my company announced a “biggest loser” weight loss contest

by Alison Green on February 11, 2025

A reader writes:

My company announced a “biggest loser” weight loss challenge today and immediately my stomach sank. This was sent by the owner/founder of my small civil engineering company (about 40 employees). This is still so fresh for me I don’t even really have the words to express how many ways this is a horrible idea and would love your thoughts.

I have the words.

And those words begin with: how is this still happening in the year of our lord 2025?

It’s incredible that so many workplaces are still oblivious to how very problematic weight loss competitions can be for many people — people with eating disorders, first and foremost, but also anyone who’s trying to have a healthier relationship with food or avoid diet culture, people who need maintain their weight or gain weight (the assumption that everyone should lose weight is really weird), anyone who’s concerned about crash dieting, anyone who does want to lose weight but doesn’t want to engage with their coworkers about how it’s going, or anyone who simply doesn’t consider their diet or their weight to be any of their employer’s business.

That’s a lot of people, all told.

If your employer wants to encourage employees to make healthy choices, they’re welcome to provide healthy snacks, subsidize gym memberships, and offer excellent health insurance. Creating a contest around crash dieting isn’t the way to do it.

Are you up for pushing back about it? Ideally you’d talk to someone with some influence over it (HR might be the right place to start) and point out that experts advise against these competitions because they’re bad for such a wide range of people.

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{ 573 comments }

{ 573 comments… read them below or add one }

    1. Caramel & Cheddar*

      Also the prize money is $1000, which divided by $20 is 50,which is more employees than you have even if you assume literally everyone will participate.

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      1. Paint N Drip*

        I wonder if the person who wrote the flyer is not good at math or the company is actually contributing. I have much more intensely bad feelings about a company-SPONSORED weight loss challenge than a company-organized one, although the whole thing is gross

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            1. Festively Dressed Earl*

              You know how we girls are, adding Greek letters and functions and differentiation and glitter to perfectly good math. /s

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              3. JustaTech*

                Math with numbers is hard. I prefer math with letters.
                (This is a calculus joke from college. But also, I do like algebra/calculus more than arithmetic.)

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            2. SnackAttack*

              Girl math was started by women on TikTok to poke fun at themselves for little habits that some women have when it comes to numbers (like, if I buy a dress for $40 and return it 2 months later, I’m actually making $40. Or if I pay with cash, I’m not spending any money). It was clearly a joke and not a serious commentary on how women think (every woman is obviously very aware that they’re just breaking even if they return an item), but of course it got taken seriously by men and misogynists in general and used as an example of why “women suck at math.”

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              1. Not Tom, Just Petty*

                Yeah, “incel” was started by a woman as well. This why people can’t have nice things. They become all peopled up by people.

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                2. Susannah*

                  I remember when I found out what “incel” meant – and actually thought it was a bunch of frustrated, angry guys trying to come up with a more sympathetic way of describing themselves that we described this group when I was in college.

                  Oh – we called it “can’t get laid.”

          2. Sarah With an H*

            Omg I missed that part
            It is truly incredible how much problematic content they managed to stuff into one flyer, on top of the awfulness of the idea to begin with

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            1. LifebeforeCorona*

              So many passive aggressive statements about food. But no real help aside from inspirational quotes. And giving side eye to anyone having a donut. It’s actually a work of art in how to be tone deaf.

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              1. I Have RBF*

                It was kind of triggering, actually. So much diet culture misogyny! It made me want to binge on donuts and muffins!

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              2. I AM a Lawyer*

                Or “you can have pizza but only if you run to the restaurant and back.” Such toxic diet culture nonsense.

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                1. MigraineMonth*

                  Yeah, this flier alone made me lose my appetite. Which is bad, because I need to eat to provide necessary nutrition and fuel to my body.

              3. Falling Diphthong*

                If there’s one thing that’s been made crystal clear over the last 50 years of people trying to lose weight in the US, it’s that all you need is an inspirational quote.

                “If you wake up early, work hard, and never give up, your dreams can come true if you’re born rich.”

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          3. MikeM_inMD*

            Calculating percentage is fancier than the simple math of total pounds lost, and since I can’t think of a third method to judge this “contest”, I’m not sure what “fancy [person] math” they are thinking of.

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            2. Not Tom, Just Petty*

              Oh, they mean how “girls” do mental gymnastics to absolve calories…”that cookie is broken so the calories all fell out, tee hee.”

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          4. Her My Own Knee*

            That part made me LOL. This whole thing sounds like it’s written by someone who thinks it’s still 1977.

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          5. LaurCha*

            ew I didn’t get that far, but “fancy girl math” just makes me want to puke. There are SO MANY THINGS offensive about this nonsense. Gross.

            Reply ↓
          1. Ace in the Hole*

            I was assuming it’s supposed to read as “Fancy-girl math,” meaning you don’t have to be fancy to do this math. As opposed to “fancy girl-math,” which would mean…. I don’t even know.

            Either way it’s still the weird and kinda gross cherry on a shit sundae.

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            1. Not Tom, Just Petty*

              No, it’s “girl math” at tik-tok trend where women posted, “I saved $150 dollars today!” And then explains they drove to four stores, signed up for three apps, used two gift cards and found on pair of designer shoes on sale for $90.”
              Male voice, “so you spent $90 plus gas and time?”
              Woman in video: “no, I saved $150. Duh.”

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      2. Carol the happy*

        W. T. F.

        These workplace weight contests violate HIPAA (Percentage of body overweight?)

        These contests discourage healthy eating as a lifelong choice instead of a sprint.
        The idea that pushback would be possible is flawed. Pushback coming from someone with a “muffin top” would come across as self-serving at best. What about the person who has battled extra weight for decades and has reluctantly decided on bariatric surgery- can she play this game?

        Anyone who had adolescent eating disorders could be triggered to their literal death.

        I have seen this fail before. And failure is the only possible outcome here.

        I’m in healthcare, and a hospital I worked in in the 90s had one of these “Contests”.

        It wasn’t pretty, or “cutesy” like this one is, it was “Science-based and Medicalese” but no less judgemental. It came down from the Administrators, and dieticians who dreamed this up “To show an example to the patients we serve!”

        It was a massive shame-fest, and the psychiatrists were furious. (FenPhen was the new panacea for weight loss, and several hospital staff were going to other clinics not in our HMO to get it. Look up FenPhen on Wikipedia for a quick history)

        We had people being admitted to the hospital WHO WORKED AT THE HOSPITAL.

