing. It was like an alarm company, so it would have been a number none of their customers had in their contacts, so probably most people did let all their calls go to voicemail the first time.

      I also think I have a used cell phone for work that maybe was programmed to ignore calls not in the contacts. My first example was my personal iPhone, but my work iPhone will just not ring. Same carrier but different plans for both. (Yeah, I should fix this.)

      I have also had the thing where voicemail shows up hours late or shows up as new weeks or months after the call, but that hasn’t happened for several months or more, and only on my personal phone.

      1. wavefunction*

        There’s an option for this in iPhone settings. Check Settings—>Phone—>Silence Unknown Callers. I usually have it on unless I’m expecting a call because of the amount of spam I get.

      2. Kara*

        My bank’s Fraud department showed up as Spam Likely once. I answered anyway due to unusual circumstances that meant i was semi-expecting a call from them and made very VERY sure that yes it really was them, but it was certainly weird!

      3. Nah*

        “so probably most people did let all their calls go to voicemail the first time.”

        there’s actually a response from someone in that same industry refuting that point directly above you! I too have had (sometimes very urgent, including an interview!) calls not come through with literally any indication from reputable numbers, and am much more inclined to give the interviewees grace in this situation, especially with the number affected.

    4. PX*

      This. Technology can be weird, I’ve had a repair company call my mobile multiple times and leave voicemails with no issue and then on some occasions they try to call and I’ve gotten no missed call notification or voicemail despite them doing both those things. When I followed up they said they called but couldn’t leave a voicemail for some reason.

      TL;dr Alison’s advice about telling the candidate how to follow up if they don’t hear from you is great.

    5. Some Internet Rando*

      Agree here that a lot of phones go straight to voicemail for unknown caller. Mine does that.

      I like the idea someone suggested of following up with a text that tells the person to call you back at a specific number. Its extra work but if you are really trying to connect with the person it would go a long way and save time in the long run.

      I also like the suggestion that you tell people in advance that if they dont hear from you by 5 after that they should call you at your number. You could add that many phones will send unknown numbers to VM (which normalizes this) and encourage people to save your number as a contact or to contact you if they dont hear back.

      After that, if you cant reach them then it is not on you.

      1. SpaceySteph*

        Yes I first experienced the unknown caller thing when I had a medical issue and called a Dr on-call number. I was sitting expectantly by my phone waiting for the on-call Dr to call back when a voicemail popped up from said Dr. My phone was auto-blocking them because they had a blocked number. Blocking the number is a fairly normal thing on-call Drs do, because they don’t want people with caller ID calling them directly vs the on-call service the next time they have an issue and I didn’t realize until that moment that phones could even do that.

        1. Dahlia*

          Slightly off topic but interesting thing to think about – block the number of the doctor’s office also keeps patients safer! If your doctor calls you, you might not be in a safe place to have the name of the doctor flash on your phone or whatnot.

    6. CTT*

      That was my first thought; I had to turn off that setting on my phone because so many legit calls weren’t coming through. It would be an extra step, but what about setting up a conference call so both parties can dial in instead of hoping the call goes through? (Although depending on the system you use that could mean it looks like you’re wanting to do a video call which you may not want it this stage…)

      1. TPS reporter*

        was just thinking that, set up a call via an app like zoom or teams. you can set up as video off and let them know in the email.

    7. Corporate Goth*

      Could add a line asking candidates to ensure they’ve turned off any “silence unknown callers” features before the interview.

      2. Kay*

        This doesn’t always solve the problem, unfortunately. I went through the hoops of specifically adding in a random company’s phone number as a contact to make sure I got the call – nope – even that didn’t work.

    8. KC*

      This! Thanks to over a dozen spam calls each day, my phone basically won’t ring unless the number is in my phone (regardless of my settings…when 99% of calls are spam, the algorithm learns). I can be looking right at it, waiting for a call, and all of a sudden it tells me I missed a call. Spammers also usually leave a 3-10 second voicemail, so unless it’s longer than that, it might not register as an actual message. The advice to give candidates an alternative is a great one, especially if it involves them calling or emailing you, so that another call doesn’t get blocked.

    9. Ashley the Nonprofit ED*

      I once spent an hour-long interview fighting back tears after the candidate crushed my hand. He was very nice and probablt qualified but I was in total agony and not listening to him in the slightest. I debated later if I should have sent him an email about it. I almost said something at the time but I truly thought I was going to burst into tears.

    10. Delta Delta*

      This. I am an attorney and often have to talk to government agencies and police departments. Luckily I recognize lots of the state agency/police phone numbers for what they are, because about 60% of them come up as spam calls. I also have a good friend who lives in the middle of nowhere and doesn’t have good cell service so she has a landline, which also comes up as spam.

    11. 888 Pocomo*

      For #5, when someone doesn’t answer for a schedule phone interview, I leave a voice mail, and then immediately follow it up with an e-mail letting them know that I’m sorry I missed them, and to get in touch if they’d like to reschedule.

    12. LCH*

      my phone sometimes sends my mom straight to VM without ringing. it is so annoying. i’ll see the VM message pop up and i’m like, my phone was right there. it did not ring. wtf.

      so, yeah, phones have gotten weird.

      1. Nicosloanica*

        Yeah, OP says she’s leaving VMs so it shouldn’t *just* be this. It may be a combination of this and nobody checking VM anymore (but job seekers should at least).

        2. Cmdrshprd*

          I have definitely had both happen, the call won’t ring and some time (usually hours) later the phone call and voice mail will show up as missed. So that unless the person texted me or sent an email. I would have no idea they called until a few hours later.

          For friends/family it is annoying but they usually know to send a follow up text. Sometimes if I call them it will then pop up on my phone sooner.

      2. I don't work in this van*

        Yes, I sometimes don’t get the voice mails until hours or even a day later.

          1. Orv*

            I haven’t had it happen with my current carrier, but back when I had Sprint I’d often get no voice mails or text messages for several days, then they’d all arrive at once.

      3. Observer*

        Would it go to voicemail and then not register the v-mail though?

        Definitely a possibility. Sometimes the VM will show up hours later, and sometimes (though not as often) it just doesn’t show up.

      4. d*

        yesterday, i got one of those no-ring, straight to voicemail calls. watched the voicemail notification appear on my phone, clicked it to go to voicemail, phone said “you have no voicemail.” i tried a few more times to check my voicemail, and it never appeared.

        my phone did mark the call as spam, so maybe it also deleted the voicemail or sent it to a spam box?

    14. Momma Bear*

      This is what I was thinking, too. My phone did an upgrade a month or so back and now more calls are marked possible spam than they used to. I think LW should give the people their number so they can add it to their Contacts, both to prevent being filtered and to be able to call the interviewer if they haven’t heard from them timely.

    15. sparkle emoji*

      Yep. I run into similar issues and when I miss someone on the phone, I follow up with an email or text asking if it’s still a good time for a call, and ask them to call me back at my number if it is. The second form of communication usually shows up for people even when a call doesn’t.

    16. Everything Bagel*

      This is a good observation. My spam calls immediately are diverted. I do see them later in my recent calls list though.

    17. WingedRocks*

      I was going to suggest the same – mobile carriers have implemented a lot of screening/blocking technology in recent years to prevent spam and scam calls. This is especially true if your phone system is VOIP, rather than a traditional landline.

    18. Bee*

      About a year ago I got a couple people in a row telling me my voicemailbox was full, but whenever I looked at it there were only two messages in it, and it had worked just fine with those for years. Turns out there was a whole secret part of it with messages my phone had decided were spam! (They were, but if you hide the spam messages, I can’t delete them!!!) I’d never gotten any notifications about any of these messages, so my mailbox just filled up without my knowing. So OP, if your number *has* been marked as spam, this might be what’s happening to your messages.

    19. Call routing to Heck*

      I’ve noticed my company’s help desk number is blocked by some carriers for our system. Thankfully switching to my Direct line usually works for me. It’s not every carrier though which makes troubleshooting fun…

    20. COHikerGirl*

      Yes! That many people saying something means there’s something going on.

      I frequently get super delayed voicemails. And my doctors office calls come in as spam.

      Also, for anyone blocking spam numbers, if the spammers are spoofing, you could be blocking a real number. Voicemails can be left, but, on an iPhone, they’ll be in a sub folder named Blocked (with Deleted voicemails).

    21. I AM a Lawyer*

      I also understand that people can set an iPhone (and I’m sure Android has the same function) to only let calls through from numbers saved in the phone. It sends the call straight to voicemail and I don’t know if it provides the user with notice that there’s a voicemail in the inbox. I wonder if more and more people are doing this but not realizing that it affects a recruiter’s ability to get through to them.

    22. IL JimP*

      I was going to say this, my Pixel will routinely not even ring or even say it’s screening a call

      Usually it’s because the number is listed as spam in their data base

    23. Jaina Solo*

      +1 to this!

      I was looking into refinancing my mortgage and ended up getting a billion spam phone calls, but I set my phone to not ring for unknown numbers. So they’re all getting sent straight to voicemail. That wouldn’t account for candidates not getting the voicemail though so I would honestly set up my own test. Maybe set up a Google Voice or other free number that you can call and leave a voicemail.

      I also love how Alison brought up not to argue about this because I had a recruiter do this. They called late so I moved on to the next thing I had to handle that day, and while it wasn’t egregiously late, the recruiter argued via text with me that they had in fact called me on time. I just stopped responding after clarifying that they had not. It’s so awkward but also no one’s going to want to join an org where arguing with candidates is a default.

    24. Underemployed Erin*

      Also for LW #5.

      I notice when calling certain parts of the US that the phone calls just ring and never actually go through.

      This happens to me frequently when I call my mom. I know she has an answering machine so if the call continues to ring after 4-5 times, there is some network misrouting issue going on. Calling a second time usually puts me through.

      This failure is happening somewhere in the telephone networking layer of things and not in the voicemail.

      Giving people the ability to call you back as Alison said can potentially fix the issue.

    25. Cats and Dogs*

      In similar type situations I make the people call me so the onus is on them to show up on time and not make me have to call back etc.

  4. nnn*

    For #2, a useful thing when declining to shake hands is to immediately say something else, ideally something that requires a response or that moves you both on to the next step of the interaction.

    This gives the person something to say or do rather than being stymied by the change in expected script.

    Examples: “I’d shake your hand but I’m recovering from a hand injury. But we’re very pleased to have you here! How was the drive down?”

    Or: “…Have you met Cynthia?”

    Or: “…Were gathering in the conference room, if you’d like to follow me?”

    If it’s your own CEO you’re meeting, there might be less of an opportunity to take the lead on the conversation like that, so you can start with the apology for not shaking hands, and then introduce yourself with your name and role, so he can process that however he normally processes that and move on.

    1. Space Needlepoint*

      Definitely. Make sure there’s a clearly friendly comment or gesture in this case.

      I remember going to an interview once and one of the interviewers simply said, “I don’t shake hands.” I nodded and went to the next person. When we were saying goodbye, we both ended up doing a partial bow to each other. This was pre-lockdown and social distancing.

      The important thing is the greeting is welcoming and with little (it’s never none) chance of looking like a snub.

    2. MigraineMonth*

      Yes! If you’re going to skip the handshake social ritual, you can substitute the “how are you” or the “are you enjoying the conference” social ritual exchange to get back on track.

  5. Queer Anon*

    For #2: In situations where I suspect a handshake may be incoming, I tend to preemptively wave at the person with my right hand in front of my shoulder so it is extremely unavailable. People do sometimes react weirdly, but I’ve found that’s become less common since the start of the pandemic. I rarely provide any explanation and that’s generally not a problem.

    1. Resume please*

      Agreed. I have done the preemptive wave along with a “Great to see you!” A second of awkwardness is worth it over a hand crush

    2. CV*

      Good idea. Getting the hand out of the usual zone will short-circuit the ingrained social training most of us received.

    3. DrSalty*

      Agree this is the way to do it. Preemptively greet them (warmly) with your preferred method. No need to draw attention to not shaking hands or make up reasons.

    4. JustaTech*

      I’ve done this in situations where I thought it was completely obvious that shaking hands was not possible (I was in a lab and wearing gloves) and this one guy just kept trying to shake my gloved hand, even after I held it up at shoulder height to wave hello.

