employee doesn’t eat, then gets hangry and irritable

by Alison Green on February 25, 2025

A reader writes:

I own a business and recently I’ve had an issue with one of my employees. She will go all day without eating (because of what looks like poor planning) and then get very irritable with everyone and complains about being hungry. I’ll offer to order her something or offer her the granola bars we have in the break room, but she brushes me off. I think she thinks I’m being an annoying mom type but really I just don’t want to deal with her hangry attitude because it affects the entire office when she gets like that. Any tips?

I answer this question — and three others — over at Inc. today, where I’m revisiting letters that have been buried in the archives here from years ago (and sometimes updating/expanding my answers to them). You can read it here.

Other questions I’m answering there today include:

  • Asking back an employee but not his spouse
  • Internships and equity
  • Writing notes on your hand at work
You may also like:
{ 158 comments }

{ 158 comments… read them below or add one }

  1. Yikes*

    This question could have been written about my partner! I would note for LW1 that a lot of medications (particularly for ADHD) suppress appetite, causing folks to go hours without eating because they truly don’t have an appetite only to suddenly realize they’re starved/hangry/etc late into the afternoon.

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    1. Yikes*

      No that this doesn’t solve the problem, and of course this employee needs to manage her own moods, but I share in case it provides a new way of looking at the problem!

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    2. juliebulie*

      Similar and opposite: struggling without ADHD medication now because reasons, and sometimes I hyperfocus so hard that I lose track of time and don’t notice I’m hungry. Then I get hangry and don’t even realize it. I’ve had to apologize to people for getting snippy with them.

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      1. JustCuz*

        I have no hunger signals. I go from fine to mad and there is nothing in between that tells me hunger is there. I just schedule eating times now.

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        1. Rainy*

          Another person with no hunger signals. I just have to stay on my schedule by eating things at eating times. I also don’t get hangry when my blood sugar is low, so there’s not much of a mood signal either. When I started on ADHD medication I had to lean even harder on the eating things at eating times strategy. Luckily, it works :)

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    3. Eldritch Office Worker*

      This is me. It’s not even that I don’t realize I’m hungry, I get sick if I eat too much while my meds are in full swing. I try to keep snacks on hand for when they wear off but there are definitely a lot of reasons (medical or otherwise) people might have altered eating schedules.

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    4. T.N.H*

      Ozempic and the like can do this too. In terms of how this changes the advice, LW just needs to be mindful that there may be a medical condition/ADA at play. Of course, being rude to colleagues is not a reasonable accommodation, but she should approach it a little carefully.

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      1. Burnt Out Librarian*

        I’m on Mounjaro and my ability to assess my hungriness is pretty much gone. I eat because I set reminders for myself to do so. She may need to start using her Outlook notifications or phone reminders to tell her to take a moment to go grab lunch– but that’s on her, not her supervisor.

        I’m curious if she feels she even has enough time to go get lunch if she doesn’t bring it with her, I would not be surprised if her crankiness is also a result of blaming her workload for her inability to disconnect and take care of her physiological needs. Of course she’s an adult and needs to plan better, but also there are probably more things at play here than just her forgetfulness.

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        1. allathian*

          It works for fat people like me who can’t recognize when they’re eaten enough without being so full they feel sick.

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          1. Rain, Disappointing Australian*

            ^ this. It doesn’t make you stop eating, it resets your body’s signals to tell you you’ve eaten enough.

            My partner, unmedicated, literally cannot feel the sensation of fullness. He will eat, and eat, and eat, and eat, utterly mindlessly, for hours, because he never gets that feeling telling him “oh I’m full”. (Never gets sick from it either – that’s another bodily sensation that Does Not Work.) Now he’s on Mounjaro, he can finally go “you know what, I feel full, I’ve eaten enough, let’s stop here” – he had to actually sit down and have a bit of a happy cry after starting Mounjaro and having his first meal while on it, because he didn’t know what feeling full was like until then – and if he does try to push past that he will start feeling very ill, another thing he’d never encountered before. So no, it doesn’t take away his appetite; it regulates it, which is what he desperately needed.

            I’m sure some people probably do end up having no appetite while on Ozempic, Mounjaro, Wegovy, etc, but that’s not how the drugs are meant to work. They’re a helping hand, not a bludgeon.

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    5. metadata minion*

      Yeah, I took a while to adjust to that when I started, because normally you could set your clock by my appetite and I just had no context for “you should eat now even though you’re not hungry and all food seems gross”.

      If anyone else is struggling with it, I find that having some trail mix or something to graze on really helps. Nuts and raisins or similar is usually something that I find not actively horrible and snacking means that I can get something resembling a meal’s worth of food even if all normal lunch options are nonspecifically Wrong today.

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    7. Mostly Managing*

      This is why my kid has reminders in their phone.
      The alarm goes off, it’s time to eat something.
      the alarm goes off, it’s time to drink, take meds, etc.
      It takes a bit of time to set the alarms, and then they go off every day.

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    9. Yup*

      This. My kid on ADHD meds can go all day long with 0 food, and we struggle to put anything at all in her lunch that’s able to go down so she can function. She has lost weight she didn’t have to spare. I wish people had a better understanding of why people act the way they do, and engage in conversations that seek to help instead of shame and blame.

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      1. blue*

        I think that’s different though – she’s a kid! It’s completely understandable that she may struggle with reading her body’s cues or managing her needs throughout the day.

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        1. Yup*

          Some people only get diagnosed as adults, and the meds and their effects are new. As an employee, they are of course responsible for their behaviour. But like anyone, they deserve compassion and curiosity before judgement. I see how this affects my child, who can suddenly concentrate and function but cannot eat. It’s a learning curve, and she like anyone–child or adult–needs support.

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      2. Dahlia*

        It is not appropriate for a manager or coworker to attempt to solve that problem. It’s just not. LW has done more than enough by offering to order food and suggesting granola bars.

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    10. blue*

      I have several people in my life who get hangry and it can be extremely challenging to be on the receiving end of someone’s mood swings, no matter the cause. If it’s a medical problem, employee still needs to find a solution. I try to carry around snacks for my partner, but even then I don’t take responsibility if I don’t have any – they are an adult who needs to anticipate their own needs. And if those needs are not anticipated, they need to mitigate the negative impact on others, barring a medical emergency.

