is it OK for job postings to require a “clean-cut appearance”?

by Alison Green on October 17, 2024

A reader writes:

There is a small family-owned butcher shop near me. They list job postings on their Facebook page, and I’ve noticed every time they post for counter staff, that they include “clean-cut” or “clean-cut appearance” in their list of requirements for applicants. I don’t believe this is specifically about food handling/sanitation requirements, since the employees currently working at the counter there do not wear hair nets or hats.

This bothers me, largely because it feels wrong to consider appearance when making hiring decisions. Also, that particular phrasing only references hair directly, but to me it has 1950’s-small-town-USA connotations a la Pleasantville and so feels to me like it would also exclude tattoos, goth style, brightly-colored hair, extra-large bodies, or anything other than fairly generic-looking white people. I know I personally would feel uncomfortable applying there with “clean-cut” included, so I suspect others would also self-select out of applying.

Which leads to my questions:
• Is it illegal (in the U.S.) to use appearance as a criteria for job candidates? I suspect not, based on the existence of the Hooters chain, but maybe it is?
• Am I overreacting or reading too much into the term “clean-cut”?
• If the job posting is problematic and/or illegal, would it be any better if the business had a well-defined dress code prohibiting facial hair, visible tattoos, non-natural hair colors, etc. and the job posting just said “must be willing to adhere to dress code once hired”?

It’s not illegal in the U.S. to require a “clean-cut appearance” as long as it’s not used in ways that discriminate based on sex, race, religion, or other protected characteristics.

For example, courts have ruled that employers can prohibit facial hair on employees as long as they make exceptions for religious practices and people with conditions that make shaving painful.

They can also legally prohibit tattoos, goth style, and other specific appearance choices (again, as long as they make exceptions for protected classes).

There are a few jurisdictions in the U.S. that prohibit appearance discrimination, but they’re the exceptions and are usually narrowly defined. For example, Michigan prohibits discrimination based on height or weight, but not other appearance-related characteristics. Santa Cruz, Calif. protects physical characteristics from “birth, accident, or disease” that are otherwise “beyond the control of the person,” including height and weight (but excluding things like dress, grooming, tattoos, and piercings).

I do think you’re probably reading more into “clean-cut” than is typically intended, at least in terms of assuming it’s code for white (but I can also see how you got there, given our history).

Because the term does allow so much room for interpretation, it would be better for any employer using it to spell out exactly what it means to them — since for all we know, they’re fine with tattoos but hate long hair on men, or it’s really just about facial hair, or any number of other possibilities.

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  1. Justin*

    I’m Black and I get where you’re coming from, but it’s all in the actual results. If they do end up with an all-white (or all-whatever) staff… over several years (bc if there are only a few employees, that won’t really mean much), your suspicions might be vindicated.

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    1. Michelle Smith*

      Yep. I’m also Black and my first thought was that clean cut would probably exclude me due to my natural hair. But I could be wrong!

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      1. No Lizards Allowed*

        FYI, Illinois law prohibits discrimination based on hair, including braids, locks, or other protective hairstyles.

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    2. ferrina*

      My mind immediately went to CROWN acts. This is exactly why these laws exist (in the few places they do exist- I would love to see more). “Clean-cut” could easily be interpreted to discriminate against Black hair and hairstyles.

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    3. UKDancer*

      I think you’re right about the number of people. If it’s a very small company it’s really hard to draw conclusions about demographics. I mean my butcher has 4 staff usually, the main butcher (white), his brother (also white), the brother’s daughter (also white) and an apprentice (Korean at present but they tend to change often). It’s a bit hard to say people aren’t hiring a diverse range of staff when 3 of them are related and the fourth one comes from an apprenticeship scheme.

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    4. JPalmer*

      Yeah, this feels like ‘functional’ discrimination that doesn’t get adequately called out.

      I imagine it’s also for ushering away individuals who don’t fit a ‘conservative sensibility’. And I get that it’s a counter position and you don’t want someone with the knuckle tattoos of ‘KILL YOU!’, but I wouldn’t be surprised if it gets used against folks who don’t fit the their ‘desired’ type of person. Like would they turn away a trans person or minority folx for not being ‘clean cut’ enough.

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      1. Jess*

        Now I’m picturing a butcher with knuckle tattoos that say “BEEF” and “PORK.” Which I think would be ideal, but not for this particular job, I guess.

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  2. Chairman of the Bored*

    I think the LW is reading too much into this one (admittedly vague and old-fashioned) term and ascribing meaning to it that doesn’t typically apply.

    Example: Kenan Thompson is both not white and not thin, but I suspect he’d still meet most people’s understanding of a “clean-cut appearance”.

    It is a bad way of writing a job posting and if a specific appearance is something that matters that much to the business they should be clearer about what they’re looking for.

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    1. Cj*

      yeah, I get where the letter writer is coming from when they say it might eliminateor goth or whatever. but I would never consider clean cut to mean body type or race.

      I personally wouldn’t even consider it to me goth, tattoos, etc as long as the person is clean and neat.

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      1. MsM*

        Yeah, I’d interpret it as “don’t make our customers question whether we’re meeting basic sanitary standards.” (I suppose some people would have that question over tattoos, but that’s on them.)

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        1. Cassandra*

          Ehh, I would be more inclined to agree with you if they actually made their employees wear hair nets, which the OP specifically says they don’t. It does not sound like a health & safety standards thing at all.