      He was on serious auto-pilot, and I finally had to say “Sorry, can’t shake hands, working with blood!” The look on his face when the whole situation *finally* penetrated was quite funny.

      (The gloves are purple, there was no way he didn’t see that I was wearing them.)

    5. QOTM31*

      I no longer shake hands for germ reasons, and I do a cheerful wave accompanied by an equally cheerful “I’m a waver!” so the other person can pivot from shake outreach to waving back. Works every time.

  6. Pickle Pizza*

    Can we just stop shaking hands altogether? I’m relieved every time someone doesn’t initiate a handshake.

      1. Peanut Hamper*

        “not everyone dislikes thing” does not mean that we need to keep doing it though. Your logic is faulty. Lots of people don’t like touching other people (especially strangers) and lots of people don’t like being injured or having old injuries revisited.

        If you like shaking hands, you can find a group of likeminded people and form a handshaking club. It will like those odd fraternal organizations that sprang up around the turn of the 20th century.

        1. blah*

          But doesn’t your reasoning also work the other way? Plenty of people don’t care about touching other people, and plenty of people don’t have old hand injuries.

          If you don’t like shaking hands, you can find a group of likeminded people and form a no-handshaking club.

          1. Dust Bunny*

            Except handshaking is still the predominant norm and it can be awkward, and look bad professionally, to decline. And it’s unnecessary. People can go handshake on their own time as a hobby; it doesn’t need to be done in the workplace.

            1. Aspiring Square*

              If it’s the predominate norm doesn’t that make the argument that people who don’t like it are the outliers and therefore it shouldn’t be done away with?

              I’m pretty neutral on handshaking, but in general I recognize that it’s positive there are social constructs and scripts that contribute to society being a thing we share, and handshaking is one of those things that can be considered a social exchange that bond us as a species.

              1. Ineffable Bastard*

                Historically, handshakes were for adult males in western cultures only. It often was a display of goodwill but also of strength. It’s not an inclusive social exchange to bond us as a species and often puts people in the path of hurt — somebody here commented on a female relative who had her bones broken by a handshake with a man who disapproved her work.
                The important part is acknowledging each other’s presence as welcome, and it can be done in several different ways.

                1. JustaTech*

                  I mean, handshaking is an improvement (germ-wise) over the previous greeting action in Europe – kissing. (In the Middle Ages.)
                  But styles of greeting take many generations to change, so I don’t expect handshaking to go away overnight.

              2. a trans person*

                “If it’s the predominate norm doesn’t that make the argument that people who don’t like it are the outliers and therefore it shouldn’t be done away with?”

                This is a fantastically bad argument that is literally the argument for why we queer people should not be visible / exist in society. Please never use it even for something as simple as handshaking.

                Also, “as a species”? As a *species*? Handshaking is not a cross-cultural universal human behavior!

          2. Irish Teacher.*

            I think the difference is that people can be injured or unable to shake hands for various reasons or uncomfortable with it, whereas I don’t think anybody has an injury that could be exacerbated by not shaking hands.

            I don’t think the reasoning works the other way because those who don’t care should be happy either way. If most people don’t care one way or the other and some feel threatened or can be hurt by something, it seems to make sense to drop it or at least keep it optional.

            And a “not shaking hands club” wouldn’t help because those who shake hands so hard it hurts others would probably still shake the hands of those in the club.

            I personally don’t feel strongly about shaking hands either way but I find it hard to think of arguments in favour of it as a social norm.

        2. Allonge*

          The logic is bad in this direction too. It’s not a question of logic.

          More importantly, OP is not much helped by a ‘just change the whole world’ kind of comment.

        1. Helewise*

          I like handshakes. I don’t know why exactly; positive human connection, I guess. But given the choice, I’ll always choose to shake hands.

            1. Jeanine*

              Yeah you can bet I would never do that kiss kiss thing with people like they do outside of the US. And I will still not shake hands anymore either. No thanks.

        2. Hroethvitnir*

          Yes. I am AFAB and was taught how to shake hands firmly (not hard). I do think it’s a little bit of a shitty arbitrary thing in terms of judging people with limp hands tbf.

          What I like is: unisex, consistent greeting. Not as intimate as hugs +/- kisses on the cheek. I was so entertained meeting my extended family in Austria and before the teenage kids went out on NYE they came and shook the adult’s hands goodbye. I think a social script is incredibly helpful, and we don’t have a great replacement at the moment. Note: I’d never be weird about someone not wanting to shake hands!

          Also. I am female presenting and don’t mind being perceived that way except when my gender strongly impacts how I am interacted with. This most certainly includes men shaking men’s hands then hesitating when they get to you. It’s more uncomfortable for me due to dysphoria but I don’t think you need to be trans to want to be treated just… the same as men at work.

          Honestly, I’m into bowing as a non-touchy alternative but that’s never going to happen. I do wave in some situations, but I really don’t see a good alternative I can imagine having uptake any time soon. (Hand on chest feels *very* weird to me.)

          1. Hroethvitnir*

            Actually! One thing I have done during the “no one is sure how to greet each other” dance is nod, and I could see that as filling a similar niche as handshaking.

            It just needs to feel like a very deliberate respectful acknowledgement that is going to feel neutral to people to have any chance of working in lieu of handshaking imo (I think the hand on heart feels kind of vaguely religious? I’m not saying it has to be, but that’s why I wouldn’t feel comfortable with doing it myself, though it’s a perfectly nice gesture from others).

      3. Clisby*

        Not everyone dislikes hugs, but that doesn’t mean every person you meet should feel free to subject you to a hug.

        1. Ginger Cat Lady*

          UGH yes! I hate it when someone I don’t know well approaches me and says “Don’t mind me, I’m a hugger!” and then just hugs me.
          I am not a hugger. People who are huggers should make sure their hugs are welcome.

      4. Artemesia*

        True but they are also such a great way to get stomach flu or a cold and a primary way those things spread. I wish we could normalize a different courtesy.

      6. Prudence and Wakeen Snooter Theatre for the Performing Oats*

        Handshakes should be something you opt in to, not opt out of.

    2. Silver Robin*

      it is a pretty ingrained cultural norm that is (generally) seen as pretty harmless (harmful ones are much easier to push back on). We would probably have more luck teaching people not to crush hands and reinforcing the existing norm to wash them regularly than we would teaching folks not to shake at all.

      I mean, norms do change, so this one could too. Obviously not all cultures shake hands so alternatives exist. I just do not see it changing very quickly or soon.

      1. SpaceySteph*

        Yeah there’s a certain era for which “firm handshake” was seen as some kind of stand in for worker quality so there’s a lot of people running around thinking they have to crush hands to succeed. I think that is changing slowly.

        There are probably situations where we can or even should remark on the firmness of a handshake like “oh, ouch, got a real grip on you” or something (would not do it to the CEO, as in OPs case though…) to help change those norms.

        1. Troutwaxer*

          But a ‘firm handshake’ is different from a bone-crushing handshake. A ‘firm handshake’ means to apply gentle pressure, not as much force as possible, then hold your hand and wrist in a somewhat rigid position for a couple seconds so touching you feels solid rather than mushy. I’ve always read bone-crushing handshakes as a deliberate attempt to cause pain and prove your aggressive superiority.

          1. SpaceySteph*

            You are correct that a firm handshake is different from a bone crushing one but I think a lot of people misguidedly implement it that way; I don’t think everyone with an unusually strong handshake is trying to cause pain and especially not permanent damage.

            Aside from that, not everyone is capable of giving a firm handshake for any number of reasons and its not a reliable way to judge people’s suitability to a job unless the job involves grip strength, so it still seems like something we can safely discourage from caring about.

          2. metadata minion*

            Agree. For me, a handshake is more of a tensing of the hand than squeezing. I’m only holding the person’s hand as firmly as if I were gently picking it up.

    3. Melon Merengue*

      Thank you. I always hide my hands and hope they’ll take the hint. Usually they don’t. I personally find grasping hands with someone (who has likely been grasping many other hands) really gross. I excuse myself immediately to go wash up.

    4. Kitry*

      Please let’s not! As an autistic person, I love firm shakes because they are formulaic and I can actually learn the rules of how to give a firm handshake. Making a good first impression can be challenging for me and being able to give a good handshake is one of the few tools I have to overcome that. For the love of God, please don’t yank away one of the few social skills that I’m actually really good at! If you don’t want to shake hands that’s fine- just use your words and explicitly tell me what we’re going to be doing instead.

      1. Hroethvitnir*

        Yeah, I left an excessively large comment elaborating on this, but I actually desperately wish we would be more consistent about handshaking (allistic but am stressed by the mix of expectations).

        Realistically people who are uncomfortable with it are common enough now that it can’t be relied on, but a backup wave can be used if the person does not reach back out to you. (I hold up my hand toward them with a single small “wave” rather than an enthusiastic back and forward.)

    5. Orv*

      Likewise. Bullies at my school used to grab my hand and squeeze it while grinding my knuckles together, and I’ve had a bit of an aversion to handshakes ever since.

  7. Kevin Sours*

    #4 Why do your coworkers have your personal contact information? More importantly now that they have specifically shown they can’t be trusted with it, why do you not block them?

    2. WellRed*

      Maybe just assume there’s a reason for coworkers to have the number. At any rate, it’s not helpful to OP to criticize that now though obviously blocking is needed.

    3. Watry*

      I don’t know about OP1, but my entire agency has access to my personal number on the intranet, and I have access to theirs. So depending on OP’s company and role, this may not be that shocking. That said, if someone was calling/texting me for such a reason, I’d be contacting their supervisor and it would get shut down hard.

    4. HonorBox*

      While they’re using it inappropriately, I don’t think it is that odd to have coworkers personal contact info. For whatever reason they do, I don’t know that blocking them is the right answer, either. Because it isn’t just contact coming over the personal device, so simply blocking them there will force the communication to any of the other channels that have already been used, which LW points out.

      LW doesn’t need to handle this on their own. I’d take the messages received to management and ask them to say something. While the LW doesn’t need to feel guilt over reporting the infractions of former coworker, having people bombard them with questions about it sure can compound whatever they’re feeling. And everyone needs to be told to stop the questions, back down and get back to work.

    5. Dust Bunny*

      My whole department has each others’ cell numbers for in-a-pinch communication. I think we also use cell numbers for office phone trees because if you don’t have power you probably aren’t checking email, etc., during a hurricane or whatever.

      But we can do that because we don’t use it like this

    6. Allonge*

      Some people need to be able to get in touch with their coworkers? We don’t all work in silos doing no-deadlines individual projects where talking to their manager once a month is too much contact.

      1. Jackalope*

        Yup! And I have the phone number of a number of my coworkers for weather issues. I live pretty close to our office and they’re in a town a half hour away, so in the winter I’ll sometimes text them to let them know if things are getting bad, if street X is closed due to an accident, etc. Likewise they’ll text me if there’s something I might not know, like if I’m coming in late due to a doctor’s appt and the office is unexpectedly closed. It’s a mutually agreed system of helping each other out that we all agreed to (anyone who wasn’t interested just didn’t provide their phone number).

      2. Pescadero*

        Some people need to get in touch with co-workers outside business hours… and if that is a business need, the business should be paying for the means of communication, not using folks personal phone

        1. Insert Clever Name Here*

          I have a job where my hours are Monday – Friday, 8-4:30 and I am available on my work phone during those times because I keep it with me during those times and it lives in my computer bag in my home office outside of those time. However, part of my job is also to provide emergency support for unpredictable issues (happens roughly 3 times a year).

          The colleague who needs to contact me for emergency support of those unpredictable issues uses my work cell first, but also has my personal cell in case he can’t reach me on the work one. If one of those unpredictable issues happens at 9:15 on a Saturday morning, he’s going to use my personal cell because I’m not going to hear the silenced call or text within the computer bag in my home office.

        2. Good Enough For Government Work*

          I run work socials on an (at least) monthly basis. I give out my personal number to everyone who asks about attending so they can let me know if they’re running late/can’t find where we’re meeting/etc.

          So long as everyone uses it appropriately, not a problem.

      3. Hastily Blessed Fritos*

        What does that have to do with them having my personal phone number? There’s email, work phones, Slack or Teams messages, physically walking over if you’re in the same office, etc. Tons of options! If contact outside of business hours is a legitimate business need, they can supply a work cell phone.