        There wasn’t an honest “opt out” for anyone, even the custodial staff were “invited to participate”. The fees were taken from our health plan extras in the payroll (We got $25 per month for discretionary healthy spending- and I was saving for a really nice prosthetic bra because my first reconstruction had left scar tissue right under seams on most bras.)

        When I had cancer return, a second mastectomy, two different rounds of chemo, and hair loss, my weight went down to 82 lbs. Some coworkers were jealous of “how easy I made it look”, even when they saw my bald head and heard me vomiting in the bathroom.

        My oncologist told everybody involved that “Healthy calories are the ones that don’t get vomited into the toilet!”

        My coworker, Jennifer, an RN, had maybe 20 lbs to lose after her third baby- but she had developed Anorexia Nervosa as a teenager, and this triggered her back into the disorder. She was found unconscious in a stairwell, because she couldn’t afford to pay the gym fees and was running the 8 floors several times an hour. She suffered a mild brain bleed in the fall, and had to give up her career for 2 years while she had TBI rehabilitative therapy.

        They almost announced her as the winner in the women age 25-35 category; she would have won a $1000 prize and a prized parking space.

        Can you get a local hospital RD to try to slam it down hard? Maybe a Psychiatrist to speak against it?

        I would definitely leak it to the local news health reporter, except that he/she might think it’s a positive thing.

        Good luck!

        Reply ↓
            1. Eldritch Office Worker*

              If you’re a medical archivist you’d fall under the same umbrella. If you’re not, then your organization might choose to follow HIPAA guidelines but you’re not bound by HIPAA in the legal sense.

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        2. Someone Online*

          Point of clarification, it would not be a HIPAA violation if participants voluntarily share their own information.

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        3. LifebeforeCorona*

          And the reporter would start her segment with the usual shots of womens’ stomachs and behinds like every other news story about weight.

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        4. Clisby*

          I don’t see how this violates HIPAA, since employers are exempt from that, but it’s a terrible idea nonetheless.

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        5. Ace in the Hole*

          This is terrible for many reasons, but it doesn’t violate HIPAA.

          First, because this isn’t associated with a healthcare provider or health plan. HIPAA only covers certain circumstances, and “extracurricular weight loss club” isn’t one. Just like if you ran, say, a theme park and took people’s height/weight for ride safety… that info is not legally protected.

          Second, the participants would be consenting to share their own information. HIPAA allows a person’s private information to be shared as long as they consent to the use/disclosure.

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        6. MigraineMonth*

          I was briefly working IT at a hospital ten years ago when I had lunch with a couple of nurse. They said my piece of cake looked great but they couldn’t have it because they were competing in a Biggest Losers competition put on by the hospital. I laughed.

          They weren’t joking, and earnestly explained to me that it was a great idea, the hospital did it regularly, and it was really motivating. I said I was sure it was motivating, but awarding cash based on a person’s ability to drop an extreme amount of weight in a short period of time seemed dangerous, especially if you do it repeatedly. Not to mention it seemed bad for patient care to have all the providers simultaneously starving themselves.

          They thought I was being ridiculous. I retaliated by eating my cake.

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    3. Pastor Petty Labelle*

      But its worth it for office fame and glory.

      Did someone actually write those words without dying of laughter? If you are doing something for office fame and glory in a serious way, please take a moment to re-evaluate your life choices.

      Reply ↓
      1. MigraineMonth*

        I’ve competed for office fame and glory, but that was creating a meme, not doing my best to destroy my body.

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        1. Kyrielle*

          Yeah, I feel like when we redecorated a filing cabinet as a Tardis we were in the ballpark of ‘office fame and glory’ but no people (or filing cabinets!) were damaged by this stunt. (And yes, we got the permission of the person who was responsible for the filing cabinet first. After she stopped laughing so hard she couldn’t speak, because she apparently loved the idea.)

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    4. Hey, I'm Wohrking Heah!*

      Yes that was my “spit coffee out” moment. I have MILK in my coffee so it has CALORIES, btw. Based on your screen name you’d best not apply there…

      If LW is on, curious if there have been other, over-the-top contests at this job or if someone has just recently gone full Mean Girl. Timing makes me thing they saw their 2025 health insurance premiums and are maybe getting a break if they incentivize “wellness.” Old job was desperate for us to lose weight but at least if wasn’t run like this goat rodeo.

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        1. Hlao-roo*

          Your comment nested correctly as a reply to Caramel & Cheddar’s 11:02am comment! This site puts the comment box directly under the comment you’re replying to while you’re typing, but once you submit it will place your comment below all the earlier replies (so Caramel & Cheddar at 11:04am, Dread Pirate Roberts at 11:05am, Pastor Petty Labelle at 11:19am, and you at 11:23am all replied directly to the top-level comment from Caramel & Cheddar).

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          2. Lenora Rose*

            It’s nested correctly but sometimes it’s really hard to tell. I keep wishing I could collapse replies between the one I’m looking at and the one it was responding to (because sometimes how a comment hits REALLY varies depending exactly who they’re agreeing with or disagreeing with), or otherwise have a more explicit link between them.

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            1. Caramel & Cheddar*

              I often wish there was an “up” button/link, that is something I could click to immediately jump up and see what comment someone was replying to if there have been lots of replies.

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      3. GammaGirl1908*

        Haaaaaaaaaaaa @ “goat rodeo.”

        I would — and have — just stare at the organizer with narrowed eyes and deadpan, “Actually, I’d rather just stay fat.”

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    5. Slow Gin Lizz*

      Yeah, you gotta wonder how many people would be excited to pay to be part of this thing. Even if I might be interested in it (I’m not), I am such a cheapskate that I absolutely would NOT pay to participate in any kind of work-sponsored event like this.

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      2. JustCuz*

        But also like what about people who have been prescribed weight loss meds by their doctor? Wouldn’t they just have a better opportunity of winning?

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          2. TeratomasAreWeird*

            Or amputation? Gives birth? Just saying, there are a lot of ways to lose weight. I once lost 8lbs in one day thanks to the removal of a seriously overachieving benign ovarian tumor.

            Reply ↓
            1. JustaTech*

              I once scared the heck out of my GP’s nurse when I reported my weight before a tele-visit. “Uh, you’ve lost 30 pounds in 2 months?!” (His tone was *very* concerned.)
              “Oh, gosh, yes, don’t worry, I had a baby!” (My last GP visit had been right before I delivered.)
              “Oh thank goodness!”

