update: my coworkers are engaged but one of them is cheating … with my boss

by Alison Green on September 4, 2024

Remember the letter-writer whose coworkers are engaged but one of them is cheating with the writer’s boss? Here’s the update.

Thank you so much for responding to my question. I couldn’t really respond to any of the comments on your post, but I read them and really had a good think about everything you said and what the commenters were saying as well. I’m here to offer an update in case you or any of your readers may be interested. Spoiler alert: it’s explosive!

The clarification: HR was kind of a joke in my former company, they didn’t do anything but perpetuate gossip. No such thing as anonymous complaints. Peter and Kate were different departments, think sales and accounting.

The good news: A few days after I submitted the letter to you, I ended up submitting my resignation. I start my new job next month. So far, my coworkers seem nice (we’ve had one casual hang/mixer organized by the new workplace — everyone bought food. My brownies were a hit!) My new company had been trying to poach me for a while, and I just decided to take the plunge. I truly can’t tell you how happy I am to be away from that mess. I’ve just been relaxing at home now. My former coworkers keep me updated about everything that’s happening and safe to say, I left at the right time. Bullets dodged.

Peter was blindsided by my resignation, and asked me why I was leaving and if there was anything they could do to keep me but I refused. I was willing to serve my notice period, but Peter said it wasn’t necessary and I could leave immediately since I clearly thought I was better than them. It was in that moment it became clear to me that I’d been telling myself Peter is a good boss, but he clearly isn’t. Even your advice touched on this briefly. So I cleared my stuff out by the end of the day, went home, and cuddled with my dogs.

Since then, Peter’s boss contacted me, asking me to at least serve my notice period. I only responded by sharing Peter’s last email to me, where he threatened to have me escorted off company property if I wasn’t gone by the end of the day. The grandboss proceeded to call me to convince me to come back. In a rare moment of wanting to be confrontational, I told him I wouldn’t feel comfortable coming back because of many reasons, not just Peter’s rudeness. I told him all about Peter and Kate. I told him my former company simply didn’t have adequate safeguards, so even if I wanted to report this nonsense I couldn’t without being afraid of retaliation. My former grandboss clearly wasn’t ready for my verbal diarrhea. Said he would call me back, but it has been blessed silence since.

On to the actual update: aka what is going on with Peter, Joe, and Kate.

The day after I left, Peter and Kate left for another business trip. However, when Kate returned home she realised their house was empty. Completely bare.

It would seem Joe had been aware of the affair for a while, and instead of confronting Kate or Peter he’d been lining his ducks in row so he could just up and disappear. He resigned by email, no mention of a notice period. No one knows where he is, or what he is doing. Kate apparently tried to file a missing persons, but Joe had already informed the police he wasn’t a missing person. At the same time as Kate came home and realized Joe was gone, his entire family also blocked all forms of communication with her. She tried to show up at Joe’s parents house, only for his parents to claim they don’t know her, they never knew her, and if she didn’t get off their property they’d call the police.

I know all this from my coworkers, who know all this from Kate because she can’t stop talking about it at work. She “doesn’t know why” Joe would have done this.

Few days after that: she also dumped Peter in a rather public, unhinged way, saying that he hypnotized her (???) and her life was falling apart because of him. But apparently it didn’t stick for long because the next day they were having loud and violent sex in Peter’s office during lunch hours.

There are rumors circulating that both Peter and Kate are about to be fired. Not sure why they haven’t been fired already. Some of my former coworkers have asked me if I could keep an eye out for jobs for them in my new company.

Thanks for your advice and compassion! Love and blessings to you.

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            1. Dawn*

              So fun story, I actually ordered a new pair of aviators the other day (this is a big deal because any glasses for me cost a minimum of about $150 even on the cheap sites) and I 100% made sure that was playing before I put them on for the first time.

    9. Cherry Sours*

      Good for him! I hope once he recovers from this disaster of both a workplace & fianceé, he can move forward and have a wonderful life.

    1. Lea*

      Isn’t it?

      Also my advice was to get someone to skip Joe the info and it seems like maybe that happened on the sly and that makes me happy because I now love Joes petty heart

      2. Ellie*

        Maybe he already knew, long before the letter was sent? It takes time to organise removalists.

        Either way, what a fantastic update! OP, I love how you told grandboss what was going on when you were already out of that mess! That’s a power move right there. Lol that he thought you might be willing to serve your notice under threat of being escorted out. But what’s up with Peter still not having been fired?

        1. Venus*

          Reading the original letter it was hard to figure out how Joe didn’t know, given that it was obvious to everyone. In the end he did know, but pretended ignorance until he could leave. Good for him!

    3. goddessoftransitory*

      Right??? This is up there with that woman who showed up at the LW’s house with two other people to sell her on the MLM weightloss scam thing!

      1. Juicebox Hero*

        Everyone who’s had an SO cheat on them has probably fantasized about doing something similar, but didn’t have the nerves or the resources to pull it off. Joe gets a slow clap from me.

        1. Falling Diphthong*

          There is a lot to be said for the slow, quiet, perfectly executed withdrawal from the craziness.

          Another AAM one: The woman who was refused a promotion because she was just too valuable to lose, who quietly finished up her day, and at 4:30 went to HR to submit her resignation effective immediately.

            2. Myrin*

              I’ll put a link in another reply but that will go into moderation first, so meanwhile you can search the site for “I burned a bridge in a spectacular way” and it should come right up.

            1. Hlao-roo*

              There have been (at least) two!

              “resigning via cod, a glorious out-of-office message, and other quitting stories” from October 5, 2017 and

              “the flasher, the scathing tirade, and other stories of magnificent rage-quits” from September 13, 2022

              (the second post has a link to a photo of “I QUIT” spelled out in fish)

              Links to follow.

                1. MigraineMonth*

                  Oh, wow, I was always picturing “I QUIT” in cod as something written slapdash in one of the prep areas. I had no idea it was done so artistically (and professionally) in the customer-facing display, with price labels for the cod, haddock and tilapia. Bravo!

            2. linger*

              The most recent collection was in June:
              https://www.askamanager.org/2024/06/the-lawnmower-message-the-mangled-journal-articles-and-other-stories-of-deliberately-burnt-bridges.html

              which I regret to say spawned this (since polished up a little)
              —with thanks to the two commenters MsM and Dadjokesareforeveryone who set up the premise, and the many others whose stories served as inspiration.

              On my final day of notice, I gave my company:
              Twelve cod a-quitting,
              Eleven keys well hidden,
              Ten trails of glitter,
              Nine cancelled contracts,
              Eight random edits,
              Seven smiley stickers,
              Six screeds of email,
              Five board forwardings!
              Four shredded files,
              Three home truths,
              Two mowed words,
              And a flipped bird, ’cause I am free.

        2. Seashell*

          I know someone who waited a while to get their ducks in a row before leaving a cheating spouse who basically had another life. It was a great story, and I suggested it be turned into a book.

            1. Seashell*

              I don’t remember all the details, but I think the cheating spouse worked odd hours in a place a long commute from home and had moved an affair partner into an apartment near the workplace that the cheater was ostensibly renting to have a place to crash late at night. The innocent spouse found out, but waited to have enough proof of all of it before letting the cheater know they were caught.

        4. newfiscalyear*

          I can’t say it was a proud moment because my heart was broken (and both our names were on the mortgage), but I’ve done the surprise move-out on a cheater.

          1. Arglebarglor*

            I’ve had the surprise move-out done TO me by the cheater. I had just bought a house, ostensibly for me and my fiance at the time. All the craziness around getting a house, mortgage, moving (and losing my job 2 weeks before closing!) was making me blind to the fact that my partner was obviously cheating with one foot out the door. Two weeks after closing, I came home to find EVERYTHING of his gone, which was most of the furniture. He left me two chairs (in the living room, one had the TV propped on it), a foam mattress pad in the bedroom on the floor, a pillow, and my dresser with my clothes in it. The kitchen was mostly ok because all that stuff was mine to begin with. I sighed and cried and moved on, since the house was in my name and I had put up the down payment by myself. He came back a few months later after finding out at his wedding reception that his new wife (yes, they got married INSTANTLY) was pregnant with some other guy’s baby. I told him to hit the bricks, and in a spectacular case of revenge being best served cold, I sold the house 7 years later during the real estate bubble of 2006 for 150% of the purchase price and started my marriage to the best guy ever debt free by using that money to pay off all of our combined credit card and student loan debt. We are still together and blissfully happy almost 20 years later.

      2. Lea*

        I love it. Maybe one day I’ll have the chance to do this not that I particular want to

        Also Peter sucks

      3. Allura Vysoren*

        Same. Remembering to tip off the police that he is not actually a missing person is so smart.

  4. the 1%*

    Wait, so Joe stole all of Kate’s stuff? Or just all of his stuff? I hope she can get some compensation if he did in fact steal from her.

    Toxic monogamy sucks, man. The “cheater” isn’t always the bad guy.

