updates: the gossipy ex-coworker, I don’t want to hire a friend, and more

by Alison Green on February 20, 2025

Here are four updates from past letter-writers.

1. Retired coworker keeps coming back to gossip (#3 at the link)

Unfortunately, the retired coworker is someone who will take offense at any direct request to be left alone to do work. He would go up and down the hallway talking loudly to other people about how “So-and-So told me to get lost!!!!” and cause even more of a ruckus. My supervisor is often not there to see what is happening, and was not effective in dealing with him before he retired. (Example: He told our supervisor, “I don’t attend meetings because that’s what works for me,” and she let him keep up that behavior.)

But the good news is, some of the other people the retired coworker liked to bother also retired, and we got some new upper-level management that he may be a little wary of, so he has not been coming in as often. I still get e-mails from him asking about office gossip, but those are much easier to deal with than his in-person disruptions. I either don’t reply or answer in a bland manner, not contributing to, confirming, or denying any gossip. This has effectively taken his obsession with office gossip off my plate.

2. How do I give notice at a job I’m passionate about? (#5 at the link)

I was, in fact, offered the job I was interviewing for. And giving notice was…not without hiccups! I was informed by my new company that in order to be eligible for a year end bonus, I needed to start no later than September 30. I had been explicit throughout the interview process that I wanted to give at least 3 weeks of notice- I really was the linchpin for the program I was building and knew more notice would be the best way to set my boss and colleagues up for success. However, given how long the background check took, I couldn’t give notice until September 13, to provide only 2 weeks. The issue? My boss was set to leave the country on September 19, and would be gone the whole rest of the following week, basically providing only 3 days of transition with her in the office. Remembering your frequent advice that people leave all the time and sometimes timing is bad, but folks just manage, I delivered this news as matter-of-factly as possible.

Boss was Not Pleased. Not pleased with me for leaving at all, not pleased with the notice timing, really just upset all around. However, I held firm- I would be foregoing a bonus if I chose to start later than September 30! And that was the plan, until…the woman who runs my division at my new company inquired how my giving notice had gone. I told her the story, including my boss’s international trip. New company and old company are close partners in the same industry, and new company didn’t want to damage the relationship with the old company, so division head was quite concerned. (Without exaggeration, I can say this was one of the most stressful times of my professional life, worrying that both companies- both of which I respect greatly!- were unhappy with me.)

Division head pulled some strings with HR to allow me to receive a “signing bonus” that was more or less commensurate with what I would have received at year end, and so I provided an additional week’s worth of notice, working 3 weeks total, one week after my old boss returned to the country. My old boss remained cool towards me for leaving, though we are professionals in a small industry- she can’t avoid working with me in the future. I’ll say that I absolutely worked my tush off during my notice period to set my colleagues up for success as best I could, and as I was documenting it all, even I was shocked by how much had been on my plate. I know they were already discussing breaking my role into 2; if they’d asked me, I would have advised 3, because 2 people would be able to handle everything I was doing, but the 3rd person would have been able to get to all the things I wanted to do or should have been doing, but just didn’t have time. I’m not sure how they plan to pay these folks- I was underpaid for how much I was doing already- but I suppose that’s not my problem. I took my nearly 40% pay increase and went to work for a company I had already deeply admired, doing work I’m excited about with people I really enjoy working with.

Thanks to you and the commenters for reassuring me that it really was okay to move on. I wish I could have finished building what we started at my old company, but I’m delighted to be working for a company where the workload expectations are reasonable, and they’re paying me so much more.

3. Do I have to use the phone for my freelance client? (#2 at the link)

Edwina called me a few more times about potential projects, but each time they ended up not going ahead for various reasons. I finally realized that she needs to talk through projects and her feelings in order to wrap her head around what to do — meaning she does on the phone with me what most people do on their own before deciding to hire a freelancer. I imagine she’s one of those people you find in every office who is extremely nice but you have to plan an escape route from when you’re busy.

In the end, someone else has taken over the projects I do regularly for this client, and we have settled into a nice routine of her emailing me the project to ask if I can take it, and me answering yes and then emailing it back when it’s ready. So I didn’t end up taking anyone’s advice specifically, but have come to better understand Edwina’s motivations, and hopefully I can steer the conversation back into focus if we work together again.

I also have a friend who stopped working with a freelance client after she couldn’t take the client calling to destress over projects all the time. My friend absorbed it all and then could no longer function, so that also helped me inform how to draw a line between what’s included in my work and what isn’t. It’s a flexible line, of course, but I think there’s value in examining it now and then and evaluating how clients fill or drain us.