      Reply ↓
  2. Shutterdoula*

    Had a coworker once who was into intermittent fasting and they were like that and it was awful. If you dared mention that they were very different (and not in a good way) when they were fasting, you’d get a huffy lecture on the “benefits” of intermittent fasting.

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    2. Ellis Bell*

      I think this is why the focus has to be on the attitude, rather than the food. No one cares about the food really, some people operate on fumes and are fine. If you make it the focus of your concern, you risk being mistakenly seen doubter of diet benefits, or a paternalistic worrier who wants to feed people. Better to say “What seeing is x and y, and that has to stop. Do whatever you need to solve it, etc, but if it helps, it seems to happen when you haven’t eaten though you’d know better than me”.

      Reply ↓
  3. Targ*

    I’m hypoglycemic: she’s a grown adult woman who needs to take care of this herself. Frame it as a work problem, but make it clear that the solution is hers to find.

    Reply ↓
    1. Peanut Hamper*

      I am too, and this makes some days really difficult when I forget to plan for food or if the day goes longer than I thought. I have literally driven from store to store looking for something to eat and not being able to make up my mind because my brain doesn’t function properly without food. But yep, that’s my problem and I don’t make it other people’s ever. But I do get to a point where I literally can’t make a decision. It’s not fun.

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      1. Admin of Sys*

        Oh, yeah, once the brain fog sets in from the low blood sugar it’s really hard to figure out what to do. But that’s why there’s always something stashed for me to have, be it granola bars or and apple or those little peanut butter containers. It does occur to me it’s easier for women though, since there’s more likely a purse around to stash food into.

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    3. CityMouse*

      I’ve been pregnant and needed to keep snacks around so I didn’t get nausea. It’s still your own thing to deal with.

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    4. el l*

      “Frame it as a work problem, but make it clear that the solution is hers to find.”

      Perfect, and that exact formula should pop up daily here!

      To that end: “I’ve seen a pattern of irritability from you, and from what I’ve seen it’s driven by hunger. It really gets in the way of professionalism – having needed conversations and getting things done with you is harder when you’re hungry. I need you to address this problem of inattention. How you resolve it is up to you, but you need to resolve it.”

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      1. Clam Condor*

        This is absolutely a conduct issue.

        if she’s willing to snap at her coworkers she’ll snap at a client or customer which could cost the company money. Our office manager did this as part of her people pleasing “dedication”. Wouldn’t take a lunch or would take a short lunch and tattle if we took our *GASP* whole allotted hour.She passed out once because her blood sugar crashed and our boss made it a point to tell her she isn’t getting hero points by not feeding herself which is basic activity of daily living.

        Is it possible she’s having financial problems and doesn’t have a lot of food options at home? Meal planning is difficult when times are hard financially.

        Reply ↓
        1. Jennifer Juniper*

          If she can’t afford food, something is either really wrong with the company’s pay – as in underpayment – or else something very off is going on in her life (like a family member spending all the money on drinking or someone’s medical expenses are so high it takes money out of the food budget).

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          2. Paint N Drip*

            Plenty of people choose to utilize ‘avoid eating’ as a dieting plan. If you’re focused on getting your calories down, and your boss offers you a snack without specifying you are being a beastly employee clearly suffering from low blood sugar I can certainly see why employee would refuse.

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    5. learnedthehardway*

      I have great hopes that my young adult son will eventually figure out that YES, he does get HANGRY when his blood sugar drops. He can’t see it when he’s IN the episode, but he’s getting somewhat better about realizing that he’s hungry and preventing them. It’s distinct enough that I won’t have a serious conversation with him until after I’ve made sure that he has eaten. He still doesn’t believe me when he is having a hypoglycemic episode – but part of that is because he’s somewhat irrational when he’s in one.

      So, my suggestion would be – tell the coworker (at a time when they are NOT in an episode) that this is a work problem. Point out the behaviour, set the expectation that they will keep snacks at their work station.

      Personally, I had to set some rules for myself, because when I’m in a hypoglycemic episode, I do stupid things (like buy 20 of the same tshirts because I can’t decide which colour I want). I can’t make decisions while in an episode, so the moment I feel shaky / agitated / break out in a fine sweat, I stop everything and eat either cheese and crackers, or (if I’m out) a hamburger, with juice or sweet tea. Protein, carbs, and fat, essentially. The carbs kill the episode and the protein and fat keep it from restarting.

      Reply ↓
  4. Pay no attention...*

    Make sure and have the conversation at the beginning of the day, before she gets hungry and unable to focus. Offers of snacks are getting blown off because she is already past her ability to cope with her emotions and think clearly.

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  5. Pastor Petty Labelle*

    Does AAM plan a theme for the day?

    Look, not eating is your employee’s issue to solve, not yours. What you can do is say “you cannot be cranky and angry to your colleagues just because you didn’t eat. You need to figure it out because it cannot continue.”

    Reply ↓
    1. Elle*

      It was a big topic in our management training last week. When does it cross the line from managing to therapy or over accommodating someone? It’s the hardest part of managing for me.

      Reply ↓
  6. MassMatt*

    Writing notes on your hand—In addition to looking disorganized and unprofessional, it makes you look as though you don’t understand how to utilize technology.

    Personally, I am a written note taker and carry a notebook of some kind at all times, but that’s me. I also carry a phone, as does virtually everyone else. Phones have a multitude of solutions for scheduling, reminders, note taking, making lists, etc.

    At the risk of sounding like a grumpy old man: We keep hearing about how young people are the most connected and tech-aware ever, and yet we have many instances like this where they are writing notes on their hands, or ignoring email, or not understanding when to talk on a phone vs: text. Many of them really do not seem tech-savvy at all.

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    1. Sneaky Squirrel*

      If I were the manager, I would also wonder what happens to those notes on someone’s hand. Are they making it to paper or computer later? And if so, why not just do it now? Maybe they don’t need them anymore and it’s okay to wash it off like it never happened. But I’d be pretty annoyed at a staff member who chose to regularly forego a notebook in lieu of their hands if they were also frequently missing deadlines, dropping tasks, losing important notes because they weren’t written down in a more permanent place.

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      1. metadata minion*

        Most of the time, if I’m writing something on my hand it’s something like “pick up prescription!” that I need staring me in the face until I do it. Once I do it, I wash it off and don’t need a record of having picked up my medication since I have the medication in its box on my (home) desk, where it’s again staring me in the face.