        1. JustaTech*

          What about business travel?
          I very occasionally travel for work with my coworkers. None of us have been provided a work phone (another story), but when we’re coordinating things like a shared rental car, or when we’re meeting in the hotel lobby, it’s just easier to do that by phone.
          It’s not my entire office, it’s just my immediate coworkers, but sometimes the legitimate business need is not enough to justify a company phone.

          1. Hastily Blessed Fritos*

            In that case, yeah, I’d give them my number, but that’s a specific situation, not the “you absolutely need a co-worker’s personal phone number to be able to communicate with them in any way” claim I was responding to.

            1. Insert Clever Name Here*

              I feel like what’s being missed is that if the *only* way my coworkers can contact me outside of business hours is on my work devices, that means I NEVER get to disconnect from work. I always have to keep my phone/email/slack up for the rare time when it’s necessary for someone to contact me outside of work hours. Keeping that up means that every phone call or text on my work cell or slack ping has to be looked at or answered to see if it is the rare instance that I have to provide emergency support for unpredictable situations.

              Or that coworker can have my personal cell and alert me that I’m needed, at which point I can go get my work devices to actually begin working.

    7. rebelwithmouseyhair*

      I would reply to them with a “you know very well I can’t tell you and I’ll be reporting this harassment since we’ll have to start checking whether anyone else was doing what Fired Fred was doing and you seem overly keen to know what’s up which is overly suspicious”.

    8. carrot cake*

      “Why do your coworkers have your personal contact information?”
      —-

      What difference does that make in this situation? @OP: Looks like some fine-tuning is needed for availability.

    9. Peter*

      FWIW, in my work experience, almost all U.S. corporations long ago did away with actually providing employees with a work phone (landline, VOIP, or company provided cell phone with company paid cell phone service). People instead either use their own personal cell phone and cell phone service (and depending upon the relevant state’s laws they may or may not get any reimbursement from the corporation for the employee what is actually the corporation’s cost of business).

      1. Peter*

        finishing the thought — People instead either use their own personal cell phone and cell phone service or they get a second phone/phone line which they dedicate just to work.

        And depending upon the relevant state’s laws employees may or may not get any reimbursement from the corporation what is actually the corporation’s cost of doing business.

  8. Eugene Debs' Ghost*

    For LW 1, I wonder if the question is a clumsy way of asking about the manager’s boundaries. Another way to fill in the free response section strikes me as, “My manager has always been able to effectively tell me when she’s having a bad day or foresees being less present due to a personal issue. She always gives me the information I need without oversharing, and I appreciate it.”

    1. bamcheeks*

      Yeah, that’s how I’d interpret it. Not about over sharing, but sharing the appropriate amount to put into context any distraction, business, or stress. I’d include things like, “I’ve got that big report to finish for the TS meetings on Friday, so I’m going to be offline this afternoon and tomorrow. Can you send me a Slack message if you need anything and I’ll respond as soon as I can?” as well as, “sorry I’m a bit spacey, I slept terribly last night.” Just the stuff that lets you know when they’ve got things going ok and what that means for you.

    2. Earlk*

      It is a clumsy way of doing that, some people get hung up on the idea of mental health being a diagnosed condition whereas sometimes it is just about how someone is doing at any given moment. So if your manager is good at pushing back when they have too much on and communicating that is the reason then that would be a reason to answer that question positively. Whereas if your manager just doesn’t communicate why they haven’t/aren’t doing something it would be in the negative.

      1. OP1*

        I don’t think I’m at all “hung up” on the idea of mental health being a diagnosed condition. I think it’s pretty clear that the question isn’t about a clinical diagnosis, but it’s still not something I’d consider reasonable to be required for a supervisor to share. (It would be even less appropriate if it were about a diagnosis!)

        There were other questions talking about communication and prioritizing vacations and work/life balance. So I don’t agree that this question is obviously a clumsy way of addressing that. It seems pretty specifically designed to be asking about whether my manager is sharing personal information with me—because again, even without a diagnosis, I think mental health can be very personal. I don’t think my manager should need to give me a reason for why something is late if the reason isn’t work related.

        1. NotBatman*

          Psychologist here — I couldn’t agree more that your manager’s health and mood should never be the kind of thing she’s ever required to share with you, regardless of diagnosis or lack thereof. Your coworkers’ mental health is absolutely none of your business, barring situations where you’re helping them get an ADA accommodation. It’s possible to be a good coworker and even a good friend without needing that kind of personal information disclosed to you.

        2. Earlk*

          Hung up was probably a bad phrasing and not a criticism of you, more that we all have mental health be it good or bad much like physical health but due to “mental health” being stigmatised it’s often not seen that way.

          1. bamcheeks*

            Yeah, I agree with you and I think this is a really important thing! I do this this gets misused and misunderstood by companies just as much by individuals, and I don’t think it’s a reflection on LW because theres no way of knowing what this particular question is supposed to mean.

            But I do feel very strongly that “talking about mental health in the workplace” SHOULD mean talking about the low-grade stuff— I had a bad night’s sleep, I’m distracted because my daughter’s getting her exam results today, I’m worried about that client meeting, it’s hard to get motivated when I don’t know whether my contract will extended. Making it OK to talk about that lower level stuff is one of the ways you make it safe to address stress and anxiety at an early stage, and signal that people can disclose bigger issues if they need to. We kind of talk about mental health as if it only starts existing when something is Bad, and I don’t think it’s helpful!

    3. Nonanon*

      This is how I interpret it; also a good way to identify if boundaries are weird. Rating them as “1” and clarifying “Prudence overshares to me and I know more about her divorce than any human who isn’t her husband or lawyer should” is significantly different from “Prudence tells me that she’s overwhelmed with personal stuff at the moment and may take longer than expected to get back to me, but always does within one business day.”

      1. MigraineMonth*

        See, I’d see even that as too much information from my manager. If she’s going to be out for a day, I need to know she’s out that day, not that she’s “taking a day off to deal with personal stuff”. If she’s not able to review my work until Friday, just say that; or she could say that she’s busy. I would never want my boss to tell me that she’s “stressed” or “overwhelmed”.

        I feel like that’s the kind of openness you can share up the chain or with your peers, but shouldn’t be shared with your reports, because it’s harder for them to set boundaries with you.

    4. PotsPansTeapots*

      Yeah, that was my assumption. The question could also mean, “Does your manager take personal time off/take advantage of provided flexibility in a way that makes their employees feel like they can take off time, too?”

      1. ecnaseener*

        Eh, it really couldn’t with the question as written. You can (dare I say, should) take PTO without any “authentic” communication about your mental well-being.

    5. Margaret Cavendish*

      Yeah, I think the problem is with the wording, more than the question itself. It sounds like they’re asking something like does she *demonstrate* effective communication in this area, or does she lead by example, that kind of thing. They’re trying to assess if individual managers are acting in a way that supports organizational values.

    6. OP1*

      I appreciate this perspective, but I’m having a hard time reading it that way. Part of the reason for that is there were other questions talking about work/life balance and communicating effectively, and all the other questions were very clearly written and straightforward. So this one does seem designed to be asking specifically about mental health, which is just kind of weird!

      1. Saturday*

        Yeah, this question seems pretty clear and straightforward too, so I’m having trouble seeing an alternative way to interpret it. I mean, (mis)interpreting it to mean something less odd might be a reasonable strategy that allows you to answer it in a way that you’re more comfortable with, but especially the “in an authentic way” part makes me think it’s asking just what it says.

    7. Salsa Your Face*

      Yes, I agree with this. I don’t think it’s asking if the manager shares every detail about that time she was being treated for depression, I think it’s asking if the manager ever says something like “wow, that was a difficult client meeting. I’m going to take a quick break to decompress, otherwise I won’t be able to concentrate on the next step” or otherwise communicates care and attention to their own feelings and emotions.

  9. Certaintroublemaker*

    LW3, since you are taking on more of the mental/organizational labor for your team of two, you should definitely be Llama Groomer Senior or Llama Groomer Team Lead.

    1. Captain dddd-cccc-ddWdd*

      … but is there a need for a “senior”, or is the issue really with the colleague and her inability to organise, and that’s what should be addressed (whether with accommodations, a PIP or whatever is needed). Another way to think about this is whether, if the colleague left, would the expectation be for OP to be in a senior/lead role relative to the replacement person, or would they be expected to be equals?

  10. Oh help*

    #3 sounds like my relationship with my very sweet, very ADHD-riddled partner. If anyone has any suggestions on how to best manage that romantic scenario, I’m all ears.

    1. WS*

      My partner also has ADHD. It doesn’t work in the same way because we’re not doing a job, we’re a partnership. I will always be responsible for the time keeping and reminding, she takes the lead on social things.

    2. Carey*

      A paper calendar on the wall that all appointments, events, etc get written on. A pad of To-Do lists that my ADHD partner uses for their ongoing tasks lists. For events we’re both attending away from our city, I generally arrange our travel and let them know what time we need to be ready to leave.
      Other than that’s it’s on them to manage their own life. Leaving on time for work with house keys, packed lunch and office entry card? Arranging tickets and travel to sports match? Organizing haircuts, dentist appointments, medical appointments? Not my problem.

      1. Lady Danbury*

        100% this, as a fellow partner to someone with ADHD. We have a shared google calendar for events that we’d both need to know about (not necessarily shared events). If we’re traveling together (whether locally or actual travel), then I let them know what time we need to leave and let them manage their chaos (time blindness!) accordingly. But in general, I’m his partner, not his mother.

        Imo, the best way to partner someone with ADHD is to acknowledge that you cannot change them (applies to any partner, lol) and to understand who they are and what their limitations are (because ADHD is not a one size fits all diagnosis) and then to decide if you can accept a relationship with them as they are. That doesn’t mean that you can’t work together to find strategies for improvement, but they have to be willing to do the work. And all the strategies, medication, etc in the world won’t magically make someone with ADHD neurotypical, so both of you need to adjust your expectations accordingly.

      2. I Have RBF*

        What’s really hilarious is that both I am my spouse have ADHD. I think mine is worse. Neither of us are medicated.

        The funny part is that I am the keeper of calendars, and the person who figures out that to get to a 4 pm appointment 10 miles away we need to start to leave at 3 pm – note: “leaving” means get shoes on, hit bathroom, grabs keys, change glasses, get into car, drive there, disembark passengers and park.

        If we both try to keep separate calendars chaos ensues, because they don’t pad it out enough. They’ll just count the drive time, so they will think “leaving” 30 minutes ahead is fine, then wonder why we’re late. They’ll also have stuff scheduled that I don’t know about until they say “let’s go”. So we keep one calendar.

        I’m also the one who makes the packing lists for trips.

    3. Azalea Bertrand*

      Medication. Would never recommend this to a colleague of course, but you absolutely can to a partner! Ritalin stopped my marriage from falling apart, vyvanse saved it. My husband is a whole new person and I’ve been able to (finally) release some of the mental load. I have a partner now, not an extra child.
      *Not medical advice, YMMV etc etc

    4. SchwaDeVivre*

      It’s going to be different for different ADHDers, but one of the key features that can be helpful is visibility. That might mean everything goes in a shared Google calendar (my partner made this switch for me and thank goodness for it), it may mean having a whiteboard in the kitchen with the calendar and to-do list, it may mean normalizing guilt-free check-ins during the day to see how both of you are getting on, it may mean something else. You’re going to experiment and see what clicks.

      It’s good to keep in mind that a lot of folks with ADHD have been told “if you didn’t remember it, it must not have been important to you”, which is just plain not true for people with ADHD. There’s often a lot of shame and guilt tied up with trying and failing to create systems to plan and remember things, so while that’s not a ticket out of accountability, it is a call for grace and a note that you’ll probably have to iterate on your solutions.

      Habits are also especially tough for ADHDers to form, and systems that used to work can often stop working without warning. Sometimes you can chain things together or create routine, but those can be very sensitive to disruption – like if you go on a vacation and come back.

      The most important thing in my opinion is that your partner is honestly trying things and giving new ideas a go, and that you recognize that they are trying with you. Even if things may fail until you find what works for both of you, continuing to be open to figuring out new systems or coping mechanisms is the key trait.