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      3. Hannah Lee*

        Several times over the years, I’ve decided to try to lose weight and did took the usual steps (following circa 1970’s-2010’s advice) with varying success. One consistent pattern I experienced was if I was making changes on my own, and having some success – increasing stamina, strength, losing weight slowly – over a period of time, and a friend/sister noticed and wanted to join in and do it too, it would sound like a good idea:

        “we can compare notes, support and encourage each other, walk/meal plan/talk strategies together”

        within 2 weeks, my progress completely stalled, I lost momentum and focus and by week 4 had completely bailed on the idea. Apparently this is a solo activity for me, and “being accountable to others” is something my contrarian “you are not the boss of me” lizard brain rebels against. And I am okay with that.

        Having a whole gang of people … at work … tracking and discussing and comparing and *cajoling* and *competing*? Oh, man, I can’t even imaging the dysfunction that would kick up. I might have to start applying for new jobs.

        And that’s even before I remember all the science that has come out most “diets” don’t really work, and crash diets/intense weight loss competitions really don’t work and can mess you up (for example the findings from the follow up to The Biggest Loser and other intense weight loss/fitness challenges) PLUS considering how difficult this would be for anyone who has any eating disorder history, or is just trying to exist in their bodies day to day with some modicum of peace.

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      4. Shipbuilding Techniques*

        I must be weird, because I would be kind of excited to participate in this. The competition would (finally) motivate me. I do see how it could be upsetting to some, though, and not the messaging everyone should be subjected to at work.

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        1. Calamity Janine*

          for what it’s worth, if a competition is what you want to push yourself forward… there are also way better ways to get that, too, than workplace schemes :) it’s very much an activity that can be casually gameified, and there are a lot of apps and communities doing just that. i don’t know of exact ones off the top of my head, as my tastes run in the direct opposite direction, but i do know that they’re out there! and according to the memes of those who do know these things, in some parts of australia, one tracker/scheduler for running groups is the new best dating app, lol!

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    6. LaminarFlow*

      Wondering if payment can be made in the “Fancy Girl Math” that is noted in point #4?

      Is Michael Scott rounding everyone up for group weigh-in on Daryl’s scale in the warehouse??

      Reply ↓
      1. pagooey*

        Every single time one of these workplace weight contests comes up, I picture Kelly Kapoor fainting and falling off that damn scale. Great minds, etc.

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    7. AngryOctopus*

      I mean, my old job had a fitness contest, where you paid like $10 and then competed against yourself to improve the most. There was an option for people who wanted weight loss but it was not counted in the contest. And the winner got to pick the charity to donate the money too. So we were all fine with it. It was not anywhere close to whatever this is.

      Reply ↓
  2. Tammy 2*

    Sorry, I have reached capacity for inspirational quotes and “I can’t believe you ate that” looks. Please check back never.

    Reply ↓
      1. Slow Gin Lizz*

        But seriously, I am so very tired of any conversation that includes judgment about food. It’s food, people, and we need food to survive. I’m definitely not the healthiest of eaters but because I’m pretty thin and was even skinnier as a child, I got a lot of compliments about how I must be such a healthy eater and exerciser, etc., and was always like, no, I just have a high metabolism and couldn’t gain weight no matter how hard I tried when I was younger. Then I turned 30, gained some weight, and suddenly my doctor and my parents were like, oy, you’re overweight and should lose some!

        Can’t win, is my point. Everyone is so judgey about people’s weight and body size and I’m totally over it. I’m pretty much proof positive that we have very little control over our body sizes and I get really mad when people get judgey about other people’s sizes. I did lose a bunch of weight when the pandemic hit because I was too upset to eat much, and a few people were like, hey, you look great, good for you! And I was like, no, it’s not good, I’ve not been eating much and I feel terrible and hungry all the time.

        Anyway, sorry about the rant, I just…am so ranty about this particular subject.

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        1. kicking-k*

          Word.
          I realised just how infinitesimally little thought people put in before they fat-shame people when it started happening to my baby. Who not only had no control over her food intake or anything else, but was exclusively breastfed.

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            1. kicking-k*

              I do NOT KNOW what is wrong with people. At least a pre-verbal baby can’t understand what they are saying, but during the toddler years I had to ask people to stop commenting. I’ve considered whether, as I am not the thinnest person you’ve ever met, it was actually sideways criticism of me, for (in their minds) feeding her inappropriately? Never got any commentary on my other child, who happens to be more slightly built.

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              1. JustCuz*

                as a “fat baby” I appreciate you shutting it down. As I grew, I was by no means fat anymore, but still family referred to me as fat?!!?! Guess what I still have at 40? An eating disorder. Bonus points for coming of age in the late 90’s/early 2000s. Shut that shit down!

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                1. kicking-k*

                  I did and do… I’ve always been very careful to avoid talking critically about anyone’s body (which I wouldn’t anyway), and certainly not my own, in my children’s presence. I don’t have control over what other people do but I can model acceptance and demonstrate that I love my children exactly as they happen to be. But I wish we were not still fighting this fight! Among many others.

            2. Rectilinear Propagation*

              Whatever is wrong is widespread because this also happened to my sister with her third son when he was a baby.

              Reply ↓
            3. Dogwoodblossom*

              I’ve seen people do this and it’s absolutely bonkers. Especially because *to me* a fat baby (of any species) triggers deep satisfaction in the primal part of my brain. I’m not even particularly into babies but I’ll see a baby and be like “Yes. Fat well fed healthy baby, excellent.”

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            4. pope suburban*

              I just saw something on Threads where a mom was wondering how to stop her year-old baby from waking every night “looking for calories” and I just…the way she phrased it gave me a primal level of ick. Your child is growing and developing at a ferocious rate. She’s *meant* to be seeking nutrition because she needs fuel for all that. Framing it as some kind of shameful nuisance behavior that needs to be stopped is horrifying and, if not curbed, will give her serious problems around food (and, depending on how far it’s taken, will impact her development). Feed the baby when she’s hungry. If you’re confused or concerned, talk to her pediatrician. Do not take to the wilds of the internet so you can ask random strangers how to put your baby on a diet.

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          2. Meow*

            If you don’t breastfeed, they will tell you that formula babies are more likely to be overweight, so you literally cannot ever win.

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            1. kicking-k*

              No, you can’t win! I hasten to say, this was NOT intended as criticism on my part of any parent who chooses or needs to use formula. Fed is best.

              I only mentioned nursing because almost all the people who passed comment would have seen me nursing the baby. So there wasn’t even that as a possible point of criticism…

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              1. Just me*

                Back in the ‘70s when I took my eldest in for his 4 month checkup the doctor (!) told me to quit breast feeding and give him skim milk. I was naive and followed his instructions. Thank goodness I figured outp a couple of years later to take crazy instructions like that with a grain of salt and use a little common sense.