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        1. Pomodoro Sauce*

          Yeah, I use writing on my hands as a similar last-ditch reminder for time sensitive issues that I can’t get to for several hours, things like “When you get back to the office remember that the key needs to be left on Jane’s desk, not in the key-cubby” (abbreviated as “key”)

          “Pick up prescription” is just like that — a necessary change in routine that requires a reminder. It’s probably not ideal from a professionalism standard but I think it’s in “harmless quirk” territory. I do think that this is separate from the issue in the letter, where someone routinely writes meeting notes on their hands.

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        2. Lisa Simpson*

          I had one of those jobs where “everyone’s hair is on fire all the time,” plus it involved a lot of different sub-environments. I regularly get compliments on how organized and professional I am with paper and digital note taking and calendars, but occasionally I’d have to write something on my hand because I was in the middle of tending two unrelated fires and someone ambushed me (Why yes, I am in the middle of putting bandages on someone who’s bleeding but sure, give me your phone number to call you about birthday party rentals.) Or it was something really important that had to follow me around as I went to a bunch of different places. TURN WATER OFF for example, as we can’t risk a flood.

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      2. HarborFreightBoltCutters*

        In college (notably, before I was diagnosed with ADHD), I had a system of writing on my hands/arms with different types of pens/markers to match how quickly they washed off to the deadline of the task.

        Smartphones have been a lifesaver, especially paired with a watch to get notifications for critical tasks. (I love todoist, but there are so many great applications and systems now).

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        1. Pomodoro Sauce*

          Oh my goodness, you’re an icon. I love that.

          I used to have a mentor write the names of species I repeatedly mis-identified on my arms in sharpie so I’d remember them for the rest of the week.

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      3. Pixel*

        These are usually quick reminders for specific tasks, not something that would be referenced back to long term like meeting notes. So there’s no need to write them somewhere permanent. Like “mail” for “remember to check the mail on the way home because I’m expecting a package.” I don’t need that reminder recorded forever I just need to make sure the task happens.

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        1. MassMatt*

          Whether it is meant to be short or long term, or permanent, there are myriad better solutions than writing it on your body (Flashback to the excellent movie Memento!). Reminders on your phone can be deleted or updated at will. Pieces of paper can be saved or discarded.

          To each their own, but IMO someone writing on their hand as a basic mnemonic system looks very out of touch, and will likely suffer in terms of reputation.

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          1. metadata minion*

            I’m not arguing for covering your hands in notes at work, but at least for me, if I write stuff on my hands, it’s because *I’ve tried all those other techy options and they don’t work*. Phone reminders work if I have my phone with me, and don’t glance at the reminder and then immediately forget it (I’ve gotten pretty good at just hitting “snooze” until I’ve actually done the thing, but sometimes I hit the wrong button by mistake). Paper notes don’t work unless it’s something to do on the computer and I can stick a physical note to the side of my laptop, because otherwise I will not remember to look at the note. I need the reminder physically attached to my body and visible.

            I realize this may sound pathetic, but this is the way my brain works. I wish technology had a solution, but so far it really doesn’t when my brain is in a bad place. I would really appreciate it if people stopped acting like those of us with ADHD and other executive functioning deficits are somehow unaware of the existence of smartphones and notebooks.

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            2. Workerbee*

              It doesn’t sound pathetic. Good for you for forging ahead with what works for you despite all the “But there is only a narrow amount of ways to exist in this world” responses.

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      4. Lexi Vipond*

        If I write on my hand – which I don’t often – it’s specifically because my hand is omnipresent. I can be in a different place with different ideas and a completely different set of equipment, or whatever, and my hand is still there. Permanent isn’t really the point in that situation.

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    2. Peanut Hamper*

      Many of them really do not seem tech-savvy at all.

      I agree, and I believe it’s because we went from a situation where people use technology to a situation where the technology uses people. When I was in high school, a computer class was about learning to program; nowadays they are often about learning to pick out a font in Microsoft Word. They never really learn to use MS Word either; out of the many colleagues I’ve had over the years, not a single one of them have ever known how to use paragraph or character styles. It’s sad.

      Reply ↓
      1. It seems I need a name to comment here...*

        To be honest though, it’s not like Microsoft makes it easy to use styles… it’s not a great user interface.

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        1. Dinwar*

          I would do some sketchy things to go back to early 2000 Excel. I could make that program do anything I wanted. Had a class, Quantitative Methods in Geology, where our first assignment was literally “You’ve seen what Excel can do. Now you get to make it do something it can’t.” (Projections in spherical geometry aren’t quite as bad as n-dimensional statistical analysis, but close!) They nerfed the program under the guise of making it “user friendly” somewhere around 2015 or so, and it hasn’t been the same since. I do a LOT of graphs for work, and the “user friendly” nature makes my job at least 100% harder.

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    3. Pixel*

      I don’t write notes on my hand personally, though I do put tape on my fingers as reminders, sometimes with writing on it.

      But, especially speaking as someone with ADHD, a notebook or phone would not accomplish the same thing at all. The point of writing on your hand is to have your notes right in front of your face so you CAN’T forget them. It’s not that people can’t figure out how to use a piece of paper or are tech illiterate, and it feels unfair to accuse them of that. It’s that these methods don’t solve the problem.

      A phone is especially bad imo – with a notebook you can at least keep it always open to the right page, but a phone usually has the screen off and you need to turn on the screen + open notes app + open the specific note in order to view your notes. And a phone is a horrible distraction box supreme. These might sound like little problems, but when you really struggle with memory, these things matter. I can’t even remember that I wrote a note or need to check it. Carrying around a notebook seems impractical because then I only have one hand to do things.

      I’ll admit I don’t understand why notes on hands is “unprofessional.” But I wonder if there are any ideas for more “professional” alternatives that actually solve the problem of needing your notes to be immediately visible and still have your hands free to do your work?

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      1. Jennifer Strange*

        I’ll admit I don’t understand why notes on hands is “unprofessional.”

        I think it’s the same reason that wearing a shirt with holes in it is unprofessional, in that it contributes to a sloppy appearance. Obviously there are jobs where that doesn’t matter, but I’d guess in most it does. It’s also an issue of possibly smearing ink (depending on what you’re using to write it) and the notes become illegible due to sweat and use of hands.