      1. But Of Course*

        Well, he probably did take all the appliances and counters and her stuff in his pockets when he left. It’s the kind of situation where you just want mementoes of the other person. /s

        1. Boof*

          There’s zero evidence in the letter that Kate thinks Joe stole anything, so IDK why we have to invent that clearly they had a 50/50 share in all the stuff and that Joe stole it all vs well, who knows it didn’t seem to be a point of contention in what LW heard about?
          I mean yeah the disappearing act isn’t my favorite way to dump someone but if Joe felt like this was the only way they could get away I think it’s equally likely that he was worried Kate was going to steal or wreck his stuff to control him or draw out the separation or who knows what, all we know for sure from what the LW said is Kate was cheating on her fiance so Kate’s the way more sus one in my book

          1. Resident Catholicville, U.S.A.*

            I think Joe’s right to take the disappearing act and burning it to the ground- they lived together and worked together. Presumably, it’d have been HELLA awkward to break up and move out, then go back to work at the same job with the ex and her lover, until finding a new job. If there was this level of dysfunction before a break up, there would have been 10x more after a break up and going back to work together.

            1. Elbe*

              Agreed. I don’t usually support ghosting someone that you’re very close to, even in instances of some wrongdoing.

              But this whole scenario just seemed so incredibly cruel to me. Cheating on someone is always bad, but doing it while they are paying a lot of money to make a lifelong commitment to you is so much worse. And doing it in the workplace, where the cheating will affect their professional life and involve their coworkers? It goes way beyond someone making a mistake. I really don’t think he has any obligation to give her closure after she acted so horribly to him. A clean break with no drama is what is best for him, and I’m glad he got it.

              1. br_612*

                I’m always a little confused by what cheaters want when they ask for “closure” when they get dumped. Like you cheated? There is no asking why here that’s why. What else do you need to know?

                1. Elbe*

                  Maybe they assume that if the person forgives them, they will be off the hook and won’t have to feel bad.

                  Or maybe Kate wants an opportunity to tell Joe that it’s all actually his fault and he should feel bad for making her cheat.

                  Who knows? I don’t blame Joe at all for just not wanting to deal with any excuse she comes up with. Having to sit through a “but I was hypnotized” conversation would only give him an eye-rolling injury.

                2. The Original K.*

                  I think they want forgiveness and/or absolution. If they get that, they don’t have to have those unpleasant guilty feelings. “Well, he wished me well so clearly I didn’t do anything wrong!” Which is why Joe’s actions are so great – he knew, Kate now knows he knew, and she just has to sit in it.

                3. MigraineMonth*

                  Honestly, even without the cheating, closure isn’t something someone else can give you. I had a boyfriend ghost me once on Valentines Day; it really sucked and I wanted to know why (and also if he was okay/still alive). I thought knowing would help. A couple months later he showed back up to explain the reason, and you know what? It just made me feel like crap.

                  (I’m not at all advocating ghosting; it sucked thinking he might be dead! But I think the specific reason for the breakup can be really painful, too.)

          2. But Of Course*

            I did note my comment with /s in case people missed the idea of shoving a dishwasher and a couch in your pocket. I was making a joke. You don’t need to defend Joe to me, I agree there’s no evidence Joe did anything wrong.

            1. Hlao-roo*

              For what it’s worth, I thought the mental image of Joe stuffing the refrigerator and kitchen counters in his pockets, then carefully picking up all of Kate’s stuff as “mementos” was hilarious (and also clearly a joke). XD

                1. Emotional support capybara (he/him)*

                  Yes hi hello I would like to sell these major appliances *slaps handful of leaves on counter*

                2. Joron Twiner*

                  I’m imagining it like in the Sims when your house gets burgled and they just stuff your fridge in a bag and leave.

                3. Grizabella the Glamour Cat*

                  I’m imagining that Joe is a wizard, and his pockets work like Hermione’s bag in Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows!

                2. Lizzo*

                  Sigh…my kingdom for a pair of women’s pants that have pockets large enough for domestic appliances.

            2. Resident Catholicville, U.S.A.*

              I know- I was replying exclusively to Boof. Though, I also enjoy the mental image of Joe pulling up carpets and stuffing them into enormous cargo pants. ;)

    2. Dust Bunny*

      I mean, if you’re not happy you can, like, leave. You don’t have to engage in non-consensual non-monogamy. She had the option of leaving Joe first.

      1. Jackalope*

        This is especially…. I don’t support cheating on your spouse, but I’m aware that it’s difficult to separate yourself from them legally and can take a lot of time, and asset division can really do a number on you if your now ex has a good lawyer. Again, I don’t support it at all, but I can at least see how someone might get there if I squint and look sideways from a distance. But if you’re engaged…. Just break off the engagement. It might be emotionally rough but then you’re free to go be with whomever you want to be without treating your fiancé like dirt.

      1. Lea*

        All the people ranting about ‘toxic monogomy’ seem incapable of considering being honest with a parter and trying to make sure you want the same things

        Because they don’t think it will get them what they want and that’s on them

        1. Athena*

          Right?? Anyone who thinks that way should please read “The Ethical S*ut” and reform their behavior. Polyamory and open relationships can be healthy but only with open communication with all parties involved.

      1. basically functional*

        That’s…not what toxic monogamy means. Someone who is cheating is by definition not being monogamous.

        1. Hannah Lee*

          Well, it is if you consider the person cheating is going through the motions of proclaiming they are in a monogamous relationship, one they are SO committed to that they are planning to enter into a lifelong commitment of monogamy to their partner. *

          So, yeah, that particular person’s version of “monogamy” is, in fact, toxic, bound to blown up the relationship, and harm the non-cheating partner.
          It’s”Fauxnogamy” if you will.

          *assuming “engaged” means about to marry one other person as their declared one and only life partner.

    7. Fluffy Orange Menace*

      It’s possible he brought all of the furniture etc… in. I doubt that “literally” everything was gone. I’m sure her clothes and toiletries were there, etc… But, it’s always interesting to find that ONE PERSON who has to play devil’s advocate and make the victim out to be the problem.

      1. Ellis Bell*

        I think “empty” probably refers only to furniture (belonging to him) but even if everything was gone, a lot of people in Joe’s position send the cheater’s personal belongings to a storage facility with instructions of how to get them, or just bag everything and send them to their family or something. It’s actually very common advice, which I received when I was in an infidelity support group. If you want to have a low drama break with someone in a situation with this much conflict BUT you have all these ties, you have to plan your exit carefully. It’s tempting to consider just chucking everything, especially if a clean financial break means clearing out a property, but it’s awfully stupid to destroy or take belongings because it gives the cheater (who is often, perplexingly, very unwilling to let go) a legal reason to insist on continued contact/conflict. Joe was in total control here, so I vote he left her stuff bagged up at the house or somewhere else she could collect them.

        1. SleeplessKJ*

          And if he did take everything I’d consider that fair compensation for the engagement ring he won’t get back.

          1. What_the_What*

            He will if he takes her to court and ends up on Judge Judy! She always says the ring is a form of a contract in contemplation of marriage and is to be returned if that contract isn’t fulfilled. Now, based on him not wanting ANY contact at all, I doubt he will, but I’d definitely watch that episode if he did!

        2. bamcheeks*

          who is often, perplexingly, very unwilling to let go

          Not that perplexing, IME. Remembering a former friend who came home to tell their spouse that they’d met someone else, and was stunned when their spouse said, “Well, that’s that then,” contacted a lawyer and told them to move out. Up until that point, they’d been the protagonist of their own personal drama and their spouse was a bit-part: they’d completely forgotten their spouse’s agency and they did not like it one bit when spouse exercised it and suddenly they weren’t in control any more.

          1. The Original K.*

            I knew someone who did the same, and was floored when her now-ex was like “OK, bye. You have until the end of the month to move out” (she’d moved into his place and they weren’t married). She wanted him to “fight for” her and his position was “Nah, I’m good.” Then she tried to backpedal and told him she wanted to stay together and he was like, “Nope! You cheated. Again: end of the month.” It was kind of hilarious – she was craving drama and he just wouldn’t give in to it (and wasn’t particularly upset about the breakup either, which also made her mad).

            1. MotherofaPickle*

              Reminds me of my former boss. He had not one, but Two Ex-Wives who were drama queens. When they threatened him with a divorce, he just said, “Send me the paperwork, I’ll sign it.” And had an apartment within the week.

              1. allathian*

                His wife-picker was clearly off, but at least he could deal with breakups without adding to the drama.

          2. goddessoftransitory*

            I can just see them standing there mentally sputtering as the Big Dramatic Confrontation they were picturing did not play out.

            1. Menace to Sobriety*

              I have to admit that, not in regards to a relationship, but I’ve had a couple of times when I was READY for a fight with a company or CSR and….they were nice and took care of it and took the wind right outta my sails! Such an adrenaline fueled let down!