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              1. Arglebarglor NP*

                Hi, Family medicine NP here. We don’t restrict calories on kids EVER, but before 2 we don’t even encourage skim milk. Whole milk until age 2. Then skim is ok, and we restrict the amount to <8 oz/day (because kids should not be drinking their calories, they get too full on too much milk and don't eat enough food and they get anemic, it's a thing). If kids are on the top edge or are off the top edge of the growth chart we encourage an hour a day of exercise, no screens, and no fruit juice/soda/energy drinks etc. We try to have them grow into their weight.

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                1. Slow Gin Lizz*

                  Thank you! I suspected that you should never restrict calories for kids and I appreciate you chiming in to confirm this. I didn’t know about the milk/anemia thing, that’s interesting. I did know you’re supposed to do whole milk for young kids because they need the fat. And it’s too bad that fruit juice has been given a reputation of being health “because fruit,” because it’s really just pure sugar with all the good stuff that fruit has. Marketing…I tell ya….

                  Also, as a person who says arglebargle not infrequently, I love your username.

                2. kicking-k*

                  That’s what we’ve always done with both our kids, being careful not to make exercise or healthy food punitive in any way. (The baby in question was born 99.6 centile for length AND weight, followed her growth lines, and is still the tallest in the class, and still growing. So she just seems to be a big child, and I hate that I feel I have to justify this! We’ve never had any criticism of her health from a medical professional.)

          4. Commenter 505*

            That’s messed up for more reasons than I can name. When anyone got even *close* to fat shaming my kids as a baby/toddler, I’d say heartily, “Yep! He’s really good at growing!”

            I also say that to my kids at their yearly checkups, regardless of their measurements. “You did some good growing this year, kid!”

            Most parents want for their kids to thrive. Nobody has a right to suggest that a child is thriving “too much.” Kid bodies grow in different ways than adult bodies, because that’s just how it works. Kind of like a puppy with enormous paws. We can see that there’s plenty more growing to be done!

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            1. Hannah Lee*

              Plus a lot of kids have 2-step growth spurts, like shoot up and then fill out a bit, or fill out a bit and then shoot up. It’s normal! Their bodies are just doing what growing bodies do. And some bodies are naturally thicker or lankier than others.

              As long as the kid is health and happy, great! And strangers, friends, family should keep their body shaming judgements, comments to themselves. NOBODY needs to hear them, especially not a child.

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          5. Buffy will save us*

            My aunt, who for sure has an undiagnosed eating disorder stemming from being overweight as a child, has been fat-shaming her grandnephew’s baby behind his back. (Not to me or I would say something.) Its crazy how ingrained that nonsense is.

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        3. ferrina*

          Yes!
          Our culture is so weird about weight in so many ways. As a teenager, I was extremely athletic- I would regularly play 2 hours of sports per day, if not more (record was 6 hours on a school day). And according to my mother (who dealt with an ED as a teen) and the BMI index in my doctor’s office, I was “overweight”. Nevermind that I was extremely healthy and active.

          And the food is a whole different issue. It’s something I file under “Let Adults Mind Their Own Business”, along with topics like health conditions and how people deal with their family and career. If you ask, I have an opinion, but until then, I assume you know your business best.

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          1. Lenora Rose*

            BMI can’t tell the difference between muscle and fat, so almost every single athlete with visible muscle is “overweight”. Which shows how absurd it is.

            (Nevermind that they changed the criteria at one point so hundreds of thousands of people went from “normal” to “overweight” overnight without changing a thing about themselves, which proves how fake it is.)

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              1. JustaTech*

                And it’s a population tool, not an individual tool!
                Grr. It was invented because nothing better existed, but now we know it’s not good for individuals so we need to invent something better (or more likely, a whole suite of metrics to evaluate individual’s overall health on multiple axis, but that’s hard and one number is easy and arrgh).

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        4. Chirpy*

          And on the opposite side, I gained a bunch of weight during the pandemic, because I’m a stress eater and thanks to an old injury, I can’t always exercise it off…and doctors never listen that the pain is not caused by the weight, the weight is caused *by the pain*.

          When I’m not in pain, and not as stressed, the excess weight comes off! (But still not enough to hit a “good BMI”, because BMI is crap and if I weighed what it says for my height, I’d be an unhealthy stick with no muscle.)

          Your rant is totally justified!

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          1. Rainy*

            Yeah. BMI always feels like the doctor’s office version of that thing where the actual impact of your work is very hard to measure so they fall back on measuring what can be measured and calling it your target…even if it doesn’t actually have much of a direct relationship to what you are doing and accomplishing.

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          2. Slow Gin Lizz*

            BMI is a load of crap that was created by an insurance agent and is merely a mean/average of weight and other measurements that was used to grant or not grant life insurance based on someone’s arbitrary life expectancy based on their weight. And is also racist and sexist since he only used white men (or at least white people, but I think only cis men) to create the chart. TOTAL BS, is BMI.

            And as to your point re: muscle, of course muscle weighs more than fat but BMI definitely doesn’t take that into account either.

            (Did I mention I’m ranty about this subject matter?)

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            1. lanfy*

              Extra fun fact about BMI: those weight ranges are based on guesswork and personal preferences rather than actual science.

              The BMI range at which people are healthiest is actually the low ‘overweight’ range. And you have to go quite a way into ‘obese’ before your health outcomes become as bad as the low ‘normal’.

              The whole thing is a sizeist crock. I recommend listening to back episodes of the ‘Maintenance Phase’ podcast n order to really get your rage on.

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              1. Slow Gin Lizz*

                I’m a huge Maintenance Phase fan! Agreed, people should listen to it if they want to know how bad sizeism really is. To paraphrase Aubrey Gordon, it’s basically people making fun of fat people for literally just existing in the only body they’ve ever had.

                Love that people are healthiest at the low “overweight” range. I’m continuously arguing with my mother about how she wants to lose weight b/c she’s a little bit overweight and I’m like, Mom, first of all, “overweight” is BS but also, if you get sick, you’re going to want a little bit of extra weight because it’s been shown that people who have a little extra weight have better outcomes than thin people do. At almost 79 years old, this is something she should really be concerned with. (She doesn’t have diabetes or high blood pressure, so nothing that requires any kind of special diet.)

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        5. Dog momma*

          And for another viewpoint, I lost the 6 pound tumor with my surgery, but my digestive system was so messed up I had to eat small freq meals throughout the day, and oh by the way, continue to deal with food aversion, yes its a thing post chemo and yes its permanent. So am on a fairly limited diet. when I was actively trying to lose weight prior to that, I consumed 1200 calories or kess…which is not good for you & unsustainable. If I want to talk weight loss and diets, I will. If you are my employer… butt out..NOYB.

