supportive boss is leaving and I blame his partner, what does it mean to have no HR, and more

by Alison Green on April 10, 2025

It’s five answers to five questions. Here we go…

1. My very supportive boss is leaving, and I blame his partner

I currently have an incredibly supportive boss but he plans to leave his role soon because his long-term partner lives in a different region of the country and refuses to move nearer to where he lives even though they work remotely.

I’m legally disabled and worried that whoever takes over once he lives will be far less accommodating in regards to my disability, especially considering that I’ve had to pivot to a lower caliber field after a devastating job loss that I’ve still not gotten over.

As a result, I can’t help but feel that my boss’ partner is selfish and I secretly hope that they break up, even though I know that it will break his heart. I have no attraction towards him and do not desire a romantic relationship with him if that was what you were thinking, I just don’t want a supportive boss to be replaced by a less than adequate one.

That’s an understandable way to feel! But it might help to keep in mind that managers leave jobs for all sorts of reasons — he could break up with his partner tomorrow, then get a fantastic job offer the next day and quit to take it. Or he could have a health emergency, or decide to move to live near aging parents, or get a sudden yen to live in Alaska, or want to start his own freelance rice sculpting business. Any of these would be disappointing, but I but they wouldn’t strike you the same way, since you’d see him as having more agency in the decision … whereas now it feels like someone else is “doing this” to him. But managers leaving is a thing that happens. It’s okay and normal to be disappointed and worried, but ultimately your boss has decided this is what’s best for him. He gets to make that decision for himself, just as much as you get to wish he didn’t!

However, could you ask for his advice on preserving your current accommodations with the new manager? That might nudge him to think about whether there’s a role he can play in how the accommodations are framed to his replacement that might set you up as well as possible. (In theory, accommodations should come from your company, which is not changing, but in reality different managers can be different degrees of supportive and are positioned to make your life harder or easier. But you could talk to your HR about your concerns too.)

2. What does it mean to have no HR?

I interviewed recently with an organization that seems like a very good fit for me. They have a clear mission and solid history, funding, and infrastructure to support it and what seems to be a good culture fit (as far as anyone can tell in an initial interview.) No alarm bells whatsoever with the hiring panel; I’d be excited to advance in the search.

Towards the end of the call, as part of the conversation surrounding being a small-staff (about 14 employees), cross-functional operation, they mentioned that they “have no HR.” I have seen this mentioned throughout the years of reading your site, but this is the first time I’ve encountered it.

What does this mean, in a practical way? They have the usual full suite of benefits, so presumably someone administrates that, but I’m not sure what sort of questions I should be asking to ensure that the absence of a dedicated person won’t be a present concern. They are small enough that they would be exempt from a lot of employment regulation (USA) already, and I am exceedingly fortunate to have never been involved with HR for any reason other than benefit questions in my career to this point. What should I be considering here if I’m invited to move ahead?

It’s very, very normal not to have a dedicated HR function until an organization reaches 50-75 or even 100 people; there’s simply not the work to support it until then. Instead, what you typically see is someone whose job includes things like benefits administration and onboarding paperwork, but whose main duties are something else. Meanwhile, the more complex parts of HR — like policy, investigations, management coaching, legal compliance, etc. — are often handled by someone like a chief of staff or second-in-command, with some of it (like legal compliance) often being outsourced. In other words, it’s not that those things aren’t happening at all; it’s that it’s operationalized differently. That can mean that there’s more room for them to be done poorly, but that tends to be tightly correlated with how effective and well-run the organization is overall (something that is especially important when the org is small).

3. Pitching a company where an ex from an acrimonious relationship is on the board

When I was in grad school, I had a serious relationship with a classmate for over three years. It was a stressful time for both of us, and the relationship was always dramatic and often toxic. It ended in an acrimonious but rather unspectacular fashion, with both of us going our separate ways and never speaking again.

It’s been 20 years since we’ve had any contact. We have both been married to others for most of that time, kids, successful careers (thanks, social media). I’ve spent a lot of time in therapy, and I work hard to avoid unnecessary drama in my life.

This week, a close colleague and I were at a networking event where we reconnected with a contact and learned that he has recently joined my ex’s family company. The contact invited us to pitch for the company’s business. Afterwards, when my friend excitedly started talking about this opportunity, I told her about my connection (pretty sure my ex is on the board of said company). She was delighted and has started assembling a team for a pitch meeting.

Here’s the thing: I don’t just have a personal connection to a director; I know a lot about this company. I know all the people involved and because the relationship ended without fireworks, I’d like to think that the family remembers me as a smart and hard working person and that my connections are likely a net positive. I am also a local leader in my specialty and my skills are particularly well-suited to the company. While the ex is on the board and probably a decision-maker, it is unlikely we’d have much day-to-day interaction.

I don’t want to show up and ambush my ex, and it would be disingenuous for me to pretend I don’t have a connection to this company. The respectful and professional thing to do is to reach out to the ex directly and … reconnect somehow, right? The problem is the thought of even getting coffee with this person fills me with dread and anxiety. I am quite content to never see them again. At the same time, the idea that we could be on speaking terms if we run into each other again would ultimately be a relief (no more running out the back door of bars!), and the alternative is to pass on the opportunity to be on the client team. I think my friend would be disappointed but understanding, but I would miss out on the financial and professional benefits that would come along from landing a new client.

I am consulting my therapist about this as well, but I appreciate feedback from the professional side. I’ve struggled with that goal of avoiding drama and can’t always see where I’m inviting it instead.

This doesn’t require coffee!

Email is perfectly suited for this, so that your ex can read it and have whatever initial responses they might have privately, and then can think about how to respond. You do not need to get together in person and go through the social ritual of coffee; you can just lay out the situation and ask how they’d like you to handle it.

The email could be as simple as, “Hi Artexerxes! I know it’s been many years since we’ve talked and I hope you’re doing well. I’m writing because an employee at CompanyName has invited my team to pitch for (project type). Normally I’d attend the pitch meeting and be part of any proposal for working together, but I thought I should touch base with you first. If you’d prefer I pass this one up and leave it to others here, I’d of course respect that, so I wanted to check in with you before my team moves forward.”

The biggest risk here is probably of Artexerxes thinking you’re overreacting — that it’s been 20 years and of course they don’t care if you pitch their family’s company. But it’s better to err on the side of being careful and respectful, which this would be.

4. Customers with ridiculously long payment times

I’m a freelancer, and I work with businesses of all sizes, from small businesses to multi-billion dollar corporations. I just ventured out on my own about a year or so ago, and I’ve run into an issue that I’m not sure how to solve.

Several of my customers have (what feels to me) absurdly long remit periods: 90 days. I’m a one-woman shop, and these 90-day remit periods leave me without access to a substantial amount of my income for an entire quarter of the year. Moreover, one of them doesn’t do lump-sum payments every quarter. They pay invoices one-off that are 90 days old. So, instead of paying all the invoices I submitted during those 90 days in a lump sum, they’ll pay the invoice I submit for April at the end of July, the one for May at the end of August, etc

When I submit an invoice, my “payment due date” is a month after I’ve submitted the invoice, which feels very reasonable. I mean, as a consumer, no one gives me an entire quarter to pay my bills without adding a lovely little chunk of interest, and I suspect that these slow-to-pay companies don’t allow their customers 90 days to pay them either.

While I’m not (currently) worried about making rent, I’m not made of gold. These long remit periods leave me incredibly stressed from a financial perspective. Moreover, they actively cost me money because the money I’ve earned from them is not sitting in my savings account accruing interest.

How do I tell these customers that they have to pay me within 30 days? Can I ask them to change their policy for me? Can I say that my policy is an X% charge for every month it’s not paid after my payment period has ended?

And a lovely little tidbit that I’m sure your readers will “enjoy” is that the businesses with the long remit periods are the not the small businesses. They’re the ones pulling in hundreds of millions, if not billions, every year (eye roll).

You can try to insist on 30-day payment terms, but a lot of big companies will refuse to alter their payment systems for you and you’ll have to decide if you’re willing to accept 90 days or not get the business. If you do try to get their agreement on 30 days, you’ll have a better shot if you raise it from the start and try to get their explicit agreement; otherwise they’re just going to shuffle you into whatever their default payment systems are. Even then, though, you might not be able to do anything about it; big companies have enough monetary power to basically force their vendors to accept their terms (or be willing to walk away, which most won’t be). That’s true even if you build late fees into your contracts; a lot of big companies will simply decline to work that way. You can try it! Just go in knowing that very often, the bigger they are the more likely they are to just use their established systems and you’ll have to decide whether you want the business under those terms or not. That’s not how it’s supposed to work, but that’s often how it does work.

That said, could you look at moving to a retainer model, where you get at least some portion of the payment up-front, or collect initial deposits? That won’t be realistic for every product/service (and if you’re in the only one in your field who charges that way, big companies may flatly refuse unless they really want you in particular), but it’s worth considering it.

5. Loud coworkers in shared space

After five years of being remote since Covid, we have been called back to the office. It’s been an adjustment, but overall going well. We have suites filled with cubicles, so it’s a shared space, and the cube walls provide minimal noise protection.

I am wondering how to handle loud coworkers who haven’t fully adjusted back to “shared space” volume, and are practically shouting in their meetings for who knows what reason. (Thinking they are being quiet through their headphones? shouting back at someone who is yelling into their phone in a noisy environment? I can’t decide.) It’s become such a problem that in my own meetings, I am not heard because the coworker’s voice is overtaking mine in the microphone! I have to either just use the chat box, or try to quickly get up and move to a quieter area. On busier days when more people are in, this isn’t always an easy option. I’d prefer to be able to stay at my desk.

This is not someone I am close with by any means, and I’m not sure how to politely tell them to lower their voice or be more aware of it. Any thoughts?

Is it one or two people or more widespread than that? If it’s one or two people, you can say, “I’m sorry to ask but I’m having trouble hearing my calls — could I ask you to lower your voice a little when you’re in meetings?” Feel free to add “the acoustics in here are tough” if you want.

But if it’s more widespread, mention the problem to your manager and ask for help, whether that’s by her reminding people to adjust their volume now that they’re around a bunch of coworkers again, or adding more noise protection (there are ways to do this if a company cares to, like installing soundproofing panels between cubicles), or rearranging things to be more acoustically friendly, or so forth.

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{ 261 comments }

{ 261 comments… read them below or add one }

  1. Daria grace*

    #1, working out strategies to deal with the upheaval and anxiety of dealing with a new boss is also likely something an EAP service can help with if your employer provides that

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    1. allathian*

      Indeed, I’d start by doing that.

      I mean the LW’s gone through some tough times, like having to switch to a less demanding job because of a disability. I’m glad they have such a supportive boss, and I can understand the worry about the next one possibly or even probably not being equally supportive.

      That said, I suspect the current manager would be horrified if he knew how the LW blames his partner for any potential changes. There are plenty of reasons why the partner might not want to move to where the LW’s current manager lives that have nothing to do with their ability to work remotely, like caregiving responsibilities of some kind.

      Alison’s suggestion about asking the current manager’s help in trying to ensure that the next manager will be as supportive as he has been is a good one.

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      1. Tiger Snake*

        LW1 – you are grieving.

        Things are changing. You are grieving the lost of a status quo. That is normal. And one of the stages of grief is called bargaining for a reason. “If his partner just wasn’t in the equation” – that’s a pretty normal thought.

        But its unhealthy to dwell on these, for exactly the same reasons its unhealthy to languish in any sort of grief. That’s why we need to take steps to process it and move on. Use your EAP services.

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        1. UKDancer*

          This so much. My own favourite boss is retiring soon and it hurts. I’ve worked with him for 20 years off and on (moving about different companies) and we’ve always clicked and he’s rather like an uncle figure to me. I feel more moved and saddened than I have done about people moving on before.

          But I can’t blame him for retiring because he wants to take things easier after a health scare last year, I can’t blame, his wife and sons for wanting to spend more time with him. So I accept the small sadness I feel and try and think on the good memories and the many things he’s taught me. I hope we will keep in touch but I accept we may probably not.

          Dwelling on it and hating his partner is really not healthy so I’d definitely recommend using the EAP to come to terms.

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          1. Grasshopper Relocation LLC*

            Something I’ve learned much too late in life – you won’t keep in touch if you don‘t take steps to do so. And you might be surprised if you do; from the relationship you describe, he may very well enjoy your company outside a work setting (especially now that you don’t have to work together). So give it a shot!

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          2. Aggretsuko*

            I’m just relieved my boss told me she doesn’t want to retire for another 10 years and will look out for me. I said if she gets another job, I’m following.

            I get OP’s pain, after years of being in an unsupportive environment. A new manager could literally just do anything to them and everything can go to hell, and there’s no way to mitigate that fear. But as Alison said, the manager could leave for any number of reasons and there’s nothing you can do about it.

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      2. Lady Danbury*

        Focusing on the partner also strip’s OP’s boss of his own agency in the process. Yes, the partner may have been the catalyst for the decision, but it was boss’ decision. It’s like when people choose to blame the affair partner instead of their own partner who cheated on them. We have a natural inclination to want to demonize someone we don’t know or don’t know well rather than accept that someone who we do have a relationship with has made a decision that has a negative impact on us. Talking with a professional would be helpful for LW to work through these changes and accept that boss is making the decision that he feels is best for him, as well as the prior devastating job loss.

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        1. ursula*

          This. It may also help to remember that your boss is a whole person who probably has a bunch of life considerations that they aren’t necessarily talking to you about. Maybe they like the city their partner lives in better than the one they live in now. Maybe they’re feeling restless where they are. Maybe there are health considerations, or family considerations (on their or their partner’s side), or this is part of a complex negotiation between them and their partner that includes compromises around marriage, kids, money, living arrangements, and all the other things that couples have to hash out together to make it work. It’s totally fair to be anxious about the change, but we also have to accept that all of our coworkers are people who have complex and worthwhile lives beyond the horizon of our view of them. Hoping you get someone great as your next supervisor – hopefully a company that was savvy enough to hire your previous boss will also have the right values and processes to find another good person to replace them.

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        2. Rogue Slime Mold*

          This is insightful: Problems need to be the fault of the party with whom you don’t want to be in an extended, important relationship you don’t want to leave.

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        3. NotAnotherManager!*

          This was my first thought as well. I don’t think LW#1’s feelings are unreasonable as an initial/gut reaction – so many studies have shown that bosses have a major impact on people’s work experience, often more impactful than pay rate or commute time. I would be devastated if my boss left because we have a strong working relationship, and they’re amazing. But they’re also a real person with more going on – partner, kids, activities/hobbies – than advocating for my work projects. It would be weird for them to prioritize me over their family, frankly.

          But, end of day, it’s the boss who is choosing to leave, not their partner. The reality is that they are choosing living with their partner over living in their current city and keeping their current job. And that’s OK! They have a life outside of work, and prioritizing that over their current job is not a huge surprise.

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        4. bamcheeks*

          This is a weird comparison because the boss hasn’t done anything wrong. If you’re talking about an affair, then it’s good to check the fallacy that says “blame the other person” because it’s important to hold your own partner accountable and recognise their agency, whether you are planning to forgive them or break up with them. LW has no comparable decision to make here, and so whether she holds her manager or her manager’s partner responsible makes zero difference. The only thing that matters here is whether it’s a helpful or an unhelpful tactic to help her work through the things she can affect.

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          1. Lady Danbury*

            You and I know both that boss hasn’t done anything wrong. But OP doesn’t, as least not emotionally, which is why they’re blaming boss’ partner. Note that I didn’t say someone who’s done something wrong, I said someone whose decisions have a negative impact on someone. Which is true in both cases, whether or not the actions are objectively right or wrong. OP’s boss’ decision is having a negative impact on them and they’re seeking to blame someone for that.