4. My friend applied for a job reporting to me and I don’t want to hire her (#4 at the link)

I got quite lucky in the end and didn’t have to have too hard of a conversation. In her application, friend’s salary expectation was way above our range, which was a great way for me to describe to her that the role was quite junior and wouldn’t be a good fit. She was at a point where she was coming to the end of a contract and getting a little worried about finding her next gig so said she’d take anything but I don’t think she meant this low of a salary and within a few days she’d gotten something way more appropriate.

So she never made it through initial screening and I didn’t need to talk to my boss about her. Her new role has its challenges but the workplace is nicer so although she might still get sucked into things that don’t really affect her, she’s also less negative than she used to be. And I’m totally amenable to listening to a friend vent! So she and I are still great friends.

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{ 39 comments }

{ 39 comments… read them below or add one }

    1. LW4*

      It worked out so well and she really is a great friend. We all have our moments but new office is helping me learn to not get drawn into negative gossipy chat so even where she still has hard days it’s easier for me to let her vent without taking it all on.

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  2. Dawn*

    LW1: Unless there’s something you’re leaving out, like that he has connections to managers who would take action against you for it, I’d just like to point out that you’re under no obligation to be nice to this guy anymore. You can absolutely tell him to straight up get lost. If he wants to throw a tantrum over your boundary-setting, that’s his issue and his problem. And noise-cancelling headphones are great nowadays, too.

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    1. Zona the Great*

      And as for the hollering down the hallway, it’s perfectly okay to stick your head out and tell him not to disrupt the office like that. What a child.

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      1. Dawn*

        Exactly. Your boss isn’t shutting him down? Well, you’re allowed to do it in that case, because you’re an employee and he’s just a visitor.

        Honestly, not that I’m recommending this but to put this into perspective, that would be sufficient grounds to tell him that he’s trespassing and have him removed from the premises if he continues. “Open to the public” isn’t the same thing as “allowed to do whatever he wants inside no matter what without consequences”.

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      2. goddessoftransitory*

        Right? I was getting flashbacks to Winona Ryder in Reality Bites: “Sammy, what are you doing here? You don’t live here!”

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    2. fancy pants math girl*

      Right. Who’s going to look worse, the person who politely refuses to gossip and gets back to work, or the baby stomping down the hall shouting that you told him to get lost? Who will your colleagues believe — you, or the known baby?

      Haha, maybe hand him a binkie the next time he comes in…(don’t, but it’s fun to imagine)

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    3. Bike Walk Bake Books*

      And stop replying to his emails. Unless he’s somehow super valuable as a professional contact–and the description of his behavior doesn’t suggest that– you can set up a rule that sends them to delete without any pangs. He’s taking time away from what you’re supposed to be doing and what you want to spend your time on.

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    4. Snark*

      Came here to say this. He can feel any type of way he wants about a polite brush-off and that’s okay; he has no power over you and you don’t really care what he thinks. And if he has a big reaction, and someone confronts you, so what? “Yeah, I told him I was really stacked up and didn’t have time. His reaction was so weird.”

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  3. Working under my down comforter*

    OP1: Can you let your management know about the emails? Maybe they can help you formulate a company “farewell and good luck email.”

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    1. Pastor Petty Labelle*

      the emails can be ignored. Completely. Don’t respond even once blandly. Once you stop giving him what he needs, he will look elsewhere. INcluding possibly leaving you alone in the office.

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      1. BellStell*

        Block block block that enail

        Also why is a rando left alone to wander the halls after retiring from the company ofices…. wtf? Maybe I missed something?

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        1. linger*

          Former colleague, thus known to the existing workers, thus not a “rando”.
          And the location is open to the public, so there’s nothing to bar their entry.
          Though there certainly should be limits on what they can do (in terms of disrupting work) once they enter.
          As OP notes in the update, Retiree’s status as Former Colleague is becoming less persuasive over time as the more senior coworkers, who knew Retiree longest, are retiring too. So the problem will solve itself eventually, as Retiree has less reason to visit, and is less accommodated by the remaining staff (and especially, by new management). It just might take a bit longer than OP and others have patience for.

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          1. allathian*

            Sure the location’s open to the public, but is this person staying in the public areas? Generally some areas are limited to current employees only.

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          2. fhqwhgads*

            Yeah, as turnover continues, the guy is gonna progress away from “former colleague” and toward “rando”, and it’ll also be less satisfying for him to be there in that context.

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  4. Sloanicota*

    #2 – this is so characteristic of nonprofits. Sure, someone will say “it’s not your problem, you’re not responsible for their success” – but the reality is that it’s very hard to leave some of these jobs and there ARE repercussions for “leaving them in the lurch.” (Possibly also true in any job but I’ve only worked nonprofit in my career). And they’re almost always going to be left in the lurch due to poor planning. No solution, only commiseration.