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          1. Mazie*

            No useful comment, I just wanted to send you some mom hugs. It sounds like you have been through a lot. I hope things are getting better now for you.

            Reply ↓
          2. Orora*

            I’m on a diabetes injectible (similar to Ozempic). I need to eat regularly to maintain even blood sugar. But the drugs have given me food aversion. I’ll be hungry but nothing sounds good to eat. I will faint or throw up because food sounds gross and I can’t eat. It’s awful.

            (And if anyone is out there saying, “It sounds great to hate eating”, please rethink your relationship with food.)

            Reply ↓
            1. Rainy*

              One of my friends was put on Ozempic for diabetes the second it hit the market (nothing else was working–he had tried all the meds, was on a super strict diet, nothing helped and things were only getting worse) and over time his A1c dropped, all his numbers improved dramatically, and I think he’d only been taking it for a couple of years at most when his Type II diabetes was completely reversed. Unfortunately, he was absolutely miserable the whole time–the Ozempic nauseated him 24/7, he could barely keep food down, and as a result he was so weak he couldn’t work out and lost muscle tone–and when he was down to what he felt was a comfortable weight for his frame, it didn’t stop, because he couldn’t keep food down. It took him a long time to get weaned off the shots safely and I don’t think his appetite has recovered.

              One of my cousins was prescribed the oral version by some quack from whatever fly by night weightloss “practice” her employer had taken a kickback from and lost a bunch of weight in one year, was taken off the oral meds immediately, no warnings or stepping down, and despite continuing with her diet plan and exercise regimen, gained it all back in two months because she could actually keep food down for the first time in 12 months.

              Reply ↓
          3. Slow Gin Lizz*

            Oh, hey, but good for you for losing that six pounds all in one go! (Sarcasm, of course.) So sorry, Dog momma, that sounds really hard.

            Reply ↓
        6. Always Tired*

          There is one category of food to be judgy about: unsafely prepared/stored food.

          Raw milk? Ew, especially with this bird flu going around. Rebel canning? absolutely not, nature is too heavy handed with the botox. High Meat? Straight to jail. (If you don’t know that one, please do not look it up.)

          That’s it. If it can kill you, there it a way to almost completely remove the risk, and you decide the dicey way is better, I will pass judgement.

          Reply ↓
          1. Lenora Rose*

            Oh, lord, yes this.

            (High meat sounds terrifying. Sounds like something the “jars of mold” lady from another AAM post would have created by accident as a gift.)

            Reply ↓
          2. JustaTech*

            Yes!
            The only food that is “bad” is food that is in fact, *bad*, as in contaminated with bacteria/parasites/viruses/molds/heavy metals that will make you sick.

            Basically for all of human existence the struggle has been “get enough food”. Yes, we live in a time of abundance, but that doesn’t mean we should turn our noses up at the ways people have invented to keep food safe!

            Reply ↓
        7. A Cita*

          Yes! I eat the healthiest one can possibly eat and do not over eat or eat the wrong foods at the wrong time, etc etc etc. And I weight lift, do resistance exercise, yoga, and run. And I can not lose even 1 pound. And it’s because of hormone stuff. Before I was super skinny no matter what I ate. You can never win in other people’s eyes. It’s exhausting.

          Reply ↓
        8. MigraineMonth*

          If I’m losing weight, it is because of nausea so severe I can’t eat solid food. Compliment it at your own effing risk.

          (One of my ex-bf’s mother told me every time she saw me that I looked great and must have lost weight. After some attempts to evade, I finally just replied with a big smile: “Nope, I’ve actually gained weight!” which confused her into stopping.)

          Reply ↓
        9. Raida*

          The only time I’m okay wit being food-judgy is when a mate has said they are not going to eat pizza! and then they are.
          Or they are diabetic and say “I’ll just have more insulin” while eating a chocolate sundae.
          Or they specifically said “Now you call me out on this if I’m snacking!”
          Or we are going to dinner and they are eating beforehand – dude, it’s a home cooked meal, they specifically made food *you* would like, this is just rude.

          Like, there needs to be a framework for *why* in that moment the specific type of food/volume of food is in any way my concern.

          Reply ↓
          1. Calamity Janine*

            if the diabetic is managing their own situation, why do they get judged for eating what they like? insulin is a tool to be used, after all, and you described someone appropriately taking care of themselves.

            what other medical conditions will you judge me for having and appropriately managing with approved treatments because i happen to have both them and ice cream?

            Reply ↓
        1. StressedButOkay*

          It’s SO “mean girls” it’s not even funny. “It’s all love…” Except for the…what, 10?, insults/judgey comments in the flyer ALONE.

          I cannot imagine the atmosphere in that office as this kicks off. I hope someone pushes back and stops this…or leans in really hard to eating pizza and “bad” things for you every day. Bring the judging, folks, I survived high school.

          Reply ↓
          1. Slow Gin Lizz*

            “I’m doing this for your own good.”

            “This’ll hurt me more than it hurts you.”

            Classic abuser lines.

            Reply ↓
          2. Raida*

            Oh yeah, I’d be tempted to exercise more *and* bake every weekend just so I’d lose weight, not be in their competition, and be eating pizza and bikkies.

            Spite is a powerful motivator, lol

            Reply ↓
        2. Some Words*

          I only made it about a third of the way in. I’d read enough fat shaming comments to get their mind-set. It’s mean and judgey.

          Reply ↓
  3. GovernerdsUnited*

    I would also point out that pregnant people are not going to be able to participate, which could be consider discriminatory. I realize this particular program is optional, but the language in the flyer is *very* guilt-trippy. Have fun being judged for everything you eat for the next several weeks–whether you’re participating or not. This is just yikes all around.

    OP, I would seriously consider pushing back on this, and pointing out how much this type of activity, even for folks who opt out, is extremely pressuring and unhealthy. Good luck.

    Reply ↓
      1. Chauncy Gardener*

        I would make sure I was having chocolate, pizza, fast food, anything “bad” every single day of this competition in front of all the mean girls in this totally messed up company.

        Reply ↓
        1. Oniya*

          Ideally, really good *smelling* bad stuff. Heat that chocolate cake just a little in the microwave to make sure everyone can tell what you have.

          Reply ↓
    2. ScruffyInternHerder*

      At OldJob, it was run by a judgemental jerk. I did not participate (was training for an endurance event – dieting and major endurance training do not play nicely) and when he called me on the carpet in a meeting, I asked him if he was trying to make sure I was undernourished for my training and wanted me to do harm to myself by doing so.