    5. I edit everything*

      The Holderness Family (you might recognize them from their parody videos on social media–very funny and true to life) just put out a book about living as a family/couple when one partner has ADHD. Supposed to be very good.

      1. Carlie*

        And you can go down an hours-long rabbit hole with their videos about ADHD, gen x, the Amazing Race… (they have different youtube channels: one for songs, one for skits, etc.)

    6. Cardboard Marmalade*

      Everyone is different, but for me I have trouble specifically with task initiation, breaking big tasks down into smaller chunks, and what I call chore-loneliness (basically the opposite of body-doubling, or rather, the things that body-doubling fixes for me). If I have someone to tell me, “Ok! We’re cleaning out the garage today! You start by getting all the tools in one place” or whatever, I will go-go-go like a wind-up toy. It’s not that I’m lazy or unwilling, it’s just that I don’t know how or where to start. THAT SAID, I have dated/cohabitated with someone for whom that strategy did not seem to work at all. I would cheerfully be like, “Ok, let’s put on some music and have a laundry-folding party!” which would’ve worked like magic on me, and he would grudgingly join me and the whole time would act like I had suggested we crawl 4 miles through a sewer pipe, Shawshank Redemption-style. So, I guess my real answer is that you’re not going to get anywhere with someone who doesn’t already have a sense of what works for them, and if they haven’t done the work of introspection/experimentation/consulting a professional to figure that out, honestly it’s not your job as their partner to do it for them. If, however, they know that all they need is a little nudge here, or a reminder there, then hopefully the two of you will be able to find an equitable division of labor where even if you’re the one doing more of the deciding/initiating, they are the one following through and completing the tasks. (Or something akin to that– basically the ideal is that both of you end up doing the same amount of work, when if it’s not the same *kind* of work.)

    7. Not the Droid You're Looking For*

      Saying this with a tone of love and acceptance that can’t come through written word – you just accept what your partner can/can’t manage, and love them through it. If you can’t, it’s not a fault or a bad thing, just a difference like all relationships have differences and you decide if you can make it work.

      Patterns and routines break, whiteboards/chore charts/lists only work until the person doing the mental heavy lifting can’t do it for some reason (like add two kids under 4!), meds are magical but only for some folks, and they’re hard to get at times. I adore my spouse and look forward every day to continuing our shared lifetime together, AND I know that there will never come a day that he can take the lead on running our household, just like I know I’ll never be an Olympic gymnast.

  11. Jai*

    RE: Number 1 – I wouldn’t actually put it into the free-text section, unless the text box is explicitly for feedback about the survey! (Or you can find a way to make it an actual answer to the open text question)

    I work for a company that handles surveys for other companies (including Manager 360s), and in specific, I handle open-text resposnes. If the open-text Q is “Any other feedback” or similar, it generally means “about your manager”, not “about the survey”, and if there’s a comment that says “I don’t think Q4 should be one of the metrics we use”, unless a statistically significant number of people also said that, we’d generally ignore it, as it doesn’t answer the question being asked! If the question is more specific than “any other feedback”, then off-topic responses are even more likely to be ignored. (Again, unless there’s a statistically significant number of people making the comment.)

    If you can instead find a way to feed back about your manager while calling out that you don’t want there to be more talk about mental health, that’s more useful in those questions.

    The other possibility is that no one else is going to be looking at the comments except your manager – in which case, the feedback definitely won’t get back to the person who designed the survey or considers it an important part of the metrics. If you know who designed the survey – or if there’s a contact email for the company that’s handling the survey for your company – it might be more efficient to let them know that the question doesn’t feel useful or appropriate. (Especially if you can get a number of people to do the same thing at the same time!)

    1. OP1*

      Appreciate this insight! I do think I have an email for the person who’s running the survey (who isn’t my manager, but is someone dealing with the training program). Sounds like it might be more useful to reach out to them.

  12. allathian*

    My SIL is a Lutheran preacher and about 8 years ago a guy on the church council who disapproves of women preachers squeezed her hand so hard that he broke two of her metacarpals. At the time, she knew that he had a rough handshake but felt that she couldn’t really refuse to shake his hand. It took months for her hand to fully heal. While she wore a sling, she offered her left hand for handshakes and people adjusted. She used to wear a sling for the church council meetings for about a year even when she didn’t wear it otherwise.

        1. allathian*

          I’m in Finland and we have single payer healthcare (so bills yes but usually not so high you have to remortgage your home or end up homeless), and this was a work-related accident so she got worker’s comp. It’s been a while but I think she took a few days or a week sick leave, mainly because the pain meds she took left her woozy. Even after she returned to work, she had to type one-handed for weeks if not months.

          I agree that it’s assault, but at the time she was a fairly new preacher and he’d been active in church council affairs for decades, and this was a small town with about 5,000 church members. She didn’t have a local support network, we live 250 miles away, although since then she’s thankfully found one. I don’t think she reported it to the authorities.

          That said, the man who assaulted her didn’t put himself forward for re-election to the church council. It’s possible he decided it was time to retire, but I’m sort of hoping that the diocese put a stop to his candidacy.

          My SIL is a gentle soul, and she had to navigate a sexist environment in an area where they were glad to have hired a preacher at all, even if many in her congregation would’ve preferred a man and let her know it. She’s been there for 15 years now and seems to have won the hearts of her congregation. She’s 40 and has grown into her role as an authority figure in her church, and she certainly appears more confident and less self-effacing than she did when she was younger. I don’t think she’d take treatment like that without making a fuss if it happened again.

    2. DJ Abbott*

      Yes, I was just thinking these bone crushing handshakes are a display of macho dominance. For most of my life, I have always gotten the impression the businessman had to have a firm handshake to show authority, confidence, etc. And there are those types who take it even further.
      Did anyone at least tell this man he did wrong injuring your SIL? What a jerk…

    4. Wren*

      Astounded at the people in the comments who’ve received hand-breaking handshakes and didn’t scream! I don’t think I’d have any control of it—I’d be making a scene!

    5. ReallyBadPerson*

      What a nasty bully! I’m sure he wasn’t charged with assault, because in these cases, they seldom are, but he should have been.

    6. Hroethvitnir*

      That is horrifying. Also: not that easy to do, let alone subtly! What on EARTH!

      I feel like people who don’t like handshakes see it all as very uncomfortable (fair!) but it’s important to note that firm, obnoxiously hard, and *literally breaking someone’s bones* are three very, very different things.

      I hate that it seems likely there were no consequences for him.

  13. Kenelm*

    LW4 persistent and invasive questioning has me wondering if people are worried about their own wheelings and dealings. Like “please reassure me that this guy’s stealing large notes from the bank is very different from my stealing small notes from the bank”

      1. Elsa*

        Whether this is the case or not, the LW could use it to her advantage. Any time she gets a message asking to spill the gossip, she could turn it back on the questioner: “Is there anything we should know about why you so urgently need to know what kind of behaviors get you fired?” That could shut them down.

    2. Paint N Drip*

      I’ll say, in the financial services industry when someone gets a regulatory ‘ding’ there IS interest and not all of it is gross (SOME of it is just gossip tbh) – the rules and regs are not alwaysss crystal clear or the use of them might be different than expected, so there is actually quite a lot of professional discussion about compliance failures and how the rest of us can avoid them to best serve our customers in the most trustworthy way.

      1. Troutwaxer*

        But that’s when you have a mandatory meeting the week after and make sure everyone is aware of the relevant regulations, while carefully shutting down all talk of why someone was fired.

        1. Quill*

          Yeah, I imagine this is some combo of gossipmongering and “I need reassurance that the time I accepted a bottle of water from a client is not about to get me fired for accepting a bribe” but OP is not in charge of managing either social phenomenon and even if they were, would not need to do it at midnight!

          If OP draws a firm boundary, both lines of questioning should (eventually) go away.

      2. Observer*

        Yeah, but the LW is not talking about just normal curiosity. Those people backed off when they were told that they need to talk to their own managers. People texting in middle of the night are a different thing. So is a message that asks for the ” hot goss.”

  14. Lily*

    For #1… I think many workplaces and managers have gone too far with the ideas that ‘you should be vulnerable’ and ‘you should bring your whole self to work’.
    Of course I don’t want to live in a world where we’re expected to be identical, emotionless robots. But there are so many examples on AAM where sharing personal information has become expected, being emotional is expected, disclosure about lived experience is expected, and oversharing is encouraged.
    I don’t want to be a shoulder to cry on, I want to be your manager.
    I don’t want to listen to all your fears and vulnerabilities and concerns, I want to you to do your job as my manager.
    I may be downvoted but I say BRING BACK THE BOUNDARIES.
    Professional, warm, respectful, we’re all human, boundaries.

    1. Six Feldspar*

      Agreed, you need to be professional at work and you can be friendLY at work but I don’t think you can be friends with your managers without it going badly wrong, as so many stories here can demonstrate…

      1. allathian*

        Yes, this. I don’t think it’s ever possible for people to simultaneously be friends and in a manager-report relationship. It can’t work without either the management becoming ineffective or the friendship taking a hit at the first attempt of actually trying to manage. Never mind the optics, it’s going to look bad to any other reports in any case.

        That said, I do prefer to work for a manager who’s willing to acknowledge that sometimes events in my private life are going to affect my capacity to work, i.e. I can get sick, my son can get sick, and within the next few years I fully anticipate that my parents, who are in their late 70s, may need more help from me.

        1. Six Feldspar*

          Yes, absolutely! I have a good relationship with my boss and grandboss, we can chat about the weekend or the local sports and we all give each other grace when life happens – but we are not friends!

          1. allathian*

            Exactly. The one time I’ve been insubordinate at work was when a former manager, who was a very touchy-feely person, decided to treat me as her confidante. She told me stuff about her son’s messy divorce, for example, and I was too naive in my late 30s to put a stop to it. So when she decided I had too much work on my plate, in addition to a huge special project that left me basically burned out, and intervened by taking some of the other work away, I lost it and literally yelled at her in the office. I guess I was lucky that I wasn’t escorted off the premises, but we did have to attend mediation sessions through our EAP. I basically realized that I couldn’t respect my manager’s authority because she treated me like a friend.

            At the end of that process I managed a sincere apology, but our professional relationship never recovered and our friendship died. She decided to get out of management, went to a sister organization for about a year and returned to do a special project for our department director, so she wouldn’t be managed by a former report, for a few months until she retired. Thankfully she retired during the pandemic so there was no in-person retirement party, and I just didn’t log on to the virtual one.

            I’m very happy to say that I’ve had professional managers who understand why managers can’t be friends with their reports since then.

    2. Irish Teacher.*

      I honestly see it as infantalising. It seems like some workplaces are starting to see themselves like schools for adults (and I’d even debate whether some of this stuff is appropriate for schools as teachers are not usually qualified in things like mental health and sometimes give very inaccurate information). There is some logic to schools being all things to children and teenagers because adults can generally be assumed to know more about life in general than children and children often don’t have many opportunities to socialise on their own bat (especially those who have unsupportive parents and/or live in isolated areas) but adults are capable of handling their own health, making their own friends, developing their own hobbies, etc and there is no reason to assume a manager or employer knows any more about these things than their employees.

      I don’t mind people discussing personal topics at work if they are discussing them with people who they have that kind of relationship with and they choose to do so. I do mind companies deciding that they should evaluate people on things like whether they are being “vulnerable” enough or socialising enough with colleagues or eating healthily. It’s not their place and they often don’t even have the necessary knowledge to judge such things.

    3. ecnaseener*

      You wouldn’t be downvoted here for saying that even if we had upvotes and downvotes on this site :) just look at how many related posts were linked in the answer!

    4. OP1*

      This is exactly how I feel! I do like my manager as a person, and we’re friendly, and we have talked a bit about personal things going on in our lives when it feels natural & we want to share. But also, I don’t want it to be an expectation for her to HAVE to share anything personal! I think boundaries are important in a professional relationship.

  15. Melissa*

    #2
    When someone approaches you with their (right) hand outstretched, you can respond by meeting it with your LEFT hand. At the same time, you say “Sorry, right one is injured!” It’s hard for them to squeeze hard in that situation (because the hands don’t line up right), so they’ll end up taking it lightly while you both have a “This is awkward!” chuckle together. It reads as friendlier than not shaking at all but accomplishes the same thing in your case.