            I would also disagree that blaming someone has zero difference. People often don’t realize how much their private thoughts/feelings actually do come across in their behavior, whether it’s through tone, microexpressions, etc, which has the potential to negatively impact their relationship with their boss. It also will also hinder OP’s ability to work through what they can affect because they’re focusing so much emotional energy on blaming boss’ partner (to the point of wishing they’ll break up!) that they have less capacity to focus on what they can change.

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          2. Lisa*

            Of course you’re right that it’s not a complete analogy, but in terms of “your emotional reaction is irrational but natural” it is a good comparison to make.

            Reply ↓
    2. Presea*

      I also think there might be feelings worth unpacking in that last paragraph. That level of defensive posturing speaks to some really intense anxiety around the idea of being seen as romantically interested in the boss. I completely believe OP, but I would have believed them just as much with a lot less defending. If the OP has deeper issues and griefs and traumas to deal with, maybe they can get a referral to a solid therapist or coach as well.

      Reply ↓
      1. Leenie*

        I think if they hadn’t said that, half of the comment section would have been speculating about romantic interest. To me, it doesn’t read so much defensiveness as familiarity with the audience.

        Reply ↓
    3. learnedthehardway*

      The reality is that change is the only constant. OP#1 – I would try to reframe the situation. Please consider that you have notice and the ability to prepare for this. You boss didn’t get fired or downsized suddenly, he’s let you know ahead of time. While you’re scared, you have time to put in some measures to ensure your accommodations are documented more fully and protected.

      I would talk to your boss and let him know that you appreciate the heads up. Wish him all the best. Tell him you’re worried that his replacement might not be as supportive and that you want to document the accommodations you have. Put together a list of the accommodations that he and you have worked out between you – esp. anything that goes beyond the scope of whatever HR has on your file. Get him to sign off on it, make copies for yourself, and have the document added to your file by HR.

      When the new manager joins, you’ll be in a good position to point out that you have the accommodations and that they are working.

      Reply ↓
  2. WS*

    #4 – this is unfortunately common. I’m not self-employed but I do work in a small business and the bigger the company, the longer they take to pay you. We have to do significant cashflow management due to two large businesses (one local and one statewide) paying their bills exactly the way you describe here. If we didn’t take their business it would be a serious cut, but the way they manage payment when we have bills and wages to pay is frustrating. On the other hand, it is a known quantity, so we could factor that into our projections.

    Reply ↓
    1. Sleeve McQueen*

      Yeah we’re a small business so I feel your pain. I don’t know if it’s an option, but seconding Alison’s suggestion that if you have a retainer model that allows it, billing monthly is the way to go. We’ll issue an invoice for the work we’ve done so far each month of the project or retainer timeframe. It’s not ideal, but it’s better than doing, say, work on January 1, billing on March 31 and getting paid for it on June 30

      Reply ↓
      1. LaminarFlow*

        I have freelanced, and I used a retainer for initial payment that was essentially 75% of the total estimated cost of my services. From there, on the estimate, I outlined payment terms that ranged from monthly to quarterly, and the fees for monthly payment were quite a bit lower than the fees for quarterly payments. And, there were no fees for clients who paid 100% up front.

        As projects progressed and evolved, I reached out to the client to let them know where we were financially, about 2-4 weeks in advance. That enabled the client to make their decision on if they wanted to extend their contract, which would revise their payment terms, or if they wanted to stop, with full payment upon delivery.

        It was a lot of work to manage as a freelancer, and there were some clients who felt that they didn’t need to pay. But, consistently over-communicating the financial terms ended up saving me from losing income.

        Reply ↓
        1. Lobster*

          Similarly, something I’ve done, and you may have to wait until you can renegotiate your contract?, is to build in discounts for “early” payments.

          If my hourly is $100/hour, I advertise that, and in the contract, I specify that for this project/partnership, I will be charging $150/hour when paid within 90 days. If the client pays 30 days “early” (within 60 days) they will receive a discount of $25/hour, making their cost $125/hour. If they pay 60 days “early” (within 30 days) they receive a discount of $50/hour, making their cost $100/hour.

          Either way, I get my minimum.

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          1. I Have RBF*

            The big companies are playing the float.

            Some of them will also aggressively take discounts. So if you make your terms into “2% 10, net 30, 5% late fee” it may get them to put you in a different payment group.

            But really big companies will still screw you with “oh, we pay everyone net 90”. This is a problem for small businesses, especially meeting payroll which doesn’t wait 90 days.

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    2. Polyhymnia O’Keefe*

      Ugh, I work for a large organization that has a labyrinthine and slow payment process, which is out of sync from the norms of my specific sub-industry. I’m powerless to do anything about it other than make sure my part of the paper trail runs as fast as possible, but as the go-between for the contractors and the payment process, I feel for them and do my very best to set realistic expectations and be as transparent about the process as possible. Still, I know it sucks, and I wish I could do it differently.*

      The red tape of certain parts of my job, when most of my speciality, outside of institutions like the one I’m at, is in a much faster-moving and more agile business mindset, has been one of the hardest things to adjust to, for sure.

      Reply ↓
      1. Sloanicota*

        Yeah, I used to work at a place that was net 60 but had a very meticulous (and often-changing) invoice process, and it sucked even for us as employees who had nothing to do with that side – I would get stopped at conferences by contractors asking for help all the time.

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    3. Ganymede II*

      I’m in one of these big companies, though not in a place to change the system. It drives me nuts, because we miss out on partnerships with a lot of small suppliers who can’t afford to basically give us 90 days no interest loans. A few times, I’ve managed to get a fast-payment approved, but the loops and justifications we have to go through to make something as basic as “paying a supplier in a reasonable time frame” are ridiculous.
      Whenever we push back on it, we hear that it’s an industry standard, which is such a crappy reason. If the industry standard sucks, don’t follow it!

      Reply ↓
      1. The Rural Juror*

        We’ve lost a couple of vendors/contractors because of slow payments. It sucks! I liked working with them.

        Reply ↓
      2. Office Chinchilla*

        I’m also at one of the big companies where our default is 90 days. We’ve changed our processes a half-dozen times since the start of the pandemic, and every time my department has had to fight and cry and beg and threaten to get them to make our payees net 0 because my payees aren’t “vendors” in the traditional sense, but every time they make a process change they don’t consider outliers and just try to make everything the same.

        OP, if possible, get a contract that includes, among other things, net 30 day payment terms. Your contact should be able to submit this contract to the accounts payable team and get your payment terms changed in their system. At least, that’s how it works at my company. It still doesn’t guarantee getting paid on time (all bets are off at quarter-end), but you’ll get a lot closer.

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    4. EngineeringFun*

      I was engineer at a large product producer who would have 365 day payment schedule. Yep 1 yr. I would get calls from vendors asking for payments and I would just have to forward them to purchasing. Some places refused to work with us or would increase the price to work with us.

      Reply ↓
      1. Clorinda*

        It makes sense for them to increase their prices in that case, basically building in the interest.
        Another approach would be to set the pricing higher but offer discounts for speedy payment.

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      2. Disappointed with the Staff*

        I’m very much in the “price accordingly” group of vendors. Including a margin for my estimate of the likelihood of getting paid at all, because that happens even with solvent customers.

        One thing that people in Australia don’t seem to understand is that tradies who offer a discount for cash are not necessarily cheating on their taxes, they’re also trying to avoid the cost and tedium of trying to get money out of people later. It’s *worth* 10% of the job price to have the money right now rather than having to send an invoice then another invoice then make multiple phone calls in the possibly vain hope of eventually getting some money.

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    5. Freya*

      As a side note, this is why the Australian federal government and associated entities like Defence have instituted a policy called the “Supplier Pay On Time Or Pay Interest Policy” – if you invoice them following their guidelines and goods/services have been receipted, then if they pay outside the payment terms (20 days if the invoice is emailed, 5 days if it was sent via e-invoicing using the PEPPOL framework) they automatically have to pay interest at the current General Interest Charge (GIC) rates (the interest rate government charges you if you’re late paying something, currently a bit over 11% per annum and calculated daily) as soon as that interest equals $100 or more.

      So if they’re 10 days late paying a $100,000 bill in March 2025, then they have to pay you an extra $312.88 on top, and you don’t have to do the paperwork to make it happen.

      There’s reasons why government departments can be annoying to work with, but if someone mucks up and you get paid late then that someone has to do extra paperwork and report it, and no one wants to have to do that, so late payments are not usually a problem for my clients (and IME extended payment terms are ignored, at least by Australian Defence, and they just pay within their normal payment terms) so contracts like that are looked upon more favourably.

      Reply ↓
      1. Anonymoose*

        Canadian government has the same concept, though it’s 30 days maximum before interest starts up. Typically invoices are paid sooner.

        Reply ↓
    6. DJ Abbott*

      Someone once told me the people who run rich companies deliberately set this up so they can hold onto their money and earn interest that much longer. I’m sure that degree of greed and pettiness doesn’t surprise anyone here.
      Meanwhile, I worked in the administrative office of a rich and greedy, but technically nonprofit, healthcare corporation, and there were a couple of times when we didn’t have drinking water in the office because the corporation had not paid the bill to the water company, and the company refused to bring more water. This was eventually resolved by getting one of those coolers that’s connected to the water supply.

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      2. Observer*

        Someone once told me the people who run rich companies deliberately set this up so they can hold onto their money and earn interest that much longer.

        If this were only “rich, greedy” companies, I would think that this is true. But I see this in so many other places, that I don’t think that that’s the real issue.

        One thing that I have seen is just overly complicated purchase / payment processes. We had something like this going, but we were able to keep things reasonable although not great. But then purchasing ramped up, funder requirements for some of our funders got more complex, and we were unable to ramp up our staffing. Things got BAD.

        We’re back to being reasonable, and we’re even generally turning stuff around more quickly than even in the pre-crazy times. It’s a combination of finding ways to get the controls we need with less convoluted processes, putting some of the necessary work in *before* an order is signed (so same net amount of time, but the vendor is not left holding the bag), increasing staffing levels, and using technology to streamline stuff.

        But it took a LOT of work and a bit of a culture shift.

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        1. CoffeeTime*

          Exactly this, I’m sure there is an element of greed in some places – but I’ve also just seen it be the result of complex payment processes or an understaffed accounting dept that can only process so much in a day.

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      3. Annie E. Mouse*

        Someone once told me the people who run rich companies deliberately set this up so they can hold onto their money and earn interest that much longer.

        This is absolutely true. I work for a massive global corporation. Our treasury department has meticulously calculated the rate of return for every extra day that we hold a dollar and adjusts it regularly based on market fluctuations. In addition to 90 day payment terms, big companies are also selling their short term receivables (factoring) because the financial incentive for holding cash is that high.

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    7. Sloanicota*

      It’s not only common in my experience, also the *only* time they break their own rules and pay you promptly is on December 31st, which means you abruptly get a bunch of unexpected money dumped on you to mess up your taxes. Found that out the hard way my first year, wasn’t sure if I could count on it happening again in year 2 (I could).

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      1. NotAnotherManager!*

        Our last CFO ran a small business prior to working for us, and I’d guess she experience this first hand because she sent notices to all providers with outstanding invoices at the end of November/beginning of December confirming a list and projected payment date of any outstanding invoices.

        Our pay cycles were weird, mostly because a lot of incurred costs were things we were a second-tier payor for (meaning the end-client was supposed to pay them, but, if that didn’t happen, we did and then billed the end-client with a processing surcharge to disincentivize that behavior). She wanted to make sure everyone got paid before year-end and that they knew payment was coming.

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    8. lost academic*

      I’ve had a client (big name industry) who had standard net 135. We had an MSA that the contracts team was proud of because they’d gotten net 85 from them instead. I was appalled at the latter before learning the former. I hate being an interest free lender to my clients because in our business, every day of sales outstanding for the company cost us a million dollars.

      Sometimes you can have conversations with the accounting people to find out the best way to get paid very quickly – it can be a timing issue of exactly when your invoices arrive (a problem I solved with a client that was typically net 60 but we could get paid in under 5 days if we hit it right).

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      1. Sloanicota*

        Yes, to be fair my old company that was Net 60 just said this because for some reason they had a “check run date” once a month, and a cutoff date before the check run date, so if the timing wasn’t right, you couldn’t get paid that month and had to wait a full month. But if you knew the timing, you had a better chance of getting paid within the month. However, finance told people not to tell contractors this, because a) they didn’t want all the invoices coming in and having to be processed on one day, and if that started happening, they’d just change the cutoff date, and b) if an invoice was “faulty” they’d make you redo it and that would almost always cause you to miss the cutoff date, and they didn’t want to deal with the ensuing panic/rush when this happened. I do think it’s kind of weird an electronic payment system would even have one (1) check run date per month … we weren’t exactly cranking up the hand-printer to get these out.

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      2. AVP*

        I worked for a small biz that basically went out of business this way.

        We would get paid by an ad agency, which would be on a 90-payment scheme with *their* giant corporate clients, so we’d be at like 100-120 days at best. But we’d have to front the entire project cost upfront, and then pay out our massive contractor/payroll bill within 30 days. We’d get a lump sum upfront but not nearly enough to front these costs in time.

        It was barely sustainable, but THEN the agencies hit on this contract thing called “Sequential liability,” where they had no responsibility to pay you at all unless they’d been paid by their client, so if the client was late, our check was even later.

        And people wonder why there are very few small businesses doing advertising work anymore and the industry is consolidating :)

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    9. Ms_Meercat*

      I’ve just lived through this on both sides of the aisle last week, being in a 300-person company. We have one client (in another country) that has 100k+ employees, and while we have a 30 day payment period, they pay us in 60 days (or well… something close-ish to that). They’re currently very late on the last payment…

      Then, I hired a freelancer in yet another country. We had worked with him before and so I didn’t think to check the payment period on his offer letter (since last time he got paid by us in our regular 30 days). He, however, had put 10 days, and then started chasing me for payments from then on.

      Now, if I really can’t find anyone else in the future to do this, I would consider using my own political capital to get an exception from finance (because we’re small enough and I know them), but it’s more likely I would just use another freelancer in the future. Thankfully, he understood when I explained it and said he’ll accept 30 days.

      With our big client that is a 7-figure project? We had to accept the 60 days in the clause, and other than some polite emails there’s little we can do to chase up beyond the 60 days. My prime contact thankfully checks in internally but the “billing” email is just a black hole where nothing ever comes back lol.

      PS: Neither of the 3 countries is the US btw.

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    10. Worldwalker*

      Decades ago, I occasionally sold articles to Dragon Magazine, far and away the biggest magazine in the game industry at the time. They were a notorious slow pay. I remember calling up to editor once when one of my articles was published and saying “Hi, Roger! It’s great seeing my name in print! Why don’t I see it in print after’Pay to the order of?’” But between the payment and the prestige, no one could afford not to sell to them, and they knew it. They were the 800-pound gorilla. When does an 800-pound gorilla pay? Whenever it wants to.

      The odds are, whenever your particular 800-pound gorillas are willing to pay up, you’re going to have to live with that. At least, so long as the do actually pay up. You’re going to have to shift your payment expectations by a quarter. Is this fair? Is this reasonable? Do they let their own customers do this? Of course not. But they’re multi-billion companies and you’re not, so it comes down to principle vs. pragmatism.

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    11. Miette*

      I am self-employed and operate on a cash basis, so I can’t afford to do business with these kinds of companies. Best believe they can figure out how to pay their rent and utilities in a timely manner, I think they can manage to pay someone who is a very small business so they can make payroll on time too.

