update: should I tell an employee I had a dream predicting his death?

by Alison Green on December 2, 2024

It’s “where are you now?” month at Ask a Manager, and all December I’m running updates from people who had their letters here answered in the past.

There will be more posts than usual this week, so keep checking back throughout the day.

In 2018, I printed a letter from someone asking whether they should tell an employee about a dream predicting he would die on September 25, 2024 (#3 at the link). They promised to update us after that date, and many of you wrote to me on September 26, 2024 asking if I’d heard back. Here’s the update.

A promise is a promise!

I’d only been working at that job a few months when I wrote in! As far as I know, my former employee is very much alive and even asked me for a reference a few months ago. He was a mostly good employee, but had been promoted too fast and fell into the classic trap of thinking there’s a level of seniority or management that exists where you no longer have to work to build consensus with stakeholders and can just do whatever you like. He eventually left for another job, which he then left to run his own company, which went under after three months. He’s at another company and unhappy enough to be looking for his next big thing. I left the job where I managed him in early 2021, so if I’m the most recent reference he thinks might have something positive to say … well, he might not have died in 2024, but the jury’s still out on his career.

P.S. Thanks to you for telling me not to say anything, and to the commenters for asking what the hell was wrong with me. Later that year, I was diagnosed as autistic! Not something I consider to be WRONG with me, per se, but definitely explains why I didn’t see an issue with wanting to tell him (and to this day, I would prefer someone tell me if they had the same dream!). I’m in a new job with a boss who loves my direct and strategically-minded demeanor, and I have gotten better at knowing when not to say something — although I now have good friends both at work and outside work who will tell me when I can’t say something.

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  1. the cat ears*

    Alison’s advice was absolutely correct and I also would have had such a hard time not saying anything! I’m glad he is apparently alive and well.

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    2. Priscilla Tells It Like It Is*

      To each their own, but I know how to fight a prophecy so I would want to know! You never think you can until you have to learn.

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      1. Antilles*

        1.) If it’s a true prophecy, wouldn’t it just still happen anyways? Perhaps in a Greek tragedy or horror movie kind of way where trying to avoid it actually causes it. Oedipus running away to avoid killing his father. Or that you intentionally stay home on the 25th to avoid the risk of a car crash, but that meant you were home alone and therefore didn’t have anybody to call 9-1-1 on your behalf when you choked on lunch.
        2.) If it doesn’t happen, how do you really know you even fought the prophecy? Was your choice to lock yourself in a room on the 25th life-saving or was it simply paranoia and you would have been just fine driving to work like any other random weekday.

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        1. UKDancer*

          Yeah if the Greek myths are anything to go by, trying to avoid prophecies doesn’t work out so well. At least not for Oedipus, Perseus etc. It seems to bring about the catastrophe one is seeking to avoid.

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      2. FindingNeo*

        “What’s Really Going To Bake Your Noodle Later On Is, Would You Still Have Broken It If I Hadn’t Said Anything?”

        Prophecies can be weird like that…

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    1. Pastor Petty Labelle*

      But apparently accurate. Damn dude, at no point do you not have to get folks to go along with what you want. Even Supreme Dictators needs to do a bit of persuasion.

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      1. Antilles*

        It’s especially funny given that he started his own company. I know owning the own company sounds like you’re being your own boss, but when you own your own company, you effectively have hundreds of ‘bosses’. It’s just that rather than being a single Department Vice President to keep happy, your new bosses are things like “our 10 biggest clients”, “the union contract”, “OSHA regulations”, etc.

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        1. Statler von Waldorf*

          “when you own your own company, you effectively have hundreds of ‘bosses’.”

          I have been tempted a few times over the years to have a variation of this quote burned into a wooden baseball bat that I can use on every consulting client I’ve had who thinks that being their own boss means they won’t have to take orders from anyone else ever again. My lawyer advised against actually doing it, even as a joke, so I just dream about doing it on the internet.

          That’s not how business is done. My consulting is only a side hustle, and I swear I spend far more time outside of doing my actual work managing clients for that than I do keeping my boss happy at my regular full-time job.

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    3. Stuart Foote*

      Ouch…I recently applied for a job where both references I used were from 2021, since I didn’t want to reveal I was looking at other jobs to my current co-workers. Although I didn’t get the job, the employer seemed suitably impressed by my references. I don’t think this is that unusual, especially since often prospective employers want three references from former supervisors which means you’re sometimes scraping the bottom of the barrel for that third reference.