    1. High Score!*

      That could backfire by the person using BOTH their hands to grip yours in an enthusiastic double friendly painful grip. The best way is to keep your hands away. One person I know has arthritis and cannot shake hands, he is open and friendly about this and everyone is ok with it.

    3. I Have RBF*

      LOL. I don’t have use of my right hand, at all. So all my handshakes are lefty. Some folks still try the dominance grip.

  16. sb51*

    LW2 — if you want to give people who’ve already put their hand out a graceful save, saying you have an injury but a gentle fist bump is okay (and you can use your left hand if you prefer) could ease the awkwardness you might feel. Especially if this guy is important enough that you want to make a good impression (even if he’s going to forget you again).

    1. Delta Delta*

      I get out ahead of it and offer the knuckles before the handshake can be initiated. The other person pretty much always responds to the fist bump. No explanation needed.

  17. Earlk*

    For the colleague with ADHD just stop organising tasks for her. I have ADHD and would love if I had someone to break down my tasks for me so I wouldn’t push back if they automatically offered to do so but I also wouldn’t assume they resented me for it if they were continuously taking the initiative to do so.

    1. Heather*

      It would be a kindness though, especially since you are friends outside of work, to have a discussion with the ADHD colleague to the effect that managing the workload for both of you is no longer manageable and that they need to figure out accommodations with management. At the same time, management needs informed that you are dropping the rope as well.

      1. Earlk*

        It would be a kindness to let her know she is fed up with it because it doesn’t seem like it was requested by the colleague. The colleague got to the same point in their career as the LW without them so why has LW assumed they won’t manage without them? It may go smoother in the LWs eyes to be organising the tasks but splitting them by assignment as Allison suggested and not getting involved may show that the colleague is perfectly capable of getting to the endpoint even if it’s not the way LW would have done it. And if she can’t, then it’s the manager’s problem.

  18. Irish Teacher.*

    LW1, I’d answer that question as if it were asking if she behaves appropriately, lets you know if she is busy, demonstrates good work-life boundaries, etc. I’m not sure if that is what it means. If it is, it’s phrased pretty badly, but I’d just answer it as “does she take her bad moods out on us, bring problems into work and then leave it unclear whether she is unhappy with our work or with something personal, take time off unexpectedly without making it clear who is to cover for her if she is ill, etc?”

    If not, then I would say she is behaving appropriately. I’d take inappropriate to be oversharing or taking stress out on people at work or changing the rubrics depending on what mood she’s in or not showing up regularly, leaving you unsure if she is ill or off-site and about what is to be done in her absence and when she will be back, that sort of thing.

    1. OP1*

      Yeah, I’ve mentioned elsewhere now that it feels unlikely for this to be the intended meaning, because there are other questions that address those topics (and none of the other questions overlap like this would if this were the intended question). That said, I do think it’s reasonable to interpret it this way, and maybe I can try to position it like this! I definitely would prefer for this to be the question.

  19. Lab Snep*

    For number 5, are you calling from what would show ad “Unknown Number”?

    A lot of people (not me because I have a lot of legit calls) have their phones set to automatically send those to the void. They won’t even know there’s a voicemail unless they look for it, because it won’t give a notification.

    While I know it’s probably best practice to have that option off when you’re waiting for phone calls, it also opens people to a lot of unwanted spam calls as well.

    2. Yes And*

      More than that – a lot of people (including me) auto-reject all calls not in our contacts list. OP could (should?) include in their scheduling email, “I’ll be calling from xxx-xxx-xxxx. Please add me to your contacts to ensure the call goes through.”

  20. I should really pick a name*

    #5
    Before leaving a voicemail, I suggest calling a second time. I’ve often had calls go to voicemail the first time, but work fine the second

    1. Hastily Blessed Fritos*

      That’s one way people can set Do Not Disturb, that a second call from the same number within a few minutes will ring through.

      1. I should really pick a name*

        I assume that the LW wants to successfully reach the person that they’re interviewing at the scheduled time.

      3. Dahlia*

        I don’t think hitting redial is that much work, but as seen above, sometimes people don’t even get the voicemail.

    3. Simon Farnsworth*

      On Android, there’s an option for “do not disturb” to let through “repeat callers”; if you call with the same caller ID twice in 15 minutes, you are deemed to be a “repeat caller”, and the phone rings instead of directing you to voicemail.

      If the candidate has turned on do not disturb because they’re about to go into an interview, and has forgotten that they need to whitelist the interviewer as an allowed caller, calling a second time after leaving a voicemail will trigger the “repeat caller” behaviour, and ring their phone (if they’ve set that option).

  21. Simon Farnsworth*

    For LW4; in a similar situation, I’ve had some success getting a script together with my manager’s help where I can say things along the lines of “I really don’t know much here; my-manager just told me that it was related to the annual mandatory training we all get, and I’ve got to tell our clients that we’ve let their point of contact go”.

    With a bit of careful tweaking of the script, you can make it sound like you’ve shared everything you know with the gossip sharks, while sharing nothing that’s not already public and also emphasizing that the regulatory training isn’t just a chore – it’s rules that you must follow. You need your manager involved, though, to ensure that the script doesn’t accidentally disclose more than you intend it to.

    1. Feelings*

      I agree with the script. It is implementable and moves the conversation away discussing what happened to the fired co-worker.

      Most importantly to me the script is not about “feelings.” Feeling upset co-worker doesn’t think asking is inappropriate. Feeling upset the co-worker is asking repeatedly about this. Feeling upset co-worker was fired.

      1. Simon Farnsworth*

        If you’re lucky, the script can name a training that tells you not to gossip as one of the ones that might have been responsible for co-worker’s downfall. That is then a huge hint to the gossip sharks that they’re on dangerous territory.

        And agreed about making it feeling-free; it’s about what manager asked you to do with clients, what trainings you need to remember to avoid the same fate, and other facts; let the feelings be something the gossip sharks extract from your manager, not from you.

    2. Artemesia*

      This. It is better to tell them something innocuous than to be coy and say ‘I have a secret but I’m not allowed to tell.’ That sort of thing just fuels the gossip.

  22. Alicent*

    LW5: Your calls might be going into the void because a spammer cloned your number and it was reported several times as a spam call. It’s super easy to have someone else’s number show up on caller ID these days (or else I wouldn’t get 16 a day about selling my property in a state I’ve never been to). Sometime also technology goes a bit awry in other ways, but if you’re hearing it from multiple people the problem is likely on your end.

  23. KT*

    #5 I’ve experienced this in hiring, and I have a (totally unproven) theory: people put their phone on Do Not Disturb mode because they have an interview. A great idea in theory! But…they don’t realize that it sends all calls automatically to voicemail. Most folks seem to get the voicemail and call back, and I also follow up with an email if I don’t get a call back within 5 minutes.

    1. Somehow I Manage*

      You may be onto something here. My phone offers to go to DND if I have something on my calendar written a specific way. I have to accept it, but the candidates may have it set to do so automatically.

    2. Leia Oregano*

      Yep, I missed an interview call this way once! Thought I was all prepared and being sooo responsible by setting my phone to DND…only to not get the call, because it was immediately silenced. I had to call back and apologize so we could continue on with the call! It was a final-round chat with the department’s director and thankfully it didn’t seem to tarnish my candidacy, but unfortunately it was April 2020 and the state instituted a hiring freeze before they could make a final hiring decision and get the paperwork through.

  24. TPS reporter*

    to LW 5, maybe people are forgetting or there’s a time zone mix up. do you send a calendar invite? that could also include a link to a non video call, or instructions to call you if they don’t hear from you within the 5 minutes start window

  25. 653-CXK*

    OP#4: Shit disturbers and random texters looking for “hot goss[ip]” should be shut down sharply and immediately, stating “I am not divulging this information. Do not continue to ask for it.”

    If they insist, go one level (or more) up to whoever manages them and tell them what’s going on. “I’ve been constantly been asked about the departure of one of our colleagues. Please state that under no uncertain terms am I to be contacted for this information, and any attempts to do so will be ignored.” If the managers are the type to put the fear of God and termination into them, the search for “hot goss” will be extinguished.

    1. Aspiring Chicken Lady*

      I can see all those hot gossipers now wanting to know the scoop about why the manager raised a fuss.

    2. Troutwaxer*

      I think I’d probably turn it around. “As you know I can’t talk about it for privacy reasons. But anytime there’s a firing you should be aware that management will be looking at everyone else closely, so instead of trying to learn what’s up maybe you should concentrate on your own side of the operation and make sure everything you do meets expectations and complies with all our internal rules and all government regulations, without exception.”

      When I learn that a colleague has been fired I usually go to my manager with the following script: “Is there anything I need to know about why Cerci isn’t with us anymore?”

      1. 653-CXK*

        I like this answer! It dampens the burning desire to while it turns the discomfort on them…”I can’t tell you for regulatory reasons, but keep your eyes on your own work and you won’t have to worry about the gossip later on.”

  26. Insert Pun Here*

    Re: spam calls, it might also help to say “I’ll be calling from [number] — you might want to add me to your contacts since many phones reject calls from unknown callers.” Some people won’t bother to do it and you’ll still have problems reaching them, but others will.

    My phone also does the thing where a voicemail shows up hours after the call, so glad to see from the comments here that it’s not just me! I’ve never been able to figure out why it happens (and for the most part don’t really care.)

    1. Jennifer Strange*

      I’ve done that when scheduling calls! My cell phone number’s area code is from the state where I grew up, but I now live in a state 1,000+ miles away, so if I’m scheduling a call over email I say “I’ll be calling from 555-555-5555. It’s my number from when I lived in Texachussettes, so I wanted to give you a head’s up so you don’t think I’m a spam caller!”

    2. Just Thinkin' Here*

      Agreed – my phone also shows a voicemail well after the fact. And my phone will also warn “possible spam” whenever a call comes from a caller ID blocked number. Providing an email and a phone number in case something happens is an easy fix. You can even set up a separate “google number” so the calls aren’t going to your work cell etc.

  27. Somehow I Manage*

    OP3 – I’d suggest tackling this with two steps. First, talk to your coworker/friend and just suggest that when tasks are assigned, you divide them up between yourselves, taking on the entire task. A shared spreadsheet that shows those projects might help so you’re able to both see how your workload is balanced would be a good starting point, too. I think you can be clear with your coworker, too, that you’re feeling like when you’re dividing up aspects of the larger task, things could easily fall through the cracks and you want to ensure that neither of you miss anything. You’re not placing blame anywhere…just observing that steps could be missed.

    Then if that doesn’t work, talk to your manager. There could be a different way for them to assign things. Maybe they need to be more specific in those assignments rather than shooting them over to both of you. Or maybe your manager does see that you need to take on more of a project manager role.

    But start with a conversation between the two of you first. Figure out if there’s a different and better way for you to manage your work and see how that works.

    1. Adalind*

      Agree with this. I’m a highly organized person and my coworker is not. Sometimes our manager or executive or whoever wants something done will email one of us an assignment. Other times they email both of us. We usually will discuss who wants to take it. I do get annoyed on occasion because I am detail oriented and end up having to fix something and feel like I could’ve just done it myself, but that’s a me thing I need to get over. He even used to call me his manager and I had to keep saying “I am not your manager!”

      Also, as another commenter mentioned, our job titles do reflect the difference. To borrow their example – I am Llama Groomer II while he is Llama Groomer I.

  28. Alton Brown's Evil Twin*

    #5 – I always let people know what area code I’ll be calling from as a way to cut down the reflexive swipe-left that some people have.

    1. Delta Delta*

      This is a good one. I am an attorney and practice in certain court hearings that are often done remotely. Sometimes we need the court to call the participants through the remote platform and it looks like a call from a different state. I ALWAYS warn my client/participant that it will look like a call from that other state so they answer it.

  29. HonorBox*

    Regarding the missed interview calls, because this is happening regularly, a switch in methodology might be needed. I was initially thinking that people are just not answering because it is a number they don’t recognize, but given the frequency that it happens, there may be something else going on. OP, I would start out by giving the candidates the number you’re going to be calling from and ask them to put it into their phone. You could even say that you’ve come to understand that your calls can look like spam or come up from an unknown number, and you want to be sure the candidate sees that you’re calling. You could also change the phone you’re calling from. Not always the easiest, but this is becoming a pattern apparently, so could you call from a landline and not your cell? And I agree with the suggestion of asking someone to call you at (number) if they don’t receive your call at the agreed upon time. It may take a little more explanation than necessary, but people generally understand that phones can be weird, so just pulling back the curtain a bit and explaining that your number sometimes goes to VM directly would at least give someone some insight.