      Reply ↓
      1. londonedit*

        Yeah, I was going to say, I would not be participating in this anyway because it’s generally a horrible idea, but also because I’m currently training for the London Marathon and no one gets to tell me what I can and can’t eat during my training, thanks. I’d also really like it if we could all manage to uncouple exercise from weight loss (the whole ‘yes you can have a pizza but only if you run there and back!!’ thing is really yucky – exercise is not punishment for something you’ve eaten, and calories are not things to be ‘earned’ by forcing yourself to exercise).

        Reply ↓
          1. JustCuz*

            No, its not. You might if you are lucky burn like 300 calories depending on your weight and what not. Its more about genetics and relationships with food. if I could show you a picture from 1940 of my deep south coal mine living depression era grandmother and her mother and her mother, and all her sisters and then a picture of me, you would be like that makes sense lol. Totally different types of food eaten, I have far more access to food than they ever did in the hills of West Virginia. Certainly they didn’t have access to sugar like I do. And yet … our bodies are exactly the same! Health conditions? Exactly the same. My own grandmother, exactly the same.

            Reply ↓
        3. MigraineMonth*

          Exercise is important to health, metabolism and *maintaining* a healthy weight. It’s *not* a good way to lose weight, in part because if you’re trying to get in better shape you need calories and protein to build muscle (and muscle is heavy).

          Also, unless the store is 20 miles away, you aren’t going to “burn off” a pizza. Especially if you’re in shape enough to do the run, because the more your body adapts to an exercise like running, the more efficient you get at it and the fewer calories you burn.

          Reply ↓
      1. Verity Kindle*

        This is my favourite hypothetical outcome, because you just *know* it’s going to ruin these awful peoples’ enjoyment of their judgey competition.

        Reply ↓
      2. Paint N Drip*

        YES cound me in – that would be such a hilarious victory!!! Yes I ate what I wanted, exercised how I wanted, and ignored your toxic BS and would you look at that, 10-30 pounds just evaporated

        Reply ↓
      3. Hey, I'm Wohrking Heah!*

        Yay pregnant women! What a way to get outed during this competition if you hadn’t told the office yet. Also, menopause cares not that you eat celery and drink lemon water whilst destroying knees on treadmill. Menopause magically turns celery into fat.
        This company should just buy everyone Ozempic and get it over with. (Sarcasm).

        Reply ↓
        1. The OG Sleepless*

          As a lifelong thin person who gained an extremely unwelcome 25 pounds after menopause, and can’t get rid of it no matter what, truth.

          Reply ↓
          1. Hey, I'm Wohrking Heah!*

            I read that the average is 22-25 lbs. So congrats on being average ;-) But that is my own personal battle and process of accepting the “new me”. It says a lot about the culture and time we grew up in, none of which I’d want to discuss or try and “fix” at work.

            Reply ↓
      4. JustCuz*

        Aw man that was my niece! Unfortunately she came the 18th! Other than that, what is wrong with this person at this office?

        Reply ↓
      1. A gentle reminder*

        Only people with a uterus can be pregnant, which isn’t just women. (Nonbinary people and trans men can be pregnant too)

        Reply ↓
        1. MigraineMonth*

          Thank you for the reminder.

          Discrimination against pregnant people is still be considered sex discrimination in the US, since the large majority of people who get pregnant are women.

          Reply ↓
    5. BlueBerryCheeseCake*

      This!! I am on a post-tumor-surgery HRT and damn losing weight is f***ing impossible! I hate everything about this, so many meds make losing weight impossible.

      Reply ↓
    7. wfh_addict*

      I’m as horrified by this as anyone else, but, taking the rules at face value, wouldn’t someone about to give birth at weigh-in time be in a good position to win?

      Reply ↓
    2. Mother of Corgis*

      I love that on top of everything else, they managed to get a little sexism in there too with the “girl math” comment /s.

      Reply ↓
  5. Anonym*

    Cripes. Is there any research or authoritative resource that OP can share with the company on actually effective ways of supporting employee health? Allison’s got the suggestions up above, but I’m wondering about easiest/best ways to convince them to change tack.

    Reply ↓
    1. Bird names*

      It would be lovely to convince these people. Considering the complete cluelessness displayed in the flyer though, I personally would not have high hopes tbh.

      Reply ↓
      1. Hey, I'm Wohrking Heah!*

        Agreed Bird. I’d probably just bring in a dozen donuts every day until the end of the competition, walk around and offer to the instigators of this, eat one in front of them & watch them squirm.

        Reply ↓
    2. Tammy 2*

      I would love to see organizations support employee mental health by not bringing toxic diet culture into the workplace.

      If convincing them not to do it doesn’t work or doesn’t feel like a viable option, calmly opting out and refusing to entertain conversation about why is fine–and and if enough people do that, it’ll die on the vine.

      Reply ↓
    3. Calamity Janine*

      i know that this borders on armchair diagnosis, but i will defend myself on this one with “i am unfortunately correct about systemic societal issues and how they are perpetuated by those who have internalized them” –

      somebody who is so deep in the paint that they believe this is appropriate, with this expression of diet culture and feeling entitled to make other people’s medical decisions and dismissing the idea that health is more than just Make Number Go Down and all the rest?

      they have put on their blinders a long time ago. they have married those blinders. they are celebrating their diamond anniversary with those blinders.

      this level of toxicity is something that they can’t just accept as bad unless they redo a major part of their worldview. it’s built upon this harmful and incorrect premise. and this is a toxicity where it’s going to also depend on a referendum about their own self-worth and how they determine that.

      if they hate or love themselves based on what the scale says, and think so hard that everyone also does this to the point where they think all of this is acceptable (!) in the workplace (!!) much less society in general (!!!)… the adjustment is going to have to go down to bedrock to correct it. that is work that generally you can’t induce someone to do. they have to choose to do it. it is a fundamental referendum on how they see the world, and how they see their very existence.

      we can, and should, tell them “absolutely not”. just like many other people’s maladaptive coping strategies, you don’t get the right to hurt other people just because you’re going through it. you’re not allowed to do that any more than you’re allowed to break everyone’s noses about it, and we also need to tell folks doing this that it’s not acceptable just as how it’s unacceptable to go “but this is my emotional support bigotry that means i get to hurt others and uphold harmful systemic prejudice”. but changing that person’s mind is not a quick endeavor. it’s also something that probably isn’t even in the wheelhouse of a coworker to begin with. it’s a big enough problem that you need someone with those professional therapy skills to challenge things, knock the whole thing down, and rebuild it safely.