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      1. lil falafel wrap*

        I think you’re taking this different situation too personally. The employee in question has worked multiple other places since working with the letter writer and apparently has made a mess of those places. That doesn’t seem like it relates to you at all, and if you know you have strong references, why take someone else’s situation to heart?

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        1. Venus*

          And your response sounds mean! People often make comments about their personal situations that relate to the post.

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          1. sparkle emoji*

            I don’t consider lil falafel’s comment to be mean. Stuart’s comment seems concerned that using 2021+ references would be a faux pas generally. Lil falafel is pointing out how the situation from the letter is unique and not a problem with having 2021+ references more broadly.

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        2. Federal Employee 10597513*

          There is nothing in LW’s post that indicates the employee “made a mess” of their jobs. The only actual evidence of failure was their business not succeeding, but I will hardly hold that against him. At least he tried.

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          1. sparkle emoji*

            That’s the LW’s understanding/implication. They say “if I’m the most recent reference he thinks might have something positive to say … well, he might not have died in 2024, but the jury’s still out on his career.” Not positive. Maybe they’re wrong but lil falafel and others did not pull that out of thin air.

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        3. Nonym*

          > The employee in question has worked multiple other places since working with the letter writer and apparently has made a mess of those places.

          That is your own assumption.

          Apart from his current job, which is typically not part of references, he has only held *1* other job. There’s no indication that he made a mess at either his current or his previous job. If he was asked for 2+ references, then it’s pretty normal to give one from his previous job and one from the job before that.

          The only known failure is his business – which is common, most businesses fail.

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          1. sparkle emoji*

            An assumption that is in the letter: “if I’m the most recent reference he thinks might have something positive to say … well, he might not have died in 2024, but the jury’s still out on his career.”

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    4. Federal Employee 10597513*

      That comment seemed unnecessarily cold. LW doesn’t know they are the only reference being used. Isn’t it common to provide two or three? If that’s the case, going all the way back to 2021 doesn’t seem weird or desperate at all. The employee may have other, more recent references too. This is really normal.

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      1. Bananapants*

        That’s a really good point. It’s only been 3 and a bit years! I definitely have references that go back about that amount of time. They’re simply from my previous job. Add in not wanting your current employer to know you’re job hunting and it makes even more sense to have a supervisor at your last non-self-employed job act as a reference.

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        1. Antilles*

          Yeah, I think that whole “most recent reference” thing is off-base.
          If OP left in early 2021 and he asked for a reference a few months ago, that’s 3.5 years. That’s really not that long. Especially if he spent a chunk of that time between jobs, then failing-at-starting his own firm (where he didn’t have a supervisor), it’s entirely reasonable that yes, getting “three supervisors” (a fairly common request in reference checks) would indeed require you to go back a couple years.

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        2. Wayward Sun*

          Other than my current supervisor my earliest reference would be from 2016. That’s the downside of not job-hopping.

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      2. Venus*

        I thought it was meant to be funny and I got a good laugh from it! It’s not appropriate to say directly to the person but the info we have about them is so vague.

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        1. Sherm*

          Agreed. It would have been unkind to say to his face, but it wasn’t, and it wasn’t even really said behind his back, because we don’t know whose back we’re talking about.

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      3. ferrina*

        It’s also that he’s been job hopping the last few years, leaving each place under not-the-best circumstances. Plus the LW’s describing his attitude as someone that thinks that at a certain level of hierarchy/seniority, he doesn’t need buy-in. I’ve worked with a couple people like that, and I’d prefer not to repeat the experience (these people also tend to disregard SMEs that they don’t like for other reasons, and there’s definitely a strong Venn diagram with people who disregard SMEs who don’t look like what they think an SME should look like)

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        1. Federal Employee 10597513*

          Where do you see that he left “under not-the-best circumstances”?

          In the original letter, the LW describes him as “one of my favorite/best employees.” The LW never says that he got fired or was largely disliked at any of his jobs. I don’t know where people are getting that from. At worst LW describes him as “mostly good” but not perfect.

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        1. Federal Employee 10597513*

          That’s a weird thing to even speculate about it because there’s no evidence it’s true. You can cover a lot of unknown situations with a well-placed “if”, but unless there’s some actual reason to believe that thing may be true, LW is just making a joke at the employee’s expense.

          Might as well say “If he left all those jobs because he was fired for embezzlement…” Still covered with the “if.”