    And let’s be clear about something, too. It is very possible that a percentage of the candidates just aren’t answering your call and aren’t bothering to look for the VM. I called someone the other day, left a detailed message, and they called back a bit later without listening to the message. The extra few minutes was unnecessary because everything I told them was included in the message. It is an easy excuse to say that you didn’t get a call and never got a VM too. So I don’t want to place the blame entirely on you, suggest that you need to make all the changes, and expect that you’ll get perfect results. But at the very least, if you do a little bit of legwork to make some changes on your end, you might get some better results.

  30. Delta Delta*

    #4 – This may be a personal style thing, but I would go aloof on this.

    Coworker: ZOMG! Why did Waken get the axe? Gimme all the deets!
    Me: Yeah, I don’t know. (said sounding just bored enough that it’s possible I don’t know)
    Coworker: For realz, tho? You totally know what happened to Wakeen.
    Me: Yeah, I don’t know (even more bored this time)

    They have nowhere to go with this and if you make it clear that the more they ask the more you’ll shut it down they’ll stop. Also, people generally have short attention spans, so within a week or so people will have moved on from Wakeen getting fired to Lucinda eating all the donuts in the break room or whatever.

  31. She of Many Hats*

    LW 5 – We all know that people don’t answer calls from numbers they don’t recognize even if they’re supposedly expecting a call from a new person. Either warn the candidates “Expect my call from #555-5555” or ask them to add your number to their contacts so their firewalls don’t block it.

  32. dulcinea47*

    #5- some phones have settings where they will send unknown numbers straight to voicemail. I’ve read of this happening without peoples’ knowledge when the phone updates and changes settings. IDK if it would be appropriate for you to warn people to check their phone settings but that could potentially have something to do with it.

  33. Imalurker*

    Wear a bigger than average ring, or one that’s slightly pointy. I’ve dealt with my share of hand crushers and pointy rings are the best way to get them to ease up mid-shake without overtly coming across as aggressive yourself.

    PS – they absolutely know that they’re crushing your hand. It’s really hard to accidentally use enough force to genuinely make someone uncomfortable. Most handshakes are NOT that firm.

  34. BW*

    LW2. I think wearing a brace on your right hand would be fine.

    My husband taught me how to shake hands so my hand won’t get crushed. No limp, just the finger tips. That’s how your hand gets crushed. Instead, make a finger gun with your pointer finger out, and the other three fingers curled in. That’s the shape your hand should be in.

    When you go to shake hands, slide your pointer finger up the other persons wrist. Make sure the area between your thumb and pointer finger goes in as far as it can and makes full contact with the other person’s area between their thumb and pointer finger. Grasp firmly.

    Practice with other people, and have them do different amounts of firmness on their side, so you can tell where you need your hand to be.

    Also, be strong and firm yourself. It will cause the other person’s eyes to look startled, because they’re be so used to dead fish handshakes, that a good handshake will shake them up.

    1. Elitist Semicolon*

      That is perhaps the creepiest sounding handshake ever and I would absolutely recoil if someone slid their finger up my hand or wrist. The point of a handshake isn’t to have the firmer grip or to startle them or “shake them up” – it’s to express a greeting. I’ll just do what my colleague does – cheerfully saying “enthusiastic wave!” while actually waving – and it’ll all be fine.

      1. Irish Teacher.*

        Yeah, you generally want to make the other person feel comfortable and as if you are pleased to meet them. A handshake is meant to set a person at ease, not startle or “shake them up.”

        1. Shipwreck1515*

          Nothing wrong with letting out a shriek, holding your hand as if it’s broken, and leaving to go get it x-rayed. Not that you have to do that, but him thinking you did is all that matters. Crushing your hand is unnecessary, unprofessional, and just plain ridiculous.

  35. Overthinking It*

    Their phones may be blocking you, or you might be coming up on the screens as “potential spam” (are you hiring for a call center operation by any chance?) I don’t know how the phone algorithms determine who is “potential Spam”. Nobody has their phone registered under that name! But somehow the phones know – or at least think they do – and you dud say you are making a high number of these calls. Ask you tech people or phone provider if they can fix it, but in the meantime, warn the prospects when you set the appointment, and give them the number you will be calling from. Advise them to save it, at least temporarily, under your company name.

    1. OP1*

      Yeah I’m always a little wary of “anonymous” surveys, but I don’t think my manager herself would be able to trace it to me because she doesn’t have the back end info. I assume HR or whoever’s running it would, but my manager is actually great so I don’t have a reason to say anything that I would be worried about taking ownership of!

      2. WhyAreThereSoManyBadManagers*

        I once filled out a survey from a recruiting event I went to, I was honest that it was extremely disorganized, not productive, and I probably wouldn’t attend again especially given the fee we had to pay to attend; well somehow the event organizer found out it was me who submitted that response and she reported it/complained about it to my boss! She was actually happy that it got me in trouble as a “complainer” even though my comments were honest and legitimate. So ever since then I rarely if ever fill out surveys, esp event rating surveys. I don’t trust them.

  37. El l*

    OP4:
    For once I’ll disagree with the advice. What your next move should be IMHO is to tell your manager that you need their support to end this. I’d ask them to send a team message to the effect of, “Please stop asking why — was let go. Those who know have legal obligations not to discuss it. They can’t talk about it. Further, it’s come to our attention that people have been bothered on personal devices after-hours looking for gossip. Knock it off now.”

    1. Ginger Cat Lady*

      They *already* have management support, and it sounds like management has already done something like what you suggest.
      Messages to the whole team never work for stuff like this. Too diluted. Everyone thinks it’s only meant for everyone else and they are just fine.
      Manager needs to contact individuals personally “Curtis, you are behaving badly and need to stop. If you do not stop, (consequences) will happen.”

  38. rebelwithmouseyhair*

    OP1 please do write N/A and add in the comments section that you do not want to discuss mental health with your manager, that it’s inappropriate and that everyone is entitled to privacy and confidentiality regarding such matters and it’s time to retire that question from the survey.

    One time, a boss shared with me and a colleague that he was in the midst of a depression (his wife had just left him, telling him exactly why, and part of her reasons involved work since she had founded the company and he then wormed his way in and was trying to oust her as manager). He told us he was going to stay in his in-laws’ country home for a while, to reflect on his faults and how he could move forward, so could we please tell him everything about him that annoyed us so he could think about all that too.
    We both sat in a stony silence. I mean, he was that toxic, I wouldn’t even have known where to start, but if I gave him an honest list and he then overdosed or whatever I know I would forever feel guilty. The guy did have kids after all who didn’t deserve a family tragedy to happen on top of mummy leaving daddy.
    We would very much have preferred him to say nothing.

    1. OP1*

      Oh wow! Luckily I can’t ever see my manager doing that, but yeah, this is exactly the sort of situation that I think an emphasis on “sharing mental health” can lead to. I do want to push back on it a bit but am trying to figure out the best way to phrase it!

    3. Salty Caramel*

      I’ll take “Things I didn’t want to know for $1,000” please.

      While it’s laudable for him to develop some self-awareness, this is so far from appropriate it needs a passport to get home. I think I would have been shocked into silence too. No good could come of that conversation, IMO.

      1. allathian*

        Indeed. It’s entirely inappropriate for managers to ask for emotional support from their reports. I’d argue that it’s equally inappropriate for reports to ask the same from their managers, although slightly less so. Managers have a duty of care that employees don’t.

        At my government employer, people are very rarely escorted out. We have an early intervention program that requires employees (and usually their manager) to attend sessions with an occupational health counselor via our EAP (I’ve done this when I was insubordinate to an oversharing manager who treated me as her confidante).

        Managers have the authority to require employees to attend these sessions as a condition of employment in cases when an employee has behaved in a way that could result in termination if said behavior continues, and this could be anything from insubordination to some forms of harassment/poor treatment of other employees or customers, or substance abuse on the job or in a way that clearly affects the job, etc.

        The early intervention program started after a departmental director was found to have debilitating alcoholism. His breath smelled of alcohol pretty much every day, and I’m pretty sure he kept a stash of vodka in his desk. Nothing was done about this until he was found passed out in the supply closet one morning. At this point he was severely enough debilitated that our employer could require him to go to rehab as a condition of employment. Unfortunately the rehab didn’t take and he was let go. On my team, we weren’t allowed to even mention his name because our then-boss, who’d worked with him before, thought it was gossip. Not quite fair, because this even applied when we were discussing work he’d initiated before the alcoholism took him. After he died, it was suddenly okay to mention his name again.

        Now they can require you to get evaluated for alcoholism if someone smells alcohol on your breath during working hours.

  39. swollie*

    OP 5: As others have mentioned, it’s possible/likely that your call is legitimately not going through to the end user AND the voicemail is ending up in a spam voicemail folder that isn’t readily accessible. I’ve had this happen both as the caller and the receiver when interviewing for roles. One way around this that I found helpful as the caller/interviewer was to set up the interview using a free conference call number so that both folks are dialing into that instead of it being a direct call to someone. This has the added benefit of being able to keep your own phone number confidential (especially if you’re using a personal cell!) without needing to mask your number (which is what often leads to the call being treated as blocked/spam).

  40. rebelwithmouseyhair*

    OP5 if it’s the younger generation, don’t bother with voice mail they barely know what that is and find it very strange. They are fine with voice messages on WhatsApp, or text messages, but for some reason a voice message on your phone’s answering machine just doesn’t wash. My daughter doesn’t even know how to listen to the messages.
    Also, while I’m fine listening to messages, I’ve noticed that this and my previous phone didn’t necessarily notify me of them for a good 24hrs, which of course could be problematic at work. I actually recorded a message to say please don’t leave a message because I don’t always see that I’ve got one, please use text as if I were a teenager. If I see that someone called and I didn’t answer, I’ll call them back and they are very often still laughing at my message, so I know they do listen!

    1. Lake (they/them)*

      what. I’m 25 and I perfectly understand voicemail, as does everyone I know. your daughter should probably figure that out…

    2. McGovern's the One*

      If the candidate is expecting a call on their phone, I think it’s reasonable that they know how to access the various functions of the device. I’m sure your daughter knows how to listen to her voicemail

    3. Dahlia*

      My phone doesn’t have an “answering machine”. My phone has a service that I have to call and put in a password and sit there for 10 minutes listening to all the options to hear a spam voicemail.

  41. I'm just here for the cats!!*

    For #5 I think a few weeks ago there was a minor issue with voicemails. I know mine wouldn’t show voicemails until the day later. So there could be something odd going on. Or your number is listed as spam or something.

    On the other side, as someone who has to call clients I’ve gotten this before. I KNOW I called the right number that they gave me and I know I left a voicemail. It seems a lot of people don’t check their voicemail or it is not properly set up
    =

  42. Brad Deltan*

    LW5 stop coordinating work people over the phone.

    That’s the answer. Just stop it.

    Besides the considerable percentage of people who HATE phone calls, the rise of AI-driven spam calls is about to render phone calls literally a thing of the past, as everyone’s phone will be ringing nonstop from them. And I mean literally nonstop. Just one of these cold-call sales systems can place 35,000 calls over ten minutes.

    1. Bella Ridley*

      Do you have a solution for the OP rather than to just say they should stop?

      What industry are you in that phone calls will be a thing of the past? They are still spectacularly common in many, many, many fields, and even spam is probably not going to stop that.

      1. Brad Deltan*

        You misunderstand me. I mean ALL phone calls will be a thing of the past. Not just in certain industries. I mean literally everyone’s phone will be ringing every three minutes with another spam call, 24 hours a day, seven days a week.

        I understand this is a bold prediction. It holds up under scrutiny if one knows anything about how gAI has progressed to the point where it can fool most people, in limited circumstances, in a real time voice conversation. And also if you know anything about how the global industry of cold-call sales (somewhat legit, but slimy) and scam callers (not legit at all) works and how this is a game changer for them. They both function entirely on volume to play averages to find marks/victims. This application of gAI allows them to ramp up from 100 calls per human per ten hours…to 35,000 calls every ten MINUTES. And with no humans needed in your call center. Your fixed costs plummet. Your opportunity costs plummet. And your odds of getting suckers who give you their money rise considerably.