        To be clear, I understand your POV on why a hand is better than a notebook, but I would keep looking for something else.

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      2. MassMatt*

        This may not work, but it’s a serious suggestion: A wristband or armband that covers the forearm. I see NFL players use them, they have a Velcro cover and underneath under a protective plastic cover is their plays to call. I believe they make them so notes can be written on them like a white board.

        This would be an odd look, maybe carried off better with long sleeves or a jacket, but would be more professional than someone writing on their hand.

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      3. Dinwar*

        When I’ve been particularly scattered I’ve written notes on Postit notes and put them on the bottom of my monitor. It’s not terribly unprofessional–most people in my office do it, in fact–and it keeps things front and center when you’re at the computer, at least.

        You can also look up “Wrist Notepads”. They come in a variety of designs, and are often rewritable. Amazon has a 9 pack for $12, and there seems to be a reasonable variety of styles from a variety of companies. It’s a bit odd, I’ll admit, but more on the “Quirky, I’d never have thought of that” side of odd, which people quickly get used to.

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        1. metadata minion*

          Oh, that’s awesome; thank you for the wrist notepad suggestion! This is for once a productivity tool that I actually didn’t know existed and it really does fit well in the “I need this attached to my hand” niche.

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      4. amyll*

        I write notes on my upper thigh with a sharpie. Does not show and i have a reminder every time I go to the bathroom.
        ( I would not drop my pants at work however.)
        I also have alarms on my phone.
        I would lose the notebook in 10 minutes. When we wore scrubs at work, so many vital signs written on legs, bed sheets, paper towels.

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    4. AnonInCanada*

      Yeah, you’d think with today’s generation, and let’s face it, the two before them, that adopted the ability to be dependent on that metal and glass thing they stare at more than anyone/anything else, you’d think they’d also learn how to say, “Hey (Siri/Google/Alexa), remind me to do (task X) at (time Y)” into said metal and glass thing they stare at more than anyone/anything else. No need to scribble things on your palms, even if it means being even more dependent on said metal and glass thing.

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      1. Pixel*

        I feel blaming this on generational issues and accusing a generation of both being tech obsessed and too incompetent to use phone reminders is really unfair. It’s unlikely most people who do this don’t know how to use phone reminders – it’s much more likely that, like me, phone reminders don’t work for them.

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        1. AnonInCanada*

          They have to come up with something, regardless of generation. Hence why I didn’t just call this a Gen Z problem regarding phone dependency: Millenials and Gen Xers like me are just as guilty. No one has instant recall, but jotting notes on one’s palm comes off as disorganized, at least to me. I’m sure everyone’s heard of a notepad/notebook. I’m sure many of them grew up watching Blue’s Clues and Steve, Joe or Josh writing in his “handy dandy notebook.” :-)

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      2. The Gollux, Not a Mere Device*

        People of any age are capable of stopping rather than snoozing an alarm, having a timer go off and not really noticing because we’re focused on what we’re doing, or forgetting to grab our phones on our way out the door.

        For what it’s worth, I’m on the cusp between Boomers and Gen X. It’s not just “today’s generation,” whatever that means–I’m still here.

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      3. Bike Walk Bake Books*

        Not all of us who have been tech-savvy since the days of the C> prompt want to have our devices listening to us all the time. Some of us also recognize that the metal and glass thing can turn into a brick if it runs out of battery, at which point it does zero reminding.

        Really no need to dismiss entire generations for doing things the way that works for them, especially given that each person in a generation is an actual individual.

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    5. Arglebarglor*

      When I worked as an RN in a very busy ER, my husband would know how good or bad my day went by how much writing was on my hands and arms when I got home from a shift. During a code sometimes you don’t have a second to log in to your computer or find a piece of paper. I have logged entire codes I was running on my left arm…and the bedsheets…and even my scrubs leg. Sometimes we were short and didn’t have someone to scribe, it was all hands on deck. Then I would transcribe my shorthand to the patient’s chart.

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    6. DisneyChannelThis*

      I’ve had the opposite experience.

      Writing a note with a pen during a meeting on a notepad = professional , looks like I’m engaged and listening

      Pulling out my phone and tapping away at it during a meeting = unprofessional , looks like I’m mentally checked out, possibly surfing the web

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    7. nekosan*

      I’ve worked at places that have badges for quite some time. I put a tiny blank sticky note on the back of my badge, and use that for jotting down tiny quick notes. It works well for me!

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    8. Jane*

      From what I’ve heard, while Gen Z is great at newer tech (social media, video editing), they fall short at old-school tech (Word Docs, file storage). This seems like a case of the latter.

      Reply ↓
  7. Glengarry Glenn Close*

    I’m not familiar with the legal requirements mentioned for an unpaid internship, but if those are not too onerous I don’t think it would be so terrible to hire your colleague’s kid.

    Yes, it’s giving them a leg up in a way, but if they don’t do it nobody will, and I don’t see how that benefits anyone.

    Reply ↓
    1. Strive to Excel*

      The legal requirements vary state by state & country by country, but a good rule of thumb is that you can only have an unpaid internship if the intern will be getting more out of it than you are.

      Reply ↓
    2. Aspiring Chicken Lady*

      Aside from legal requirements, there’s also the requirements for the school program. Coordinating an adequate course credit-worthy internship is not something you do without planning ahead.

      Reply ↓
    3. MigraineMonth*

      Sorry, I’m not following what is meant by “if they don’t do it nobody will, and I don’t see how that benefits anyone.”

      Do you mean better for the privileged kid to get an internship than for no one to get an internship? I’m not sure that’s the case, assuming that the privileged kid will be competing for jobs against less privileged kids.

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      1. Glengarry Glenn Close*

        That is what I meant, but I see where you’re coming from. If LW feels it’s their place to ensure a hypothetical level playing field then that’s fine. It’s also alot of work to have an intern, especially in a workplace not set up for them

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    4. Starbuck*

      They are onerous though. For an unpaid internship at a for-profit business to be legal, the intern needs to be benefitting more than the business, Essentially, it’s a training program you’re doing as charity. It’s a lot of work!

      Also, part of the point of an internship is networking. Daughter needs to practice that for herself, not just get her mom to find her a spot.

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    5. Jane*

      It’s creating an even bigger problem for underprivileged people who already have to compete against people with privileges they didn’t earn.