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      5. Umami*

        I was thinking that too. The issue here is the source – not only is out a boss talking about their dream, but having a captive audience who can’t decide if they want to know the information or not. It seems to me that whether you would want to know or not is irrelevant, it’s not up to another person to decide for you (ie opening someone else’s box).

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    5. Ask a Manager* Post author

      I’m going to close this thread and ask that we move on from this, please. Clearly it hit some people differently than others, but I don’t want people who are kind enough to send in updates to get a barrage of criticism for how they word things. Thank you.

      Reply ↓
  4. juliebulie*

    If someone had a dream like that about me, I would want to know. So that I could have as much fun with it as possible. There was a Taxi episode about this, you know.

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    1. The Prettiest Curse*

      I’m glad he’s still alive and well! I’m definitely team “prefer not to know”, because I don’t trust myself not to overthink myself into a nasty accident.

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      1. Irish Teacher.*

        I’d prefer not to know, I think, both because it is a bit creepy and also because…well, depending on the person, I might not be sure if they were telling the truth or not. If it was a close friend or family member, I’d think, “yikes, that’s a bit specific and creepy,” but otherwise would just laugh.

        But I think from a colleague, especially one I wasn’t close to, I would kind of wonder why exactly they were telling me. Were they just telling me because it’s kind of random and somewhat funny or do they actually think it’s somehow prophetic or…are they just trying to…sort of make me uncomfortable, by essentially implying, “I think about your death”? Did they even really have this dream or did they just make it up to get a reaction out of me? See if it scares me or something? Or as a weird way of imply they hate me and are dreaming I was dead?

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        1. juliebulie*

          Actually… now that I’ve read more carefully, that this was someone dreaming about the demise of a direct report, I can definitely see where this would be very problematic. Given the power differential, I probably would not have fun with my boss about it. But I would forever have doubts about my boss. (For telling me, not for having the dream.)

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        2. metadata minion*

          Yeah, unless the dream was particularly funny or epic (e.g., killed by a mountain of paperclips in the supply closet or in a battle to the death with Godzilla), I would just be vaguely creeped out.

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      2. Lilo*

        I’d frankly avoid that person because it just would feel like they were trying to get some kind of rise or reaction out of me.

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      3. ferrina*

        Right?! It would definitely interfere with my quality of life.
        Though it might make me a little more timely with paperwork.

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      1. Umami*

        I was thinking that too. The issue here is the source – not only is out a boss talking about their dream, but having a captive audience who can’t decide if they want to know the information or not. It seems to me that whether you would want to know or not is irrelevant, it’s not up to another person to decide for you (ie opening someone else’s box).

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    3. Red Canary*

      I’d prefer not to know, because it would definitely make me think less of the person telling me, at least if they seemed to take the dream seriously.

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  5. Irish Teacher.*

    Thank you so so much for coming back to us with the update. So much time has passed since the original letter that I thought you might have lost interest or forgotten. So thanks for thinking of us.

    Reply ↓
  6. Premonition Dreamer*

    As a premonition dreamer myself (haven’t been wrong so far), I’d never share my premonitions with the subject. It takes a certain person to hear the premonition and do with it what they want. Typically, the subject wants you to have a different dream or wants you to provide some emotional labor or thinks you’re somehow responsible. Tread lightly.

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    1. SB*

      What type of things have you predicted, if you don’t mind the question? I’m deeply curious if it’s little things, like knowing what someone is going to eat for lunch. Bigger things, like knowing who they’re going to marry. Or like really big world events – earthquakes and stuff

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      1. Premonition Dreamer*

        Always the big stuff but only in my world. Births, deaths, pregnancies (and loss), crimes to be committed, adulteries, my cat being reincarnated (a particularly goosebump-inducing story), etc. My biggest premonition was the violent death a friend’s father and the subsequent arrest of friend’s brother AT the funeral. Everything has happened identically to my dreams. My dreams can come years in advance or the night before. I can also see things in my waking life. I once landed in Burbank to visit my brother who lived in Glendale. Never been to California before this trip. He picked me up at the airport and said he wanted to pick up Little Ceasars but didn’t know where one was. I blurted out, “There’s one in the Adams Square Shopping Center”. He believed me and drove to Adams Street and there it was. I also knew that horrible I-70 accident outside of Denver was going to happen and I stayed home that day. Would’ve been killed or witnessed the horror.

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        1. SB*

          That’s fascinating. Thanks so much for sharing. I don’t think I’ve heard of premonition dreams being that detailed prior to the events before.

          And I don’t think I’d like that ability….it would definitely get me stuck in fight/flight/freeze mode.