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      2. HCworker*

        Honestly, I’d even say maybe there are good reasons to exclude certain types of goth attire if it involves a lot of jewelry (potential problem with food handling) or many loose layers with a lot of potential for getting caught in stuff, trailing through food, etc.

        And I say that as someone who has a “goth lite” style a lot of the time. Not every subculture or grooming choice has to be stridently defended in the same way we protect people from types of discrimination based on race, disability, etc. I’m not saying it makes sense to state “no goths allowed” but it does make a lot of sense to have dress code expectations based on the needs of the job, and as soon as you have dress code expectations you’re going to by definition exclude some forms of dress.

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        1. UKDancer*

          Yes, I’d think for food handling you’d want people not to wear jewellery as a rule. I mean rings get caught in devices, dangly necklaces can be pulled off if you lean over. It’s probably a rule in most butchers not to wear a lot of things that could cause injury and not to wear loose clothes or hair. That said my local butcher has longer hair but he has it tied back in a ponytail and wears a hair net.

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        2. Lydia*

          I’m trying to put my finger on why this both makes sense and bothers me. I think it’s because normally a person’s aesthetic can be adopted to situations. A person who likes to dress sporty can still find something that’s appropriate for work but fits within their style. I have seen the language of being “clean cut” mean you must have short hair for men/straight styled hair for women, which leads to discrimination. Clean cut doesn’t actually include indigenous people who grow out their hair, or people whose religious practice includes beards.

          This was language I saw back in 1996 in a job posting for…Texaco, who then paid out about $176million in damages for racially discriminating against employees. When that happened, that language disappeared from their job listings and that tells me all I need to know about the reason it was included.

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          1. Allonge*

            A person who likes to dress sporty can still find something that’s appropriate for work but fits within their style.

            But we would advise the employer to note the expectations regarding dress / style / appearance in the job ad, no? Sure, most people (in any case most people not on TV) are not so attached to a specific style that they cannot modify it to suit the work needs. But it should be clear from the ad that something exists here.

            Is ‘clear-cut’ a great way to put this? Not really. It’s a butcher shop though, not an English professorship. I would want to see the results of this hiring before making a judgment on how much of an issue it is.

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          2. HCworker*

            Yeah, that’s completely valid, and I think that’s why the job listing is clanging for a lot of us (me included). I brought up subculture/style because the OP did, and that stood out to me because it sounded like they were as concerned about making sure a variety of aesthetics get included as they are about other dimensions of inclusion. I actually agree that inclusion of that sort would make the world a better place, but I just don’t see putting optional, temporary, relatively superficial self-expression on the same level as stuff like cultural hairstyles, etc. That’s why I mentioned goth attire. I agree it would be very bad for a business to use this kind of language to exclude, say, bigger bodies or trans people or folks with protective hairstyles. But I’m not going to get as up in arms about a business deciding alt/goth is not the aesthetic they want representing their business, and the OP kinda rolled them all together.

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      3. Lacey*

        Yeah, I think clean cut just means you look tidy.

        So a white person without tattoos, but with tangled hair, sloppy clothes and body odor wouldn’t be clean cut, but anyone who had neat, clean clothes & hair would be.

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        1. ferrina*

          The issue is that “tidy” hair can be accidentally (or intentionally) racially biased. For example, are locs considered “tidy”? What about fros?

          Or if we are considering clothes, certain body types are hard to find well-fitting clothes for. Designers tend to design for only certain body types, and if your dimensions aren’t commonly designed for, it’s a pain to find clothes that fit well. You spend a lot more time and/or money for clothes that fit well, which if you work a low-paying job or are just starting your career, can be a real barrier.

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    2. lost academic*

      Given that this is a butcher, I would put some reasonable money on the person writing the ad groping for the phrase “clean shaven” and missing just a little.

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      1. Fish Microwaver*

        I thought “neatly groomed” or “clean and tidy appearance” were possibly the words they were looking for.

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  3. the 1%*

    “Clean-cut” is not just a reference to hair, it refers to a generally well-groomed, somewhat conventional appearance. Think clothes that fit and are in good repair rather than baggy or torn clothes. But it absolutely doesn’t mean you have to be white or thin.

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    1. duinath*

      And I would guess your hair doesn’t actually have to be cut in a specific way, just generally neat and if it’s long probably put back or up.

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    2. Radioactive Cyborg Llama*

      Mmm, there are plenty of people who would not consider a fat person clean cut just because they’re fat. And many Black hairstyles would not be considered “clean cut” by some folks, either. I don’t think either of those are appropriate, but biases do exist.

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      1. Silver Robin*

        Just dropping into agree. The same outfit on a fat body is considered untidy and gross, while on a thin person it is smart and chic. Do not get me started on how revealing the neckline can be depending on the shape of the bust underneath.

        Clean cut having a million shades of meaning creates space for discrimination based on whatever biases the employer has. I get LW being suspicious; though we would have to actually take a look at who gets employed/sticks around to see whether biases are actually at play.

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    3. a trans person*

      It can absolutely mean that you have to be thin. We have many, many examples in this site’s history of people who find *any* clothes look poorly groomed on a fat body.

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      1. the 1%*

        I’m talking about the standard definition of “clean cut.” Obviously it is possible to interpret the term in a weird way (like the LW) but standard definitions exist!

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        1. Lydia*

          It’s not weird when you know that language has been used in the past to discriminate against specific groups of people.

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        2. ferrina*

          The technical definition and the colloquial usage are not equivalent.