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  5. Sloanicota*

    #3: I can say, as a past freelancer in the nonprofit sector, some people are just not thinking about us as being basically hourly – they are treating us the way they might treat a staff colleague – and need to be cued, or you need to have a plan to deal with it. Many freelancer raise their hourly rate to include the project formulation costs you can’t bill, if your work involves a lot of that type of thing. But you also have to avoid people who want to vent to you unpaid or yes, “think out loud.” They should realize the issue, but in my experience rarely do. Good on you for handling this well OP.

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    1. Slow Gin Lizz*

      I think that some “think out loud” people maybe don’t realize that a) there are many people who are not “think out loud” people and b) their thinking out loud, while extremely beneficial to them, is sometimes extremely tedious or draining for other people to listen to. I’m not saying this to slight them, I’m just saying that everyone’s brains work differently and sometimes we completely forget this fact. And heck, even for those of us who don’t usually think out loud, there are definitely times where bouncing ideas off people or venting about personal issues (with friends, not coworkers) can be really helpful. And it sounds like Edwina maybe needs the self-discipline to discuss her project with someone else or else she won’t do any of the planning for it.

      I think it’s a good idea, as Sloanicota pointed out, for this OP to consider billing Edwina for her project idea calls, or charging her firm a slightly higher rate to account for these calls. Or even raising your rates entirely but giving people a discount if they reach out to you via email instead of on the phone (although maybe don’t put this on your website or you’ll get all kinds of spam). After all, she is taking up more of your time than your clients who just email most of the time, so your rates should reflect that fact.

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  6. 40 Years In the Hole*

    #1 (guy retired): how exhausting to (still) deal with this pass-agg bully-baby. And spineless of your manager(s) to not have wanted/been able to, you know, manage him. My guess is a lot of the staff are younger and/or female and/or not well experienced in setting workplace boundaries.
    Since he has free access (?!) to the work space you probably can’t do much there, can you (1) don headphones and just ignore him, or indicate you’re on a call? His pouty-pants response is his to manage; (2) can you block his incoming calls and emails, and redirect to spam? (3) let your manager know the frequency/what sort of distraction he causes, and it’s impact on your and colleagues’ workflow.
    And – ok, petty – set up “Let It Go” or some such hold music on your line? Some people can’t seem to retire gracefully; I’m afraid I’d not have a lot of fux left to give at this point…

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  7. Middle Name Jane*

    I don’t understand why LW-1 continues to respond to even occasional e-mails from the retired employee. It’s just giving the attention seeker more attention. There is no obligation to reply, and no reason to. Just ignore them. Block them, even. Set up a filter so their e-mails go to your trash folder. Even though the drama has decreased, it’s still there when it doesn’t have to be.

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    1. Slow Gin Lizz*

      Agreed, just stop reading the emails and replying to him altogether. If he asks you in person why you haven’t been responding to his emails, you can say that you’ve gotten really busy and haven’t had a second’s time to formulate any responses, sorry.

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    2. Vipsania Agrippina*

      Instead of setting up the filter so that his e-mails go to the trash folder, I would create a folder only for him, and make the filter move the e-mails there. This way, if things should ever get ugly again, OP will have some proof to show.

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  8. Middle Name Jane*

    The job exit by LW-2 seems unnecessarily fraught. It doesn’t sit well with me that their old boss essentially threw a tantrum, and the new company capitulated. Why was the new boss asking questions anyway? All of it seems over the top. LW-2 did nothing wrong by providing 2 weeks’ notice. Both companies acted weird about this.

    I once left a job with the standard 2 weeks’ notice, and the response from my employer (a small nonprofit) was to essentially shun me for those 2 weeks. It was really odd, and I wasn’t the only person they treated that way. There was high turnover, and I saw the same kind of behavior when other employees gave notice.

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    1. Saturday*

      New boss wanted to keep up a good relationship with old boss, and LW had wanted to give a longer notice period anyway – the extra bonus money allowed that.

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    3. Metal Gru*

      “that their old boss essentially threw a tantrum, and the new company capitulated”

      This is because the two companies are closely related – the dynamic is that they are arguing over LW as if LW is a shared resource that they need to agree on the best way to transfer, rather than an independent person with their own wishes. The new company has found that they can break the deadlock with this “resource allocation issue” by spending a bit of money, and that’s often the cheapest way (vs loss of relationships) to pay for it. I think LW2 was probably closer than they might think to having the offer pulled altogether to keep their current company happy.

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      1. Leenie*

        “ I think LW2 was probably closer than they might think to having the offer pulled altogether to keep their current company happy.”