          3. coffee*

            I assume that people who are willing to let go break up before moving onto a new relationship? As a general trend. So maybe it’s not surprising that cheaters are unwilling to let go.

            1. Grizabella the Glamour Cat*

              Yep, I think cheating can be a power trip for some people. When the person they’re cheating on finds out and says, “Okay, bye,” that takes their power away and ruins the whole thing!

        3. Turquoisecow*

          When my aunt found out her husband was cheating on her, the story goes that she left all his stuff on the lawn and changed the locks. I doubt that included furniture and I’m sure there was some stuff missed or disputed later in the divorce proceedings but also Joe and Kate were not married and did not have a legal arrangement like that, but I’m sure there are some details here that Kate left out or exaggerated and the house was not literally “empty,” but just “empty of all of his stuff and with no sign that he had lived there.”

          1. sparkle emoji*

            Yeah, given that LW is hearing this through coworkers and Kate is high emotion on this topic, there’s a lot of places where exaggeration could have happened. I think it’s more likely Joe took stuff that belonged to him vs some dramatic heist of every last thing in the home including her coffee maker.

          2. Azure Jane Lunatic*

            My now partner realized that their abusive ex (they had broken up with her in September; this was January) was basically refusing to accept the breakup and continuing to commit financial abuse as well as all the other kinds, so they took almost all of their possessions and their cat and went to stay with a friend.

            Her tantrum was glorious.

            Unfortunately they did have to stay in contact (via lawyers) to work out some details but she was just FLABBERGASTED, there was no SIGN that anything was wrong!!! Lady, the time to “work things out” was back in AUGUST when you two were in RELATIONSHIP COUNSELING together.

          3. JustaTech*

            When my great-great grandmother discovered that my great-great grandfather was cheating on her (mis-directed letters told the whole story) he came home to all his clothes in luggage on the front porch, and he lived in a hotel down the street for the rest of his life.
            They never divorced (it wasn’t a Done Thing), and he never argued, but he did stay involved in the lives of his kids and grandkids.

        4. feathersflight*

          I assumed her stuff was sent to a storage unit, if it really was completely bare. He could have left the info about the storage unit on the counter or something. It depends just how much work and money he was willing to put into the moment of her walking in to an empty house!

          I do agree with the commenters saying it was probably an exaggeration on Kate’s part. But it’s such a beautiful thought.

      2. Roland*

        Right. Literally all we know if “their house was empty. Completely bare” and that’s 3rd hand information sourced from a dramtic cheater and ultimately edited for an advice column. Maybe we don’t need to analyze why he took the couch and dishwasher and all her bras or whatever when we don’t even know IF he took the couch and dishwasher and all her bras or whatever.

      3. Irish Teacher.*

        And it sounds like the LW got this from colleagues who got it from Kate, so…it’s possible she was exaggerating. Given the actions Kate took in general here, she sounds like the kind of person who would come in and tell all her workmates, “he took absolutely everything; the house was completely empty,” even if he just took his personal effects.

        Everything here – her telling her coworkers everything, the sex in Peter’s office, the dramatic dumping of him and the fact that didn’t last long – all gives me the impression that she’s an utter drama llama.

        1. Observer*

          all gives me the impression that she’s an utter drama llama.

          I’d say that this is a bit of an understatement. She really does sound unhinged. And Joe clearly realized what he was dealing with. I mean he not only disappeared, he prepped his family, and managed to get their buy in!

          Which is a good thing. The fact that she came to his family’s house, under the circumstances, is WILD. Especially since she *clearly* knew why he disappeared. Hence the show of dumping Peter and claiming that he “hypnotized” her. Which, really?!?!?

        2. Katydid*

          I wish I could reply with Gifs – all I can think of is Ron and Tammy 2 from Parks and Rec for when her and Peter “reunited” in the office. LOL

      4. sheworkshardforthemoney*

        We just have her saying that the house is empty but she doesn’t have much credibility in this whole scenario. Just taking everything that he paid for will make any house look very bare.

        1. The Rat-Catcher*

          Not me trying to figure out what a gender switch is on a microwave. The neurodivergent literalism strikes again!

      6. Bitte Meddler*

        My ex’s ex-girlfriend moved out when he was at work. When I met him, he told me this whole sob story about coming home to an emptied-out house. Nothing in it! Nothing at all!

        Then, several months into dating, I went to his house. I marveled at all the things he’d had to buy all over again after his ex had taken everything: bed in the master bedroom, dining table and chairs, L-shaped couch, bed in the spare bedroom, bookcases, ottomans, lounge chairs, coffee table, side tables.

        And he was like, “What? No, I’ve had all that stuff for years.”

        Me: “But you said Robin took everything and you came home to a completely empty house.”

        Him: “Oh, I meant she took all the things we’d bought together, like the curtains, some framed posters, and her own furniture and stuff that she’d brought with her when she moved in.”

        Me: “That’s… not even remotely the same as ‘My ex emptied out my house and left me with nothing.'”

        (Why, yes, my ex is prone to hyperbole, exaggeration, and straight-up lying).

    9. nee: email settings*

      This is the only part that struck me as over the line from Joe. Did he really take all of their joint possessions? That would not be okay. (I do fully respect him clearing his own stuff out without a trace like this! It’s just if it’s also her stuff that makes it not okay.)

      (I don’t think this exact fact pattern is when I’d be talking about toxic monogamy, though. There are other circumstances that might warrant it, but this isn’t one of them to me.)

      3. Observer*

        Did he really take all of their joint possessions? That would not be okay

        But why would you think that? Let’s face it, Kate is *not* anything within *miles* of being a reliable narrator here. And her perceptions are also not likely to be reliable – so she’s going to be piling lies and exaggerations on top of a skewed perception of what actually happened.

        Which is a long way of saying that Kate claiming that the house was *bare* doesn’t mean that the house was actually bare, much less that Joe took *anything* that was not his.

        1. Hroethvitnir*

          Absolutely. The simplest explanation here is Joe took furniture he owned, maaaybe co-owned, but leaving the house *literally* empty is wildly unlikely and a huge reach.

      4. Somehow I Manage*

        I read that less like the Grinch taking everything and leaving nails on the wall and more like he just cleared his stuff out and left no trace of himself. Completely bare of his presence. Especially given that he notified police that he was not indeed a missing person, it feels like he just vanished himself and his stuff.

    10. Presea*

      I think we can take the LW in good faith that they’re including all relevant details of the situation between Joe and Kate. While I can concede that there likely could be a lot more to their story, that’s not really relevant to the LW and speculation on the matter winds up becoming fanfiction, which is against site rules. Its perfectly fine to ignore “good for Joe” type comments if they make you uncomfortable for whatever reason.

    11. Not on board*

      Seriously?! That’s your take? If you’re unhappy in a monogamous relationship, you can leave. Also, to be cheating with someone else at your workplace? And having sex at work and/or during work hours/work trips? She’s just a trash person, who’s totally unprofessional.
      I say good for Joe. Also, Peter is just as trash and unprofessional.

      1. Star Trek Nutcase*

        IMO the “cheater” is always a bad person. Though it’s possible the other person is a bad person also (e.g. controlling). But ultimately, the cheater chose to cheat without “first” ending the relationship – even if it’s by a pathetic text breakup. I’d be hurt by a breakup (by text or otherwise), but can accept not all relationships last. I’d be beyond hurt, raging angry, and unforgiving of the cheater because IMO betrayal and lies are much worse than any physical or emotional sex.

        1. Hroethvitnir*

          I have zero judgement for people who cheat in abusive relationships – sadly, it’s often what is needed to finally escape (psychologically, logistically, or both).

          But that’s a million miles from here! I just feel obligated to insert grey into black and white statements due to too much exposure to Reddit.

          1. Lenora Rose*

            The one case of cheating I kind of forgive was exactly this. 1: She hadn’t cheated physically, though she was definitely having romantic and sexual feelings for someone else who was actually supporting her. 2: Her spouse was at BEST emotionally abusive. He never hit her but that’s one of the better things that can be said of that relationship.

            And even then, I’d have a struggle to reconcile it if she’d crossed that last line, even though we got a much closer view of just how messed up and toxic he was than we liked.

    14. Aldabra*

      It was one snippet of a secondhand account, you’re really reading way too hard between the lines here. Sheesh.

      1. Aldabra*

        And since he contacted the police already to let them know he’s ok, I’m pretty sure he didn’t then steal all of her stuff, or she’d be reporting the theft not just that he was missing.

        1. Certaintroublemaker*

          This. She wouldn’t be pulling up to the parents saying, “Where’s my fiancé?” She’d be saying, “Where’s my stolen stuff?” And they wouldn’t be threatening her with the police if it would get their son in trouble.

    15. MicroManagered*

      LOL WHAT?! Tell me you’re currently having an affair without using the words “I’m currently having an affair.”