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    12. learnedthehardway*

      With some of my clients, I put in a retainer payment. I had to – not only were the bills taking forever to get paid, but I hate invoicing (very stupid of me), and some clients try to weasel out of payments.

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    13. HR Exec Popping In*

      I work for a company with standard very long payment terms. However, we have an exception process for small firms if they ask. So please be sure to raise it as a concern. It is very possible that you can get expedited payment if requested.

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    14. i know, right?*

      Interestingly, Nike – the largest footwear company on the planet – pays its factories in net 20.

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    15. Tempest*

      I work for a small business and have the same experience. We’re lucky in that what we sell can’t be found elsewhere, so I have leverage when I tell them I am not going to accept their order with the long payment terms. I imagine if you are offering products/services that are easier to come by, you would have a harder time pushing back. That said, I’ve had no problem getting even the largest companies down to at least Net 45 with some back and forth.

      LW4 – It doesn’t hurt to push back. A short “Unfortunately, we do not offer N90 terms, our standard terms are Net 30. We are a small business and in order to (fill in here, keep prices competitive, be able to serve our customers, etc etc) we need to adhere to this policy.”

      Also! If you are a Small Business, or a woman/minority/veteran/disadvantaged small business, many of these large companies will have programs for that, including shorter terms. It would be worth it to ask about it!

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    16. X*

      My employer has 120 day payment terms as a default. We absolutely can support shorter payment terms, but 120 days basically ensures we get paid for the product we make before we have to pay our partners. It’s kind of gross but I don’t have the power to change it.

      However, I was recently in a session with two consultants we work with who were trading tips with a third on how to get 10 day payment terms with us (basically, who to talk to, and to position the request after a big win.) It was eye-opening. I am sure we still lag late if there’s an approval not completed or something, but Accounts Payable would be following up on it as a past due payment instead of a “ehh, it’s not due until June so whatever” payment, which is a big difference in urgency….

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    17. irritable vowel*

      OP, I don’t know what industry you’re in, but if it’s one where there’s a “food chain” of smaller companies providing a service for the larger companies, and you’re doing work for the smaller companies, even if the smaller companies seem to pay you on a better schedule, keep in mind that if their operating budget is partly dependent on getting paid by the larger companies (the ones that take forever to pay), these smaller companies can sometimes overextend themselves to the point of going under. And then you don’t get paid at all. So, it’s worth asking (if you don’t know for sure) the smaller companies if they serve as sort of the middleman between the bigger companies and the freelancer layer. This is very common in industries like educational publishing. Smaller companies like publishers that are producing the finished product are much better to work for than intermediary service providers.

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      1. Sara*

        I agree, and given that, Alison’s suggestion to talk to HR if they can help keep the accommodations is a good one, since it’s an actionable and reasonable step for the OP to take. My own instinct would have been to scold the OP for being ridiculous and self-centered, but that’s why Alison is doling out advice and not me.

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        1. Bazzathedog11*

          Thi person is scared at whatever accommodations she has in place by current manager already may not be recognised by the new manager. These may have been very generous on top of what is available as a accommodation already offered. Let’s be honest that column the other day where someone with a broken leg had to get a doctors note to use the lift before employer would grant accommodation was ridiculous. But some of the decisions on accommodations can take months. Selfish, just a tiny bit, understandably.

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          1. Dust Bunny*

            However, the way to address that is with HR and the new manager, and if that isn’t enough, with a reality check about what kind of employer this is. If the only thing making your job doable is the mercy of a particularly kind manager, you have bigger and much more tenuous problems.

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            1. Mad Harry Crewe*

              I don’t think you have much experience navigating the world as a disabled person. I’ll leave it at that.

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        2. Danish*

          Right, its the sort of thought we can rationally know is ridiculous, but I can definitely understand the anxiety and dont blame OP for spiraling about it. My own work history is such that, in a place that was extremely rigid about attendance to the minute for no business reason, i was always out of PTO, always anxious about it, always having meetings with the manager about my bad performance, always on the verge of being fired. My work and personal life were so full of stress, worrying about what foods I could eat or activities I could do, if they ever had the possibility of making me sleep poorly because that could throw me out of work for days.

          Then I got a job that did not care what hours you worked and literally all of that went away. My life improved in every way by about 400%. In the way that i expect is “normal” for non disabled people. It is both very stressful and extremely frustrating to have to think about how easily your life can be low key ruined by how flexible any given manager is, when all you want is to just like, live. When you know life doesn’t have to be so hard, it feels so, so unfair.

          All that to say, I can’t fault the OP for being angry and bitter. I think it’s good they wrote to Allison, who can give them a concrete action that could help, instead of just stewing or trying to talk to their manager about that aspect of it.

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          2. MsM*

            I don’t know. I can’t help side-eyeing OP for calling the partner “selfish” without any kind of acknowledgment none of their reasons for being unhappy about this have anything to do with what’s best for Boss. If they did successfully talk the guy out of moving, and suddenly their previous, more prestigious position came calling, are they really going to claim they wouldn’t be out of there in a heartbeat?

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            2. LaminarFlow*

              Same. Referring to Current Manager as “selfish” for putting his own needs/wants/desires before LW’s needs is cool…..But, LW needing Current Manager to put aside his own needs/wants/desires, just for LW’s benefit isn’t selfish? That doesn’t add up.

              LW is understandably freaked out about the unknown of New Manager stepping in, and shutting down all of the disability accommodations that are currently in place for LW. But, LW would be wise to wish Current Manager well, and ask him to partner with LW and HR to ensure that LW’s current disability accommodations stay in place when New Manager steps in.

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        3. WoodswomanWrites*

          I appreciate Alison’s response that creating blame for the manager’s departure is the wrong place for the letter writer to focus.

          Despite that, it’s unfortunately too common for employers *not* to accommodate employees with disabilities so it’s a legitimate fear for the letter writer to not trust they will have as good a work situation with a new manager. Discrimination against people with disabilities in the workplace is a real thing, and I don’t consider pondering their vulnerability to be self-centered. Alison’s recommendation to shift the focus to ensuring the accommodations continue is spot on.

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          1. Anonturtle*

            Thanks for stating this, Woodswoman. LW’s doom-spiral, however unproductive in solving the issue at hand, is still understandable in the context you lined out.
            LW1, I do understand how difficult this can be. I had to pivot right at the end of my extended formal education as my health took a seemingly sudden downturn. While I did end up in a field that is mostly comparable in regards to payment, it still stings that I’m using next to nothing from my previous education working with stuff that mostly does not interest me. There’s a lot of grief involved in that process, and, as WoodswomanWrites pointed out, a lot of experience-based fear on how quickly necessary accomodations can crumble with the wrong boss. I’ve been there myself and was angry that an intractable, and to be honest, ableist boss, could change working conditions so quickly.

            I’ll add some ideas and also would like to underline Alison’s advice. I really like her recommendation for two reasons:
            1. it gives you back some agency in figuring out how to move on from the current situation. Even if we might not like these kind of changes, finding out more about what can be done in the moment can help alleviate some anxiety. If your boss has been supportive so far, I suspect he’ll be open to brainstorm how to make the transition easier as well.
            2. focusing on the real issue. Currently your focus is on the partner and their imagined unwillingness. This however keeps you from facing your fear in full and from taking concrete steps to address how your boss leaving will affect you. Writing in here was a good step though. I’m glad you choose to spill this concern outside of work.
            Additional ideas, in line with the first point about agency. Yes, your disability makes certain things more difficult, you on average more vulnerable than your peers and the whole situation of your boss leaving a lot more daunting.
            Can you try reframe your boss leaving in one of the ways Alison outlined? Alternatively imagine you boss winning the lottery, being able to retire completely and therefore being out of the picture independent of their partner. Or, if that is not too close for comfort, for all we know the partner works remotely due to health issues of their own we don’t know about and needs more support now themself. Either way, focus on the work aspect. In a similar situation after some grieving of my own I decided to look a my finances, calculated if I could afford to be out of work without anything lined up if the situation got as bad as I feared and started to take stock of my application materials. If you can, take some time over the Weekend, maybe as little as 15 minutes, to sit with the disappointment and fear and pick *one* step to take next. Be that talking to your boss or your EAP to talk over different options. Best of luck, be kind to yourself, forget about the partner and their imagined fault in this.

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        4. Spooz*

          Well, I could wish Alison had been more emphatic that its one thing to be concerned about your accommodations needing to be formalised but quite another (and quite unacceptable) to blame your boss’s partner for your boss’s decision to leave. It’s not an OK thing to think and the OP should work very hard on reframing the issue.

          “Boss’s evil partner is ruining my life by MAKING him move!!!” –> “Given that boss is leaving, I need to make sure that my ability to work in this job is going to continue to be facilitated by the company”

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          1. LL*

            As long as OP hasn’t told boss or anyone else at work that they blame the boss’s partner, I don’t think we need to keep harping on them for blaming the partner. Yes, they need to work to change their mindset on that, but it’s actually not a huge deal in the grand scheme of things.

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        5. Sloanicota*

          Yeah … this person needs to remember that how they feel isn’t hurting anyone – a private thought in your own head is just that, it’s not a sin – but it’s also completely unproductive, so after sitting with it and letting it go, they should take her advice.

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          1. Lady Danbury*

            I would challenge this some because often what people assume are their private thoughts are publicly obvious in a variety ways (tone, microexpressions, etc) especially to those who know us well. It would be helpful for OP to work through their feelings towards the situation and boss’ partner for OP’s own good, as well as to avoid tainting their relationship with their boss.

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            1. Six for the truth over solace in lies*

              I agree. Most people are not good enough actors to hide anger and resentment well, especially in front of people with good emotional intelligence and social awareness. If you can, it’s best to try to resolve those feelings rather than feed them, because if you work yourself up, there is an extremely good chance that people will notice.

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        6. Elizabeth West*

          Eh, I get it — having weathered a retiring wonderful boss for a new lesser one, and it not turning out okay at ALL, I feel for the OP. I did not have accommodations set up beforehand. If I had, it might have made a difference, but since they absorbed my department into another and restructured my entire job, it might not have. OP doesn’t say that the job is being restructured, just that someone else is taking over.

          I would definitely talk to the current manager before he leaves, right away! It’s worth trying.

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  4. Librarian*

    #4 I work in local government, 45 days to pay is standard and when all goes well. it isn’t the size or available cash flow, it’s the complexity and approvals. those may increase in the bigger companies. if an invoice is missing one piece information, rejected, start over. check runs are only on certain days, courier and signature request times, etc. when I’m talking to new vendors, I ask if they are used to working with local government and my state. can you terms change? instead of individual invoices, hot milestones on a project for one lump sum. or they pay for materials up front?

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    1. Spooz*

      “it isn’t the size or available cash flow, it’s the complexity and approvals” – you’ve hit the nail on the head here.

      The LW is relatively new to freelancing. IME, if you can save aggressively for, say three months you can build yourself a cushion such that you’re living on the income that’s come in this month that you earned 90 days ago. Adjust your personal budget cycle to the payment cycle of the corporate behemoth rather than the other way around.

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      1. Miette*

        Yeah, no, it’s not that easy. Sometimes the nature of the work is seasonal, so it may be some months before a small vendor will work again. Sometimes a person doesn’t book enough business to build/maintain that cushion. Sometimes it’s a lean start to the year because the large corporation didn’t get around to finalizing its budget until the end of January so nothing’s in place/approved until mid-March. And sometimes large companies are just a-holes.

        My sister’s very large company just implemented SAP for accounting and guess what–they now require vendors to submit invoices via an SAP portal that… YOU GUESSED IT, the vendors have to pay hundreds of dollars per year to access. It’s not complexity–it’s greed.

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    2. amoeba*

      Hm, I don’t doubt that’s how it is for you, but honestly, I wouldn’t assume that’s the problem with most big companies. For us, everything is electronic anyway and they’re absolutely capable of getting payments out within a few days if they want to. They are very clear that they just prefer 90 days because of course, the interest also accrues for us if we keep the money for an extra 60 days! I imagine we’re not the only company that operates that way.

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      1. Ellis Bell*

        I think the word approvals refers more to humans releasing funds and higher ups checking in that everyone is following protocols with expenses and budgets rather than their not having swift electronic payment methods. There’s a bigger chain of accountability in bigger companies.

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        1. amoeba*

          Sure, but at least for us I know that that’s not the problem – they’re very clear on the fact that they just prefer the 90 days because it’s financially beneficial for us to pay as late as possible.

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          1. Miette*

            This. I’ve worked at a place where this was expressly the purpose of the policy. That said, they also had a policy of paying on shorter terms for very small vendors and consultants, so they could do it both ways and no one suffered. I’m sure they were an outlier.

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      2. Insert Clever Name Here*

        I work for a large company (Fortune 500) in the US in a highly regulated industry and here is the process invoices go through:
        a) supplier submits invoice in the payment portal (clock starts for payment terms)
        b) disbursements person 1 reviews the invoice and determines which of 20 paths it gets routed down for approval
        c) disbursements person 2 confirms route, checks the PO has enough money and is still active
        d) business unit finance determines what WBS number(s) are applicable and the amount of the invoice allocated to each
        e) business unit person 1 (who can confirm the work was done/goods were received) approves
        sub e) potential intermediary BU approvals depending on the charge
        f) final business unit approval by the person with budgetary authority
        g) invoice sits at waiting to pay until the payment term for the invoice has been met (meaning that whole process could potentially be done in 28 days, but if your payment terms are Net 45 the payment won’t actually be sent via ACH until day 45)

        This is all electronic (paper invoices — and we have some who still insist on sending paper invoices — have steps before a) but a person still has to interact with the invoice at each step.

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        1. Emmy Noether*

          I work for a small to medium size company, but the process is similar (except there’s no portal, just an email inbox with automatic import, and I don’t know if we wait until the end of the payment term). The timeline is fairly tight though. I do step (e) and get a reminder after 2 business days, and it gets escalated if I don’t approve by day 3. I’m fairly sure we do the whole process within 30 days easily (we’re getting those discounts).

          I do have to regularly remind some vendors that if they don’t send the invoice to the right inbox, it will not get paid.

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          1. Insert Clever Name Here*

            I have actually just discovered (literally, it came up yesterday) that our ERP system does not send reminders when there are items to approve in your queue; no reminders, no escalation, nothing. The only people who see a report on aged invoices right now is AP. All of this is dumb, obviously.

            What might come as a downright shock to people is that our CEO is not actually Scrooge McDuck trying to dive into a money pit and has mandated an overhaul of the whole process — increase transparency into where approvals are in the queue, get aged invoice reports to the BUs and put some metrics on on-time payments, etc.

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    3. Llama Llama*

      I work for a large corporation. I think for most vendors it’s 90 days and it’s definitely because they want to hold on to that cash longer not because of red tape.

      Not that there isn’t more layers to payments. I worked in an area where we were an exception and could pay bills ASAP. However, it was always to a new vendor. Setting the vendor up took like 8 business days because there were a lot of approvals for it to happen.

      Once a vendor is in the system, it was just the time it takes for an ACH to transfer, which usually not same day like some of the vendors demanded.

      All that to say, red tape is maybe 15 days not 45 or 90.

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      1. Sloanicota*

        Yeah there was definitely nothing including new vendor set up that required three months for us. And it would hardly possible to be more bureaucratic than the job I’m thinking off (federal government pass-through funding, subject to frequent federal audits).

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    4. Observer*

      check runs are only on certain days, courier and signature request times, etc.

      Some of this makes sense. But even with printed checks (which should be a real exception!) something like once a month check run (which someone mentioned up thread) is ridiculous. As for couriers? What on earth? Again, with very few exceptions, there should really be no reason for anything physical to need to be transported, even within a large company with multiple physically dispersed sites.