          Technically, sure.
          But in practical usage? The beauty standard of “professional” has often been used to define a very certain beauty standard. Studies have shown that people who are fat are less likely to receive promotions and career advancement. Styles that are considered professional on one body type may be looked down on when worn by another body type (see also: AAM letters from women being shamed at work for having normal clothes but people don’t like that the women have boobs).
          See also: CROWN acts. It’s quite common to see discrimination against Black hair and Black hairstyles. Styles that are clean, beautiful and take hours to create are dismissed as “not professional” because they are Black styles in Black hair.
          See also: Any minority that has to step up the formality of their dress to be taken seriously. Not sure if there is any study on this, but I’ve experienced/witnessed/heard a ton of minorities and women run into this issue. I’ve been in situations where I had to walk in to meetings wearing outfits several layers up of formality in order to get the same level of respect as junior colleagues who were wearing stained jeans and a t-shirt (why yes, I am a woman and the junior colleagues were men, and yes, this was at a tech company, how could you tell /s)

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          1. Middle Aged Lady*

            This! I once worked at a restaurant where we could wear shorts: IF our legs were thin, tanned and shaven. One larger, pale female employee was told she could not wear shorts. Funny that those rules didn’t apply to the men on staff.

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  4. Cease and D6*

    I suppose the question for OP, since this is a local shop that they have presumably visited, is whether the demographics of the current butcher shop employees (compared to those of the town in question) support a hypothesis that ‘clean cut’ is being used to discriminate against a protected class. For instance, if the place the shop is located is very diverse but the staff are all “fairly generic-looking white people”, that could mean this term is a euphemism for something that would be illegal. If those things aren’t true, it plausibly isn’t.

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    1. ThisIsNotADuplicateComment*

      This is probably the best way to look at it. Clean cut is generic enough that reasonable people wouldn’t use it to mean “white” but assholes definitely would, and there’s unfortunately no way to know which this place is without some legwork.

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  5. Juneau*

    For example, courts have ruled that employers can prohibit facial hair on employees as long as they make exceptions for religious practices and people with conditions that make shaving painful.

    How does that work for positions where employees have to wear respirators? They wouldn’t get through fit testing.

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    1. FMNDL*

      Whether religious accommodation requests must be granted does depend to some extent on the burden to the employer – if the employer can successfully argue that there is not an accommodation that will enable the employee to still complete the job, the accommodation request may not have to be approved.

      (I am not a lawyer but I do work in this area.)

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    3. C in DC*

      If it is a job requirement that one needs to wear a respirator, then the employer can state that facial hair is not allowed for safety reasons or work conditions and then it’s not discrimination. It’s why, for example, people in the U.S. Navy are allowed to have moustaches but not beards – equipment doesn’t fit over beards.

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      1. KatePM*

        USAF has allowed shaving waivers forever, and recently relaxed their shaving standards. I know many careers in the Air Force require use of masks, especially if deploying, but I’m not sure how the appearance of facial hair affects masking and deploying.

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        1. Bella Ridley*

          Not US military, but in other militaries there are a few workarounds. The member shaves for the fit test and gas hut, keeps their beard otherwise, and then shaves if deploying into a CBRN environment. The member may use Vaseline to get an appropriate seal (varies depending on type of respirator, type of beard, nature of contaminant). There are also gas masks designed for use with beards, typically targeted at Sikh men who keep long beards, that provide a full-head-type barrier that usually seals around the neck.

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        2. Liane*

          My husband was in the Air Force years ago and he told me that the shaving waivers then allowed only the shortest possible beards, nothing like the full beard he prefers as a 60-ish veteran. :)

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    4. LBCM*

      My son is a Fire Captain and they are not allowed to have beards as the masks they wear into a fire would not seal properly.

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    5. spcepickle*

      I employee people who wear respirators – We do have a reasonable accommedation of a PAPR for people who can’t / don’t want to be fit tested, but only because we already own them (they are WAY more expensive than respirators). Our rule is you must be fit tested for a respirator and then maintain your facial hair OR you must be willing to wear a PAPR. We give each person their own respirator, but we only have two PAPRs so sometimes people have to share them. (Obviously wearing it at different times, not two people trying to wear one PAPR)

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      1. Dawn*

        At first I read this as your saying that you already owned the people and I was terribly confused.

        It’s probably time for some more antipyretics…

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    7. Cthulhu’s Librarian*

      I was going to comment about this as well. I’ve seen the “clean cut” language used in job postings at firehouses and hospitals, where respirators and masks needed to be fit tested, and the reasons that I have heard given were that facial hair interferes with maintaining a seal on these pieces of equipment.

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  6. carrot cake*

    I take “clean cut” to mean looking hygienic, e.g. clean fingernails, brushed teeth, clothing with no stains or holes; and being pleasant and professional.

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    1. Tech Industry Refugee*

      That is how I interpreted it, too. Didn’t seem insidious to me. This is common in the food service industry.

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    3. Charlotte Lucas*

      I worked for a famous mouse back in the day. They had a whole guide describing what was expected for a clean-cut appearance.

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  7. FMNDL*

    At least 22 states in the U.S. also have some version of a CROWN Act, which prohibits race-based hair discrimination by employers (such as banning locs or Afros). Definitely look into your state’s version for specifics.

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  8. I AM a Lawyer*

    I wonder how this would interact with something like California’s CROWN act, which prohibits discrimination on the basis of hairstyles historically associated with race, like locs or braids.

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    1. I should really pick a name*

      Clean cut is a fairly subjective term.
      It doesn’t universally exclude those hairstyles (though I’m sure there are people intend it to).