        I’m not sure that’s the given that you think it is. But even if you had a solid argument behind that deduction, not every thought needs to be shared. LW is happy with her job and the outcome. What’s the upside in trying to make her feel less secure?

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  9. Lenora Rose*

    letter #1 is a definite example of how we are so often taught not to rock the boat socially, and is the perfect case for Captain Awkward’s Return Awkward to Sender. He’s bringing the awkward. You… are asking for the room to finish the work you are paid for.

    Let him stomp up and down the hall and make his aggressive shoutings. It’s not your fault he hasn’t got basic professionalism and is allowed to wander roughshod through your workplace, and the more people he disrupts, the more obvious it is why YOU didn’t want the disruption.

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  10. cindylouwho*

    LW2: I need to be able to give plenty of notice.
    New company: You need to start in 2 weeks.
    LW2: That is making my old company mad.
    New company: [surprised Pikachu face]

    So annoying how the new company was upset, but so glad they sorted it for you!

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  11. HalesBopp*

    LW1 – Honestly, I’d still reach out to HR about this! Even if an office is open to the public, that doesn’t entitle someone to walk around and pop in at random to people’s offices. I would treat this the way you would treat any other member of the public – if the person is not there to conduct business or by specific invitation, then they do not need to be on the premise. HR is likely best equipped to handle that conversation with grace. Hopefully, this former colleague can connect with his fellow retirees instead of folks in your office.

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    1. LifebeforeCorona*

      Yes, I’ve never understood the impulse to visit old workplaces. I never have because I don’t see the point. These people were work colleagues and not friends and I’m not interested in trying to maintain a relationship with them. I did go to one farewell BBQ because I knew they were going to serve the local ice cream which is really good. I ate my burger, grabbed my double chocolate mocha ice cream and left.

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      1. Selina Luna*

        I agree. And I lived on the same site as where I was working (teaching on a reservation can be wild), so I made real-life friends with coworkers, too.

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      2. niknik*

        Its what happens when you make work your life. Some people can NOT handle the retirement shock. All their social contacts are bound to their job, their self worth depends on being needed by colleagues and praised by bosses.

        I don’t know this guys exact situation ofc, but a have seen it playing out. Kids and partner estranged after being put second place after the job for decades, never time to establish and interests, let alone hobbies. Leaves a big nothing. Scary, really.

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    3. allathian*

      Yes, this! My employer used to host a party for retirees and current employees once a year. They dropped it during the lockdowns and haven’t restarted. I went once to see a work friend who retired a few months before, it was lovely to catch up with them but…

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  12. NonnyMouse*

    Having an awkward resignation moment really resonates with me.

    I was working at a job with a horrible manager. It was a career change for me, and I came to the position with 12 years of management experience to a job with a boss and a flat reporting structure. Our boss (“little boss”) had no management experience, hid in her office all day, and didn’t back her staff up at all. She put people in unsafe situations and left us alone in unsafe situations frequently. Staff turnover was really high (of a staff of 4, two people left within the 3 months before I was hired).

    Fast forward to my six month probationary review – she chose to keep me on probation because of a whole bunch of things about me that she had made up. Like literally made them up out of thin air. We had no HR office and so I had no recourse other than to write up a rebuttal to go along with my review. She demanded weekly meetings with me to discuss my “improvement.” It was right that moment that I started aggressively job hunting and lined up a new job within a month and a half of her fake review.

    My new job had a hard start date, which meant I could only give one week’s notice. She was on vacation the previous week, and was due back on Monday. She comes back from break and is sick – so doesn’t come in Monday. I send her my resignation via email (not ideal, but I was leaving either way) on Monday AM. She just never responds. She doesn’t come in Tuesday or Wednesday. Finally, on Wednesday, I tell my coworkers – one of whom is best friends with the administrative secretary at the home office. Coworker texts friend, friend says send resignation to big boss. Big boss accepts my resignation and little boss doesn’t come back till Friday. She never responded to my resignation email nor addressed it with me at all in person. I just left on my last day and didn’t come back. Most awkward last week of work I’ve ever had.

    After I leave, they promote someone into my position and hire someone new. In the next 3 months, that new person and two other staff members leave. Big boss finally realizes little boss is the problem, and has her do management training. It doesn’t work. Over the next year (until she is forced to “retire” early), 6 people quit (still a staff of four). That branch is now under new management – and they are doing an awesome job. But it was so so awkward.

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      1. NonnyMouse*

        Plus a scathing article in the local paper about the high turnover. All of the folks who had left were interviewed (myself included). Some people left the field entirely to get away from her.

        It was a scandal but big boss refused to deal with her. He thought she was a fine manager who just needed some coaching.

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