      Reply ↓
  8. metadata minion*

    If anyone else is in the position of LW4, who seems sincerely baffled at the writing-on-hands thing: when I do it, it’s because my brain is so scattered that if I don’t have it literally staring me in the face, it’s going to vanish into the aether. This is also why I write things on post-its and then put them on my laptop, rather than just using the many productivity tools available on the laptop. Writing something in a notebook or digital to-do list only helps if I remember to look at the notebook. These days phone alerts really help, but I also don’t want my phone buzzing or beeping all day and annoying both me and my coworkers.

    So if I’m having a really spacy day and just absolutely need something on my hand, I’ll write it on the underside of my wrist, or just inside my shirt cuff if I’m wearing long sleeves. That way I’ll see at least part of it pretty frequently, but it’s much less obvious to a casual observer. Still a thing I try to avoid, and I’m lucky to be in a position where nobody particularly cares if I look polished, but it’s a reasonably happy medium.

    Reply ↓
    1. Hannah Lee*

      While I don’t write on my hands, I do use post its or other small notes in a similar way.
      I realized only a few years ago that in my brain, if something is in a notes app, or any app, or filed away or even in a slot on my desk that says “do today” it’s like it not longer exists. It’s like an adult form of object impermanence. Even a notepad used 100% for to-do lists becomes background noise or forgotten or goes missing.

      But a post it note stuck somewhere that I can’t avoid it is useful. (I also will put things out of place as a memory aid … “why is this can of olives on my kitchen table? Oh, that’s right, I put it there to remind me to call the plumber.” because writing “call the plumber” on a to-do list will both remove the task from my working memory (because I wrote it down) and make it become invisible because I will not notice the to-do list in my environment)

      Come to think of it, writing on my hand might work, except I suspect I would find the marks on my hand distracting and want to wash it off ASAP.

      Reply ↓
    2. Pomodoro Sauce*

      I’m right there with you — I used to do it more often when I had a job where I’d be out in the field, and then back in the office — if I remembered a field task in the office, or an office task in the field, I needed a reminder to say, bring in the vehicle log sheets. Check the maintenance records. Report a damaged gate.

      Reply ↓
    3. Lady Catherine de Bruh*

      Same. I just remember things better when they’re written on my hand (I wouldn’t have seen it as a weird thing to see on others, but have learnt today that that’s not usual).

      If not actually written on me, reminders work best for me as a physical thing that can’t avoided (like putting a post-it note on the glasses I use for driving home). I do have diaries and notebooks, but I can somehow misplace them merely by putting them down on a flat surface. Hands are a bit trickier to misplace.

      Reply ↓
  9. CityMouse*

    Honestly doesn’t matter what her issue is, she can’t take it out on her coworkers. She deals with her colleagues properly or she should be fired. If OP doesn’t out a stop to it they’re likely to have staff quit anyway.

    Reply ↓
  10. Strive to Excel*

    Another mark in the “focus on the problem, not on the assumed cause” – people *do not like* when you reduce what they’re saying to “you sound like you need a snack.” I found this with my teenage brother during the summer when he grew several inches. He would get super hangry and would start snapping at us. Thing is, while he shouldn’t have been snapping at us over small things, he wasn’t making up problems. When we told him “sounds like you need a snack”, it sounded to him as if we were saying “your problem is not important to us, and we care more about our comfort than your comfort.” Further, it turned into a bad habit of assuming that every time he was upset it was because he was hangry – which naturally blew up in our collective faces the first time he had a major problem and felt we were downplaying it. Much was learned that summer and many apologies given.

    Focus on the behavior – “Don’t snap at your coworkers” is a reasonable request. If you have a level of trust with your employee, “I’ve noticed you do this more on days when you’ve been fasting” could be something to bring up. But don’t start by assuming that it’s a food or med related issue.

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  11. Tom R*

    As a fellow Hangry getter they sometimes need someone to remind them to eat. At work I am pretty good at making sure I have snacks and stuff but sometimes at home I get distracted and forget to eat. My wife is good at seeing the signs so will sometimes shove an apple or something in my hand

    Reply ↓
      1. CommanderBanana*

        Or set a reminder, or post a note, or do literally anything other than making this someone else’s problem. I will take responsibility for feeding any pets or children in my orbit; I’m not doing it for another adult.

        Reply ↓
        1. CommanderBanana*

          No it’s not. If I wanted to be in charge of other people’s snack times, I would have become a preschool teacher.

          Reply ↓
            1. Starbuck*

              That’s exactly the point though, something that works at home with your personal relationships isn’t necessarily transferrable to the workplace.

              Reply ↓
          1. CommanderBanana*

            Yes, it is, but the LW is not her coworker’s loving spouse, and it’s a general rule of thumb in this community to engage with the question that was actually written in about. I’m sure Tom R. is lovely. I’m sure the wife of Tom R. is lovely. I’m sure the lovely apples she is lovingly giving to Tom R. are lovely. But unless I missed a giant part of this letter, the LW didn’t marry her coworker or sign up for a lifetime of lovingly handing her snacks when she gets hangry.

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            1. Jennifer Juniper*

              I would create even more awkwardness at the office – because I would think it was my fault for not remembering to silently and discreetly hand the co-worker a snack. When someone snaps, I people-please.

              Reply ↓
        3. Starbuck*

          It’s reality though – it’s not really appropriate to make that kind of reminder the responsibility of coworkers, especially not regularly. That’s on an adult to manage themselves in the workplace.

          Reply ↓
    2. Pomodoro Sauce*

      Ah, my husband does the same for me! Sometimes some of our wiring is a little wonky, and our loved ones lend us their reliable hunger signals and bedtime routines.

      Reply ↓
    3. Dust Bunny*

      This is patently not your coworkers’ job. Manage your time better or set reminders on your phone.

      (Frankly, if my boyfriend were relying on me to remind him to eat so he didn’t snap at me, I’d tell him the same thing: He’s a functional adult and needs to manage his own damned blood sugar.)

      Reply ↓
      1. CommanderBanana*

        Right? I get irritable when I’m thirsty.