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    1. Selina Luna*

      That’s a reasonable question. I wonder if size of business matters when it comes to hiring choices. I would think so, but I don’t know. I know that even small businesses are not allowed to discriminate service based on protected classes (though even that would exclude sartorial choices). I know for sure that a business that doesn’t want people wearing or failing to wear certain clothes is welcome to make that a rule of their business.

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    2. MotherofaPickle*

      I was wondering that, too. I worked for a decade for a small, locally-owned ice cream place that almost exclusively hired high school girls. No bias in hiring at all…that’s usually who applied. In fact, the high school boys, or Older Ladies who applied never (and I mean NEVER worked out), but Boss usually gave them a chance.

      A decade later and I always got back to get ice cream or cheese fries whenever I’m in town and it’s still high school/early college ladies. And Boss doesn’t do the hiring anymore. My former co-manager does and he only sees “potential” not “chromosomes”. But, on second thought, anyone “clean cut” would be in the running, because “unkempt” doesn’t present well to the customer.

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    3. avocado lawyer*

      Depends on the state (and maybe locality). Federally, an employer needs 15+ employees to be subject to most anti-discrimination laws like Title VII, the ADA, etc., but many similar state and some local laws cover smaller employers. Some kick in at a single employee.

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  10. Heidi*

    Is it possible that “clean-cut” is intended as some sort of butcher humor? It’s not great if it is, but it’s such a specific job I’m wondering how it could be a coincidence.

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    2. a trans person*

      I didn’t think of this, and I regret that if it was the intention… I actually find it pretty funny? Shame the problematic pieces are more visible.

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  11. L-squared*

    I’m black, and I’d still consider myself clean cut.

    Short hair, either clean shaven or short beard, no visible tattoos.

    I don’t take it offensively if I see it, because I have some friends who frankly pride themselves on NOT being clean cut. And that is their choice. But I won’t begrudge a business for wanting to put forth a certain aesthetic.

    I always use the example, if someone has a hip hop clothing store, I don’t know that I’d want a kid who looks goth in there, even if I may be happy to have that same kid working in a place focusing on heavy metal clothing.

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    1. Suze*

      Right, I was also bemused by the suggestion this rather straight-forward phrase could be construed as racist or something. Glad to hear that a non-white person agrees. (I am mixed race but live outside of the US). I don’t want to be unkind but being offended by something like this seems like virtue signaling, there are more serious problems than small businesses not using the optimally PC language in job postings.

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  12. Rachel*

    If I saw this posting I’d assume they meant fairly basic standards as far as looking clean, probably no huge or facial tattoos, ripped clothes, elaborate piercings etc…none of which is terribly unusual in a client facing position.

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    1. Paint N Drip*

      I do think it’s an interesting thing to include on a job listing though, because I personally would self-select out and choose not to apply even though I work solely in client-facing positions. And probably the WAYS I’m not clean-cut (my hair is wavy and mostly looks messy even when freshly clean and styled, I always have pet hair on me, I’m plus-sized and my clothes can look frumpy or ‘off’ due to sizing/cut/etc.) are exactly the things a butcher shop doesn’t want to deal with, so perhaps they have the right idea!

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  13. Not A Manager*

    I read “clean cut” in this case to mean “mainstream appearance, not alternative or edgy.” But it’s an old-fashioned term with a lot of cultural connotations. In my experience, it was applied approvingly mostly to middle-class white boys who played sports. I never heard a woman referred to as “clean cut,” and if it was applied to a POC it was usually accompanied by some other pretty loaded words.

    I would have some feelings about a business advertising in this way.

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    1. Goldenrod*

      I get what you mean, but women and POC can absolutely be clean-cut.

      What this particular employer had in mind, of course, we don’t know.

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      1. Ellis Bell*

        I completely agree with you that women and POC can be clean cut, as I understand the term. I have to say though, it wasn’t until Not A Manager said it that I realised this, but I don’t think I’ve ever heard it applied to a woman either.

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      1. Kelly L.*

        Same. My most charitable interpretation would be “these are deeply small-c conservative people that I wouldn’t want to work with.” Even though I’d probably qualify. It gives the impression of a 50s kind of conformity.

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        1. I should really pick a name*

          Middle-aged, gay, black man.
          My most charitable interpretation would be that they mean good hygiene, clothes without holes, and just didn’t put that much effort into their word choice.

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          1. Lydia*

            I think that’s the best approach. Not that they’re intending it to be code, but that they didn’t choose their phrasing very well. I commented previously that similar language appeared in a job posting for a Texaco station where I worked and after the $176million settlement Texaco had to pay for very clear racial discrimination, that language disappeared. I’d like to think it was because they rethought what the “clean cut” language could appear to mean, but I’m also suspicious.

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    3. Hroethvitnir*

      This. Impossible to say based on wording alone – but the fact it’s unclear is a feature, not a bug, if you do mean it as a dog whistle.

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  14. Tech Industry Refugee*

    I think OP is reading too far into the employer saying “clean cut.” Most likely, the employer has encountered disheveled applicants and/or they are trying to portray a certain high-quality vibe for their brand. More than likely it means, look neat and groomed, wear clothes that are clean and ironed.

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    1. I'm just here for the cats!!*

      Exactly! Especially in food service there is often a specific grooming needed. No long or dirty nails, clean clothes, hair tied back, etc.

      I know many POC who are “clean-cut” and many people who have alternative styles (goth, etc) that would be the definition of clean cut.