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        2. Throwaway Account*

          Early in my pregnancy I dreamed it was a boy and in the dream he was wearing a specific “sailor suit.” It was a boy, and my aunt in another state gave me the sailor suit after he was born – in the exact colors, collar, embroidery, etc. That is my only “premonition dream,” but I believed it and assumed during my whole pregnancy that it was a boy.

          I once had a waking “premonition” or drive to “get” a guy for my friend. I felt a sort of compulsion to “pick up” a stranger at a house concert. I personally found him not attractive (not my type), but I “had” to connect to him. I cannot describe how strongly I felt both a drive to “get him” and no desire for him at all. Later, he said he thought I was flirting with him, but he really preferred my friend. They have been together for 20 years!

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      2. Circe Nightshade*

        I have psychic dreams and they’re so pointless. They only last about a minute and it’s always something like seeing someone crossing the street and their dog does something noticeably cute or weird, or someone I know saying something completely inconsequential. I don’t usually realize they’re these visions of the future until they’re happening and I get overwhelming deja-vu. I can remember what happens once the deja-vu starts and either let it play out or change it if I want, so they’re a little fun but not useful.

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    2. Nobby Nobbs*

      I mean, if I believed in prophecy and someone shared an alarming premonition about my life and then balked at dealing with the resulting emotions I’d be wondering why they brought it up and how they expected me to act, so you’re probably right to tread lightly if you don’t want to do “emotional labor.”

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      2. magic*

        Yeah, I agree. I can’t have your cake at eat it too in the “disclosing premonitions” department. Emotional labor is a pretty specific concept, and I’m not a fan of how it’s used these days.

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      3. Lilo*

        I’d actually feel like the person telling me would be expecting emotional labor from me. What exactly would this person want me to do in this situation.

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          1. Wayward Sun*

            Or the start of some kind of scam. I’d expect the next sentence to be “it’s because your money is cursed. Bring it to me and I’ll cleanse it for you for a percentage.” Very common scam in some circles.

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      5. Radioactive Cyborg Llama*

        Presumably they would bring it up so that you had the information, not so that they could be your emotional support person.

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        1. magic*

          Certainly, they are free to extricate themselves from the situation and have no obligation to be an “emotional support person”. But when you give someone information that is alarming and unusual, you must be prepared for a response you might not like.

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        2. MaxPower*

          to do what with? You (general you) tell me you dreamed I’m dying on a certain date or in a certain way and what am I supposed to do with that? Especially in the case of Premonition Dreamer who insists that they’ve never been wrong, implying that this is inevitable.
          So, all that you’d be doing is giving me a reason to dread or fear something. To do that and then absolve yourself of the bad feelings I feel would be a dick move.

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        3. Lilo*

          I mean, to blunt, I do not believe in this kind of thing. So now I’m in the awkward position of either potentially insulting this person’s beliefs about premonitions or providing some kind of validation and taking this seriously. It’s not a good position to put someone in.

          I don’t see this as being that different from telling someone you had a sex dream about them. It’s not appropriate and it demands a reaction for something for which the person is question bears no responsibility.

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          1. magic*

            I have so often been put in similar positions (not about premonition dreams, thankfully) about spiritual and/or pseudoscientific stuff by others and it’s the absolute PITS. It happens regardless of neurotype. NT folks can’t see my discomfort because I’m high masking and freeze in situations where I have no script. ND folks always clock me as ND and make big leaps in terms of my openness to hearing about this kind of thing based on my general open-mindedness/me indicating an interest in spirituality. Both tend to get mad when I politely express that I cannot endorse what they’re saying!

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      6. boof*

        “it’s a good time to buy life insurance if you have a family hey?” lol no I would not tell people I dreamed about them especially if I wasn’t convinced I’d had prior accurate premonitions (I don’t really)

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  7. bamcheeks*

    fell into the classic trap of thinking there’s a level of seniority or management that exists where you no longer have to work to build consensus with stakeholders and can just do whatever you like

    OH MAN. I worked for someone like this. Except their version was “once you’ve got it through the too committee, everyone just has to fall in line— wait, why are they not falling in line?”

    With ACADEMICS, no less, who never met a committee they couldn’t ignore.

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    1. Not That Kind of Doctor*

      IME it does exist up to a point — there’s one making life difficult in my work orbit — but it’s rare.

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    2. deesse877*

      I did not have to read anything after “through the committee” to know that this was in an academic milieu.