      1. Ginger Cat Lady*

        My thought, too. His own guilt is playing a role here. Monogamy isn’t automatically “toxic” when it is what both partners agree to. Just like polyamory isn’t inherently “toxic” among consenting adults. Both kinds of relationships absolutely CAN be toxic, but “toxic monogamy” is what cheaters say to excuse their cheating.

    18. Kella*

      Fun fact: Disregarding the (sexual) safety of your partner, lying to them, and breaking your relationship agreements with them is toxic even when you are non-monogamous!

      We don’t know any of the details of how their belongings were divided up or what may or may not have been left behind.

    20. Optivia and me*

      Hi Pete/Kate/random incel maybe IDK.

      Your comment is both a weird take and a really weird/false interpretation of the events as laid out. So I don’t really know what you were hoping to accomplish beyond putting that weirdness out into the world for everyone else to deal with.

      Thanks, I guess.

    21. Myrin*

      Assuming you’re not simply trolling, why on earth would that be the station your train of thought arrived at? Talk about taking things literally-literally, good grief.

          1. Elizabeth West*

            LOL my favorite Tube announcement is “This is a Piccadilly Line train to Cockfosters.” That will never not make me giggle.

            Or in this case, “This is a Kate and Peter train to a massive cock-up.”

              1. londonedit*

                Londoner of 25 years’ standing here and I have NEVER heard this before – and I love it! Especially as Arsenal are also among my least favourite football teams.

    22. Ready for the weekend*

      Maybe they were renting or co-owned the place and he wanted everything gone to get rid of any responsibility he was associated with.

    24. Alpacas Are Not Dairy Animals*

      I’m pretty sympathetic to the idea that all forms and degrees of sexual possessiveness/jealousy/control are toxic, no matter how socially normalized – but I think we can take the “emptying” of the apartment as a figure of speech here. If he did take her KitchenAid or something he should give it back though.

      1. Ann O'Nemity*

        I took “emptying” of the apartment as a figure of speech too. But it’s even more juicy if Joe took literally everything, even the last roll of toilet paper.

        1. StephChi*

          He’s be even more of a hero if he did take the TP, and all of the tissues so she can’t use that as a substitute. She comes home, there’s no sign that Joe ever lived there, AND there’s no TP or tissues.

        4. Caramel & Cheddar*

          I’m picturing it like the Grinch who stole Christmas. Joe even took the last can of Who Hash!

      2. Waratah*

        This kind of seems like the polar opposite of possessiveness/jealousy/control, though? She betrayed his trust and he just stepped aside and left her to it. He let her keep her job and her home without subjecting her to so much as an uncomfortable conversation, and he’s the one who was forced to leave everything behind and start again. If the genders were reversed, I think we’d probably be saying ‘the man gets to keep his job and the house, the woman only gets to escape quietly with the house contents’ is an outcome skewed in favour of the man. Disappearing into the night isn’t exactly an effective method of controlling anyone. It’s a great way to abdicate from exerting any influence on a person ever again forever, though. Like, I’m struggling to think of a clearer and more effective way to say ‘You do you boo, imma get out of your way and do my own thing over here’.

        If anything, it kind of sounds like the actions of a person escaping an abusive relationship to me. While we don’t have any direct evidence, the amount of secret planning, the abrupt no contact and the complete disappearance are all things we advise women to do when escaping toxic men. Add that to the fact that she tried to hunt him down at his parents’ place when his actions clearly say ‘Don’t contact me’, and, well, I’m hearing alarm bells. I might be overreacting, but I definitely don’t think we can jump to ‘he’s toxic’ when the information can just as easily be interpreted as ‘she’s toxic’.

        1. MigraineMonth*

          Very true. It feels like a power move because we’re hearing Kate’s shocked reaction, but if you think about everything that Joe gave up…

          If he actually moved away to avoid her, then he gave up his apartment, his job, his community relationships (doctor, dentist, that friendly barista on Mon/Wed/Fri) and his proximity to his parents just to escape her and the shadow of her affair.

    25. OhGee*

      Kate, is that you? For real though, calling this a case of toxic monogamy is so corny. Signed, polyamorous for the last six years and SLOW CLAPPING FOR JOE

      1. Eulerian*

        Why are people keep saying slow clapping for Joe? I’m guessing by context slow clapping means something different from what I’m thinking of?

        1. EDIA*

          The slow clapping for Joe is the supportive kind, which may or may not escalate into full applause. The clapping is slow because people are just basking in Joe’s coolness and letting it sink in. We might be able to help differentiate this slow clapping from what you’re thinking of if you actually said what you’re thinking of, though.

          1. Eulerian*

            I would normally interpret slow clapping as sarcastic. But that didn’t seem to fit the context here.

            Thanks for the explanation!

            1. MigraineMonth*

              I think it started as a movie trope where someone does something shocking/controversial and the audience is silent. Then one person starts slowly clapping, then more, then thunderous applause and a standing ovation. Hurrah!

              Which was overused and mocked as a trope, so people started using “slow clap” sarcastically.

              This is hearkening back to the original meaning.

    26. Bossy*

      So don’t get into a monogamous relationship if you don’t want to be in one, or is that too much to process for ya?
      I had a bf in college who cheated on me and I pleasantly told him let’s not be in a monogamous relationship. He was like great let’s just date and I was like, oh no thanks. Bu-bye. And he was surprised and confused. So stupid.

      1. metadata minion*

        Ok, I’m confused — I would also interpret your statement the way your boyfriend did. I would assume “let’s not be in a monogamous relationship” means “let’s be in some other kind of relationship”, because otherwise you’ve just picked a weirdly complicated way to say “I’m breaking up with you”.

        1. blue rose*

          I had taken it to mean Bossy meant “Let’s have an ‘exes’ relationship.” Exes is also some other kind of relationship. When relationships change, they don’t always become closer.

    29. Waratah*

      Even if Joe took Kate’s belongings and sold them or burned them or something, what on Earth makes that something only a monogamous person would/could do? Are you genuinely expecting us to believe that nobody in the entire history of poly relationships has ever made off with their partners’ stuff upon leaving a relationship?

    30. Katherine*

      Love the scare quotes around “cheater.” Having an affair while engaged to another person, without that person’s knowledge and consent, is not “cheating.” It’s cheating, period. And correct, you’re SO SMART, the cheater isn’t ALWAYS the bad guy. I mean, is there any circumstance in the entire world where you could accurately say “The _______ is always ______”? However, in THIS CASE, the one that we’re actually talking about, the cheater is pretty clearly the bad guy based on the facts of the letter, as related by, you know, a PERSON WHO KNOWS THE PEOPLE INVOLVED, not some “I’m so much smarter than you” AAM commenter.

      Also, toxic monogamy? All Kate had to do was break up with Joe. She opted out of being a decent person and Joe didn’t elect to take a mild approach in his response.

    31. It’s A Butternut Squash*

      This is such a gross and frankly stupid attitude. It’s not “toxic monogamy” to want to be in a monogamous relationship and be angry if you’re cheated on. They were engaged with a wedding date set, she was wasting his time and money, endangering his health, and made staying at his job untenable. He lost things that were far more valuable than a TV or a blender.

      If you want to be non monogamous, go do that openly with other people who do too. It’s not weird or unnatural or bad for other people to be monogamous.

    32. Ellie*

      That’s one interpretation. I personally know of several couples where one person literally bought everything, right down to the furniture, sheets, towels, cutlery, pot plants, and even the pets that the couple owned (admittedly, in my experience, its usually the woman who does that but I know of at least one man who was in this situation). If it was that kind of a relationship and provided he dropped her clothes and any documents off at her parents, I’d say he’s in the clear.

    34. Ex-Teacher*

      >Toxic monogamy sucks

      I guess it’s wrong to expect your partner to abide by the agreement you made to be monogamous? And it’s just absolutely the worst when, after you break the agreement, they decide that they don’t have to keep the agreement either!

      /s, because you probably need that.

    36. WantonSeedStitch*

      “Toxic monogamy” is leaving when you’re cheated on? I’m sorry, NO. As someone who’s been polyamorous for 20 years, going behind someone’s back and breaking the agreements of a relationship is always bullshit. I don’t get the impression from the OP’s letter that Joe did anything vindictive or harmful to Kate, rather that he just got the hell out of Dodge and made the cleanest possible break because he was Done. Frankly, I’d have done the same thing.

    37. Dek*

      I don’t know why “cheater” is in quotes. When you cheat, you’re a cheater.

      Open relationships exist. You can be ethically non-monogamous. This is not that.

      1. Jules*

        Right?! I need Joe to turn up in the comments, like he’s Milton from Office Space drinking a margarita with no salt on the beach.

    2. It’s A Butternut Squash*

      Idk one of my favorite parts of this is that OP got herself TF out of there. I kind of hope she never hears about it again.

      1. MigraineMonth*

        Yeah, poor OP was losing sleep over this crap. I’m glad they’re well out of it, and I hope Peter gets fired for how he treated them.