      If you had said this even 10 years ago, I would have considered some of this not crazy. But today? Seriously?

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      1. CoffeeTime*

        Depends on the industry. Cheques are still relatively common in mine and all of the above could apply depending on the situation.

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  5. Sleeplesskj*

    Re #4: you can set whatever payment terms you want but the fact of the matter is that you can’t make your client change THEIR payment terms. I’ve been a freelance voice actor for 15 years and I have clients that pay me within minutes and clients that take six months to pay. You’ve got to bake that spread into your planning. Focus less on how long it takes them to lay and more on the fact that they are paying – if it’s a steady customer you’re still getting steady payments – just not on your preferred timetable. And yes – the big name companies are always the slowest pays. It’s maddening. But not something you can change.

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    1. linger*

      Missing out on months of interest? Having to pay extra for your own expenses while waiting?
      1. Build the difference into your base rate, so that the slow clients are effectively paying you the interest that would accrue. Presumably that’s a margin of less than 10 percent, so is unlikely to lose you the contract, especially as routine payment delays make the company a less desirable client for competitors.
      2. And then, if you want to, offer a discount for prompt payments (e.g. of 5% for paying within a month of the invoice date, or of 10% for paying within a week). That way there is some incentive for slower clients to change towards your preferred timeframe if they can do so; but you don’t lose out if they can’t. And meanwhile you’re not disadvantaged when competing for other clients with shorter payment cycles.

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      1. Slow Gin Lizz*

        Yeah, I was going to suggest your #1, but your #2 is also a good idea. Totally feeling OP’s frustration with the situation. I have a friend who’s a music teacher in several different schools and one of them was, for awhile, only paying quarterly! So even though she’d start teaching in Sept, she wouldn’t get paid until Dec (or something like that, I don’t remember the actual timelines). I don’t know if that’s still the case; it’s possible the teachers finally unionized (or “unionized”) enough that they were able to push back on that. It’s a rather terrible practice; if you have lean times in the summer b/c you’re teaching a lot less, not getting paid for the first couple of months of your fall semester is really difficult. Of course the people in charge of this policy were likely admins who were a) employed full-time all year round so they never had a drop in salary during the summer and b) paid every two weeks or so anyway. It was just the contractors – the part-time private music teachers – who were only paid quarterly. And now, looking into the salary laws in my state, I’m realizing that this isn’t even legal, so I really do hope they changed this. At some point I should ask her about it, since I haven’t heard an update from her in awhile.

        Back when I was also a music teacher I worked at a couple of community music schools that only paid monthly and even that was hard, but luckily for me their schedules were somewhat staggered so I was still getting some money every couple of weeks. Man, I do not miss that one bit. And this probably isn’t legal in my state anymore either, if it even was at the time 20 years ago.

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      2. 10 years freelancing*

        Strong +1 to both of these! I work with a WIDE range of clients and offer sliding discounts for full up-front payment or 50% deposits, which benefits smaller clients who jump at the chance for a “bargain” even though I secretly think of that as my base rate. It keeps things affordable for them, and the big companies don’t blink twice at a 10-15% markup, especially when I present it as my undiscounted base rate even though it’s functionally the same thing.

        That changes the dynamic from “their processes are costing me money” to “for clients in this category, I charge X rate to reflect the long remit period.” It doesn’t matter whether there are legitimate admin reasons or not; I literally don’t care. The effect on me and my income flow is the same, so I adjust accordingly.

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      3. SK*

        I was going to come in to say a similar thing – you hit the nail right on the head with this advice. The easiest way to address the lag time is to increase the fee to incorporate the loss. We factored in the cost of interest on our line of credit and also implemented the discount for prompt payments where it was feasable.

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        1. I Have RBF*

          Exactly.

          If their long payment lead time makes you have to take out loans, then include the cost of servicing that period that you have to float them into your fees. (EG your base rate plus three months interest, and round up for processing time.)

          They want to play the float, you make them pay the float.

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      4. Thin Mints didn't make me thin*

        yeah, definitely boost your rates for this. (I don’t recommend calling it a “PITA charge” on the invoice, but you can definitely do it in your head.)

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    2. Also bad at names for these things*

      I work for a government that has a slow slow payment process and agree with this advice. We aren’t trying to do anything clever with interest, we just have a long review process with many steps. We will 100% reliably pay eventually though, which isn’t true for some private clients in the industry. I assume people build this time cost into their rates. I tell vendors the best thing they can do to speed it up is to give me very clear and correct invoices so no one along the review chain has questions or needs to decipher the invoice. You would be surprised how much I get confusing, incomplete, or incorrect invoices.

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    3. Elara Harper*

      I disagree. You can make clients change their payment preference. I’ve been doing freelance work for 3 years. My contract says 12% interest accruing after 14 days, each invoice says that as well. I bill on the 1st and the 15th generally. My contract also indicates non-payment per the terms will result in contract cancellation. If a client accepts that contract, I don’t care what their usual practice is. If they don’t pay by day 20, they get a new invoice with the interest added. I’ve never had to enforce it beyond that, but the next step would be my notice of cancellation. I don’t work for free.

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      1. Pescadero*

        That is the thing – big businesses with rigid payment structures… just won’t accept that contract.

        You’ll agree to their payment terms, or they just won’t hire you.

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  6. OatLatte*

    #4 – As Alison mentioned, big businesses are more happy to walk away when something is not on their terms. I am the contracts manager of a much smaller company, and its hard internally to get something paid on time, too.
    The only way I’ve seen us pay on the suppliers terms is when we have explicitly been told that we will lose a date (for an event booking), or they won’t start the work (for a consultant). Otherwise its – too bad so sad, this is our SLA.

    Depending on how business crucial your work is, maybe if you could tell you contacts that, in future, you can’t start working until a deposit is paid.
    If your work is cyclical, you could build that in to each invoice – a 20% invoice for the 90 days, and 80% for work completed in the previous 90 days.
    That way you have a supporter on the inside who can ask Beth Anne in accounts payable directly, opposed to you emailing a generic email address and hoping for the best. But I’ve also seen us kindly part ways with a supplier that we couldn’t agree with over terms, so its tough!

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  7. ZucchiniBikini*

    #4 This used to be a big problem for me (I’m freelance, in Australia). It has improved significantly since a policy change at government level in 2020 led to a requirement that all public agencies and publicly-funded bodies (which includes our 39 public universities, which is my biggest client base) must pay the invoices of sole traders within 21 days of receipt. It’s been such a massive relief, and now I only have one private sector client who drags their feet, all my university and government clients pony up quickly.

    Before this, I had the best success with a retainer model (requiring 20% of the job price, or 15 hours of labour at my going rate if the client wanted an hourly payment basis, upfront) rather than trying to get anyone to honour my 30-day payment terms. I tried and tried to get 30 days built into agreements and it very rarely worked, but a lot of clients did have flexibility to pay a retainer, and that at least meant I was getting some money in a timely fashion. However, that worked for me because almost all of my projects are medium-term engagements which require 70-100+ hours of labour spread over months, rather than micro-jobs of a day or two in length. I don’t think it would work as well with more piece work style freelancing.

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    1. Freya*

      I looooove that policy (I helped test the e-invoicing system for a client’s Defence clients, ironing out the bugs, early on in the implementation). I was Very Pleased when they expanded the system to cover all new contracts (early on, it was limited to contracts under $1 million, for a variety of reasons including making sure smaller businesses to whom it would make more of a difference got prioritised) and it’s a very big factor in why one of the first questions I ask when I make contact with the contract management for a new project is: are you ok with us using e-invoicing. I want those automatic 5 day payment terms!

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    2. Fiorinda*

      Wow. This is the first time I’ve heard of that policy change, and I’m pretty sure none of the public universities I’ve invoiced as a sole trader since 2020 have heard of it either: most flatly refuse to pay before 30 days from receipt of invoice; some take a minimum of 45 days from receipt of invoice to pay; and one pays on the last day of the month following the month in which the invoice was received. Could you give me the name of the policy so I can wave it at them and see if it changes anything?

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      1. Your Local Password Resetter*

        Freya was talking about the “Supplier Pay On Time Or Pay Interest Policy” a few comments up, that may be the one they’re referring to.

        Reply ↓
      2. ZucchiniBikini*

        That’s disappointing, Fiorinda. I have worked with 9 different universities since 2020 (currently working with three) and all 9 have implemented this payment policy. One of my current ones, in fact, pays me in 7 days (although the other two do not!)

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        1. ZucchiniBikini*

          And yes, it the policy mentioned by Freya upthread. And it does apply to universities that receive government funding, as they are NCEs (although some might argue the toss on that). However, it has clearly been inconsistently implemented sector-wide. Given your earlier comment, I think I may know one of the universities you are dealing with, because I know they still have a published policy stating that they pay on the last day of the following month. However, I’m also personally aware of several freelancers who have successfully pushed back on that (not sure if it was because they cited the Supplier Pay on Time Policy, or through some other mechanism).

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  8. there are chickens in the trees*

    OP #4, this is a large part of why I got out of free-lancing more than a decade ago. I was spending one-third of my time getting new projects, one-third of the time actually doing the work, and one-third of the time trying to get paid.

    And be careful of those 90 day periods – some companies (not in the US) start the clock when they receive your invoice, not when you submit it. So you also need to get confirmation that they actually received it; otherwise this can add even more time until you finally get paid.

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  9. Catn b*

    #3 Charge what you would require to be fairly compensated when paid at 90 days but include a discount for payment at 30 days – that way your clients with system flexibility will be incentivised to pay on time but you don’t miss out if they don’t.

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    2. KateM*

      You mean that OP would add the lost intererest it would accrue to their bill, and would take it off for those who pay within 30 days? (Not saying that out loud, of course.)

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    3. MJ*

      I was going to suggest something similar – just make sure you increase your base rate so you don’t get penalised when people pay promptly. Eg if you usually charge $500 per day, raise it to $600. And offer a 20% discount for payment within 30 days. Means it’s a win-win for you – you either get your usual rate paid on time, or extra if they’re late.

      I did this for one client who was persistently late and slow, and it worked.

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    4. Emmy Noether*

      This is a very common and traditional practice in Germany (it’s called “Skonto” – interestingly there doesn’t seem to be a specific English word, it just gets translated as “discount”). Usually about 2-3% discount for paying within 30 days.

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    5. bamcheeks*

      I think this is the way to go! Basically it’s the same as adding a late charge, but you quote the higher figure as your standard rate.

      The risk of this is that they baulk at your higher rate, but since the large institutions that have inflexible payment systems tend to be much less price-sensitive anyway. I work in an organisation with an overall budget of around £1b and the reason we have inflexible systems is because there is an absolutely ludicrous amount of admin involved to track money and budgets through a large organisation: our aim is to try and minimise the cost and amount of internal staff time it takes to get payments into the organisation and out again.

      Getting the system to flex and pay in less time than usual: incredibly hard. Adding an extra 20% for late payment: almost certainly impossible. Raising a purchase order for £6000 instead of £5000 in the first place: almost completely frictionless.

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    6. Insert Clever Name Here*

      OP 4, I work in supply chain management at a large company and I think this is the way to go assuming they offer no other payment terms. Other things to be aware of/think about:

      – it sounds like your payment terms are Net 90 Days, meaning invoices are paid 90 days after they are received by the company. Even if your contract specifies lump sum payments based on a milestone schedule, that payment would be 90 days after the invoice is received.
      – do you have a formal, negotiated contract with the company? It should specify the payment terms, and that is the place to change it. The payment term you put on your invoice is irrelevant because if it’s different from your contract, the term in your contract controls. Same thing with late fees — if I didn’t agree to late fees when we were negotiating, they will be ignored on the invoice by AP because our contract states “no other fees beyond those stated herein.” I often have suppliers upset that their invoice isn’t paid in 30 days and have to remind them that they were given the option of several payment terms and choose Net 45 days!
      – assuming you have a contract, talk to the person who issued it about the difficulties a 90 day invoice cycle is causing your cash flow and see what other payment terms are available. If you don’t have a formal contract, talk to whoever contacts you for you to provide work and ask them if there’s a way to change the payment terms. My company’s standard is Net 45 but we also offer shorter payment terms in return for a discount on a sliding scale (like what Emmy Noether mentioned). We legitimately want to do what we can to support our small suppliers, so it’s worth asking.

      And my standard message to everyone: for the love of baby pandas, read your contracts! The contract is there to specify the rules of engagement and what will happen when things go sideways. If it’s not in the contract, don’t expect it to happen.

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  10. Kella*

    OP4: Could you either add a late fee to invoices that aren’t going to be paid off within your preferred period or offer a “discount” for paying the invoice off by a certain cut-off? That way, if the company does have wiggle room on when to pay, they can make that a priority, but if that’s not actually in their control, you still get compensated for the extra hassle. I think if that’s not an option, you just need to plan around the assumption that working on one of their projects in April goes toward your July budget.

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    1. Lemons*

      It sounds like in this case, the payment timing is company policy/probably in the contract, so charging a late fee at day 31 when you agreed to work with a net-90 company doesn’t work.

      I agree that LW4 needs to rearrange their budget to work with the timing, I do this and genuinely forget about the net-60/90 payments because I’m too busy hustling to cover the perceived deficit in income, so it’s like a lil treat when those payments finally come in.

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  11. Jeam*

    for #4 personally at my job after thirty days have passed and there’s no payment I start sending reminders every week… sometimes being annoying pays off I think. although we really only have a few ‘problem’ clients

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    1. amoeba*

      I though the problem was the actual contracts that state a payment goal of 90 days? Not sure how sending reminders two months before that date would help there once you’ve signed that – I’d say it’s necessary to negotiate different contracts from the start.

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  12. PurpleCattledog*

    I disagree on LW1 – it’s not reasonable to find a man’s partner selfish for asserting themselves as an equal in their relationship! I wonder if there’s bias at play and you’d be taking the same view of the manager if they were female?

    It’s reasonable to be concerned of the impact on you, I’d even get being annoyed that your boss is not sacrificing their career/life for your benefit (so long as you recognised that was completely unreasonable). But the impacts on you are not the partner’s fault. Why should they have to move over your manager moving? Their preferences for their life and career are every bit as important as your manager’s!

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    1. amoeba*

      Yup. People don’t choose where they live just based on what job they have – there are so many viable reasons for somebody not wanting to move away from/to a particular place! (Especially in the US at the moment, I imagine… Don’t want to speculate but, for instance, if the company is located in a pretty red area, that would be a *very* understandable reason not to move there. But so are a million other things – maybe the partner is really passionate about their local community theatre, maybe they have family in the area that they care for, maybe they just prefer the weather! Honestly, either way, it’s their choice!)

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      1. Bunny Girl*

        That was my first thought! There’s a ton of states right now that I, a queer female scientist, would absolutely not step foot in for love or money. A little empathy goes a long way.

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    2. Emmy Noether*

      I also wondered how much it’s the partner that doesn’t want to move, and how much is they discussed it and both prefer the partner’s city (maybe it’s a nicer place to live?). It’s impossible to really know that kind of thing from outside a relationship. Even if manager said something like “Oh, Alex doesn’t want to move here”, that’s probably not be the whole truth. And either way, manager wasn’t kidnapped. He decided this, and it’s wrong to blame anyone else.

      Not that it matters, anyway. Being bitter about the cause of this won’t make anything better.

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      1. Sloanicota*

        Yeah, honestly since OP is getting everything second hand, it’s better to let all that go … I find that nobody can understands the intricacies inside someone else’s relationship no matter *how* close you are. And plenty of people blame their spouses for things in conversation even when really it’s a lot more complicated.