      Reply ↓
  8. Dawn*

    Definitely not something wrong with you! But also definitely something that has a bit of a learning curve when it comes to interacting with the allistics (and the broader population in general. Sometimes we have conflicting things that end up getting on each others’ nerves.)

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  9. Ellis Bell*

    I think not telling the employee about this dream was definitely the right way to go. Apart from all the obvious reasons which forbid it, apparently OP’s subconscious was actually predicting the death of …. their career. Exactly the sort of thing you don’t want to hear from your boss, especially if it’s true. Kudos to OP for instead bringing their puzzling, visceral reactions to the dream to instead be analysed here. And for updating us of course!

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  10. Nonanon*

    For those of y’all wondering what that noise you heard around 1:30 US Central time was (I’m not doing conversions for every time zone), twas I GASPING.

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  11. Jay*

    As a neurodivergent person, I’d be super curious to know how many of the folks who write in for advice identify as being somewhere on the spectrum. I’ve noticed a lot of updates (especially when the question related to navigating complex social situations) include an aside about receiving a diagnosis that shed new light on the letter writer’s perspective. This blog really does function in a lot of ways like the “How To People” guide that I used to think everyone but me must have recieved. Thank you, Alison!

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    1. Filthy Vulgar Mercenary*

      This blog really does function in a lot of ways like the “How To People” guide that I used to think everyone but me must have recieved

      This resonates with me so strongly! I feel the same about the CaptainAwkward blog – AAM for the non-work parts of life.

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      1. Jenesis*

        As a not-diagnosed-with-anything-but-definitely-ND person, I feel the same way about advice columns in general (and the Internet more broadly). I wish schools taught this stuff, and not just in the context of consent in sex ed. But I suppose if most of the NTs just “get it” without specific instruction, it falls to me to find a different way to fill in the gaps.

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    2. magic*

      I’m a late diagnosed neurodivergent person myself, and having read this blog since I was a teen (I’m now in my mid 20s) I can say it’s been a huge help. Particularly in terms of identifying what is abusive and unacceptable, and learning to accept/work with things I feel are unreasonable are unjust. I personally don’t use “How to People” framing, but I absolutely think your experience isn’t uncommon.

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      1. magic*

        Oh, also – as a high masking person in the process of learning what works for me, what doesn’t, what’s maladaptive, etc., this has been a valuable resource! I don’t think (??) Allison identifies as neurodivergent herself but I think the way she communicates and runs AAM just works for my neurodivergent brain.

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  12. werewolf*

    as a late-diagnosed autistic person, i really love updates that include getting diagnosed with autism. same hat!

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  13. Cassandra*

    Definitely the right call not to tell the employee at that time, but I totally understand wanting someone else to tell you the same information! My dad had a dream that his favorite radio show host died in a plane crash, and it came true just a few months later. That was almost 25 years ago and he still regrets not saying something (although people would have thought he was crazy at best!)

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    1. magic*

      Let this letter be a reminder to everyone that us autistic folks vary as wildly as the general population in terms of our beliefs, values, and spirituality! (LW wasn’t making generalizations, obviously, but I find that neurotypical and undiagnosed ND folks can be quick to make assumptions).

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      2. Luna*

        I’m the opposite of neurotypical after sustaining a serious traumatic brain injury after an accident. I’d never want anyone to tell me they predicted it. Beliefs don’t matter when bestowing potentially devastating news to someone. LW made the correct choice in withholding it.

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  15. TooMuchOfAManager*

    I had a coworker tell me that they dreamed about me in that way during a meeting and it freaked me out for months. It brought on that weird dread that literally weighs you down mentally and emotionally. I absolutely did not want to know and I think that people who share things like that, especially in a nonchalant way, do not understand the impact their words can have.

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  16. BarkeepersFriendFan*

    I am so glad you have people looking out for you in person, and doubly so that you wrote in to Alison before telling your employee that. Whew! And also, lol, because in your place, I would also want to tell them, but I fortunately have learned to keep farfetched things to myself unless I am with very good friends. Even wit the, I wouldn’t mention it unless we were already talking about similar strange dreams.

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  18. One Duck In A Row*

    I love that several folks must have updated their calendars with a reminder to check in on this years later. Either that or they have unbelievably fantastic memories. This is the kind of person I aspire to be, but usually fall short on. (Though it did remind me that I will have a calendar reminder pop up on 12/24 at 9:00PM, EST. Actually, I think I have it set for the day, hour, and minute before, as well, so I can’t miss it. Set a few years ago, repeating in perpetuity. If you get it, you are my people.)

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