      it would be a really cool world if there was just a magic spell to go “bippity boppity boo, here’s the research conclusively disproving your worldview” was enough and also worked all the time. i mean before becoming disabled i was aiming to be a science writer. i have been on the hunt for that incantation for so long. my very marrow itches for it. if i figure it out, i will be renting every available billboard and every possible skywriting service available, believe you me!

      but… i think the best to hope for is “here’s why that is not appropriate for the workplace”.

      so, less studies. more talk about company liability, what can cause lawsuits, and so on. more focus on “this will cost the business money and that’s not good”. less focus on “here are the studies showing this is incorrect and harmful”.

      i think Alison’s on the right track there. and, honestly, this is probably what you have been asking for the whole time with your comment lol!

      so i write this as much to myself as anyone else: it is so, so very tempting to try and treat this as “ding dong you are wrong here is the medical studies to prove it”. because it is so blatantly wrong! and my degree is in biology and not business lol! you see the harm being done to others, and you see how it’s driven by someone who is motivated to harm themselves too – it is normalization of some very disordered thinking about eating on display. it is so tempting to try and seize the problem by the root. we see where the root is. we know it’s gotta get out of there. especially if you’ve put in the hard and necessary work to get this problem out of your own head, so you know firsthand both how damaging it is, how to get it out, and how much better your life is without it! but… it’s just not going to work to try and pluck this out at the root for someone else. not unless you can get the person who is growing the garden to agree that the gympie-gympie tree has no place in there to begin with. unfortunately we have plenty of evidence here to see that it’s someone gardening who planted that tree on purpose and hugs it thrice daily and thinks everyone should also have this in their gardens to the point where they are organizing in the workplace so everyone has a potted sapling on their desks to take home and plant in their own gardens too.

      so instead the conversation has to be in business terms of liability, discrimination risk, yada yada – dancing around the root of the issue in a way that is frustrating and unsatisfying and lets a lot of the harm continue in other venues because you only have standing to talk about one expression of it. the conversation has to be “do not bring gympie-gympie saplings into the workplace” instead of “oh my god what are you doing don’t you know that’s the most venomous and dangerous plant in all of australia Get It Out Of Your Garden Omg!”. the second part is entirely true, and something that needs to be said. the second part is also something that the people who need to hear it in this situation have already decided to harden their hearts and ignore.

      i wish there was a good way through that gordian knot, but i ain’t found a sharp enough sword yet.

      in conclusion, it’s frustrating enough to make one eat one’s hands. even and especially if one’s hands are not on the approved list of low calorie snacks

      Reply ↓
      1. Carys, Lady of Weeds*

        I just want you to know that I’ve taken screenshots this whole thing because you put all of it so well and it’s so applicable to other things that are going on. You can’t help uproot other people’s trees without them accepting that the tree needs to go. It’s frustrating and sad and infuriating and just…life.

        signed, drinking a cherry coke in defiance of god and whoever wrote that memo.

        Reply ↓
      2. Csethiro Ceredin*

        “but this is my emotional support bigotry that means i get to hurt others and uphold harmful systemic prejudice”

        Ooof. That is the best way I’ve seen this expressed. And there is so much daily proof of the prevalence of this mindset.

        Reply ↓
      3. MigraineMonth*

        Beautifully put. Can we get some studies on liability or lost productivity/efficiency from extreme dieting? I know I can’t concentrate on a damned Excel when I’m hungry, but has someone run the numbers on that?

        Reply ↓
        1. Calamity Janine*

          while i don’t know off the top of my head if there have been any, i do know where you should look: there were several studies during ww2, usually with conscientious objectors as volunteers (or, y’know, “volunteers.”) about starvation. how well one could still function on several starvation diets, the best way to treat someone afterwards (which diet slowly ramping up was most effective), etc.

          the fact that this is where i’m pointing you to in terms of data probably tells you most of the story, though. certainly if you can find them, it makes one hell of a bludgeon to take to the topic, lol

          Reply ↓
          1. Calamity Janine*

            to complete the useful part of this thought, lol – these studies were done i believe by United States armed forces. i want to say army, but it may have also involved other branches, or simply been done as part of a think tank at a higher level. i haven’t studied them extensively firsthand but they definitely gave useful data, some of which was put to good use almost immediately on the western front. (figuring out what to feed someone who has been starving or nearly starving for months is trickier than you would expect.)

            Reply ↓
    4. Wombats and Tequila*

      All but one winners of the “Biggest Loser” TV show all gained some or all of the weight back, and some folks ended upneven heavier. It’s almost as if abusing people physically and psychologically makes them less healthy.

      Source: https://scienceofbehaviorchange.org/a-new-show-features-biggest-loser-winners-who-regained-weight-reveals-a-deeper-truth-about-weight-loss/

      Also, people have wildly different metabolisms. Younger folk will tend to lose weight faster, as do taller people. On general, men have higher metabolisms and build muscle more easily. Genetics plays a huge role. Having childhood adverse experiences is highly correlated with being obese as well as having chronic health conditions that make it difficult to exercise, as detailed in the excellent and groundbreaking book, “The Body Keeps the Score.” Mobility impairments, hormonal imbalances such as PCOS, and many medications that people take have weight gain as a side effect.

      Does management really want to encourage someone with well-controlled depression, schitzophrenia, or bipolar to go off their meds?

      Do they really want to encourage a competition in which a younger man can easily beat a short, older woman, or someone with MS, PCOS, or chronic fatigue? That sounds like a bit of a legal landmine.

      Unfortunately, the kind of person who launches this kind of contest is also often the kind who thinks people who get triggered are “special snowflakes” and that all overweight is a moral failing caused by eating donuts.

      Reply ↓
      1. NigelsMinion*

        My thoughts exactly. I’d love to ask the organizer in a very public meeting whether I can subtract the weight of any new gallstones I develop from restricting calories too dramatically. Maybe start an office pool about how widely my cystic ovaries will vary my blood chemistry week over week?

        Reply ↓
        1. LibraryAnne*

          Oh… my golly gosh.

          Every woman on my mother’s side of the family, including myself and my mid-twenties daughter, have all had to have our gallbladders out. I’m thinking that our fierce determination to lose some weight put each and every one of us into a medical crisis. SMDH.

          Reply ↓
  7. Bird names*

    *extremely tired sigh*

    LW, I’m sorry you’re dealing with this and I hope others are comfortable pushing back as well.

    Reply ↓
  8. ScruffyInternHerder*

    Sigh. So are these as prolific in other non-architecture/engineering/construction industries too?