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    3. mm*

      Right. I’m sorry LW1 is concerned about their own situation. But I do not like the implication they have that this partner is forcing anything. You don’t know what the conversations were and why the decision was made the way it was. Was LW1 privy to those moments? Did the manager openly complain and show resentment for his partner? There could be a million reasons why manager is moving…maybe renting/owning, family, taxes. Long distance is tough and closing it is always the goal. Sorry LW1 but this is not unreasonable

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      1. amoeba*

        Yup. I mean, I’m also in a long-distance relationship and I’m the one who doesn’t want to move to my partner’s area/country, even though I could probably pretty easily find a job there and it would make sense on paper. For the very simple reason that I don’t like that place and would be unhappy there, and that’s valid as well!

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    4. AvonLady Barksdale*

      I 100% agree with this. This is NOT understandable nor reasonable. Concerned that a new manager might change things? Sure. Sad your boss is going? Absolutely. But blaming his partner? Come on. Ultimately it doesn’t matter why your boss is leaving, and it certainly doesn’t matter if he’s moving to another state. The impact would be the same if he simply took another job. Assuming your boss has no agency is a pretty big and, frankly, rather unfair leap. I moved cities twice for my partner so I’m a little biased here, but even when I wasn’t thrilled about certain things it didn’t mean I was forced into it.

      Focus your energy into getting your accommodations in order, or in organizing your approach to a new manager, or into writing your boss a nice note about how much you appreciate him and how you wish him luck in his next endeavor because treating this as if his move punishes you is really unkind to someone who also has a lot to deal with right now.

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      1. Sloanicota*

        Yeah, but also – I feel like there’s a subtlety here that’s important. I sometimes struggle with thoughts and feelings that aren’t rational or “good.” However, lumping a bunch of shame/guilt on them, or being angry at myself for having thoughts or feelings I “shouldn’t” have, has never done much to help me move through them. You have to have compassion for yourself, realize the deeper need/anxiety driving these thoughts, and let yourself feel it to work through it sometimes. Which is basically what’s in the advice given.

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        1. bamcheeks*

          I’m so with you on this. It’s true that resenting their boss’s partner isn’t productive, but it is also essentially harmless, and maybe it plays a useful role for LW. Sometimes externalising our hurt, fear or anger onto someone we can’t harm helps us recognise the pain, and sometimes it helps us treat the people in our more immediate vicinity more kindly! As long as you aren’t planning on acting on it, I would just acknowledge that that’s how you feel and let yourself move on to figuring out whether there is anything useful you can do to make the future feel safer. And if there isn’t, I’m so sorry. It’s a bad time to feel vulnerable and I don’t blame you.

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          1. MsM*

            I don’t know. I think blaming the partner is depriving OP of the opportunity to take agency here. Not just in terms of making a plan while Boss is still here for how to protect their accommodations, but they don’t even really seem to like this job; they’re just terrified there’s nothing better out there. Maybe instead of panicking, they should use this as an opportunity to start a search of their own before they feel forced into it.

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          2. mm*

            It’s not harmless. It harms LW1 because she is storing resentment for a unrelated 3rd party rather than using her own emotional resources to make her situation better. It’s not good for the manager or his partner, because stuff like this does come through. And maybe this is speculation but my hunch is that manager and partner are both queer men or queer of some sort. And LW’s resentment is stripping them of the agency to build their life and family as they please in the place they please. She might not be stopping them but she’s also not seeing the larger cultural context of LGBTQ relationships

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          3. Workerbee*

            Key word there: “Sometimes.”

            OP #1 needs to take responsibility for their feelings, which are misplaced even if they’re somehow entitled to them.

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          4. Kate*

            I’m married to an academic and after many years of uprooting my career and social life for him to pursue this dream, we’ve decided – together – to move home. His colleagues and mentees are understandably sad to lose his expertise. But the thought that they would blame *me* for that decision is pretty infuriating. I don’t agree that it’s harmless, especially of the OP is communicating with colleagues in ways that show their resentment. It contributes to a really toxic workplace culture in which having obligations outside of work – family, community, or even health needs or disabilities like the OP has – is seen as a liability.

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        2. A*

          So I agree that shaming or guilting people who are feeling things they “shouldn’t” feel doesn’t really help those feelings go away. The LW deserves to have compassion for themselves and deserves to work through these feelings.

          I just think where, when, and how the LW works on those feelings really matters in this situation. The LW needs to find a place to work on this that is not work. The LW’s boss doesn’t deserve to be the LW’s teaching lesson. I’m not sure if I am articulating myself well but it sort of feels like the LW has these deeper needs and anxieties and the boss is where they are workshopping that. The boss is a whole person, the boss is not somebody who exists as a foil for the LW to tackle their deeper needs.

          The LW deserves compassion. The boss deserves compassion. The boss’ spouse deserves compassion.

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          1. Dust Bunny*

            Yeah, I think this is what’s making me uncomfortable about this letter.

            I was bummed when my longtime manager retired, but I wasn’t resentful. It’s not appropriate to be this invested in or dependent on one person to make your work life (or most other aspects of your life, really) workable. The LW doesn’t own the manager.

            I don’t know if this means the accommodations offered were minimal and precarious, or if the LW arranged them mostly through the manager to avoid having to go through HR, or if the LW doesn’t have a good enough overall support system and the boss has become support to a degree that isn’t really OK at work, or what, but I think something has gone out of balance.

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          2. lunchtime caller*

            Even a hint of “your partner is so selfish for making you move when I need you here” coming through in the workplace would be SO weird and uncomfortable when the LW needs to be focusing on all the work solutions that have been recommended here

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          3. Diana*

            Nahh, LW is an adult and this isn’t a mature way of processing the situation. Their boss and his partner get to decide what works best for their lives and they are not selfish for doing so. I feel for the LW that they are unhappy about losing a boss they like, but their letter is childish. They are not part of this couple and it’s insane for them to believe that their wants should trump what works best for the actual people involved.

            I truly could have sympathy if they were worried about what is going to happen with their work situation, but to go off saying that the boss’s partner is selfish is where they lost me. They didn’t even ask any questions, they just wanted to complain.

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      2. Dinwar*

        “This is NOT understandable nor reasonable.”

        It’s understandable, but not reasonable.

        The LW is treating the event as a threat situation, for valid reasons. And when people are threatened, some tend to lash out. And the LW opted to blame the person responsible for creating the situation, which is better than a lot of people would do! This is a perfectly normal human reaction to such a situation.

        The problem is, it’s not reasonable. One cannot expect others to build their lives to suit one’s preferences. Nor can you expect your manager–who’s relationship with you is tenuous at the best of times–to build their personal life to suit your preferences, or even needs. It’s Main Character Syndrome, and is extremely unreasonable.

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        1. lunchtime caller*

          “And the LW opted to blame the person responsible for creating the situation, which is better than a lot of people would do!” We don’t actually know that’s the case at all though, the LW has just decided that the person they’re blaming is responsible. I think it’s important to break down that assumption since it’s where all these “they’re selfish!!” thoughts are coming from–maybe the boss actually would like to move!

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          1. Dinwar*

            I don’t think I was clear. I’m not saying the manager’s spouse did anything wrong; they have zero obligation to build their life to suit the LW. The spouse was the cause of the events, though. Most people I’ve met at least would have lashed out the manager if they were going to lash out at anyone.

            And I’m not saying this is a good attitude. It’s not. But a lot of normal human reactions are not great. I think it’s important to recognize that, and not be overly harsh with folks for behaving like normal humans.

            “I think it’s important to break down that assumption since it’s where all these “they’re selfish!!” thoughts are coming from–maybe the boss actually would like to move!”

            I doubt that much thought went into it. The LW seems focused entirely on what this move will do to them. The rest seems to be fanfic built up to support their conflicting emotional needs–the need for safety, manifest in the desire for the manager to remain, and the need to lash out, manifest in the spouse being the villain in the narrative the LW developed.

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    5. Dust Bunny*

      The bottom line is that the partner, the manager’s relationship dynamic, and their personal decisions have nothing at all to do with the LW and are not the LW’s business, and if the only thing making the LW’s job bearable is the manager’s intervention, that’s the bigger problem.

      I can’t tell from the way this is written if the LW got some accommodations through HR and the manager sort of granted more of them on his own, or if the LW primarily went through the manager to get accommodations because the manager was more approachable, and HR may or may not be in on some of the process, and now that Manager is leaving LW is going to have to make things more official and isn’t happy about it. But it wasn’t fair or reasonable to depend on the manager never, ever leaving.

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    6. toolegittoresign*

      I sense some red flags here in terms of how emotionally invested LW is in their manager. It feels like manager perhaps gave a bit too much explanation of why they were leaving, and that perhaps this is because the manager was concerned about how LW would react. LW’s mention of not being interested in the manager romantically is a bit beside the point — you can get too emotionally attached to people even if you don’t want to date them. The boundaries here feel blurry.

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    8. biobotb*

      Yeah. I get the LW’s fear about what their next manager may be like. I understand being frustrated that the boss’s partner won’t move, but considering the partner *selfish* for not rearranging their whole life to accommodate their partner’s employee? What?

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  13. LifebeforeCorona*

    #4 I work at a very large institution that has a 60 day billing cycle because “it’s always been that way.” As a result we have lost small vendors and contractors who can’t or refuse to wait 60 days for payments. It might be small potatoes for the Big Institution but it has a real cost to small businesses. There are fewer and fewer vendors willing to accept those terms. In these times of electronic banking and so many payment options, it’s very frustrating to wait 2 months for a cheque to be put in the mail. There is a real perception that we’re out of touch and it’s affecting our reputation in a no so good way.

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    1. Resident Catholicville, U.S.A.*

      One of our customers, a Very Big Corporation, wants to change our terms from 90 days to 120 days. It’s mind boggling. And they use a third party vendor to pay and that third party vendor charges us fees, so we have to increase the price to the customer to counter act those fees.

      I’ve found that the larger the company, the longer it takes them to pay, partly because of bureaucracy, partly because of lack of empathy for smaller businesses, etc. Smaller companies tend to have the same issue and will pay very promptly for this reason.

      We’ve implemented measures such as moving as many companies over to ACH (quicker turn around, less chance of checks lost in the mail); raising prices on companies that take longer to pay; offering a discount for payment in 10 days or less; and just being a real pain in the butt if late payments become standard. When I took over the AR/collections role, I basically had to train our customers that no, I wasn’t going to put up with bullshit and eventually, most got in line with terms and pay promptly. Now, it’s to the point that some pay early, most on time, and the few that pay late I just know it’s a thing and I’m going to have keep on top of them.

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      1. Resident Catholicville, U.S.A.*

        Oh, and, I track when and how each customer pays. So, if I know they pay on Mondays, I don’t bother them on a Thursday if I know it’s not going to be issued until the next Monday. Giving the customers some grace and then acknowledging their systems when you email them shows you’re working with them and not setting expectations that they can’t reach.

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    2. Jax*

      Even as I read the question this morning I was thinking about whether I want to devote today and tomorrow on a project for a company — or if the math isn’t mathing anymore. If I submit it next week, the earliest I can file an invoice under their system is May 1 and I likely will not be paid for this until almost August. Technically the pay is darn good but it’s a diminishing returns thing. A cost-benefit thing.

      Seriously. I could be better off working two 2-3 shifts waiting tables in that timeframe and have at least cash in pocket. Or I could spend those two days networking for a salaried job. I mean, this is what was going through my mind. The thing is, I worked for this company for years and what they pay me for now is my name in the field, the draw it still has, so they contract with me.

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  14. amoeba*

    OP4: Yeeeeah, that’s unfortunately pretty common with large companies – we (30k employees) are exactly the same, plus apparently also often late with payments. It sucks and it definitely sucks for us as well, because obviously it’s pretty embarrassing when vendors start complaining to us because they didn’t get paid on time. And we have zero influence on how it’s handled, obviously.
    That said, at least for us, there is room for negotiation – the payments department will always push for 90 days, but if you told me that doesn’t work for you, I would absolutely try to get that changed, and I know it’s possible in general – they just prefer not to! I’ve also had contracts approved that required a 25 or even 50% pre-payment, and other modifications. So it absolutely could be worth reaching out to your contacts at those companies and see if they can get something changed on your behalf.

    Otherwise, could you just add a 10% or whatever fee on top? Sadly, I believe my company wouldn’t bat an eye about a 10% higher price (they don’t really know what the things I try to buy cost, they also don’t care, they just make the payment conditions and that’s it!) It would still be stressful, but at least you wouldn’t be losing money anymore…

    Or phrase it the other way round – make your prices 10% higher and then offer a “discount” for companies who pay within 30 days?

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    1. Lokifan*

      DEFINITELY the other way. I’m in the UK and a lawyer told me when I was a freelancer that late fees often can’t be enforced (even when they’re in the contract) but discounts for “early” payment can, because they’re offering benefits to both sides instead of only one.

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  15. DJ Abbott*

    #1, it sounds like you see your current job as having less prestige or importance than your previous job, because you refer to it as being lower caliber.
    Maybe it would help to realize that with a tiny number of exceptions, all jobs are important. If no one was doing your current job, how would that affect individuals? The community? And society? Your job is an important part of all these things.
    IMO It’s never good to be measuring yourself or your jobs in terms of prestige or caliber. Then you’re always in a state of feeling inferior in some ways and superior in others. Just be who you are and do what you do to the best of your ability. Don’t let people who see themselves as superior affect you.

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    1. Velleity*

      LW admits that she isn’t over that previous job loss, which was devastating, and that is where to start untangling the complicated emotions about her current situation. All jobs are important, but she wanted that job and now she has this one, and a supportive boss was her consolation prize. Now she feels as if that’s being taken away from her as well and she’s helpless to stop it.

      You’re not helpless, LW. History isn’t repeating itself. You can’t keep your boss from leaving, but you can take steps to protect your accommodations and work through the pain that’s leading you to blame his partner.

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  16. Helvetica*

    LW#1 reminds me of “the Iranian yogurt is not the issue here.”
    The issue is really your company not providing you with the accommodations you need (or you not trusting them to do so) and you have essentially relied on the kindness of your manager who is now leaving.
    His private life is not really your concern, and I don’t think you can confidently claim that the partner doesn’t want to move out of spite or what other motivations you are ascribing to them. People’s lives change all the time! The issue is your company’s overall lack of support, which you can address, as Alison points out.

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    1. Always Tired*

      Also, the manager is a grown man, with all the agency in life that implies. He’s making the decision to move. He has decided life with his partner is more important than his current job, which frankly is a pretty normal decision if you can afford it, in the grand scheme of things. Why is it this nebulous partner OP is upset with? She isn’t kidnapping or blackmailing him.

      Reply ↓
  17. Helvetica*

    As someone in a similar situation to LW#3, I would modify Alison’s script somewhat; I think the last sentence can be seen as being too much, so I’d leave it out. If you don’t want to go because you feel too anxious, that should be your decision and not something that your ex can veto, especially because it doesn’t seem like you did anything outrageous to them. I’d only use that sentence if the relationship had ended acrimoniously because of your actions but it doesn’t seem to have been the case.

    Reply ↓
  18. Snarky McSnarkerson*

    LW #4, I happen to work for one of those companies and they’ll take 120 days to pay if you let them. As one of the people who enter invoices to be paid, I’ve learned a few tricks. One of them is “adjusting” the invoice date. If you submit your invoices to a person or department, I encourage you to talk with them to see if they also have some tricks. Also, with these large companies you must have some kind of agreement, yes? Next time it’s due for renewal, don’t just sign the document they give you. Negotiate. Then when they don’t pay timely, you have something they agreed to and now they’re in breach of that contract. I recently got a small business consultant paid in less than 30 days!