        Ways I have solved this:
        Bought several reuseable cups, including a giant Stanley
        Bought a fridge with a water dispenser
        Keep lots of fizzy water around
        Fill the Stanley cup
        Put the Stanley cup on my desk
        Sip from the Stanley cup
        Carry around the Stanley cup
        Measure my water consumption

        Ways I have NOT tried to solve this:
        Made it someone else’s problem to remind me to drink water

        Reply ↓
      2. blue*

        I, the partner of a hangry person, have limited patience for managing bad moods related to hunger. I usually have an emergency snack in my bag, but beyond that it’s up to the individual capable adult to deal with their hunger and related issues. Having to deal with a hangry coworker would put me on edge.

        Reply ↓
    4. Strive to Excel*

      The flipside of this is that if you’re bad at regulating your own blood sugar, you need to at minimum be gracious when someone offers you food. If you snap at someone trying to problem-solve then you need to deal with your own problems.

      Reply ↓
    5. Peanut Hamper*

      I have literally told my coworkers at previous jobs that if I seem really grouchy for no good reason, it’s perfectly reasonable to ask me if I had eaten recently, because they shouldn’t have to put up with my terrible mood when there is an obvious solution. But I also made sure that they never really had to ask that question.

      Reply ↓
  12. CzechMate*

    Tbh, the “I’ll offer to order her something or offer her the granola bars we have in the break room, but she brushes me off” makes me wonder if the employee could have an eating disorder. In that instance, it’s better not to comment on the employee’s eating (you can certainly have food available, but don’t question when they don’t want to eat it), focus on the workplace performance, rather than the food intake, and make sure there are accommodations to, say, leave work early to attend therapy sessions.

    Reply ↓
    1. Firm Believer*

      This happened with an employee of mine. We’d worked together for many years so I felt a little more comfortable bringing it up in the context of how it was affecting me and how I was concerned for her but not everyone can do that. Not trying to diagnose but she demonstrated textbook characteristics of orthorexia and a very toxic relationship with food. She would somehow take out her anger with feeling unwell on me, as though it was somehow the jobs fault that she was unable to function properly on the incredibly strict diet she was following. I had to make her food on occasions that I happened to have that she could eat. It was untenable. Her anger issues were a result. When I brought up her control issues with everything including food, she said she knew I was going to bring it up, so I think she may have considered that her relationship with food was unhealthy. Anyway, I gently suggested therapy and left it at that. I don’t know what she did but she is better. She still has a very strict diet and eating schedule but I can tell it’s gotten better and she now has fewer restrictions and we can go out and have a fun lunch or dinner again. Not sure if she went to therapy or not but she even recognized another coworker not eating and tried to problem solve. I wouldn’t suggest everyone go this route but I had the type of relationship with her that I felt I could at least include it in a larger conversation about her work issues. She knew it came from a place of care for her health.

      Reply ↓
  13. H.Regalis*

    That would annoy me too. No one wants to be stuck in a room with snappish irritable people, and coworkers are generally a captive audience.

    Reply ↓
  14. Dinwar*

    I used to work with a guy like this. I started keeping snacks around, and encouraging others who worked with him to do so. Buying some pretzels or the like was a lot easier than dealing with him when he was hungry. We never made a huge deal about it, we’d just keep the snacks in the open and make sure everyone knew they were available, so it wasn’t a big thing to eat them.

    Would it be possible to offer some guidance on planning, since the missing meals seems to be a planning issue? Depending on what the planning issue is, it’s either directly impacting work (ie, scrambling to get things done last-minute, poor time-management, etc) or indirectly impacting it (by annoying everyone that has to deal with this person in Hulk mode).

    Reply ↓
    1. MigraineMonth*

      I disagree. The LW is not a the employee’s parent, therapist or life-skills coach. The employee is acting inappropriately at work, and it’s the LW’s job to tell them it’s not appropriate and hold them accountable.

      It’s the employee’s job to figure out how to behave more appropriately, whether that’s meditation, bringing lunch, setting alarms to eat, switching medications, etc. They can ask for reasonable accommodations (e.g. a set lunch period, if that’s not too disruptive, not “feed me whenever I’m a jerk”), but this isn’t on the LW to solve.

      Reply ↓
      1. Dinwar*

        It’s not unreasonable to coach more junior staff on time management and planning. Especially when those issues are impacting other people’s work. That is, in fact, part of managing people.

        Further, the attitude “This is your problem, get it fixed and get out of my office!!” may have worked in the past (though its prevalence in sitcoms is precisely because it did NOT work), but doesn’t fly today, at least not in many offices. No one wants to work with Jonah Jameson. A more effective approach in most workplaces would be to offer to help find resources to manage the problem, or coaching to manage it.

        Further, opening the dialogue may show that the issue you see isn’t necessarily the issue that needs addressed. There’s a reason why safety does a Root Cause Analysis–99.999% of the time the thing that caused the injury isn’t the actual problem, the actual problem is a deeper issue that allowed that situation to develop. By approaching this from a Root Cause perspective you remove the moralizing (and let’s be real, people are treating this as a moral issue) and could help determine the actual problem, not just the symptoms. I know someone who was like this because they were going through a messy divorce; giving them some time off basically solved the problem as far as work was concerned, by allowing the one person to focus on getting their personal life in order so they COULD plan. Another time folks realized that we’d massively overloaded a few people, to the point where no amount of planning could resolve the issue. And yeah, that guy with the blood sugar issue–by opting to look at the “Why?” instead of only the “What?” we were able to find a simple and effective solution that didn’t single him out.

        Reply ↓
        1. Lisa Simpson*

          This is also going to vary a lot based on what your recruitment pool looks like. If you’re in a professional field with a healthy recruitment pool, then you’re absolutely free to stick to “You are snappish. This is unprofessional. We are going to start the corrective action process and you will need to fix this to keep your job.”

          If you’re in a field where your candidate quality is variable or the recruitment pool is shallow, mentoring and coaching first might be a more sensible option, even if it’s not technically your job, because you’re not guaranteed a better replacement.

          Reply ↓
    2. Paint N Drip*

      I appreciate this comment – if as a community it is possible to support your coworkers, I personally think it is a nice thing to do. No one is FORCING anyone to parent this coworker or be solely responsible for their mood, but like… kindness is cool. I appreciate when others care about me and I enjoy caring about others. Plus, I’m a sensitive cat (when a coworker is exuding rage or other bad vibes, I don’t like that) so community support that ends up helping ME is a win-win

      Reply ↓
  15. Peanut Hamper*

    I used to be a teacher, and I once had a principal who had a habit of writing on her hands all the time. “It’s the one notepad I can never lose!” she would say. It looked so unprofessional coming from someone in a leadership position. You are responsible for the education of 400 middle schoolers and you can’t keep track of a notepad? Not a good look. (She was also one of the worst principals I ever had the misfortune to work for. I still have bad dreams about that place.)