    3. Larry, I'm on Duck Tales*

      Until I hear otherwise, I’m going to assume Joe married Eva Mendes’s character from “The Other Guys” but treats her better than Will Ferrell’s character did.

    2. Rook Thomas*

      Agreed! Much, much more dramatic than I expected. And that last bit about loud . . . things . . happening again? Unreal.

    3. BW*

      When I read that the update was going to be explosive, I made popcorn and came back to read THE BEST UPDATE EVER.

      3. LateRiser*

        It has been over 20 years since my sister was in a school production of that musical and I still can’t get the songs out of my head!!

        1. Not Australian*

          Yikes, I had the same problem and it was *way* more than 20 years ago! I think I *still* know that show word for word, and did before I ever saw a production of it!

        2. Insufficient Sausage Explainer*

          36 years, playing in the school orchestra for our Christmas production, and SAAAME!

        3. Aerin*

          I think that’s how Encore on Disney+ works so well. A layperson might ask, “How many people really remember all the lines and choreography from their high school musical?”

          And the answer is “basically all of them”

  8. Boof*

    OH MY this is so satisfying I wonder if it’s real but also don’t actually care – OP you got out of there, you told peter’s boss all the nonsense when they begged you to come back, and obvious affair was obvious and Joe escaped too rather than getting sucked into a legally binding agreement with a cheater unknowingly.
    yea wish the offenders had learned a lesson but at least damage control is done.

    2. Elbe*

      The LW handled this so well!

      Peter’s last email to me, where he threatened to have me escorted off company property if I wasn’t gone by the end of the day.
      I’m 99% sure they are planning to fire Peter. This guy is completely unprofessional, to the point that he would rather be petty than actually have a transition period for his team. This is not the type of thing that grandbosses take lightly, even without the affair and gossip and workplace messiness. Peter seems to be banking on word of his behavior never reaching his higher-ups and the LW did a good job of torpedoing that plan.

        1. Elbe*

          There’s usually quite a bit that goes into firing a manager.

          They may have to:
          – Verify the LW’s version of events and confirm that the email is real
          – Coordinate with IT to get his accounts and logins deactivated at the right time
          – Document wrongdoing and confirm with HR to make sure that they’re not at risk of any lawsuits
          – Have a transition plan for who will be managing his team, etc.

          1. Ellie*

            He had loud sex with Kate in his office while the rest of the team was outside. How could they possibly not have enough to fire him. Hell, he’s such a liability, even if they couldn’t legally fire him, you’d think he’d be on gardening leave.

            I assumed that grandboss had been lied to by Peter, who probably said OP walked out and refused to serve notice, so that was a terrific move by OP to forward that email. But the fact that Peter is still there speaks to a deeper dysfunction. Kate still being there I can understand, she’s lost her fiance (deservedly so, of course) but she might be able to claim that Peter harassed her, if he has any authority over her. So that probably requires a more cautious approach. But Peter? Why isn’t he gone!

          2. Dancing Otter*

            IT probably has a form at the ready for deleting users. Takes maaaybe fifteen minutes. And it’s not likely the first time IT has been asked to take a closer look at email history.
            My bet’s on your last point. I had a manager who was fired while I was on vacation. It was a mess. No one knew the status of anything he was doing, or even what all he WAS doing. I was small fry then, so low priority, but it took two days to find out who was going to sign my timesheets, let alone an actual conversation about next steps. A transition plan before firing someone, especially a manager, is Important.

      2. Possum's mom*

        The only thing left to wish for is that , after Peter’s boss read the forwarded email sent to the OP by Peter , the boss went to Peter’s office to let him have it while he was letting Katelyn have it!

    3. Juicebox Hero*

      Meanwhile, Joe is sitting at his new desk at his new company and an office mate says, “Hey, Joe, how’d you wind up moving all the way from Teapottsville to Wakeentown? That’s a good thousand miles away!”

      “Fred, if I told you, you wouldn’t even believe me…”

  9. CommanderBanana*

    Well, my gob is smacked and my flabbers are gasted.

    I don’t know why, but his family claiming they don’t know her and never met her is just….*chef’s kiss.*

    4. Silver Robin*

      that was what sealed this as absolutely legendary. Joe lining everything up quietly and getting out is courageous and incredible; so happy for and proud of him (as much as a stranger on the Internet can be). But to *also* have a family that closes ranks like that?? Blocking: A+. Supporting Joe: A+. Claiming they do not know her: exquisite.

      2. Unemployed in Greenland*

        getting allllll the deets about your family member’s cheating ex, and doubling down by pretending they’re a complete stranger when they show up on your lawn?

        priceless.

        … For everything else, there’s MasterCard.

      1. Cat Woman*

        That was truly my favorite part! Just visualizing Joe casually calling the police to say, “oh, hey, you may get a report from my cheating ex-fiancee to report me as missing. Nope, I am fine, I just bounced!”

        1. Kelly*

          And the police would actually be appreciative of this, not least because he’d feel obliged to give some of the backstory to the bouncing, and the tea is exquisite. I also suspect they’d have experienced great joy in advising Kate that Joe is not a missing person.

          1. goddessoftransitory*

            *Kate goes tearing into the police station with long and dramatic rendition of Missing Joe*

            Police: Okay, so just to let you know? The main difference between us and you is that he let US know he’s fine.

    6. No Longer Gig-less Data Analyst*

      If anyone I loved was treated like Joe and asked me to do this, I would jump at the opportunity. Revenge is a dish best served cold and all that.

    8. M*

      you don’t know why? I know why, lol. as someone who divorced a dude who’d been cheating and lying and basically telling everyone that ~the cheater isn’t always the bad guy~ since (confirmed) Year 1 of the 15-year marriage and (suspected) probably even before then, they said that because that’s how it feels, to find out someone who was family or all but family had this whole second life.

      I have always thought that if my ex ever calls me up wanting to make nice, that’s what I would say to him before hanging up: why would I want to be your friend? I don’t even know who you are.

      On the tiny lil chance Joe ever reads this: so much love to him and his awesome awesome family.

      1. EDIA*

        I am having difficulty parsing your tone (nature of internet comments), but CommanderBanana was expressing admiration/awe at the parents’ actions, not confusion/bewilderment.

        1. CommanderBanana*

          ^^ That. The family’s forming a Wall of Silence is the just the cherry on the icing of this deliciously satisfying cake.

    9. Elle Woods*

      My flabbers are gasted too.

      An extra special round of applause to Joe’s family for having his back in such a spectacular way.

    10. Observer*

      I don’t know why, but his family claiming they don’t know her and never met her is just….*chef’s kiss.*

      It says that he was very well prepared, and he managed to really give his family some crystal clarity. And they had his back. So, a really good outcome.

  10. Anon Again... Naturally*

    Wow… that is just wild. I’d like to go ahead and request another update when you have one, please.

    I’ll just hand out some popcorn for this one.

  11. Llellayena*

    Oh…my…drama… I think it’s awesome that you both got out in time AND still had connections to hear the gossip because WOW! That is NOT how I expected it would go but it honestly seems like the best outcome for all the GOOD people involved. I hope you’re able to help select former coworkers into new and more stable positions.

          1. whimbrel*

            Aah thank you, I should have remembered that! (I occasionally have reason to work with geochemistry data that I plot on a logarithmic axis because of the significant differences in values I’m working with.) Appreciate the correction! :)

  13. Persephone Mulberry*

    “Kate apparently tried to file a missing persons, but Joe had already informed the police he wasn’t a missing person.”

    This might be my favorite bit.

    1. Moose*

      He really thought of everything. I’m honestly very impressed because that’s stone cold and COMPLETELY warranted

    2. Person from the Resume*

      I admire Joe. He planned far ahead and headed off Kate’s missing persons report in addition to alerting his family of his departure. He didn’t want the police wasting time on Kate’s shenanigans.

      Although resigning by email, disappeared and cleared out all his things does read like a breakup and not being a missing person requiring police action, he didn’t want the police to have to waste any time on investigating it.

      1. Jezebel*

        Kate could have also reported it as a break-in/robbery, so letting the police know he took his own stuff and left willingly saved them a lot of time and effort.

      2. MM*

        I don’t know if it was about consideration for the police so much as it was about making sure there was no room for Kate to believe anything other than that he left her of his own accord.

        1. Observer*

          Or that there was no room for her to find a way to contact him somehow, even indirectly.

          And, he’s right.

    3. Juicebox Hero*

      “Hello, Teapottsville Police Station? Hi, my name is Joe Coworker. Listen, my fiancee Kate Twoface is having an affair with my boss Peter Poker, and I’m sick of it, and I’m fixing to vanish while they’re off on a ‘business trip’. I know, right? Anyway, if she tries to report me missing, I’m not actually missing, ok? Right, thanks, appreciate it. Bye!”

      6. Van Wilder*

        I’m dying.

        But like, yeah? How did that conversation actually go? I never would have thought you could contact a police department for something like that.