    Reply ↓
    1. Aww, coffee, no*

      Seconding the advice about speaking to your local contact if you have one. I work for a large company with 120 day payment terms, and it drives me up the wall when we have a good supplier who can’t afford that sort of delay and has to refuse to supply us.
      I’ve had several phone calls (*nothing* in writing; I want to keep my job) where I’ve been able to quietly advise suppliers how they can potentially improve how long it takes to get paid.

      Reply ↓
  19. Bookworm*

    LW2: Definitely highlighting the last sentences of Alison’s response. Worked at a small organization with no HR (10 people) and while HR is not your friend, etc. it was a pretty terrible experience. Owner was a poor manager and I was eventually fired. Would HR have made a difference? I doubt it (not your friend and all that, etc.) as it was a terrible fit overall but in retrospect it might have made the offboarding a little easier to have someone to be competent in even that aspect. *eyeroll*

    Not all experiences are like that and hopefully this org isn’t. At least you know and it just might be good to keep in mind going forward.

    Reply ↓
    1. Not The Earliest Bird*

      One of the biggest reliefs of having my small company bought out by a large national company, was they took on all of the HR. We can refer all HR issues to them for guidance instead of trying to figure it out on our own, and possibly making legal mistakes with long reaching consequences.

      Reply ↓
      1. JustaTech*

        Yes! When my in-laws were selling their small business they were finally getting around to creating all the documentation they’d never gotten around to writing, and some of it was HR-like.
        They asked my husband and I to go over it (the whole of my qualification for that is that I read AAM!) and oh boy there were things in there that I even I knew were Not Legal. Not cruel or mean or unkind, but some of the ways things were phrased about paying out things I had to be like “uh, yeah, I’m pretty sure that’s not legal in your state, you need to check on that”.
        Thankfully everything got cleared up and they hadn’t been making serious mistakes, but they would have been *well* served to have some kind of HR consultant check on stuff years before.

        Reply ↓
  20. Benihana scene stealer*

    For #1, actually your boss leaving could be a blessing in disguise. It sounds like you are very dependent on him currently, and it doesn’t sound like a healthy situation if it’s brought you to the level of wanting him to split with his partner.

    Reply ↓
    1. juliebulie*

      That’s a good observation! I think #1 needs to take some steps towards feeling a little more independent. You don’t have to search for a new job in earnest, but at least prepare yourself for a move in case you need to. Maybe you’ll still feel yourself at the mercy of your new boss, but you’ll maybe have a little more confidence.

      One thing though, LW is dreading the new boss despite not knowing who it even is. LW, consider that you wouldn’t want the new boss to come in with the same negative expectations towards you that you have towards them. Give them a chance before expecting the worst.

      Reply ↓
      1. DJ Abbott*

        Yes, I’ve been mentally prepared to leave my job for three years now. I don’t really want to, but can if I have to.
        This gives me the confidence to stand up to the managers- one who gets judgy and critical when she’s anxious, and one who, well, I’ve posted about before.
        I’m doing my best and if that’s not good enough, they should fire me. They won’t find anyone who does a better job.

        Reply ↓
    2. Ellis Bell*

      I’m going to agree with this as something that should be a major takeaway for OP. There are times when I’ve gotten unhealthily enmeshed with a particular job, or a particular supervisor and sometimes you don’t even realise it, until a big change or reshuffle is occurring which reminds you it’s actually all just business really. I’m sure OP is aware that their feelings are a wake-up call and are looking to rebalance themselves, so these are my own personal grounding rules; one is that the head of the company, and it’s overall culture is always going to be way more important than any one manager or colleague. It’s true that individuals can have an absolutely huge effect on our happiness but people always leave! That’s always going to happen. Two is that your marketability and flexibility outside the job you currently have is always important insurance in case your company changes ownership, culture or has difficulties; always a possibility. The third one is that status is often fools gold, and high status fields can make you think in unhealthy ways about your own and other’s attachment to the work. You need to think more about your own personal happiness than about things like “caliber” and prestige (if that is what the OP meant). It sounds like OP is not giving themselves any credit for being able to flex into a completely different field in what sounds like a tricky situation. Instead of feeling pride in their ability to do that, OP is viewing it all as loss, and devastation. I don’t know what the next supervisor will be like, OP, but I hope they give you as much support, and maybe a bit less insight into their private life (as you know, that hasn’t actually been all that helpful; even if it was it true, which isn’t a given).

      Reply ↓
  21. Panda*

    Regarding #4, yes, many big companies do this and it’s annoying. I worked on vendor contracts and your payment period should be listed in the your Master Services Agreement. Often it’s the company’s standard turn around time of 90 days, but you can try to push back and insist on your normal 30 days. You may both have to compromise on 45 days.

    Reply ↓
  22. Keymaster of Gozer (she/her)*

    OP1: It often feels like we’ve lost all control of our lives when becoming disabled/having a disability get worse and latching onto a perceived constant is a coping mechanism. Having that pillar leave can feel personal, like how are we supposed to feel when the world just keeps kicking us in the teeth?

    This may not work but one way I’ve coped with this is to adopt a refrain of ‘just because the engine has cut out doesn’t mean the train can be stopped’ so I can keep plodding along. I can’t say it’s always successful (I attach myself to the weirdest things, like crying broken hearted when my car breaks down) but it can give me a breathing space to recalibrate the brain.

    Definitely get accomodations down in writing if you can though.

    Reply ↓
  23. Trying to Work Here*

    #5 – I hadn’t even noticed, but this loud talking/shouting used to be a problem when we first went back and has naturally, vastly improved. I think by people a) getting used to zoom calls in the office every other week and toning it down and b) getting used to booking meeting rooms again when we’re in office. Here’s hoping it improves for you too.

    Reply ↓
    1. Sloanicota*

      I recall this being a problem even back before covid, when some people just seem to have a preternaturally loud “phone voice.” I always felt bad asking them to tone it down since, I mean, they were doing *work,* it wasn’t like they were just chatting six inches from my cube like half my coworkers did, or playing little noise games with their tongue, or leaving their cell phone on vibrate/Max Jingle and then leaving the office, or …

      Reply ↓
      1. Paint N Drip*

        my boss is this person, just LOUD in the subconscious phone-quality-may-not-be-good not-shouting way – he has gotten better about closing his office door sometimes but I have to imagine everyone he’s talking to is cringing and turning down their volume

        Reply ↓
    2. Sloanicota*

      Another option, when I was at a *truly* open office – like, it was just one room with one big table we all sat around (shudder) – we had a rule that meetings had to be taken in one of the little glass telephone booths. I actually didn’t like this, it was a pain in the ass (and requires the right tech set up) and the booths were claustrophobic, but it’s a solution to the noise issue, and a company that has divided their space into Max Cubes may just be forced to invest in conference spaces.

      Reply ↓
      1. Craving Better Volume Control*

        I’m hoping it improves as well!!
        My concern is that these coworkers aren’t in the office on a “regular” basis as we are encouraged to travel to our suppliers. So I’m worried they’re not going to recognize how loud they are being because their time between office days can be significant. I’ll likely say something if it continues.

        We also have those phone booths and I hate them! Anyone larger than a “normal sized human” is claustrophobic in there. I’m a small person and crammed in those. It’s a solution, but not a great one.

        Reply ↓
        1. I should really pick a name*

          I’m worried they’re not going to recognize how loud they are being

          They won’t realize it if no one tells them.

          Assuming they’re not jerks, they wouldn’t be doing it if they thought it was a problem.

          Reply ↓
      2. Benihana scene stealer*

        When I worked in a place with an open office as you describe, those little glass phone booths were like an oasis :)

        Reply ↓
    3. lina*

      I’m one of those with a loud phone voice. In my case, it’s because I was trained in theater / projecting your voice from a podium or stage without a microphone. Somehow my brain has equated “person on the phone” with “person at the back of the audience”. I don’t even realize when I’m using that voice most of the time – I’ve made a conscious effort to tone down my phone voice, and I still slip back into it when I get excited about something I’m talking about! to me, that’s “phone normal”.

      Definitely address it with your coworker. “Hey coworker, I don’t know if you realize, but you project your voice quite a lot when you are on the phone – it can sometimes make it hard for me to be on my own calls, because my microphone picks up your voice. Would you mind trying to tone it down a little?”

      Reply ↓
        1. JustaTech*

          Yes! Somehow “projecting” sounds much less judgmental than “loud”. Maybe because I was taught to project in school, while school was also where we were told off for being loud.

          Reply ↓
    4. Forking Shirtballs*

      In addition to what everyone has said, I’m curious if the loud talkers are wearing headphones that cover both ears vs. one? I have a peer who is a self-aware loud talker, and one thing she found helpful was switching to headphones that only covered one ear. It increases her awareness of people and noise in the environment around her, so she’s more aware of the volume of her own voice. Whereas, when she has both ears covered, she doesn’t realize how loud she gets because she doesn’t have the same awareness of her surroundings. At least, that’s how she describes it. She also invites us to let her know when she’s being too loud.

      Reply ↓
  24. Alice*

    OP 5, check what you mic input it. If your computer is using the COMPUTER mic instead of the mic that is built in to your headphones or set set, that will probably be part of the problem.

    Reply ↓
  25. Lacey*

    LW4: I’ve seen a lot of advice for freelancers to charge more to larger corporations.

    Part of it is just that they’re going to be using your work more widely so it’s worth more.
    But part of it is to mitigate the late payments.

    I don’t know what type of work you do, but I know Jessica Hische sells a guide for freelance graphic designers and you can probably find a guide for whatever type of work you’re doing.

    Reply ↓
    1. SnowRose*

      Yup! We have our standard indirect rate that gets applied plus a separate administrative fee for my area. I don’t have a say over the indirect rate since it’s the association’s federally-approved rate, but I can and do adjust the administrative fee for the services my team provides. For smaller agencies, we often drop it altogether, but for larger and/or more complex agencies, we adjust it based off anticipated complications. The key thing is that it’s justifiable. We know that larger, more complex agencies are going to have scope creep that falls into a gray area in terms of contract, may take longer to pay, etc.

      Reply ↓
  26. Blue Pen*

    #2 — My experience working for companies/orgs without a dedicated HR department is not intended to be a blanket statement, but in addition to everything Alison said, I would also encourage you to think about the practical, on-the-ground translation of having no HR person to go to. If you have a conflict with a colleague or need to report some kind of nefarious activity, without HR, confidentiality (without the prospect of retaliation) is pretty much out the door.

    Again, I’m not saying it’s all bad; I’m sure there are places who have figured out how to operate smoothly. But in my experience, that hasn’t been the case at all, and I don’t think I would ever again work for an employer that didn’t have a dedicated HR team in place.

    Reply ↓
  27. ghostlight*

    LW5: At my previous job that I just left, I had a coworker who had no idea how loud she was. I mean, her voice was just constantly at a 10 on the volume scale and she loved to talk and ramble to anyone who walked by her. And this was All The Time, not just when she was on a call. I would always book a conference room if I had a call since she would get picked up by the mic (even though she was 5 cubicles down from me), and started wearing noise-cancelling headphones at my desk to focus on general work since her voice carried so much.

    Reply ↓
    1. Craving Better Volume Control*

      That sounds chaotic, and slightly similar to my situation. My peers on the call would immediately say “yeah I can’t hear you, whoever is sitting next to you is getting picked up instead”. And I would have to tell them that they are actually a good amount of desks away!

      I guess I’ll have to find a conference room for the more important meetings. I’m sometimes in back to back calls for hours at a time, so staying at my desk is the preferred option. Unfortunately might not be the case.

      Reply ↓
    2. Myrin*

      As a fellow loud person, I will never understand people like that – I’ve known since I was a child that I’m very likely to just by nature have the loudest voice out of everyone in any given situation. And since I don’t want to disturb and annoy people, I pay extra attention to it. I slip up all the time but generally catch myself pretty fast.
      You simply can’t tell me someone who is old enough to have an office job is oblivious to the fact that they are loud unless there was a recent change somewhere (like OP’s situation with the working-from-home, but also something like sudden hearing loss or a problem with their vocal cords, stuff like that).

      Reply ↓
  28. JP*

    For a while when I first started at this company, my boss in accounting was essentially the head of HR, which basically meant we had no functional HR. It was very unfortunate given that she was in desperate need of being reported to HR for her behavior. Luckily, the company grew and eventually hired a dedicated HR person. My boss was essentially forced to resign soon after. But man, those first few years where my head exploded a few times a week hearing the stuff coming out of her mouth were really something.

    Reply ↓
    1. Paint N Drip*

      This to me is the one big risk of that setup! It isn’t uncommon that someone can be entirely inappropriate and needing to be addressed with HR… and they are HR. Wild to experience it, and crazymaking

      Reply ↓
  29. Dr. Rebecca*

    #2: When I worked for a “family” small business with no HR what it meant was that they stonewalled my worker’s comp until I gave up, so…caveat emptor.

    #4: I’m amazed, actually. I’ve never seen a customer/buyer/purchaser who dictated their own payment terms. I worked in Accounts Payable for a while, and it was always the seller who set things to net 15/30/45 or whatever. I say stick to 30 days, and smack ’em with a late fee if they go over.

    Reply ↓
  30. Adventures in Grad School*

    #4 When I worked in consulting for a small business doing contracting we had the same problem. Once in awhile, if the payment was in breech of contract, we would issue a formal ‘stop work’ order. One thing I’m curious about – I heard a rumor that it behooves big companies to do this because they have large bank accounts where even small interest gains matter – so they wait until the last possible second to pay so that those accounts stay topped off. Had anyone else heard some version of this?

    Reply ↓
    1. Insert Clever Name Here*

      I’m in supply chain management for a large company — yes, it helps my company’s cash flow to have funds sitting in the bank (our standard payment term is Net 45 days). But it’s truly not a big deal for someone to ask for different payment terms; there’s a lot I can approve without having to involve anyone else and as long as I’m not doing like Net 3 days no one cares because there are enough other suppliers who just grumble about their 45-day payment terms but don’t ask for anything different!

      Reply ↓
  31. MissouriGirl in LA*

    LW5-We have a person in our office who is extremely loud. Even with my door closed and their door closed, you can hear them. Even people on the other side of the office can hear them. This person walks down the hall with their speaker on.

    Despite this, the one thing that irks me more than anything is when you walk past their office, they will call your name. I’ve threatened to give them some candy, so if I’m “summoned”, I’ll at least get a treat (I participate in dog sports as a hobby).

    The bigger problem is that this person is the CEO’s ” favorite.” And yes, this begs a bigger issue within our agency.

    Reply ↓
  32. Sally*

    LW#2, I worked at a small company w no HR and there were too many ridiculous things that were allowed such as hiring 2 pairs of sisters, a couple of best friends, and 2 sets of mother/daughter. There was always an implied threat that disciplining one of the best friends would result in both quitting. One mother supervised her own daughter and the other mother reported to her own daughter. During the summers, the president and the manager would hire their respective children to help out with certain projects. No one was held accountable. Not fun.