        The wild card is regulation, but in the USA that’s been laughably inadequate for decades. The original law was passed in 1991, then “strengthed” by the Do Not Call registry law in 2003 and revised in 2007. None of which has made the slightest bit of difference. But this new level scammers/spammers are poised to take things to could shift the paradigm, finally, as people everywhere (including rich/powerful people and lawmakers) are forced to literally shut off the parts of their smartphones that accept incoming phone calls to get away from the incessant noise.

    2. Caramel & Cheddar*

      She’s not coordinating with them over the phone, she’s trying to conduct an interview. Doing the phone screen on Teams or Zoom is an alternative, I suppose, but a video call for something as simple as a phone screen seems like overkill.

      If she was just trying to set up an interview, I’d absolutely tell her to do so via email. But this is happening after the interview time has been set up and people are no showing the interview. If you know that you’re supposed to have an interview with someone at 3pm and you also get a call at 3pm, that’s a call you should answer. [If her calls are indeed going through, and not being marked as spam.]

      1. Brad Deltan*

        The answer is to understand that it doesn’t matter what the LW is doing, or what industry they’re in, or what they want or don’t want to do. The system itself is “going away” and very soon. Either the LW adapts or they simply won’t be doing their job anymore, because they won’t be able to call anyone at all; everyone will be forced to shut their phones off (or more precisely, the part of their phone that accepts incoming calls) to get away from the nonstop tsunami of junk calls. It’ll be orders of magnitude worse than it is today.

    5. GenX Enters the Chat*

      This is absurd. Businesses use phones. A brief phone screener should not be shifted over to zoom/skype/literally anything that involves seeing the race, gender, size, and home of the person being interviewed. Prepping for a phone interview should not have to involve setting up a home studio and doing your hair.

      I work in a place where people call us ALL THE TIME. The only way to tell if a person being hired to answer the phones can be civil and coherent when answering is to… guess what? Talk to them on the phone.

      1. VintageLydia*

        I know at least Teams allows for audio-only calls and I imagine many of the others do as well. Setting up a conference call solves the issue if it’s a technology problem (which it might be based on the frequency.)

  43. jasmine*

    The way that some employers are treating mental health actually reminds me of something that happened with my cousins once. This happened twice (with two separate cousins). I was going through something kind of traumatic (and not the kind of thing that you could keep private). I was talking to my cousin on the phone about it, getting support and all that. And my cousin asks if I was seeing a therapist to help me through it.

    Now I had been seeing a therapist for a while now, but I wasn’t comfortable sharing that with family. So I just said no. But they kept on pushing me to go to therapy and to understand that there was no shame in it. I wish I had better boundaries, but I was young, I was going through said traumatic experience, and I just told them the truth about my going to therapy to get them to just drop it.

    Fighting the stigma around mental health is not done by not respecting people’s privacy around it.

    1. Ineffable Bastard*

      I think it’s a different case — as you were venting and looking for support, your cousins were likely very concerned about you and worried that if they did not “convince” you to get help of a professional, things could get worse to you. People can feel very guilty if they feel they could not help you enough because they do not have the knowledge and training. If you said “yes” to the question and they pried and kept asking questions about your therapist, then yes, it would be a disrespect of your privacy that needed to be cut out. I understand why you felt pressured about something you did not want to share and I also understand why they did it.

      I hope things got better for you.

      1. Orv*

        Often “are you seeing a therapist?” is also a subtle hint that someone feels like you’re using THEM as your therapist, and they’re not comfortable with it.

    2. allathian*

      At a guess, they kept pushing because they felt they’d provided as much support as they could and realized that it probably wasn’t enough.

      Next time when you’re talking with family or friends about a mental health issue or a traumatic event and someone asks if you’re seeing a therapist, I’d bet good money that they’re really saying “you need more help than I can give you, please talk to a professional.”

      Obviously it would be better if they could say that outright, but if you’ve never been allowed to either state your boundaries or to expect them to be respected, it has to be learned. It’s been my experience that people who are good at stating and holding their boundaries generally respect other people’s stated boundaries as well.

  44. Scott M*

    #2 When offered the handshake, grip the top edge of his hand with your left hand, while explaining you are recovering from a hand injury. While it is awkward to shake hands this way, it at least gives him something to do with the offered hand, which makes it less awkward than having to withdraw it.

    I have experienced others do this with me for multiple reasons, they have a deformed right hand, they are carrying something in their left hand (suitcase, box, child), or an injury. It’s totally normal once you experience it and he probably has.

  45. Juicebox Hero*

    When I was grade school age, my brother, who is 11 years older, had a friend who liked to shake hands with me and pretend to be in excruciating pain when I squeezed. When you’re a 10 year old girl, the idea that you’re squashing a grown man’s hand makes you feel pretty badass.

    We met up again at an event last year and I suggested a crushing handshake for old times’ sake. Unfortunately my hands are a heck of a lot stronger now. Sorry, Bruce!

  46. It Ain't Me Babe*

    #1 I always say that everything is rainbows and unicorns. Maybe I’m paranoid, but I know that even an “anonymous” survey administered via email can contain metadata that identifies the responder.

    1. OP1*

      Oh for sure. If I do say anything in the free response section about not wanting to discuss mental health, I would be very careful about wording so that it’s something I would be okay with having my name attached to (and honestly probably try to put a positive spin on it. “I love how my manager has professional boundaries!” Lol).

    3. Orv*

      That and the prevalence of companies where anything less than all 5 star ratings means “fire that employee” has caused me to just reflexively give the top rating for everything.

  47. Pizza Rat*

    #5–you have a pattern here and the info is coming from multiple sources. This is on your end.

    There’s always the flukes. I emailed and called a recruiter who never showed up to a phone interview. I got a scolding email saying he called on time and there was no record of a call at that time on my phone.

    This is not that case. You need to investigate and put checks in place.

  48. Cat Lady in the Mountains*

    LW5: I’ve been asking folks to dial in to a phone-only zoom call (I don’t even share the video link, just the dial-in number and code) or conference line. That way I’m not dealing with the spam call situation. If someone doesn’t dial in at the scheduled time, doesn’t let me know something’s up, and it’s a high-volume role that I have a million candidates for, I’m not gonna make any effort to reschedule.

    1. Brad Deltan*

      This would be a perfectly acceptable solution to my admittedly apocalyptic-sounding pronouncement on this front (search on my name to see the comments). Personally I think this is superior anyways. Calling someone always feels so rude, like you’re interrupting their day. Or more precisely, that’s how I feel when someone calls me. Even if it’s scheduled. I know just because I feel that way doesn’t mean everyone else does…but I’ll bet quite a few people do.

      Also it seems a little easier for the interviewer, although I’d be curious to know if I’m mistaken on this. But I’d think setting up a basic phone-only Zoom (or Teams or whatever) means you can work on something else convenient whilst waiting for the other person to join. And if they never do? Oh well, scratch that name off the list, right?

  49. Strive to Excel*

    OP #1 – horribly worded question. It comes across as very invasive. My generous read on it is that it’s asking about how well your manager models mental health/self care at work. People follow the example set by their superior. For instance, if your boss says “leave at 5” but then stays until 7 PM there’s people who will stay late from perceived pressure. So if your manager is either modelling healthy work habits or giving really clear direction and feedback to make sure you can have a healthy work habit,

    1. Strive to Excel*

      Dangit, cut off too early.

      “My manager models and encourages healthy workplace habits” could be a totally relevant answer to that question, without going into way too invasive.

  50. Caramel & Cheddar*

    LW3, you said “I’m sure she’s aware that so much of it ends up falling to me, but this is never explicitly acknowledged” — are you sure she’s aware? You describe her as hands off, so unless you’re actively telling her that you’re carrying the load, I wouldn’t assume that she knows you’re managing the work so much. If the work is getting done, she has no reason to worry about the breakdown of who is doing what. Talk to her.

  51. CTA*

    Re: #5

    I had something similar happen to me. I was expecting a screening call from HR. 15 minutes past the time, I email to ask if everything is ok. The HR person says they called me, went to voicemail, and my voicemail was full. My phone didn’t ring and I had no log of a missed call. We rescheduled for another date and the HR person gave me her contact number in case it happens again. HR said they might have experienced bad reception, so I think she was using a cell phone instead of a land line in an office building.

    I thought it was so wild. I never had that happen before and haven’t had that happen since. A few days later, I had a friend call me and they got to my voicemail fine. At a random networking event, someone overheard me tell this story and he said something like that happened to him (no log of missed call and caller said voicemail was full). No idea how this happened. PS – This was many years ago before I had any sort of call blocker on my cell phone.

    1. Alan*

      Yeah, glitches happen. People sometimes tell me that e-mail to me bounces too, even if they have the right address. Who knows?

  52. Been there… sort of*

    LW 2 – the only problem with the brace is that there are some lunatics out there who will then try to shake your left hand! I had this happened to me when I had a broken elbow and before I could even do anything about it, they just grabbed my left hand! Which actually hurt because my hand wasn’t ready for it and it was just awkward

  53. Caramel & Cheddar*

    LW #5 — I wonder if you could also let the candidates know what number you’ll be calling from, so that a) they can recognize it coming in (presuming it doesn’t go to spam), and/or b) they can add you to their list of contacts in advance so that the call has a better chance of not being flagged as spam? As someone who doesn’t typically answer unknown numbers, I’d probably do option B if I knew the number in advance.

  54. SoCal Kate*

    For OP #2, you could consider going for a fist bump. I have a similar issue where if someone shakes my hand too hard it can really hurt for a while. When people reach out to shake my hand, I instead offer a fist and they usually quickly pivot to a fist bump. I have had someone fist bump so hard it hurt a little, but the rate at which it happens compared to a handshake is much lower.

    Since you are meeting with the CEO, I might still wear your hand brace to signal why you are going for a fist bump instead of a handshake.

  55. Jo*

    #3 I like the advice given, but offer another perspective. Good teams are often comprised of people with strengths and weaknesses that compliment each other. Is there an area where your co-worker could take responsibility to offset the extra work you put in organizing the tasks? For instance, if she’s really detailed oriented and you share supply stocking, could she fully take that on with you being more a cross-trained backup?

  56. All het up about it*

    #3 – I like Alison’s advice and the other suggestions. However, I was really struck by I’m sure she’s aware that so much of it ends up falling to me, but this is never explicitly acknowledged. How, OP, are you sure? Unless you have had the direct conversation, you can’t be sure. You can only assume. And many of us have been there, thinking it’s SOO obvious the work we are doing, but sometimes, it’s just not to those managing us.

    I think starting with changing how you handle assignments is a good step – if possible. (Sometimes it’s harder to take whole assignments when you are part-time.) But I also don’t think having an honest conversation with your boss that that due to personalities and natures, you’ve been taking on more work and you’d either a) like recognition (and pay!) for it or b) like her help in stepping back and only handling a fair amount of the workload so you don’t get burnt out isn’t a horrible conversation to have.

    And one last also – often people with ADHD are more capable than they seem and can find their own organization systems, but when people are constantly stepping in to remind or do on their behalf, it’s harder to put those systems in play or accomplish them. Maybe try just making sure that the assignments/duties are clearly assigned and then let Lucy handle it how she will without reminders and follow-up for you. It could end badly, but then you have an excellent spring board for that conversation with your manger as well. Or Lucy could figure it out and make it work, just in a different way than you would have.

  57. Alan*

    For LW #2, this might feel weird but a fist bump allows you to meet their outstretched arm as you explain that your hand is injured. Like anything else, be matter of fact about it and no one will think twice.

  58. I Pay Taxes, Too*

    #2

    You’re fine! People have hand injuries. Or they’re sick and doing everyone a favor by not shaking hands. It’s not a big deal as long as you’re matter-of-fact about it and make a point of being otherwise reasonably warm.