        2. Aerin*

          It’s a pity he won’t be able to put “planned, organized, and executed a CIA-level extraction from a relationship with a brazenly cheating fiance” on his resume

    5. rebelwithmouseyhair*

      I didn’t know you could do that. Joe can put “attention to detail” on his CV, this is proof enough! I bet he’s very thorough and dependable and all, that firm lost a stellar employee there.

  15. Fluffy Orange Menace*

    “My fiance is missing and someone also at the same time took his favorite recliner, his clothing and his blackstone grill. I’d like to file a report.”

    “Ma’am that is not a kidnapping; he has left you. Proceed accordingly.”

    2. FrivYeti*

      While this is funny, it’s worth noting that a lot of missing persons reports are framed as “X has been behaving weird and I think they’re having a mental breakdown, please find them before they hurt themselves.” Which is a tool that abusive partners and parents often use to track people down, because then the police find someone who says “I don’t want to go back” and continue to treat it like someone who needs to be brought back.

      Informing the police in advance that you’re leaving indicates mental wellness, and also says a lot about what Joe assumed his wife’s reaction to being left was (and he was right!)

      1. Irish Teacher.*

        I can’t help suspecting there was even more going on behind closed doors. Not necessarily abuse, but given Kate’s behaviour in general and the fact that Joe seemed to have it predicted and warned both his family and the police not to give her any information on him/take her search for him seriously, I’m guessing he’s dealt with her drama in more ways than just finding out she was cheating on him (not that that’s not enough!).

        1. MK*

          This woman claimed that her affair partner hypnotized her into cheating and then had loud sex with him at their workplace. I think it’s safe to say she was a nightmare to live with.

          Unfortunately people tend to not leave bad relationships unless/until they have a “legitimate” reason, because they confuse “no one is perfect” with “it’s normal that my partner sucks”.

          1. A reader among many*

            Agreed. And even when every day feels terrible, we persuade ourselves that things will get better: “Oh, Kate’s only like this right now because of the stress that she’s under for Reasons X, Y, and Z (two of which Kate made up to garner sympathy) and so she’ll be herself again as soon as we’re past that. This is just a rough patch.”

            1. MigraineMonth*

              “It’s the stress of planning the wedding, I’m sure she’ll be less awful once we have a binding legal and financial entanglement…”

      2. wordswords*

        Uh huh. I was thinking that too — it really says a lot about Joe’s (accurate) read of the level of tactics Kate was ready to leap to, and puts the whole “quietly getting his ducks in a row to absolutely vanish while she was out of town” tactic in context.

        Given all that, I’m glad he’s free of the relationship for more reasons than just the cheating!

      3. Observer*

        what Joe assumed his wife’s reaction to being left was (and he was right!)

        Fortunately, she was not his wife yet.

      4. Lizard the Second*

        Some infamous murder cases also involve the killer filing a missing persons report with the police – “My wife has run off and left me. Nope, don’t know where she is now.”

  16. Language Lover*

    Joe’s approach reminds me of the guy who wrote in who had ghosted his new boss/ex at an international school when they were living together and teaching at another international school.

    But here Joe was in the right. Ice in his veins but right.

  17. Nonsense*

    Oh, the things I’d have been tempted to yell as commentary during Kate and Paul’s little reunion. What would they do, fire me? HR can’t even manage to fire them.

    1. CherryBlossom*

      Personally, I’d be tempted to bust out “Careless Whisper” on a boombox right outside their door. [Or more realistically, max volume on my phone].

      If I have to be in a dysfunctional job, might as well have some fun with it, right?

      4. Good Enough For Government Work*

        I once had a flatmate who would have very loud, lengthy sex with his girlfriend in the communal areas of our flat (the living room sofa was a favourite; yes, I *know*).

        Anyway, I took to blasting Disney songs, on loop, as loud as possible to put them off.

        (It’s A Small World worked best; thank God for earplugs.)

      5. Dek*

        When my neighbors would get busy loudly in the wee hours and keep me up, I would crank up Weird Al polka music.

        Might not be the right mood, but dang is it funny.

    2. Falling Diphthong*

      I suspect this company is a reminder of why, even though “place where no one can get fired” sounds nice in theory, in practice you’re surrounded by people who would have been fired anywhere else.

    3. Unkempt Flatware*

      Honestly, I’d probably try to open the door. If I’m being subjected to audible sexual harassment (I think being exposed to the sounds of violent sex is harassment of the whole office if not an assault), I’d love to subject them to humiliation and shame.

      2. Chirpy*

        The fantasy answer is pull the fire alarm…

        (except that you really shouldn’t actually do that and waste the fire department’s time.)

        ….so….find an air horn?

        1. Silver Robin*

          if a bucket of ice cold water were not more clearly assault and likely to cause property damage, I would be so tempted…

    4. Dust Bunny*

      I had a college friend who had an upstairs neighbor who is was in a rather enthusiastic relationship.

      After one too many sleepless nights–the dorm doors all had white boards installed next to them–friend went upstairs and wrote “Regular cardio might help with that stamina problem” on Neighbor’s white board. Things got quieter after that.

      3. HonorBox*

        Had a friend who lived upstairs and her roommate was in a similarly enthusiastic relationship (LOVE the terminology, by the way). She would step out to brush her teeth and they’d lock the door. So she’d come down to my room and my roommate and I would throw a soccer ball against the ceiling and pound the ceiling with a broomstick arrhythmically.

    5. noncommittally anonymous*

      I’m picturing the entire office outside the door applauding as she creeps out afterwards.

      1. Old Hampshire New Hampshire*

        Or paddles with a score out of 10 like they have on Strictly/Dancing with the Stars.

    6. rebelwithmouseyhair*

      My go-to when people are having sex too loudly for my personal comfort is to shout “stop simulating”. Even if they’re not simulating, it works a treat.

  19. Goldenrod*

    WHOA. You weren’t kidding when you said it was explosive!!

    I think my favorite part is Joe’s relatives claiming they “don’t know her, and never knew her.” That is some cold (well-deserved) shiz. Love it.

  20. Emily (not a bot)*

    This seems like a lot of information for Kate to be sharing at work, including information that does not make her look particularly good and therefore is particularly odd to be telling her coworkers.

    3. Juicebox Hero*

      Yeah, the fact that she was lurking in the background of a video meeting, undressed, during her and Peter’s “business trip” makes it pretty obvious she doesn’t have a lot of common sense.

      She seems like one of those people who thinks nothing is ever her fault. I mean, if she expected people to swallow the line about Peter HYPNOTIZING her…

    4. Elbe*

      The blatantly poor judgement and destructive behavior of both Kate and Peter make me think that there could be some type of drugs involved here. Most people would know that carrying on like this at work is going to get them fired. They could just be two run-of-the-mill jerks with narcissistic tendencies, but this level of irresponsible pleasure-seeking screams addict.

      Just one more reason that I’m glad Joe is not involved with this anymore.

      1. Distracted Procrastinator*

        Not necessarily. Some people are just addicted to drama. It makes them feel wanted and powerful. They will actually seek it out and/or create it themselves because they need the adrenalin hit from the chaos.

    5. Irish Teacher.*

      I’ve known people who’d do it. I mean share information that makes them look really bad. Sometimes it’s because they are so sure that they are right and that everything they’ve done is justified that it doesn’t occur to them anybody might feel differently (after all, Joe left her, so clearly she is the victim, right?). Sometimes they are just drama llamas and just want to be the centre of attention, good or bad. And sometimes…it seems like they just can’t keep stuff to themselves, like they just blurt things out without even thinking of the possible reaction.

      2. Dust Bunny*

        I once had a coworker who wanted to discuss the taste of . . . certain bodily fluids one encounters in intimate situations. At work. She quit for some other job but it didn’t pan out. She reapplied at our place and bosses were considering rehiring her until everyone got together and told them, H*ll, no–they weren’t enduring any more of that.

        Some people are just like that.

      3. essie*

        So true. One of my super dramatic coworkers has shared so many details of her messy divorce, totally unprompted and unwanted, it’s like the whole office was there watching the whole thing happen. She was certainly not blameless, and let me tell you, she has no problem broadcasting it. Maybe the weird part is that it happened years ago, so there’s *really* no reason for her to share.

      4. MigraineMonth*

        I’m not at all surprised she shared how Joe left her. She was the victim of a shocking and DRAMATIC betrayal just before her wedding! Obviously she has to share the circumstances with the people who she invited to the wedding, and her coworkers, and her dentist, and strangers in line at the deli.

        Given how oblivious some people can be, she may also have thought her affair with Peter was a secret from her coworkers at that time.

    7. DramaQ*

      Considering she was seen on camera during a work zoom meeting in Peter’s hotel room undressed I can’t say that I am surprised Kate has no sense of self preservation or modesty.

      I am guessing her mind set is to now go scorched Earth throwing anyone she can under the bus in the vain attempt to come out looking at least better than Peter.