    Reply ↓
  33. Small biz employee*

    OP #2: I work at a 10-person business with ‘no hr’ that works a lot like Alison said– our COO handles most administrative stuff (employment paperwork, travel reimbursement, maternity leave), our CEO and COO jointly handle performance/policy concerns, and our benefits/payroll are handled by an outside company; I think the outside company technically also has an avenue for reporting stuff like harassment if you didn’t want to report it to our COO. Some stuff to ask might include the specifics of how benefits are handled for things like enrolling in optional coverage (and employees’ take on how well that works), what the reporting structure is for concerns about things like harassment. I think you can frame it with a question like “I’m coming from a bigger org, so I was wondering about how you handle things that would run through HR is a larger company, both for things that are pretty routine, like health insurance or maternity leave, and for things that hopefully will never be an issue, like serious performance concerns or reporting harassment.” The specifics may matter less than them having some kind of policy/process/plan in place (versus ‘hunh, we’ve never considered what we’d do if we got a harassment complaint’ or ‘we’d never have to worry about something like that happening because we’re like faaaaaaamily’)

    Reply ↓
  34. The Tin Man*

    LW#4 I am not at all surprised that the largest companies are the ones with the longest payment terms. I work for a large company that does that, and it is 100% to help our cash position. There is a regular push to get customers to pay on shortest terms possible and to pay suppliers in the longest terms possible. We also just do not pay late fees, period. It requires CFO-level approval to do non-standard payment terms for a supplier so that only happens if the supplier has specific leverage or if the supplier has an advocate in our business.

    Reply ↓
  35. Resume Please*

    #5 – I’m in a similar boat. Open office space + people who have been remote for years having to suddenly adjust to each other. Just yesterday, I had to deal with a VERY LOUD phone talker, who wasn’t even sitting that close to anyone. She’d be told to quiet down, she’d do it for a couple of sentences…then it would slowly ramp back up again. This was repeated at least three times.

    I can’t offer any solutions, but I can commiserate!

    Reply ↓
    1. Office Plant Queen*

      Some people also just have loud voices. My spouse was one of them and the only thing that fixed the problem was moving from a cube to an office.

      The problem is also worse if someone is on meetings all day vs doing a lot of independent work. Someone whose schedule is regularly packed with meetings should really have an office regardless of seniority. Unfortunately that’s not usually how it works!

      Reply ↓
    2. ScruffyInternHerder*

      Complete commiseration and sympathy here. We moved into a new space. From offices to small cubicles. We’ve made suggestions which have been shot down due to *reasons* (aesthetics, costs, “but then everyone will want an office”, whatever), including everything that was suggested in the response by Alison. Our management is sympathetic but there’s another layer above them that has been shooting down every single suggestion made while emphasizing “but collaboration!”. What I do is 90% independent, high concentration necessary work, 10% collaboration of some sort. Of that 10%, probably half that time is spent active ON the phone, meaning we all get to listen to each other on the phone and try to not be jerks to each other.

      So I’m now at “completely malicious compliance”. I literally belted a “you need to modulate your voice or go elsewhere” at a coworker who was screaming during a meeting. Best part? He’s not even in my department! (On top of the rest of it, they mashed departments together in the worst possible ways!)

      Management has almost come to the realization and point that the space just doesn’t work. Almost. They can see the point and they’re almost there. No idea how long its going to take for the upper management (the ones currently shooting down everything) to come to terms that this grand vision doesn’t work.

      Reply ↓
    3. Marion Ravenwood*

      Not at work, but a social group I’m involved in recently got into a very heated discussion about this topic (essentially people participating in certain activities as part of the group being Overly Loud), and the cycle of people being told to be quieter, doing so for a few minutes and then Gradually Getting Louder Again was a big part of the issue. It still hasn’t been resolved, so I also have no solutions for LW5 but I can definitely sympathise!

      Reply ↓
  36. Jennifer Strange*

    #1 I am really sorry you’re dealing with this, but I want to gently point out that you don’t actually know the details of why your boss has chosen to move to his partner rather than his partner moving to him. Just because they work from home doesn’t mean they can uproot their life to move to your area. There could be so many other factors at play (including the possibility that they have a disability of their own!).

    Rather than spend your energy on being angry at his partner, take the time to talk with him about how you can best prep yourself for his replacement. I would document any accommodations your current boss has made for you, make sure you’ve got information about ADA requirements/contacts handy, and (most importantly) try to go into your meeting with your new boss with optimism. I know that might seem hard, but if you immediately go on the defense with them before they’ve had the opportunity to prove themselves it will likely be harder to convince them to give you the same support/grace your previous boss did.

    Good luck!

    Reply ↓
    1. juliebulie*

      I just wrote a whole thing about approaching the new boss with an open mind but I think you said it better. I realize LW has good reasons for being wary of someone new, but dwelling on how bad this person might be (based on previous experience) sets the stage for a possibly needlessly adversarial relationship.

      Reply ↓
    2. Office Plant Queen*

      I was thinking the LW should also talk with their boss about what the process will look like for hiring a replacement. Does the company do interviews with the people someone would be managing? Because if so, LW might be able to be part of the interview process. And if not, can LW’s current boss have a conversation with their boss about making sure the ability to support disabled employees is part of the interview criteria?

      Reply ↓
  37. E*

    LW3, totally understand the icky feelings of dredging up the past. I agree with Alison’s overall approach but I’d tweak some of the language she suggests to be less tiptoe-y with your ex, both to not give up your power (which might make you feel resentful or regretful later) nor inadvertently offend him by making too big a deal. I’d do Something more like this, pretty similar but slightly more direct/assertive while still considerate/giving him a chance to voice concerns

    “Hi Artexerxes! I know it’s been many years since we’ve talked and I hope you’re doing well. I’m writing because an employee at CompanyName has invited my team to pitch for (project type). I’m planning to be part of the proposal/pitch meeting, any proposal for working together, but wanted to check in with you first to let you know, and see if you had any concerns.”

    Reply ↓
    1. Bike Walk Bake Books*

      I like this. I was thinking that if it’s been 20 years and LW is still at “running out the back door of a bar” level of avoidance, they may be giving this a lot more energy than the ex. This is a chance to reset to a polite professional accommodation of each other’s existence in the world and put down the history they’re carrying around.

      Reply ↓
      1. Letter Writer #3*

        Alison edited some extraneous info out (rightly so!) – there was an incident where I did see him at a crowded happy hour with my coworkers, and quickly departed out the backdoor. It’s likely I give the entire mess WAY more energy than they do, which stems from how the relationship ended. I really appreciate you picking up on that because sometimes i still lack the tools to see the rational answer where this person is involved. The email is the way to go, but I don’t owe them anything, including forgoing a business opportunity. Thank you!

        Reply ↓
    2. Forrest Rhodes*

      I like your suggested wording, E, with one qualifier: I’d leave out the “check in with you first” part—to me, that sounds like OP is asking for Artexerxes’ permission to participate in the meeting.
      How about ending with: … but wanted to give you advance notice in case you have any concerns.”?
      That way OP is taking control—”I will be at this meeting; the advance notice is so you can sort out any problems you may have with that.”
      ??

      Reply ↓
  38. Benihana scene stealer*

    Not that OP 1 should be rooting for this but people do break up all the time. It’s not inconceivable that something could happen to change your boss’s plans. It’s doubtful but either way being as professional as possible and approaching the new boss with an open mind is the best strategy.

    Reply ↓
  39. Fluffy Fish*

    LW 1 – I totally get you are in your feelings right now. We aren’t often rational when we’re feeling emotional abotu a situations. But you’re feelings abotu the partner being to blame is off-base.

    Being in a relationship means you make decisions together. And yes that means one person’s preferences sometimes take precedence. But assuming no abuse and assuming all parties are competent mentally capable adults both partners are agreeing to the decision. A relationship isn’t a dictatorship.

    You have valid concerns, but there’s no blame to be assigned here.

    You also have agency! Sometimes we get stuck in a spot where we feel like things are being done to us and we don’t have control or options. You do! You can share your concerns with your manager – that might mean he plays a role in finding a replacement and trying to screen out bad fits or telling the person who will. You can talk to a therapist. You can pad your life outside work with good things as a little armor against unpleasant work places (ask me how I know). You can even brush off your resume and take a gander at what’s out there.

    Reply ↓
  40. Clarke*

    #2 – I actually disagree with part of the answer. In small enough organizations, no HR can mean that things like onboarding, investigations, coaching, and legal compliance *don’t* happen at all or don’t happen as well. Not saying it always happens by any means, but I have seen it happen more than once.
    There can also be a lack of clarity on where to take problems if they need to be escalated or involve a boss or a board member. OP, I’m super happy you’ve never needed to utilize HR before, but it can be challenging to have none when/if problems arise.

    Reply ↓
    1. JustaTech*

      At the same time (and not to disagree but to build on your comment) – this can happen when HR used to be competent but then something happened (people left and weren’t replaced, for example) and so everyone else *thinks* that HR will do onboarding and coaching and whatnot and “HR” is really just an unmonitored email.

      (I had several coworkers who I worked with for years before realizing that they’d never actually been properly onboarded because our HR had given up and their boss was oblivious. Like, all the payroll stuff happened, but none of the “welcome to the company, here’s a lot of basic info”.)

      Reply ↓
    1. Benihana scene stealer*

      I think LW 1 has serious problems apart from the boss leaving. I took at as kindness/sympathy rather than support of her position

      Reply ↓
    2. bamcheeks*

      Genuinely, why does it matter? It simply wouldn’t matter to me if a person I had never met and who had no impact on my life chose to make me the author of their misfortune entirely in their head. It’s not about me, it doesn’t affect me, I don’t care.

      Reply ↓
      1. A*

        I think it would be really hard for the LW to use their boss’ partner as a punching bag and keep that opinion safely contained at work for the remainder of the boss’ tenure at the organization.

        I would have an opinion of a direct report who hated my partner because I was moving.

        Reply ↓
      2. biobotb*

        I doubt it matters to the boss’s partner, but the LW’s mean-spirited focus on the partner as the arbiter of their future ills is not actually helping the LW. It would be better for them to give the partner grace and focus on what they can do with their boss’s help to set themselves well up for the future.

        Reply ↓
    3. Jennifer Strange*

      I don’t think anyone is saying the LW isn’t being irrational, but my guess (hope, maybe?) is that they wrote and sent this in a fit of fear and passion. Having a disability and not knowing if those above you are going to actually work with you on it can be a scary thing, especially as rights for all folks are being gutted at the moment. I think the LW is 100% wrong, but I don’t think there is anything wrong with extending them grace as well. Hopefully doing so will encourage them to do the same for their boss’ partner.

      Reply ↓
  42. Observer*

    #1- Worried about losing a supportive boss.

    I do sympathize with your concern. But I think that there is a piece that you really need to reframe a bit. That is your judgement of the partner. Calling them selfish makes no sense, since there is no sign that this is going to harm your manager.

    Keep in mind, the partner has no obligation to you (other than the standard stuff that humans owe each other.) So, any issue with their behavior could only come in relation to the behavior regarding the partner, to whom they do have an obligation to. Furthermore, if your manager is as good as you say, Partner does not even know that you / your issues exist. A good boss is not telling his partner about you and your issues, because that would be inappropriate.

    Keep in mind that just as the partner doesn’t see the impact of this on you, you have no idea what the background of this decision is. You cannot know the whole story regarding their decision to not move nor you boss’ decision to move to be with his partner.

    I get it – this does not change your fundamental problem! But I think it will be easier to figure out what your next steps are if you focus on the stuff you need to deal with and leave the judgements alone.

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  43. law*

    because his long-term partner lives in a different region of the country and refuses to move nearer to where he lives even though they work remotely.

    Yeah, that happens sometimes. Maybe that part of the country is not desirable in terms of career opportunities, cost of living, housing, weather, educational opportunities for children (if that’s something relevant to the LW’s boss and partner), etc etc. Maybe the partner just has a knee-jerk, irrational hatred of that state or region. For reasons too dumb to go into but relating to past family trauma, I will never live anywhere near the state of Alabama or within it (even if everyone in the state aligned with my political and ideological beliefs, the COL was obscenely low, healthcare and education were free for all in-state residents and their dependents, etc).

    But like, the LW’s boss’ partner gets to have preferences on where they live and the LW’s boss gets to decide the parameters of his relationship with his partner–including if that means leaving a job to move because long-distance relationships kind of suck over the long-term. You can’t help having feelings, LW, but your boss moving to be with his partner is sort of like Iranian yogurt–it’s not actually the issue here. The issue is that you need to focus on securing your accommodations at your current company, regardless of who your boss is. And that applies to any job you have anywhere. What if your boss were laid off tomorrow because of budget cuts? What if the whole company were acquired tomorrow? What if you suddenly were head-hunted for a much better job (in whatever way that means)? What if your boss wasn’t moving cross-country (or wherever) but randomly got a bug up his butt about supporting your accommodations for whatever reason?
    All of those scenarios would also affect your current accommodations but don’t have anything to do with your boss’ personal relationship dynamics.

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  44. Just a Pile of Oranges*

    #2: It was me (safety person) and the accountant who fulfilled the HR role at my last company. I handled onboarding and training and policy/legal, and she handled benefits and payroll and related items.

    The important thing isn’t really whether a company has HR, it’s whether they’ve appropriately assigned the responsibilities of HR to someone or several someones and most importantly, can tell you who to see for what. I’ve worked in companies where that wasn’t clear at all, which sucked because nothing got done. Though to be fair, in a sufficiently large and bureaucratic organization you can still have nothing getting done.

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  45. Peanut Hamper*

    #2: I just want to give my experience with this. I’ve seen small orgnizations where this was not an issue. But at my last job, I was effectively the HR (just one of many hats I wore at this <20 personnel company) and I was constantly telling my nepo-baby boss (who did not like being told "no") that he couldn't do this thing (i.e., telling employees they can't discuss pay and benefits with each other) because it was illegal, he couldn't do that thing (i.e., docking pay when people make mistakes) because it was illegal.

    I spent a lot of time trying to keep him from breaking the law and ending up on the receiving end of a lawsuit (which he would have no doubt ended up blaming on me). It was exhausting, and is part of the reason I no longer work there.

    But yes, this can work in some organizations where the boss is not a massively spoiled man-baby, but if you are concerned about it, I would definitely ask them about HR issues they've had in the past (such as having to let someone go, putting someone on a PIP, etc.) and how they've handled it. Don't be afraid to ask probing questions if this is a concern and possible deal-breaker for you.

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    1. Observer*

      The thing is that even with an official HR, these kinds of things happen when top management is bad. I mean, just look at some of the horror stories on this site. Or look at some of the lawsuits and workplace related settlements that get reported on.

      Bit I totally agree with you that the questions you mentioned are a really good idea.

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  46. Roscoe da Cat*

    #3 There shouldn’t be a problem – unless you moved out and left the country while your bf was on vacation…

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  47. Ty*

    LW4: In those big companies, the team hiring you might be in a completely different team to the contracts team negotiating the contract who will definitely will be in a completely different department to the finance team. Asking is probably going to slow down the time it takes to be able to sign the contract and frankly frustrate a lot of transactional staff who are just trying to churn through contracts and invoices and get bogged down if things are out of the ordinary. It could just potentially be a bunch of weeks waiting without work or a contract just to hear “no” back. It’s very unsurprising that big companies are slow, everything takes a long time in big companies – there is always just a lot of work that needs to be triaged and there are a lot of departments having to co-ordinate. The sure way for things to get even longer is to try to get somethings to be exceptions to the processes.

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    1. Insert Clever Name Here*

      This isn’t necessarily true. I’m supply chain management in one of these big companies so as the person negotiating with the contractor to set up the contract, no, asking me if there are alternate payment terms isn’t going to frustrate me or take a bunch of weeks to get you an answer. Of all the things we negotiate it is literally the easiest and quickest thing.

      I want my small suppliers to stay in business and have the cash flow they need to make that happen and I have the authority to authorize a variety of alternate payment terms without bringing anyone else into the picture.

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  48. Office Plant Queen*

    For #4, I work for a mid size company and handle vendor setups. Our default terms are net 60, but that gets negotiated all the time! Most independent contractors end up with net 30 terms, as do most large companies with more negotiating power. There’s also a subset of contractors who get paid immediately, mostly tradespeople. (Yes, that does mean that big companies are trying to insist on being paid within 30 days while not paying their vendors any sooner than 90.)