    To this day, when I see someone write on their hands in a professional environment, it sends me back to the time and place. It’s one thing to jot down a phone number while you’re on the subway, but come on–you’re in an office, literally surrounded by office supplies.

    FWIW, they recently started stocking reporter’s notepads in the supply closet at work and these things are AMAZING! Big enough to take quite a few notes, small enough to easily slip in the pocket of your lab coat.

    Reply ↓
    1. Dinwar*

      I like the sketch notebooks Walmart sells. There’s small moleskin-style books for on-the-go note taking, which easily fit into pockets, and larger hard cover books for in-office note taking. I like the half-sheet (8.5×5.5) size better than letter paper for some reason, and since they’re unlined I can set them up however I want. And they’re cheap enough that if I lose them, meh, I’ll get another. The paper is a bit rougher than something like a Composition notebook, because they’re intended to be used with pencils to sketch pictures, but I’ve rarely had any issues with them.

      You can see a difference in how people treat you when you sit down with a few pens and a hard-cover notebook, as opposed to random scraps or writing on your hand.

      Reply ↓
      1. NothingIsLittle*

        I’ve since treated myself to some really fancy notebooks (a new one every year), but Michael’s has some nice plain ones for like $6. They’re A5, hard cover, and come in tonnes of colors. I prefer dotted to totally blank, since it’s unobtrusive enough to be flexible but still keeps my writing straight.

        Reply ↓
  16. LaminarFlow*

    There’s no mention of this, but is it possible that the employee is just super strapped for cash, and can’t afford groceries?

    I enter this into the fray because I worked with an intern who wasn’t paid, and in his senior year of college. He was living with several roommates to keep costs down, and he cut all kinds of corners just to be able to take public transit to his internship. I realized just how food insecure he was when he took several leftover sandwiches, pieces of fruit, salads, bags of chips, etc., home after a catered meeting. I didn’t want to embarrass him, so I ramped up how many meetings were catered to basically all of them, and started “ordering too much food” for meetings going forward. How weird that his food allergies & preferences were always covered with the food that was ordered for meetings. Luck of the draw, I guess/s

    However, if LW’s employee isn’t food insecure, none of this matters, and Alison’s advice is perfect – you can’t force her to eat, but she does need to have a good attitude while at work, and she can remedy that however she needs to.

    Reply ↓
    1. Dust Bunny*

      This person is not an unpaid intern, though, and at some point their personal finances are not their employers’ business (i.e. this invites their boss to comment on any spending that seems non-essential that could be used for food).

      Reply ↓
    2. toolegittoresign*

      Unfortunately food insecurity is often invisible and it’s not going to be appropriate to ask about it. Since offers of free food are being turned down by the employee, it just has to be addressed as an attitude issue. Unless leaving communal snacks out regularly won’t cause issues (and we’ve seen a lot of letters as to how that can go wrong.)

      Reply ↓
    3. Aya*

      Employee brushes off LW’s offer to order food/the readily available food in the break room. Maybe employee has a mental hangup about “I must pay for my own food” or not accepting charity/perceived pity, but it’s still on employee to do what they must so that hunger-induced horrible mood doesn’t splash all over coworkers.

      Reply ↓
    4. CommanderBanana*

      You’re a really kind person. I always tried to make sure the interns got first crack at any leftover snacks or food.

      Given that the coworker is refusing food, I really doubt that’s the issue.

      Reply ↓
  17. Lady Cat the Cat Lady*

    The mention of using your hand for a note writing spot… Can I say that there are exceptions? My father used to work for the phone company. Being several feet up on a phone pole, it was much easier to write on his hand, than dig out paper, which, depending on the day, could end up a soggy mess, or blowing with the wind. But for indoor work, yes, I suspect notepads would look a tad more professional…

    Reply ↓
    1. Christmas Carol*

      I used to work with a bunch of diesel mechanics. When they would look up part numbers, they would write the relevent numbers on their hands before leaving the computer terminal to go to the parts shelves. Then, by the time often greasy repair job was finished, the ink would be worn off their skin, and they’d be ready to jot down the next part number for the next job. They were also very particular about their pens. They much prefered click pens to the kinds with separate tops, because they always lost the caps.

      Reply ↓
  18. Fred*

    You understand that punishing someone and refusing them an opportunity just because some other people might not be able to do that is exactly the kind of discrimination you’re complaining about?

    Reply ↓
    1. Jennifer Strange*

      The internship doesn’t even exist, so it’s not punishment to not take this person on as an intern. Also, no, not giving someone something because they have connections is NOT the same as the discrimination folks who come from underprivileged/underrepresented backgrounds face.

      Reply ↓
    2. Retired Vulcan Raises 1 Grey Eyebrow*

      That’s not punishing them; it’s just refusing to give them an extra boost up the ladder when they already have more privilege than most people about to start their careers.

      Reply ↓
    3. TMarin*

      Thank you for this post. Deciding to do or not do something based on skin color or perceived privilege is in my mind a form of discrimination.

      Reply ↓
      1. Jennifer @unchartedworlds*

        It isn’t “perceived privilege” – it’s an actual practical advantage they have by luck which not everyone has. (I.e. a relative in a steady job who’s willing to ask around for them.)

        Of course a lot of business decisions are made via family/friend networking like that. But Alison and the OP aren’t wrong that it perpetuates unfairness. You might know someone yourself who would’ve been really good at something but didn’t have the right connections to get their chance.

        Reply ↓
          1. Shutterdoula*

            What, exactly, has this potential intern done that leads you to believe she is “smart”? Looks to me like the potential intern hasn’t done a damn thing to get an internship. Her mom reached out to someone and tried to strong arm them into creating a special opportunity just for her daughter.
            Not a damn thing “smart” about that.

            Reply ↓
      2. Starbuck*

        This is such a weird take. If there was an already open internship position, and the coworker was refusing to hire or consider the daughter because of the connection there, that would be one thing.