      Hence the “he hypnotized me!” She’s hoping to drum up sympathy due to the power imbalance between her and Peter.

      Also look at the fact Joe pretty much disappeared in the middle of the night. That tends to be something victims of abuse do when they finally escape. It could have been an epic “screw you” or I am guessing given the epic implosion course Kate is on that Joe likely suffered a lot more than anyone knows in his relationship with her.

      1. rebelwithmouseyhair*

        yeah his heart must have been well and truly broken, I felt very badly for him with the first letter.

    8. rebelwithmouseyhair*

      Someone who tries to “sneak past” a work webcam in use while undressed is hardly expected to have good judgement about how much information to include when ranting?

  23. Elbe*

    …when Kate returned home she realised their house was empty. Completely bare.

    YES, JOE! If Kate thinks her life is falling apart now, wait until she gets fired. I don’t think Joe is the only person here getting some ducks in a row.

    Thank you so much to the LW for the update!

    1. Elbe*

      I want the LW to anonymously send Joe a link to this so that he can see all of the support he and his family are getting.

      2. Elle*

        See how I packed up all my belongings while my cheating fiancée is on a trip? I don’t make a big scene. Very demure, very understated. When I leave my fiancé and the shards of my life behind, never to be seen again, I warn my local law enforcement. Very approachable.

    1. Elbe*

      Yes, and OP, too! OP has been compassionate toward Joe, wants to avoid drama, did their former office a solid by telling grandboss what’s up, and apparently makes A+ baked goods.

  27. Ellena*

    One of my favorite stories and updates between Joe, the hypnotizing and the loud and violent s*x… this is just amazing! Congrats to OP for the new job

  28. Juicebox Hero*

    Meanwhile, Joe is sitting at his new desk at his new company and an office mate says, “Hey, Joe, how’d you wind up moving all the way from Teapottsville to Wakeentown? That’s a good thousand miles away!”

    “Fred, if I told you, you wouldn’t even believe me…”

  29. Anon21*

    Some of this doesn’t sound super plausible, which makes sense as it’s reaching the LW third-hand (Kate –> former coworker –> LW). Either way, a great story.

    1. Peanut Hamper*

      It is very cold in space…which is what Joe has given himself here.

      Some heros wear capes. Other heros just take all their stuff, walk away, tell the police they are gone and not missing, and just disappear into the shrubberies. Well done, Joe!

  31. Ellis Bell*

    I don’t know who is my favourite hero in this story. The nominees are: 1) Joe for just being an epically cool guy with great timing and foresight. 2) OP for unapologetically telling off the grand boss for having such a clusterfuck of a company with useless HR, 3) OP’s former colleagues for keeping OP, and therefore us, fully informed of the insane developments and 4) Karma.

  32. learnedthehardway*

    Wow! Glad you are out of there, OP, and that you had a chance to explain exactly why to the Grand Boss (who will hopefully do something about the situation). I’m wondering if GB (grand boss) told Joe, or if he was aware already.

    2. Emotional support capybara (he/him)*

      Yeah, I read the title and knew we were going to be dipping into the national strategic popcorn reserve for this one.

  36. Peanut Hamper*

    A story in three acts:

    1) Kate fucks around.

    2) Kate finds out.

    3) Kate: surprised Pikachu face.

    Plus a supporting cast of characters Shakespeare would be jealous of.

  37. Margaret Cavendish*

    I missed the original story, so reading this all at once is quite the ride! That was a *very* satisfying outcome for OP and Joe, and for the rest of us reading it vicariously on the internet.

    It sounds like there will be a less satisfying outcome for Peter and Kate, but…well, they’re pretty much the definition of FAFO at this point. They f***ed around (literally!) and woweee, did they ever find out. Too bad for them, I guess!

  40. Sick of Workplace Bullshit (she/her)*

    I love this update. As someone who has been cheated on (it is utterly humiliating), GO JOE!!!

  41. jasmine*

    me seeing the title: starts eating popcorn

    me reading “it’s explosive!”: starts eating popcorn very quickly

  44. A Book about Metals*

    This is an aside but can you actually call the police and say something like “If anyone calls saying I’m missing, I’m not so don’t look for me” ??

    It sounds like alot of problems could come from that

    1. Myrin*

      You can. I don’t know if there are specific parametres involved which must be met – I actually believe you need to turn up personally so that they can actually identify you and not believe some random kidnapper posing as the person they’ve just abducted on the phone – but I’ve both read about the act itself on the internet and in the local paper.

    2. AnonyNurse*

      I’ve not done it myself, but my understanding is that, yes, you can do this (at least in the US), although I imagine managing to talk to the “right” person may be a challenge in some areas. In the US, there is an established “right to go missing” that is identified in the first amendment as a right of anonymity.

      It kind of reminds me of when we used to be told to report to credit card companies that we’d be traveling out of the country, so that charges wouldn’t be flagged/cards wouldn’t be cancelled. Or letting an embassy know that you’re visiting a country.

    3. Irish Teacher.*

      I’d imagine you could call them up or call into them and say, “I am leaving my wife and moving to X town. My relationship has broken down and I do not want Kate Surnameson looking for me, so please don’t tell where I am. If anything truly happens to me, my mother/father/sister/brother is my next of kin and they will contact you.”

      Though honestly, a few months ago, a body was found on my street of a man who had “disappeared” twenty years ago. He had actually died and been in his house the whole time. His sister apparently contacted the police when she didn’t get a Christmas card from him and they said “oh, the word on the street is that he’s gone to England” (which honestly didn’t even explain it as I am pretty sure they have postboxes in England) and left it at that.

      That was the word on the street. We heard that too and actually did half-joke sometimes about “what if he was dead in there the whole time?” but the police had been around and the council boarded up the house (or somebody did; we assumed it was the council) so we assumed that possibility had been investigated and ruled out. Clearly not!

      So yeah, if “the rumour going around is that he’s gone to England*” is enough to keep the police from investigating, I’d totally believe that going into a police station, showing them one’s ID and telling them you plan to disappear would do it. Especially in this case, where Joe is only saying that if one person calls to say it, don’t look for him. I think that’s a bit different than “if anyone calls,” as a lot of people need to hide from a specific person.

      *he had moved here from England, so him returning there wasn’t that strange.

      1. Myrin*

        Okay, now I have to know: did the sister call the police twenty years ago or just last year? And if the latter, who had sent her Christmas cards in her dead brother’s name? Or do you mean the guy had been alive (but hidden somehow) in his house for twenty years but only actually died recently?

        There was a similar incident two houses down from my grandparents a few decades ago which I actually remember talking about in an open thread once, now that I think about it. It was very “Psycho”-ish, two siblings who were about ten years older than my grandparents lived there but then the brother moved to Berlin. What nobody knew is that he became very sick and came back to live with his sister, only to die shortly after in their house. Which only came out when the sister died about twenty or so years later and they found him still sitting in his chair (I’m not making this up! It really happened! I remember it!).

        They had a little store in their house and mum used to buy milk there when she was a child and often remarked to me (before this all happened!) how Leni had always been somewhat weird and a bit creepy but who could possibly imagine something like that!

        1. Good Enough For Government Work*

          I think you may need to re-read the comment. The sister called the police because she had NOT received a Christmas card from him.

          1. Myrin*

            With respect, I think you may need to re-read my comment. I said “did the sister call the police twenty years ago or just last year? And if the latter, who had sent her Christmas cards in her dead brother’s name?”.

            If the sister had only called the police this past Christmas because she hadn’t received a card, that logically means she must’ve received cards in the years before. Irish confirmed below that the sister called twenty years ago but it wasn’t entirely clear in the first comment (even though I guessed as much) so I was very intrigued and thought I’d ask about it.

        2. Irish Teacher.*

          She called the police twenty years ago. They ignored it, told her he’d gone to England and the body was finally found years after she’d let them know.

    4. sheworkshardforthemoney*

      I believe that you can. Several years ago a woman “disappeared without a trace” Her partner filed a missing person report and asked the public for help in finding her. The police did locate her and after speaking with her told the public that she was safe and nothing more. They also said that people have the right to disappear and that they appreciate a heads up so that they don’t waste resources looking for them. The partner continued to rail to the media and anyone who would listen about what an awful person she was while revealing very personal information about her which confirmed that maybe she was right to disappear.

    5. Ellis Bell*

      Such as? I think you’re assuming Joe is opting out of police protection for infinity rather than just saying “I’m leaving my girlfriend on Tuesday and she’s probably going to come into the station and lie about that”.

    7. Ann O'Nemity*

      You absolutely can call the police to preemptively report yourself as not missing. It’s actually advised in abuse cases, and the police will know not to reveal any information about current whereabouts.

      1. Betty Spaghetti*

        That is correct and I have done it. Although head’s up, your utility company is nowhere near as careful with your personal information as you would think.