    Anyway, point is that you can and should ask for net 30 from the start. Their system very likely does let them set different terms for different vendors – because either it’s manual and they can do whatever they want, or it’s automated and no sane ERP system wouldn’t have an option to have different payment terms for different vendors. Most likely the obstacle is not technological, but rather that they have to do something annoying like get approval from someone three levels above them to deviate from their standard terms. Not that approval isn’t a significant obstacle – that’s the point of requiring approval, after all – just that you’re success is going to be about how much they need your services and about the political capital of your contact at the company

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  49. Parenthesis Guy*

    Since it’s been twenty years, it makes sense to just send an email. But if it was a shorter period of time, and you had a friend in common, you could always have the friend reach out to see what’s what. That way, you wouldn’t have to have contact with the ex directly.

    The challenge is that this strategy could avoid drama, but would be seen as very high-schooly.

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  50. i know, right?*

    I can’t be the only one who thinks that feeling like the boss’s partner is being selfish, and hoping they break up, is in no way, shape, or form, understandable.

    Reply ↓
    1. Just a Pile of Oranges*

      I think the LW is less trying to say they wish misfortune upon anyone, and mostly just trying to communicate exactly how anxious this change is making them.

      These kinds of feelings aren’t understandable in and of themselves. But it is understandable that having peak anxiety causes irrational thoughts, and that might cause someone to ask for advice or help for addressing the contributing factors to the anxiety.

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      1. Jennifer Strange*

        These kinds of feelings aren’t understandable in and of themselves. But it is understandable that having peak anxiety causes irrational thoughts, and that might cause someone to ask for advice or help for addressing the contributing factors to the anxiety.

        This. The thought in and of itself isn’t understandable, but the feeling behind it is.

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    2. lunchtime caller*

      If I were either person in the couple I would find those feelings very weird and creepy, and part of why I’m in favor of the LW switching thought tracks IMMEDIATELY and not indulging in any of this “just feel and accept your feelings” handholding in the comments is because if even a hint of those feelings comes through to the boss, it might very well sour all the conversations they need to have for their real work concerns.

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    3. Head Sheep Counter*

      I found the letter unsettling in regards to the fixation on the manager’s partner. We all have unreasonable inside thoughts about various things (do I really want the person who cut me off in traffic to actually burst into pustules?… maybe but I wouldn’t tell anyone other than you and my dearest friends…). That the inside thoughts raise to writing a letter here makes me concerned about the LW. Something is off here.

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    4. MCMonkeybean*

      I was a bit surprised by that response too but I think Alison probably meant more that the anxious feelings about the boss leaving sre understandable.

      You feel what you feel and feelibgs are not always rational and I can get behind that, but it does seem a bit concerning that they don’t seem to acknowledge or maybe don’t even realize that their feelings about the partner being “selfish” are not at all reasonable.

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    5. JustaTech*

      I think it’s understandable as in “I understand why you are having such an intense reaction” not understandable as in “this is a reasonable, proportional response”.

      To give an extreme example: I *understand* why my toddler is having a meltdown – I told him he couldn’t have a cookie. Is that a reasonable, proportional or rational response? Of course not. But I can understand that he’s super hungry and doesn’t have an understanding of time (dinner is in 3 minutes, kiddo), and frankly, is a toddler.

      In this case the LW isn’t a toddler, but they are in a precarious place that makes them understandably anxious.
      Is the LW re-directly that anxiety in a non-productive, unkind, and irrational way? Yes. Which is why no one is suggesting that they say anything to their boss about the boss’s partner. What Alison (and everyone else I’ve seen so far) is saying is “I see why you’re having these feelings, but you really need to re-direct them in a better, more productive way. I’m sorry you’re in this place and you’re so scared.”

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    6. fhqwhgads*

      It’s not reasonable but is understandable. It’s a primal-brain thing. Having the thought isn’t reprehensible or odd (not saying everyone’s mind would go there, but it’s not shocking either).
      As long as they’re not acting on it or saying it outloud to interested parties, it’s fine. Feelings aren’t rational.

      Reply ↓
  51. Emily Byrd Starr*

    #5: Ugh, I can relate, although my experience was several years before covid. I worked in an office where most people worked in an open concept plan. I was one of the few people who had a private office, which I shared with two other employees. Because our corner office was separate from the rest of the workplace, other employees treated it like their break room and would come in to chat with us. I found this very distracting, as I have ADHD and find it very difficult to return to my work after being interrupted.
    So you can see how this office plan didn’t work for me. I finally had to resort to using headphones.
    Nothing more to say except that I sympathize with you, LW5. Hope you can talk to your supervisor or HR and get the problem resolved.

    Reply ↓
    1. I Have RBF*

      I had this problem at one place. Three of us on a team had one office space, but other people, especially one guy from accounting, would use it as their social space and stand there yakking at us for up to an hour at a time. Drove. Me. Nuts.

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  52. Ultimator*

    My current employer had no dedicated HR when I started (almost 50 employees at the time). Payroll was handled by the single accountant, benefits by the wife of one of the two owners in a part-time capacity. One thing to note is that whoever is handling these things may have no formal training. Even the unavoidable work of evaluating benefits providers can be challenging without training (not that every place I worked with HR did a good job of that!) I never had to report any harassment or seek help with a coworker conflict so I can’t speak to those aspects.

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  53. RagingADHD*

    LW1, it is entirely possible to become emotionally dependent on someone without any romantic interest in them at all. Your letter gives the impression that you may be relying on this boss’ personal / emotional support in a much deeper way than simply administering your accommodations correctly.

    Feeling personal friendship and attachment to one’s boss isn’t an inherently bad thing unless it becomes so intense that it causes other problems. And I think perhaps it has, because the idea that your boss should place loyalty to you over a desire to be with their partner, or that the partner is being “selfish” by not guaranteeing your indefinite access to the boss, is a distortion of what a boss-employee relationship, or even a personal friendship, should be.

    I think, in addition to asking for help in making sure your accommodations are transitioned well, it would behoove you to seek a wider base of personal support, whether that’s making new friends outside work, or seeking a professional support system, or asking for more support in your existing relationships.

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  54. Art3mis*

    #4 – I agree with what Alison says, sometimes you might not have a choice. I work for a third party payor, basically we pay other company’s bills for them. Some are massive companies that just have to grind invoices through their system. Some are just very disorganized and don’t have a central AP system. In some cases you can get paid faster if you opt for a different payment method. Some of our clients pay their vendors faster if they get paid via credit card instead of ACH or check.

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  55. Dawn*

    LW5: Why are you at a loss? Talk to them.

    That’s it. That’s the entire solution. Talk to them. Ask them to please be quieter. Done.

    I swear some people write in hoping they’ll be told that there’s a solution to basic human interaction that doesn’t involve them having to ask anything of anyone, ever….. sorry, it doesn’t work that way.

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  57. WorkingGirl*

    Oof, as a freelancer myself, #4 is a relatable struggle. But yeah, I have also experienced that the bigger the client, the longer it takes to get paid for your work. What I do when I liaise with bigger clients is I ask for confirmation of their payment terms upfront, and then I write it into the contract that payment will be “net 90” (or whatever it is), at least having it in writing gives me some comfort.

    Another thing LW4 could do – and I’m not sure what field they’re in exactly, so this may of may not be relevant – if the work for Big Client requires some upfront cost from LW (equipment rental? Supply purchase? Travel?), perhaps LW can invoice for that cost separately, and get that paid sooner?

    Reply ↓
  58. merida*

    #4 – On a related note, a previous company I worked for sold their products on Amazon. Amazon at the time had a 120 remit period, but they were typically very late so in reality we were getting paid sometimes six months after. We pushed back hard and after months of negotiations we got them to eventually pay within their 120 days. They were the only seller I heard of who had anything over 90 days to begin with… and it’s not like Amazon struggles to pay their bills, they just don’t care. I hate that that’s the way things work. I feel for you, OP!

    Reply ↓
    1. I Have RBF*

      IIRC Amazon runs on thin enough margins (because retail) that they use every trick in the book to make money with their money, so them paying slow is not a surprise. If you want to change it, you need to make it cost them more than they make on the float, and even then you have to deal with institutional inertia.

      Reply ↓
  59. Statler von Waldorf*

    #4 is just life in the Oil & Gas industry. Every single multi-national billion dollar oil company pays like that, and it goes downhill from there. There are middlemen who run very successful businesses by just taking a cut in exchange for paying invoices in two weeks instead of three months. My current gig has subcontractors that use us because we pay in 50-80 days instead of 90-120.

    Actual advice for freelancers: Those notices on your invoices or statement stating that you charge interest on overdue accounts? They are legally toothless. Unless you get your customers to actually sign a contract agreeing to it, no court will uphold them. I wouldn’t even bother with them. Instead, increase your rates by 10% and offer a 10% early-pay discount. You catch more flies with honey than vinegar.

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  60. Workerbee*

    OP #1, hoping your boss gets his heart stomped on to benefit you is not a good perspective to nurture. Instead, it’s as selfish as what you’re mistakenly attributing to your boss’s partner.

    Channel that toxic energy into getting written verbiage from HR for your accommodations.

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  61. law*

    and refuses to move nearer to where he lives even though they work remotely.

    That doesn’t necessarily mean anything though. Tax nexus, data security, a company’s own policy about remote workers and physical locations, etc…I get that the LW is upset but again, it really behooves them to shift focus from the inner workings of their boss’ relationship to “what do I need to do, HR-wise, to formally secure my current accommodations at this current workplace, regardless of who my actual supervisor is at any time?”

    Reply ↓
  62. FunkyMunky*

    #5 is exactly why WFH is still superior on many levels. I just don’t get what companies want to accomplish 5 years down the line by pretending last 5 years didn’t happen

    Reply ↓
  63. Pi314*

    #4: Ugh, my company recently changed to longer payment terms and is imposing it on all the vendors we order from, and it’s causing so much havoc. It used to be relatively easy to adjust payment terms on a case by case basis (the vendor basically just had to ask) but now it seems like they won’t budge. Another policy change at the same time was to force vendors to use a specific software application to receive orders and submit invoices, which apparently many of them don’t like. Most of my company does routine manufacturing and orders thousands of the same parts over and over, so the suppliers of those things get a lot of business and are willing to make accommodations. My division does fairly niche R&D and we work with a lot of suppliers who are the only option for the things they sell, and we’re ordering small quantities or one-offs. So a lot of these suppliers are just saying “we don’t like that, no thanks!” I really don’t blame them, but my team is struggling to get what we need. I really hope the people within my company who made these policies realize the impacts.

    Anyway, no solutions to offer the LW, but they have my sympathy.

    Reply ↓
  64. Office Manager*

    For long payment timelines, are you following up and making sure stuff is received properly and not forgotten about? There are certain companies that really have it together and I never need to follow up, and some that if I don’t follow up they’ll go months and months and then suddenly need insurance info, PO, etc when I finally follow up.

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  65. WestsideStory*

    #4. Two things that have worked for me with larger clients.

    First is getting an advance. You have to get into the system anyway, it’s better to have the paperwork all set up and a little money to “float” while the creative work gets done.

    Second is offering a 5% discount for payment under 30 days. Doesn’t always work, but often this lights a fire under some eager AP clerk.

    Reply ↓
  66. DJ*

    LE#5 we are having the same issue. Not enough meeting rooms but MS Team for all means those from other locations (internal or external ppl) don’t need to travel to meet saving time. But even if they did travel to meet face to face not enough meeting rooms!
    Sounds like employers aren’t expanding their space but cramming ppl in!
    Also desks that were never meant to be all day desks and thus not height adjustable being turned into permanent all day desks. Splits up teams as adjustable desks are in demand and go to staff who need them due to musculoskeletal problems so those who don’t need them have to sit away from their team members who do!
    We also have the problem with the 2pm fridge throw out. Didn’t matter when not many in but now if a staff member needs to bring in 2 meals 1 to eat during a long commute home due to food timing or dietary issues have to take their dinner out and keep on their desk. Not good for keeping food fresh

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  67. Zap R.*

    LW 1, as some who has lost a job because of a disability and had to take a crappier job afterwards, I know how important having a supportive boss can be. However, THIS IS NOT ABOUT YOU.

    You don’t know what’s factoring in to his partner’s refusal to move. Maybe they’ve got elderly parents or a family member in long-term care. Maybe they want to start a family and love the schools in the area. Maybe your boss has always planned to move to his partner’s hometown one day. Maybe they just straight-up don’t want to move! It’s none of your business whatsoever!

    You can absolutely sit down with your boss and figure out a transition plan to ensure that your accommodations are protected. It’s totally reasonable to be freaked out by the prospect of explaining your situation to a new boss. Believe me, I get it. But this is a completely inappropriate way to frame the situation and deeply unfair to your boss and his partner (who have not actually done anything wrong.) Focus on what you can control and let the rest of it go.

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  68. JM*

    #4 – I work in Higher Ed and they only way we can process an invoice quickly is if there is a way to pay by credit card. If you have the ability to offer this, we can sometimes pay an invoice the same day it’s received or shortly after. I think our one-time payment limits are $5K. Anything over $5K requires a one time card approval. Anything $10K and over requires involving a procurement buyer, so it would still technically be possible, but they’d likely open a purchase order at that point and then invoices are subject to receiving and approval via the procurement system.

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  69. Raida*

    3.

    I would go for even less, the email could be as simple as,

    “Hi Artexerxes! It’s been many years since we’ve talked and I hope you’re doing well. I’m writing because an employee at CompanyName has invited my team to pitch for (project type). Normally I attend the pitch meeting and be part of any proposal for working together, so I thought I should touch base with you first as a heads-up so it isn’t a surprise.
    If you reckon there’s going to be issues with this approach just let me know, and we can discuss before my team moves forward.”

    I’m not asking if I am allowed to do my job in case I shouldn’t go near them in case they still don’t like me because of years ago when we agreed to break up…
    I’m telling them “I have a job, it will intersect with yours. Problem?” And they can say if they give a shit. If they don’t, neither do I. If they do, then I am ready to be supportive of a way forward *and I’m not the one overreacting*

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  70. Raida*

    4. Customers with ridiculously long payment times

    You set your payment terms.
    You are clear about them up front, and the late payment fees added at x point, and work stoppage after y delay.
    You then accept they don’t hire your company *sometimes*
    It is a contract, and a business can’t just “policy” their way out of the terms of the contract.

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  71. WFH4VR*

    #1, your boss is not leaving “AT YOU.” You need to control your overly personal thoughts and focus on the task at hand, which is working out written accommodations with HR, not by wishing harm on your boss’s partner.

    Reply ↓
  72. Wednesday wishes*

    LW #4 – it may be too late for the current customers, but going forward raise your price and give a “discount” to those that pay in 30 days. If you’re worried that they won’t accept your contract because the price is higher, you can explain to them that it is THIS price if they pay within your terms. often customers will ask us if we charge fees on credit cards, and I always tell them not if the bill is paid within their terms (some are 20 days, some 30 days). Otherwise we reserve the right to charge the 3.5% fee. The longer you wait for the money the less it is worth (or the more it costs you, whichever way you want to look at it).

    Reply ↓
  73. Letter Writer #3*

    #3 reporting in! I don’t have much by way of an update, other than to say how much I appreciate Alison and the commentariat for their assistance. In my attempts to avoid drama, I was still making more with the idea that I had to do all this “outreach.” I absolutely see that a simple email is the professional and non-dramatic way to handle this, and that’s how I’m going to proceed. Thank you!

    Reply ↓

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