        But this is an internship that does not even exist! If the LW wanted to offer an internship and actually had the time for it, they could write it up and post it somewhere and the daughter (and anyone) could apply and LW could chose whoever seemed best. But you’re saying the better way to do it is just offer it to whoever asks? That’s pretty silly.

        The daughter/mom are asking for a special favor, it’s not a punishment to not give someone a favor. Expecting it though… I believe that’s called entitlement.

        Reply ↓
  20. Semi Retired*

    Someone who writes on their hands all day and leaves it there is obviously not washing their hands very often. Yuck.

    Reply ↓
    3. Other Duties As Assigned*

      My youngest (17 with ADHD) writes herself homework notes using special “tattoo” skin markers that are designed to stay pretty well and are nontoxic. The notes survive repeated handwashing but can be washed off the wrist with a little effort.

      Can you shed your judgemental attitude with the same ease?

      Reply ↓
      1. Starbuck*

        This is kind of silly, what is more likely? That someone is using a special kind of pen that most people haven’t heard of, or that they’re doing the sadly super common thing of not washing their hands properly?

        Regardless it’s always smart to assume that stuff other people are touching is possibly gross and act accordingly by washing your own hands.

        Reply ↓
  21. Yes And*

    LW3: I work at a significant nonprofit in a passion field, and we struggle with this all the time. I’ve discouraged our company from making space for connected interns, for all the reasons Alison laid out.

    However, we were finally able to square this circle by accepting a placement of an intern from a local trade association. They are paying the intern (something resembling a living wage no less!), and they ran the open, equity-focused screening process. All we have to do is find meaningful work for them for a few weeks (not a hard task).

    If you have work for an intern but not a budget or a process, do you have a local trade association you could collaborate with?

    Reply ↓
    1. Peanut Hamper*

      Sometimes, it’s a lot of work to pull out your phone, unlock it, scroll to find the note-taking app, open the app, and write the note. (Plus, if someone has ADD/ADHD, looking at your phone might be the last thing you want to do in the middle of your work day.)

      But yeah, I get it. There are better solutions. If you’re not going to use your phone to write something down, just get a little notepad. This is pretty old technology at this point.

      Reply ↓
  23. Thegreatprevaricator*

    Personally, I really don’t get why we are giving colleagues hands this level of scrutiny? I feel like this is a similar thing to where we ask children to show us their ‘listening’ posture, guaranteeing that some kids won’t actually listen to anything because all their executive function goes into ‘listening’ . Actually same for adults. While it may give the *appearance* of disorganisation, is appearance or actual delivery more important? I get that in a client facing role one may want to present a certain appearance but I am in favour of letting people organise their work in a way that supports them to be most effective. Plenty of people have explained why someone might be writing on their hands. A person might be well aware of how it presents, and choose to be doing it anyway.

    Some of the things I do probably look slightly odd, or disorganised, but fortunately my employer/ manager trust me to find my way to excel in my role. I certainly make a judgement call about how I may be perceived, but sometimes it’s worth it. Certain received wisdom about organisation doesn’t work for me, I wasted far too much of my life trying to abide by it.

    Reply ↓
    1. Thegreatprevaricator*

      Also, everyone saying ‘do you wash your hands’ have surely not tried to remove biro recently? I swear 2 happy birthdays would not remove

      Reply ↓
      1. metadata minion*

        It really depends on your skin type. I have relentlessly oily skin and even permanent marker will wash off pretty quickly (I only write things on my hands if it’s something I need to do in the next few hours). If you have drier skin it absorbs the ink better and it’s going to be harder to wash off.

        Reply ↓
    2. Disappointed With the Staff*

      I’m one of those adults. You want listening posture? You got it. I’ll walk away afterwards with no idea what was said, but I looked attentive and made appropriate noises when required.

      This crops up for me occasionally when I’m making notes because I know I’m in no state to remember anything much. Whoever is talking will say “no need for that, this is just a casual chat”. Which is fine, but they need to be honest about me not being expected to retain anything and they often are not. So I’ve taken to noting down afterwards “Bob dropped past about 2:30pm but said not to take notes” so that if it does come up later I have a record.

      (this is normally when I’m deeply engaged in the thinking part of my job and I’m desperate to get back to it before I completely lose state)

      Reply ↓
  24. RLC*

    Somehow “notes written on hand” person brought back memories of a colleague who wrote on the hood of his truck in lieu of having paper/clipboard on hand. His “system” was especially ineffective when a client wanted a copy of the information (this was before phone cameras were available). It was a bit like his personal portable whiteboard, and so odd to observe. If he needed to “erase” something, he licked his hand and wiped away the writing. Icky!

    Reply ↓
  25. anonymouse*

    I used to work as a zookeeper and it was pretty normal for us to write notes on our hands. It was also pretty normal for us to have actual poop on our clothing, though, so your mileage may vary.

    Reply ↓
    1. Dinwar*

      I’ve seen drillers write notes in the mud on the side of their rigs, and I’ve drawn maps in the dirt with a stick before on jobsites. So yeah, part of this is absolutely going to depend on your role.

      I would say that if you’re in a white-collar job writing on one’s hand is generally a bad look, though. Maybe you can get away with it–everyone’s got a quirk or two–but in general it’s going to come across as juvenile and disorganized in ways that make you look incapable of handling the work.

      Reply ↓
  26. Festively Dressed Earl*

    One more wrinkle: some people don’t recognize all their hunger signals and are sticklers for not eating when they’re “not hungry.” I have a relative who’s gruesomely rude in the morning, then pleasant and contrite after lunch. She prides herself on not eating breakfast because she’s “not hungry in the morning”, meaning her stomach isn’t growling and she doesn’t have a taste for anything, but she can’t or won’t connect the dots that her foul moods mean she is hungry in the morning without knowing it.

    Reply ↓
  27. Festively Dressed Earl*

    Re: asking back one spouse and not the other.
    Does the LW intend to eliminate Pam’s position or hire a replacement? If Jim’s being professional, he’ll understand if LW finds a better candidate, but it’s possible he’ll get offended that Pam was passed over. LW shouldn’t take one bad employee to keep a good one, but they should be prepared to replace Jim if he figures out what happened and takes it badly.

    Reply ↓
  28. Wingo Staww*

    Focus on the behavior rather than the eating/hangriness. I fast much of the day, yet manage not to blow up at people. Everyone is in charge of their own moods and reactions.

    Reply ↓

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