    8. CommanderBanana*

      You sure can. I work at a shelter for abused women and a few of our clients have done it, or gone to the police to say that if a particular person looks for me, do not give them any information or try to help them find me, I am not missing. Usually they’re in the processing of getting a restraining order against said person so that helps.

  50. Pita Chips*

    LW congratulations on landing a new spot! That’s great news.

    and thank you for the story. Wildest thing I’ve read in a while.

  53. IAmOnE*

    This is probably one of my favourite updates ever! Well done OP, so proud of you for getting out of there so quickly.

    Please send a final update when Kate and Peter are fired.

  54. Seeking Second Childhood*

    Everyone wondered if Kate was in Peter’s chain of command – but I also wondered if Joe was!

  55. Delta Delta*

    My actual favorite part is Joe’s parents saying they don’t know Kate. This had to have been in the works for a long time, and they are playing a perfect supporting role.

  56. spuffyduds*

    I find myself hoping Joe’s parents gave “We don’t know you” an EDGE, like “We *thought* we knew you, but clearly we DON’T.”

  57. Baffled Teacher*

    When we say we want updates we want this kind!! DRAMA! PASSION!! REVENGE! ABSOLUTELY NO SITUATIONAL AWARENESS! the stuff of legend!!

  58. Global Cat Herder*

    I had a co-worker whose wife left him the exact same way that Joe left Kate. So much so that I seriously think it’s a “how to safely leave your abuser” script. Including contacting the police, staying a third place (not with family), and having family prepped with how to deal with the police.

    Co-worker also claimed his wife had left the house “completely bare” but she left everything that was Just His. If you picked stuff out of his rants, she left a lot of stuff! Two closets full of his clothes, his office, his game room, the elaborate home theater setup including fancy couches, and a garage full of camping & fishing gear. Which she had piled in the center of the garage so he could see it first thing when he got back from yet another of the “camping weekends” he regularly took without his wife and 4 small kids – and without any of his camping gear.

    1. Aggretsuko*

      I agree, I doubt the house was utterly emptied of anything other than Joe’s stuff.

      From what I’ve heard of people leaving an abuser, yeah, that might be the case.

    2. Boof*

      ” a garage full of camping & fishing gear. Which she had piled in the center of the garage so he could see it first thing when he got back from yet another of the “camping weekends” he regularly took without his wife and 4 small kids – and without any of his camping gear.”
      ooooooo go gurl!

    3. allathian*

      This just goes one step further to confirm that Joe and Kate’s relationship was probably abusive and that Joe was the victim. Go Joe! He certainly followed a “how to safely leave your abuser” script.
      -He prepped his departure pretty thoroughly, including going to the police to tell them he wasn’t missing if Kate filed a missing person’s report.
      -He got his parents on board and they pretended not to know her when she showed up.
      -He quit his job and took his stuff away when she was on a trip with Pete.

      I’m sorry for Kate in a way, she seems to have fucked up her life pretty thoroughly.

    4. Bananapants Modiste*

      “So much so that I seriously think it’s a “how to safely leave your abuser” script. Including contacting the police, staying a third place (not with family), and having family prepped with how to deal with the police.”

      It is exactly that script, I saw it on Quora!

  59. Techno guy*

    Wow what a ride. Alison should give a ‘popcorn’ alert before we read these so we can settle in with a snack or frosty beverage.

      1. Festively Dressed Earl*

        If you see “Wait, what?” in the tags, it usually means it’s time to get a crispy snack and a soda so you can do a spit take. Not sure why this one didn’t get that.

  61. Telephone Sanitizer, Third Class*

    That’s not a bullet dodged, that’s an entire nuclear arsenal. Holy shit.

  62. Ex-Prof*

    wow! When Joe gets his ducks in a row, they are got! Notifying the cops in advance that he wasn’t a missing person was /chef’s kiss/.

    1. Too Many Tabs Open*

      Joe didn’t just get his ducks in a row, he organized them into a marching band and had them perform a halftime show before waddling off into legend.

  63. MistOrMister*

    Good on Joe for walking out!! The only issue I have with this story, and the previous one, is how everyone in that workplace was willing to keep quiet about the obvious affair when they thought Joe didn’t know. It doesn’t appear anyone involved believed Joe and Kate had an open relationship, just that no one wanted to tell the guy. I can’t imagine how isolated that must have made him feel!

    It is absolutely hilarious to me that Kate came home to him and his posessions missing. Usually I would not advocate for leaving in such a manner (unless its for one’s safety), but someone carrying on a long term, very obvious affair with a coworker when their SO works at the same office deserves what they get. It absolutely blows my mind that Peter and Kate were heard having loud sex and were not immediately fired and escorted from the premises.

    1. Strive to Excel*

      The problem, as Alison identified in the prior letter, is that because one of the participants was a manager there was a risk of retaliation involved.

    4. Ellis Bell*

      On the safety issue; I don’t think it’s a coincidence that Joe happened upon advice for leaving an abuser when planning to leave Kate. When cheaters are undergoing guilt and cognitive dissonance (or, you know, hypnotism), rarely is their behaviour towards the victimised partner safe, level and adult and this is usually more visible to the victim than the cheating (which is also unsafe, obviously). I’m not saying Kate physically abused him but there is such a thing as emotional safety, and Joe is entitled to a clean break from someone likely to stalk and dramatise. In my experience (I left a cheater in a similar manner) it’s not just about delivering just deserts, it really is about putting yourself back together again. As for people staying quiet about the affair towards Joe; nobody likes doing that and in this case, if they had spoken to him they might actually have endangered his pose that he didn’t know anything while he was preparing his exit plan.

  64. A Book about Metals*

    When is the wedding scheduled? Kate has a lot of fences to mend in the interim. A good couples counselor is a start on the road back

      1. Peanut Hamper*

        Oh gosh, yes. Geologic faults have shifted. Tectonic plates have moved. Asteroids, dinosaurs, etc. This wedding is EXTINCT!

    5. Emotional support capybara (he/him)*

      My fellow traveler on Spaceship Earth, I am genuinely confused as to how you can read this whole saga and think there wedding is still on.

        1. Peanut Hamper*

          Also, I love your username. If I ever win the lottery, I will have multiple actual emotional support capybaras!

    7. Unemployed in Greenland*

      I think Joe took the phones, the couples counselor, and also the entire internet with him.

    9. HonorBox*

      Feels like Joe going full Jason Bourne takes a wedding off the table. Given that his parents deny even knowing Kate, and given that she and Peter were loudly canoodling in his office, I think that ship sailed long, long ago.

  67. I'm the Phoebe in Any Group*

    Everything possible had been said about the glory of how Joe left.
    There was also a gem for the next round of Bosses Handling Resignations Badly:
    “I could leave immediately because I clearly thought I was better than them.”

  68. Elizabeth West*

    When I saw “This is explosive,” I went and took a shower and fixed a bowl of cereal before I came back and settled in for one of the best updates I’ve read in a long time.

    I hope Joe is living his best life.

  70. Ebar*

    I’m left wondering what Peter is brings to the table to justify his continuing employment given that he’s effectively run off two staff members and is engaging in what would be politely described as disruptive behavior.

  71. Never the Twain*

    I need to know, synchronously with Joe’s departure, did the office microwave disappear too?
    (Another of my favourites)

  73. Bill and Heather's Excellent Adventure*

    I am so glad that both you and Joe are out of there. I am full of admiration for Joe’s planning and ninja skills (especially forewarning the police that he is NOT a missing person!). You absolutely did the right thing by telling grandboss about the mess that’s going on. Holy bananapants, Batman!

  74. rebelwithmouseyhair*

    The detail that Joe had already reported himself to the police as “not missing”? I didn’t know you could do that! But this kind of attention to detail is just brilliant.
    I’m not sure whether OP isn’t testing out a screenplay for a new series, working title Bad (Office) Romance…

  76. K in Boston*

    I go back and forth with how much I believe in karma, but boy. If there was ever a case to make for it, this feels like it would be it. Cheers to OP for getting out of there without needing to wade any further into the mire.

  78. HonorBox*

    Love this! So much.

    While all of this is so great, the fact that OP got the hell out makes it so much better for me. It is galling that Peter didn’t want OP to serve out the notice period and then grandboss had the audacity to call to ask. That email from Peter is amazing, and the fact that it got forwarded and all of the gory details of the affair were shared … YESSS!

  80. Syfy Geek*

    You know the overused image in all the action movies where the hero is walking toward the camera and there’s a HUGE explosion behind him and he doesn’t even look back?
    That’s Joe.

  81. Nothanks*

    This is an excellent story! I am so glad to have invested my time in reading this. (I know that sounds snarky, but I really mean it. I love a good story with intrigue, drama and people standing up for themselves!)

  84. Lizbrarian*

    My bananapants are in orbit! I wouldn’t feel too upset about telling your grandboss everything. He discovered rather quickly why it was an untenable situation.

    I have so much respect for Joe. That was a *chef’s kiss* way of extracting yourself from a toxic situation. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

Comments are closed.