    Oh how I wish this were true. I’ve found that people who are still in the handshake business, and especially men of a certain age, can get very testy if you refuse to shake their hand. One such case that had a significant impact on my career path: I was sick as a dog when I had an interview for a grad school program. Visibly and audibly sick, people-stepping-away-from-me-on-the-sidewalk sick. This was pre-COVID and people were broadly less understanding about rescheduling an interview over germs; if I missed the interview, I missed that application cycle entirely. I put on my makeup and dressed up and did my best to act chipper, but I was struggling to breathe and uncontrollably dripping out of my nose, and it only got worse running (stumbling) around on public transport and through the rain. When I arrived at my interview, the interviewer flashed a big smile and extended his hand, and I bowed and apologized profusely but said that I was rather ill and it probably would not be wise to make contact. He turned very suddenly cold to me, and the rest of the interview was awkward, stilted, and perfunctory, with him glancing at his watch with each question and not seeming very attentive at all. He ended the interview right on the 30 minute mark – and I knew that was a bad sign because a friend who had applied to and been accepted to the program a previous year said that he was so great to interview with and he clears his whole afternoon for these interviews because they often go long.

    It’s entirely possible he was angry I showed up sick at all, of course – in that case, he might want to be more flexible about his interview scheduling policy. I hope COVID has had a positive effect on these kind of things, but I’m not even confident in that.

    But, anyway, the moral of the story: a hand brace or cast or anything visible is much more likely to be respected even by the kind of people that put way too much stock into things like handshakes to begin with, vs. just telling them an excuse. Sorry to say it – personally if somebody simply told me “I don’t like to be touched,” that would be enough! – but there’s so much social weight put on handshakes that anything short of a visible injury can turn some people hostile. I’ve heard: there is advice for the world I want to live in, and advice for the world that we do live in. “Be honest!” is the former and “use a tactical diversion!” is the latter.

  59. Shazam*

    I also work in the financial services industry. If people are texting you in off channel communications you need to shut that down and escalate it quickly. I’m sure you’ve seen the huge fines regulators have levied this year and last.

    1. I'm just here for the cats!!*

      See I don’t understand this. I can understand not communicating about clients and confidential info. But could you get in trouble for texting about non work things? Like if this gossip was not secret information, but say 2 friendly coworkers gossiping about how the caterer didn’t provide plates, how could that be fined? Now, is that a bit unprofessional sure. But nothing to be fined over.
      And what about texting people for carpool or to let them know the office is going to be closed because of a water main break.

      1. Ann Perkins*

        The line is whether it’s “business-related” or not, so your examples would possibly not be in scope. That being said, the regulators view that pretty broadly, so something that is about office happenings could be considered business-related but something like texting about what movie to watch on Netflix that night would more clearly be out of scope.

  60. NobodyHasTimeForThis*

    #4 I would be so tempted to reply that they were fired for gossiping and calling people after hours.

  61. Lizzo*

    LW4: You didn’t ask about this, and this may have been advised in other comment threads here already, but it’s worth restating: if I had coworkers who were super invested in “hot goss” to the point that they were bothering me loooooong after work hours concluded, and also didn’t give a hoot about a colleague’s privacy, I’d be polishing up my resume.
    Good workplaces with good culture don’t tolerate that BS. (And yes, they do exist.)

  62. Patisseries*

    #5 – This recently happened to me, as a candidate. I leave my cell service off when I have good wifi because using both at once can cause the phone to switch back and forth, which interrupts the connection. I learned to turn on wifi calling in my settings, but apparently phone updates reset it to off, so I missed the call. Luckily, in my case, I emailed to check in, and the person calling seemed to know the drill and suggested that an update might be the culprit, and he was right. If this is happening regularly to the poster, at least some of the cases might be similar situations where candidates either don’t know to turn on wifi calling in the first place or didn’t notice that an update turned it off.

  63. Yes And*

    “But that takes real resources, whereas a survey question like this doesn’t.” No-f’s-left Alison is my favorite Alison.

  64. I'm just here for the cats!!*

    After rereading #1 I kind of wonder if the survey was trying gauge if the manager blows up at people or is unfair to peoples mental health needs

  65. Prudence and Wakeen Snooter Theatre for the Performing Oats*

    For missed interview calls, you could ask them to call you instead. Very firmly puts the ball in the interviewee’s court.

  66. The Gollux, Not a Mere Device*

    5) From the other side, if you’re the person expecting calls that might be from unknown numbers, check that you didn’t tell your phone provider to block suspected scam calls entirely, rather than sending them through labeled as “Scam Likely.”

    This isn’t advice for the LW, but I think Alison and other commenters have covered it from that end.

  67. Kaya*

    for #3. I really like Alisons suggestion about having only one of you take on an assigment and switching it. At my job i am the chaotic one, and it suits me well! i get things done, and am considered a high-performer when I can work alone. BUT it does make collaboration a little difficult. I would really appreciate if at similar situation, someone would say: “Yea, we really don’t NEED to work as a pair” :D

  68. Katie*

    For #5 – iPhone has a new(ish) feature that seems to have automatically been switched on for some people that sends unknown numbers directly to voicemail or spam – it doesnt even ring on the phone. My partner discovered this when the vet tried to call and it did not even ring. So the tech issue may be on the recipient’s end and they might not even know.

    1. Orv*

      Some phone carriers now offer that too. Also a lot of people simply will not answer a number they don’t recognize. For a while I was getting four or five scam calls a day; that kind of volume has made the phone an unreliable way to get in touch with people, unfortunately. That said, if I was expecting a job interview I would sure as heck answer every single unknown number.

  69. Orv*

    #2 has me wondering if anyone’s ever filed a successful workman’s compensation claim for a handshake injury. Because it seems like one that takes more than a few days to heal might qualify?

  70. juicebox*

    #5, I ran into something similar as the applicant. I had installed the Robokiller app on my phone to weed out spam calls but had deleted it soon after because it didn’t do a very good job. However, even though I had deleted the app, it was still forwarding calls to my number through its service and calls from recruiters got stuck in the void in the process. My phone showed no missed calls or voicemails even though the recruiters said they had left one. I had to call my phone provider to fix it and suddenly I was getting all my normal calls again.

  71. Borogovia*

    OP3: I have been on both sides of this situation. I cannot emphasize enough: don’t do work that is going to make you resentful, or be more generous than you can afford! This is not good for you or for your friend. On both sides, here is what worked for me: when the person doing more work focuses on their own needs. What I mean by that is not expecting to come to a shared agreement on what’s fair and then having your coworker/friend step up accordingly, or trying to manage their feelings or their results at work. What do YOU need to enjoy your work and not feel resentful of your coworker/friend? What actions can you take to set that boundary for yourself? Eg. “Hey friend, I have been overwhelmed lately and I think it will help if I take on full projects rather than splitting them up into tasks / I won’t be able to do X anymore.” and then sticking to that. In my experience this clarity is honestly the biggest gift you can give your friend.

  72. Nopity Nope*

    #5, if you don’t have a conference call system, it’s time to get one. Both parties call in to the number, so neither party has to worry that they might miss a call. Further, there are records.

  73. Kristin*

    “The ‘hot goss’ is this: do not call my phone after hours, or at any hour, to ask invasive and inappropriate questions like that. I’m not talking about it. Do we understand each other? Thank you.”
    I mean, wow.

  74. Raida*

    1. Survey asked how my boss communicates about her mental health

    I would look at this question through the lens of
    1) In their capacity as a manager, do they “communicate about her own mental health and wellness in an authentic way.”
    2) Within the context of leading by example in having healthy work-life boundaries
    3) Taking full advantage of the EAP
    4) During 1:1’s when discussing workload, stress, burnout

    And not “Do they divulge personal health details?”

    And honestly, as bad surveys are a pet peeve, I’d reach out to the program and let them know that the question is either framed as “We will mark them down if they aren’t sharing their personal medical information” or is insufficiently framed to make it clear within what context and in what manner is it expected that a good manager would be forthright in discussing the benefits and pitfalls of…”

  75. Raida*

    4. My coworkers want me to tell them why a colleague was fired

    I’d go back to my boss on Monday and tell them “I’m going to need to take some days off until this whole invasive-questions thing has been handled. I don’t want to snap in the office at my co-workers but mate I can tell it’s coming. How long do you think is fair to give everyone the time needed to wrangle those six? We thinking like by Wednesday I’d be all good to come back in and be back online? Do you need anything additional from me to help move things along? I’ve got more texts and so forth if you’d like.”

    Essentially: Hi Boss, I am being harassed. I have told you. I am telling you now that for my own health I’m going to refuse to come to this workplace until you’ve done your job. Now that you know this is *properly serious* you can speed up whatever is happening – or start actually doing something if you’d neglected to act until now.

  76. lnelson1218*

    Post #5,
    Can’t tell you how many times I have left a voicemail. People saw that I called. Don’t bother with listening to the voicemail and just call me back. If it was a 5-15 second message fine, I am probably just asking you to call me back. A minute, two minutes, there is more content. Annoys me no end. Especially when it is clearly an answer to a question and you don’t actually have a follow up question. I have worked in benefits. so for example. Are our semi-annual dental cleaning covered under our dental plan? In the voice email: yes those cleanings are 100% covered. Unless there is a follow up question, you do not need to call me again.

  77. Peter*

    On #5, might the issue be coming from using a VOIP phone?

    I do personal business with a very large institution which has its staff use the VOIP it provides (rather than giving them either an plain old telephone service phone or providing them with a mobile phone service). Every time they call me there is some kind of problem, and sometimes a problem when I call them. After a few failed tries, the staff person ends up calling me using his supervisor’s personal cell phone!

    VOIP can have erratic, inconsistent functioning, here in 2024.

  78. Little Miss Sunshine*

    I think the elbow bumps we introduced during covid should be permanently replacing the handshake. I still recall vividly the time I met a manager and he squeezed my fingers together so hard my rings left impressions on the adjoining fingers and I had tears in my eyes. Not to mention, people just do not wash their hands properly or often enough. Keep your cooties to yourself. I will be wearing a wrist brace to my next in-person event just to avoid touching people!

  79. Chaotic goose in a box*

    for 5, I have had multiple people be confused by my spam filter that asks you to state who you are and why you are calling to filter out bots, slam, telemarketers, etc. a few have thought it was voicemail and hung up either without saying anything, or after stating who they are. here’s the problem — it’s not voicemail. I don’t get any notification of the call or anything someone says until they finish responding and then it calls me. if they hang up during the process, I have no idea the call even happened. this is all working as intended and desired. most people are not confused by it, so I don’t want to make changes. I wonder if something like that is going on. these spam filters are getting quite common. all my friends and family use them (people in your contacts bypass it).

  80. Silverose*

    For #5, I’m a candidate who didn’t get a call at a scheduled time from an HR recruiter and all I had was an email address (well, technically 2 email addresses – a direct one, and an HR system one) to reach out to. So I emailed both email addresses at 15 minutes past saying “I thought we were scheduled today at XYZ time but did not receive a call; I’m still interested, please let me know how to proceed.” I never heard back from anyone about that position. It’s the first time I’ve ever been ghosted for an interview by the company.

  81. just some guy*

    #1: I have worked with managers who shared info about their mental health situation, in an appropriate way, and it worked well. Things like “Hey team, just to let you know, I have bipolar disorder so you may notice some erratic work patterns from me – here is what you need to know about it, please be assured I am receiving appropriate care”. Sometimes managers need accommodations from their team, and disclosing a MH situation can be part of that. It also gave me much more confidence when I needed to disclose my own MH stuff to them.

    Key thing here is that this was *voluntary* disclosure, coming from managers who trusted their workplace and their team (and who had good legal protections and a strong union). It should never be something people feel obliged or pressured to do.

    1. Sheldon Cooper*

      I agree with that sentiment. I periodically have bad anxiety, and have shared that on occasion. In my opinion, we should normalize statements like, “I’m having a lot of anxiety today and need to WFH” and take them the same way as “I have a really bad cold and need to WFH.” That said, there should be boundaries with staff – over sharing details, using them as therapists, using it to ask invasive questions about their mental health, etc. are all out of bounds.

      1. just some guy*

        It’s a case of Goodhart’s Law (“when a metric becomes a target, it ceases to be a good metric”): a good workplace will result in people feeling comfortable disclosing mental health information when it’s appropriate, but forcing people to disclose does not make for a good workplace.

  82. Mel*

    I know my work phone often gets marked as spam. I assume because while I call from one number, it shows up as the main number for the business I work for on the recipient’s phone. I always make sure to follow up with an email because of this.

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