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      1. Peanut Hamper*

        This is where I landed as well. They want someone who is well-groomed, has hair that is under control, and wears clean clothes that don’t show visible underwear. Given that they are working around food (especially in a butcher shop where things can get ground into meat or sausage), I don’t think this is especially terrible.

        They could definitely have used more specific wording though. Again, use your words, say exactly what you want.

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    2. The OG Sleepless*

      I worked at a place that hired entry-level workers and the phrase they used was “neat appearance.” The employers themselves weren’t the most inclusive bunch in their personal views, but it didn’t seen to affect their hiring decisions, and over the years they had people of widely different races and body types as well as at least one hard-core goth.

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  15. DramaQ*

    I think it is someone who likely didn’t think through the connotations of the phrase.

    I work in food and I cannot have long nails, fake nails, nail polish. If I worked in the plant I would have to remove my eyebrow and nose piercing because there is always the chance they could fall out into product.

    A new tattoo depending on where it is at would be eye brow raising because it is a healing wound. It’d need to be somewhere I could keep covered and clean when working with product.

    I need to have short hair (shoulder length or shorter) or if I have long hair it must be tied up when working so it doesn’t get caught in things or drop into product.

    “Clean cut” to me would mean dressing and groomed in a way that both keeps me safe and keeps the product clean/safe.

    If I can’t even do that for the interview working around raw meat products with lots of sharp objects probably isn’t for me.

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    1. Tech Industry Refugee*

      This is a great, detailed example. It also applies to other occupations – in massage school our nails had to be cut and unpolished, since long nails can harbor bacteria and polish can chip.

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  16. Dawn*

    Honestly, I agree with you that I read “clean-cut” as “looking like the alt-right white dudes who showed up for Charlottetown” but there’s probably not much you can actually do about that beyond not working for/patronizing them.

    It might be interesting to call them up and ask them to define it, though.

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    1. spuffyduds*

      Very much agreeing with your point, but as a Virginia resident I am required to let you know that scary riot went down in CharlottesVILLE.

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  17. Goldenrod*

    I’ll probably get absolutely slaughtered in the comments (pun intended), but I’m not sure I would want to buy meat from a goth.

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      1. Goldenrod*

        Well, I was being a little facetious but something about the connotations of Dracula/vampires/blood with goth + purchasing meat could give a butcher shop a dark, murderous vibe…

        In reality, though, I’d probably be fine with it! I understand that in reality goths are perfectly nice people…

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    3. Paint N Drip*

      Personally I’d be SUPER into a goth butcher shop, the opportunities for jokes and aesthetics are just out of control

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    4. RVA Cat*

      Meat you could tell. It’s the meat pies you have to watch out for – especially when they’re right next to the goth barber.

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    5. JPalmer*

      Most Goths I’ve met were either
      – Very detailed about their appearance and hygiene. Like it takes a lot of effort to maintain a nicely manicured goth appearance
      – Were sacking Rome (history joke)

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  18. Ellis Bell*

    It really all depends on whether they’re going by the dictionary definition of clean cut, or if they’re just using it as a euphemism for something else. If they literally mean “clean cut”, that doesn’t mean hygienically clean, it’s the difference between cutting paper with sharp scissors, and tearing it. i.e. a clean cut makes for smooth edges and neatness. So, for clothing, it would be indicating neat clothing, well cared for, non ragged, and no holes; in terms of your theory about goths, it would be more against punks than goths, because you can be gothic and still be incredibly neat and sharply outlined. When it comes to hair/personal appearance, again it should really only refer to being as neat and smooth as expected for most workplaces. Speaking as a curly haired person, you definitely come across people who think that any curls or textured/natural afro hair is never “neat”, or that fat people are never well dressed (which is what I meant by using “clean cut” as a euphemism) but it’s not necessarily what people mean. Tatoos, I think are not really covered by this! So much depends on the specific culture of the workplace, and even the nature of the tattoo, that I would probably treat that as a separate issue, though I understand what you mean.

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  19. Mesquito*

    I’m not saying they weren’t saying this to be discriminatory, I don’t know the situation. But I do know that like 10 years ago all the wildest-looking punk rock guys w the living room tattoos and the rusty scissor haircuts decided to get jobs as butchers for some reason, maybe best case scenario they’re just trying to avoid that.

    Reply ↓
    1. Peanut Hamper*

      If they are, they should not look in the kitchens of any restaurants they like to eat at. Restaurant people are a tribe unto themselves and there are a lot of tattoos/piercings/smoking, etc.

      Reply ↓
  20. I'm just here for the cats!!*

    I can see where OP is coming from but unless there are other racial or socio-economic class things going on at the shop, i doubt that the owners mean it that way. I do think it is outdated to use those words without giving more detail.
    They just want someone who is clean looking, i.e hair trimmed or pulled back, clean hands and trimmed nails, showered, and well kept. Afterall the counter staff are the face of the store, similar to how a receptionist is the face of a hotel.

    Reply ↓
  21. Irish Teacher.*

    To me, “clean cut” generally seems to imply a certain type of person rather than a certain level of grooming. I suspect this ad did just mean grooming, but it isn’t the first thing that would come to mind for me. My association with a “clean cut young man,” which is usually how I’ve come across the term is somebody middle class, with the “right” accent, doesn’t drink, smoke, swear or use illegal drugs, possibly attends some type of religious service on a regular basis, is polite to his elders, got good grades in school, that sort of thing.

    Given the context here, I would guess they just mean “somebody who looks presentable and hygienic,” but I don’t think it was a great choice of term as it seems like a number of us have slightly differing associations with it. And it might make me wonder if they would be more likely to judge less conventional styles (goths, punks, etc) as “not presentable.”

    Reply ↓
    2. Catherine*

      I didn’t read it as necessarily racial but I’m so used to the word “clean-cut” being applied to men (in fact, I don’t remember the last time that I read it about a woman or NB person) that I’d absolutely think it was a flag for “women need not apply.”

      Reply ↓
  22. lost academic*

    I want the OP to find out if they really meant “clean shaven” and just used the wrong phrase because they either didn’t know the difference or were just struggling when writing the ad and went with something that seemed close enough. This is a butcher, after all.

    Reply ↓
    1. Meep*

      +1

      I hope it is just the example they used, but needing a clean cut butcher is funny to me. Not from, yes, sanitary is important, but the stereotypical description of a butcher is this brawny, hairy man with a cleaver.

      Reply ↓
  23. Happy*

    “I know I personally would feel uncomfortable applying there with “clean-cut” included, so I suspect others would also self-select out of applying.”

    Yes, that’s the point.

    Reply ↓
    1. not nice, don't care*

      Same with postings for ‘energetic’ people who are ‘low-drama’. You get to know what the euphemisms mean in job ads. They are usually red flags.

      Reply ↓
        2. Paint N Drip*

          If I saw that in an ad, I would assume they are seeking employees who:
          – ignore stuff going on that isn’t totally above-board
          – accept mistreatment from the problem manager/owner
          – don’t have any personal life or personal issues in any way

          I can imagine a crappy employer thinking that my medical emergency then months of physical therapy that I scheduled around work was drama, or that asking for the resources you need is drama, or trying to follow the laws/mandates of your industry is drama

          Reply ↓
        3. Global Cat Herder*

          An ad that says “low drama” tells you the company is full of bees, and they don’t want anyone who will do “dramatic” things like point to the bees, or ask when the bees will be removed, or even say ouch when the bees sting them.

          Reply ↓
  24. KatePM*

    Wouldn’t some of these “clean-cut” characteristics fall under genetics? And how you can’t discriminate based on those features? E.g. POC’s natural hair texture, or height and weight of everyone?

    Reply ↓
    1. Tech Industry Refugee*

      I see no reason why a large bodied person, tall person, or person of color with a natural hairstyle couldn’t be clean cut.

      Reply ↓
    2. Frosty*

      Likely the real problem here is that “clean cut” is not defined or is associated with different things to different people. It makes me think of a marine or “Biff” on Back to the Future or maybe Andy Griffith on the Andy Griffith Show – a flattop hair cut, collared shirt, white, middle class, 1950s etc.

      This idea isn’t necessarily “correct” but some people might think it – and then not apply! To me the term is a bit of a pejorative – which is why the hiring manager should use exactly what they want: no tattoos, no piercings, no non-natural hair dye etc. (or whatever it is they mean).

      Reply ↓
      1. Tech Industry Refugee*

        My suspicion from this overall comment section is that “clean cut” must have different meanings to different generations. It seems pretty split. I am in my early 30s and the phrase doesn’t make me think of the 50s or middle class at all; for me, it just conjures someone with a neat appearance.

        Reply ↓
  26. Frosty*

    I’d bet that they want to prohibit tattoos, piercing and non-natural hair dye but are afraid that by saying that they might get hit with discrimination accusations. To skirt that, they are saying “clean cut”. They definitely should say what they mean though, because people (like here in the comments) are making all sorts of different guesses as to what they mean, and they would self-select out, when they actually could be a perfect fit. Or have a skillset that is great and worth bending the rules on “no tattoos” (or whatever).

    The no tattoos/piercings/hair colour rules are really common in the service/retail industry and mostly pretty outdated.

    Reply ↓
    1. Frosty*

      yes exactly – I associate it with military, with buzz cuts and tucking in bed sheets and ironed pleated pants etc.

      I belong to a religious group that is anti-military so even that brief association to me sub-consciously would keep me from wanting to apply.

      It’s not a well defined term so it shouldn’t be used at all for hiring.

      Reply ↓
  28. TheBunny*

    I read clean cut differently. To me it means presentable enough gnat people aren’t concerned you are touching their food.

    Reply ↓
  29. JillianaJones*

    When you said ‘goth style’ all I could think was Abby on ‘NCIS’- I love her style and tow the line of work-appropriate goth myself, but I always wondered if some of the stuff she wore (lots of metal, platform boots) would have been a safety hazard in a lab setting.

    Reply ↓
  30. QTPOC*

    I would 100% read clean-cut as a dog whistle for racism.
    It might not be the intention but given that Britannica defines clean cut as “having a neat appearance that suggests you are someone who does not break rules or cause trouble” and that POC people are often assumed to be people who break rules and cause trouble, it makes me uncomfortable.

    Reply ↓
    1. Paint N Drip*

      Thanks for bringing in a real definition! I agree with your first sentence, and unfortunately also the second

      Reply ↓
  31. Worried I Misunderstood*

    Maybe this is my white privilege showing, but I read clean cut and thought no face/neck/hand tattoos or piercings anywhere in the face. And if I were a business owner of a food place, I’d say everyone’s hair has to be back from their face and behind shoulders so it won’t fall into food – either with a headband (short hair) or ponytail holder/scrunchie/clip, etc. If their hair texture is such that it will stay back without hair things, that’d be fine too.

    Reply ↓
  32. Sihaya*

    This is a butcher shop. They handle massive quantities of ground beef, use deli slicers, push meat through saws. I’d say it’s the last bastion of the “clean cut appearance” as a safety issue rather than an unspoken social code. If my hair was long, I’d show up with it tied up. I’d cut my nails short and wear only short piercings in my ears. My shirt would be fitted and nothing would hang loose. Thats just my impression. This ain’t advertising for an Abercrombie store, where the context of “clean cut” would absolutely be eyebrow-raising.

    Reply ↓
      1. Orv*

        That works if you’re a woman. If you’re a guy, probably not, because a “man bun” has a lot of cultural connotations.

        Reply ↓
  33. Cosmo*

    Maybe its the media I consumed but I wouldn’t use clean cut in a job add. I do read it as someone who either is looking for someone out of the 1950s or is out of date.

    I would think it would be much better to include in the job description something like “employees must maintain cleanliness standards necessary for food service including but not limited to no long nails, short hair or long haired up neatly and securely, clothing free from stains or rips, etc”

    Reply ↓
  34. Jl*

    To me, clean cut means young white male with a fresh haircut and smart business attire.

    so yeah, it’s discriminatory.

    Reply ↓
  35. RVA Cat*

    “Clean-cut” for men and “polished” for women in my mind imply “preppy upper-middle-class appearance”. It especially chaps my hide for low-paying positions – there’s a subtext they want somebody with family money so they can underpay them without exposing their clientele to The Poors.

    Reply ↓
    1. CommanderBanana*

      Ugh, yes, I’ve seen descriptions saying they want “polished” appearances, and for women, that means: styled hair, no grays, makeup, manicured nails, expensive clothing, jewelry, heels, etc. The bar is higher and way more expensive to have a “polished” appearance as a woman than as a man.

      The irony is that I do all of the above, but I still balk at the expectation that someone should have to to be perceived as professional. I work in an office, not at an aesthetician’s office, and spreadsheets don’t care if I have gray hair.

      Reply ↓
  36. BlueSwimmer*

    Just dropping in to say that my butcher for a few years had hot pink hair, many tattoos, and facial piercings. She was an excellent butcher who did the job while going to grad school for her doctorate. Jenny the butcher/landlord on Dead Boy Detectives reminds me of her.

    Reply ↓
  37. SunnyShine*

    I work in the food quality industry. Whole we didn’t use the term “clean cut”, all policies dictate that the person must be clean and well groomed. It’s a hygenic concern if someone shows up with holes in their clothes or unwashed. Especially when you work with raw meat. If they can’t take care of their personal appearance, they most likely won’t follow the work place hygenic rules either.

    And as someone with brightly colored hair, I assure you that goth and brightly colored hair are no where in the same category as being overweight or other protected statuses.

    Reply ↓
  38. AbbieJoy*

    I own a small food business. I run my business out of a commissary kitchen, so there are all types of businesses in there.

    I don’t know this butcher, but in the context of food service as I know it – I think this just means clean and in clean clothes with a hairstyle that can be put back or is short enough to not require that. This is a client-facing role, which is different from many (most?) food service jobs, so people coming in will judge the business based on the cleanliness of the staff.

    I see folks in the commissary kitchen who look like they have not showered in recent memory, wear clothing that is stained/dirty and otherwise have personal hygiene that would make me think twice about eating their food. I would not assume this means anything about race, gender, weight, or needing to be cis presenting.

    Reply ↓
  39. Angeldrac*

    Ew. Nah – this has the same connotations for me as “bubbly personality”. It may be legal and “acceptable” but it also feels red-flaggy.

    Reply ↓
  40. CHRISTOPHER FRANKLIN*

    I live in the San Francisco Bay Area near an very nice butcher shop called the The Local Butcher Shop in Berkeley where the butchers often sport tattoos, probably long hair under their caps, and are very well trained professionals. If I saw an job listing asking for someone ask for “clean cut” employee, I would assume that it was coding for a young middle class white man.

    Reply ↓
  41. Moose*

    OP have you considered that the butcher shop near you asking for a “clean-cut” appearance is actually just someone trying to make a joke in their job ad so that it gets more engagement?

    Because honestly I think it’s funny and it’s the type of thing I would do.

    Reply ↓
  42. Filofaxes*

    Disney World and Disney Land park employees (“cast members”) probably have the strictest “clean cut” appearance guidelines around today and last time I was there (2023), there were POC cast members, not-skinny cast members, “goth-lite” cast members, etc. And I think WDW and DL have even relaxed their earlier rules about facial hair for men—before it was “never ever!” and now it might be “within reason and neatly trimmed.” The same MIGHT also apply to tattoos. But don’t quote me on that, I’m too lazy to look it up.

    Now there is still a lot to criticize about Disney’s employment practices as far as the parks specifically in terms of pay, guest entitlement, etc. But like, I really don’t see where “clean cut” is somehow translating to “Kate Moss and Chris Hemsworth Lookalikes only please” for some random butcher shop in Tumbleeweed, New Jersey. That the LW is not even going to apply to but just wrote in about so they could have performative SJW cred. Yay, I guess? Other people have wars in their countries, Kim.

    Reply ↓
  43. Formerly Retailed*

    Clean-cut to me reads as “The Disney Look” of the 1990s; a certain weight, natural hair colors, clean shaven, plain hair accessories to keep it pulled back, no eyeshadow, no “wild” nail polish colors, heavy emphasis on “All-American” looks, i.e. young, thin, white people in their late teens and early 20s who read as upper-middle class.

    Reply ↓
  44. Honoria Lucasta*

    In contrast to some other commenters, I think the “clean-cut” requirement is defensible on grounds other than hygiene: it may very well be part of the business’s aesthetic branding choice to have a vaguely throwback brand, and as long as their standards for that don’t extend to discriminating based on actual protected categories (like race, gender, etc) then it’s fine for them to say the style they’re looking for. And saying “clean-cut” gives them more latitude to weigh the overall balance of different elements. Listing explicitly “natural hair colors, no visible tattoos, no piercings” invites nit-picky enforcement of standards, where giving the general goal that implies “we want you to look clean and style yourself in a more conservative/traditional manner” allows your manager a little discretion on any individual point.

    Reply ↓
    1. CHRISTOPHER FRANKLIN*

      Ironically, that is my issue… what if the business’s aesthetic branding choice to have a vaguely throwback brand involves having only men as customer facing? It say that outright is illegal but “clean cut” is pretty much never used in regards to women much like “demure” is almost never used for men so there is a subtle communication that you want a man for the role. It reminds me of the term “articulate” which is rarely used in terms of white men but is often used somewhat pejoratively with black men.

      Reply ↓
  45. lilsheba*

    Oh for christs sake can we stop with the appearances thing already. Who cares whether someone has piercings or tattoos or long hair or facial hair or whatever as long as they are clean, a pleasant person and can do that damn job.

    Reply ↓
  46. New Senior Mgr*

    Front staff at a butcher shop, I’d prefer to see a clean-cut person as well.

    But I can see where you’re coming from because it can open the door to stereotyping and discrimination.

    Reply ↓
  47. Bob*

    I can understand why they use this phras. Understand no circumstances would I hire anyone that would complain about such a minor thing. I can already imagine how much work they would be.

    Reply ↓
  49. Seashell*

    When I was a teenager in the last century, my friend & I were trying to get a summer job at the same retail establishment. They hired me, but not her.

    During the training, I figured out why. The dress code involved one earring per ear, no dyed hair in a color not found in nature, and no unusual haircuts. My friend had a long braided “rat tail” and multiple earrings in each ear. I had 2 piercings in one ear, but I didn’t always wear 2 at a time and, even if I did, the 2nd was usually small.

    Reply ↓
  50. Yup*

    And the sign said
    “Long-haired freaky people
    Need not apply”
    So I tucked my hair up under my hat
    And I went in to ask him why
    He said, “You look like a fine upstandin’ young man
    I think you’ll do”
    So I took off my hat and said, “Imagine that
    Huh, me workin’ for you”
    Whoa

    Reply ↓
  51. Modesty Poncho*

    I don’t think I’ve seen “clean-cut” in my lifetime outside of Disneyland, and even they have come around to allowing tattoos and non-red nail polish. That’s what it conjures for me – an extremely specific look with long hair on women, short hair on men, no unnatural colors, only certain colors of polish and lipstick, no tattoos, no nonconforming gender expression.

    At best, it’s just a confusing term that doesn’t communicate clearly. By some peoples’ definitions here (clean and neat, hair pulled back, put together) my pink hair can be clean-cut. By other definitions it can’t be.

    Reply ↓
  52. Sparrow*

    As a trans person, I always get really nervous around job descriptions with phrasing like “clean cut appearance”, or any kind of strict dress code that bans things like dyed hair, piercings, tattoos, etc. My thought is always “This is a workplace that cannot abide even minor deviations from the norm, so how are they gonna handle the fact that my visibly trans self is a major deviation from the norm?” Thus far, every time I have attempted to apply at a place like this regardless, the answer has turned out to be “They do not handle it very well”.

    So I’m not saying that every business that uses phrasing like this or that bans dyed hair/piercings/tattoos/etc has explicitly anti-queer motivations… but I am saying that in my experience, they do very often go hand-in-hand, at least enough that I now tend to avoid any job posting that uses language like that. I am not someone who can pass as cis ever—the fact that I have both facial hair and visible breasts is usually the first indicator, even before we get into the fact that I use he/him pronouns and also enjoy wearing dresses—and for safety reasons, I am not particularly keen on showing up for an interview somewhere where I’ve gotten indications that people might not be cool with any of that.

    Reply ↓
    1. Sparrow*

      (Also, just want to make a quick point of clarification before someone takes this the wrong way: my comment about “visible breasts” obviously does not mean that I’m showing up to job interviews topless or anything, just that I have a large enough chest that it is pretty obvious my chest isn’t flat regardless of what I’m wearing.)

      Reply ↓
  53. LingNerd*

    I read “clean cut” as “look like you’ve showered recently and dress in a way that is not off-putting to customers.” But I can see where that would get into discrimination really quickly. Especially because what counts as off-putting to customers depends very heavily on where you are. It would be much better to specify – something like “must follow dress code, including covering all tattoos and having a clean shaven face.” Or whatever it is they mean

    Reply ↓
  54. DJ Abbott*

    Having grown up in the midwest in the 1960s-70s, I understand the meaning of clean cut. To me, it means someone who looks neat and clean and is not going to have a lot of hair getting in the food.
    It makes perfect sense that a food establishment would want people who look neat and clean working with and serving the food. I’m surprised they don’t do hats or hairnets though. Do they use gloves?
    Other commenters are probably right that they should spell it out more.

    Reply ↓

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