    I’m in AEC myself. I’ve seen the above letter nearly verbatim in several work places over the course of my career…including in large enough firms and companies that they *should* really know better, but alas, here we are. And even though I’ve not seen a “weight loss” challenge at my current employer, our entire wellness plan, which is a separate rant for another day, is based on the premise that everyone is looking to lose weight. Its gross.

    How about adding a registered dietician available by appointment and covered by insurance, maybe a discounted gym membership, or permitting a more flexible working arrangement? THOSE are concrete things that would help.

    Reply ↓
    1. Beth**

      My husband works in investment banking and he and his colleagues have done several self-organised weight loss challenges over the years. I never asked many questions so I don’t know if there were prizes (I suspect yes because bankers = monetary incentives), just that sometimes he’d ask me to bake fewer desserts for a while when he was involved in a challenge.

      But this was very much driven by him and his work friends/colleagues, nothing official and there was no pressure to participate.

      Reply ↓
      1. AtoZ*

        I’ve seen this in investment banking, too. Except there was pressure to participate (they would say pretty much everything on that flyer…) and they were taking weight loss pills, wearing garbage bags in the sauna, etc etc to lose weight. I honestly don’t know how any work was actually done during that time.

        Reply ↓
    2. HonorBox*

      Your suggestions – dietician, gym membership, flexible working arrangement – are all great. Except that you can’t finance those on the backs of employees as easily as this crap “contest.”

      Reply ↓
      1. ScruffyInternHerder*

        They could be offset by a little less on our wellness program though. (Sorry, I know I said that that was another rant for another day)

        But if you’re paying a third party company to basically present this week’s blonde instagram “nutritionist/biohacker/life revolutionist” of the week and push some supplements…you could just not. (My word choice of “blonde” is in fact relevant; in five years of this nonsense, there have been four non-blonde presenters of either gender for a weekly presentation.)

        Reply ↓
        1. Hey, I'm Wohrking Heah!*

          I feel ya-biohacker-lol. Look up band 4 Non Blondes if you’re not familiar. A good counterweight to the grifters your company is paying when they could just give you all a longer lunch to go for a walk or whatever.

          Reply ↓
          1. ScruffyInternHerder*

            Believe it or not, I am familiar and “What’s Up” was absolutely my teenage angsty anthem. And I completely missed my own unintentional pun.

            We have absolutely kept track though, because there was an immediately noticeable pattern :)

            Reply ↓
    3. JSPA*

      I had a registered dietitian insist I must have an eating disorder and a bad relationship with food, as well as insisting that I must be gluten intolerant (I’m…not). I had and have IBS, food intolerances and a genetically-based nutritional deficiency (which in combination they could have killed me, had I followed her guidance) as well as several other genetic peculiarities.

      Luckily I found the right combination of enzyme pills and the missing nutrient to expand what foods I could tolerate without spending hours on the toilet, and then rebuild my ravaged body before my eyes, bowels, connective tissues and kidneys all gave out.

      But please, everyone, remember that there’s no attribute (whether that’s a certification, a “great bod,” charisma, money, clout, or even great empathy) that prevents someone from having blind spots, or an axe to grind. I would therefore look quite askance at a work-supplied dietitican, who’s supposed to be the right dietician for everyone in that workplace.

      I’m a big fan of always continuing to confer with your body, as far as what it is telling you it needs, wants, or wants to avoid, and how much of a good thing it can currently handle.

      Humans are complex; our behaviors tend to have a range of complex causes. Even if we treat those behaviors as problems in their own right, rather than imperfect attempts at self-treatment, they’re rarely changeable with a simple, one-size-fits-most strategy.

      Reply ↓
      1. The Unspeakable Queen Lisa*

        Well sure, but it’s still a better choice for them to have a dietitian available to those who want one than to sponsor a drastic weight loss contest.

        It’s always true that an expert of any kind can give you bad advice. True of doctors, dentists, lawyers, architects, engineers, etc. That doesn’t mean all experts are bad or should be avoided. And frankly, it’s a bit condescending for you to be like, “People! I bet you never considered someone could be bad at their job. Or have biases.”

        I’m sorry you had a bad experience and I’m glad you are better, but that doesn’t mean you need to sound the alarm about dietitians forever every time the word is mentioned.

        Reply ↓
    4. Always Tired*

      My construction company talked about doing a weight loss challenge when I started and I shut that down so hard. I was like “you want people who do HEAVY PHYSICAL LABOR ALL DAY to go on crash diets for a cash prize? And you can’t see any potential danger or conflict of interest of very angry workers comp insurance adjuster in our future?”

      Like, be so for real. The best thing we could do to improve team health is probably trick/bully people into annual wellness checks and using the mental health programs already covered, and have a tobacco cessation program.

      Reply ↓
    5. Carol the happy*

      Childcare at the gym, for men who have children? (Not going into who are men/who can get pregnant here; my daughter’s company has gym childcare vouchers for women, but not for men. She works in a “destroying things” test lab. They’re showing support for women….)

      Reply ↓
  9. Dawn*

    There’s really no part of this that is not horrifying.

    I’d be eating extra snacks through the whole thing, just to express my opinion.

    Reply ↓
    1. Daughter of Ada and Grace*

      And following Captain Awkward’s advice to embrace the awkward. “Yes, I am eating my third donut of the day! It’s delicious!”

      Reply ↓
      2. Dawn*

        Oh, I would be bringing in extra donuts. The extra gooey kind. Even if they didn’t work with my own dietary restrictions.

        One day I might even do a cake.

        Reply ↓
        1. Phony Genius*

          Based on stories here of how competitive some people get, I can imagine participants bringing in donuts to sabotage their competition.

          Reply ↓
        2. Aww, coffee, no*

          I’m bringing in a box of M&S Yumnuts and eating them, ostentatiously, with loud noises of enjoyment. Wash down with a full-sugar cherry coke.

          Yumnuts are described as the ‘love child of a yum yum and a doughnut’. They’re shaped like a doughnut, but are made with a ‘fluffy, buttery dough, which is then smothered with delicious toppings’. They are amazingly good. M&S is a UK store known for it’s excellent food section.

          Reply ↓
      4. Analystical Tree Hugger*

        Do you know how pets will stare at their humans while slowly doing the thing they know they’re not supposed to do?

        Another option is alternate is to use that: Slowly bite into the donut, making direct eye contact with wide eyes the entire time. Mix it up!

        Reply ↓
    2. FricketyFrack*

      There’s an amazing vegan bakery about 20-30 min from me and I pretty much never go because getting there is kind of a hassle and I’m not much of a dessert person, but I would be going out of my way to make it there *frequently* during this competition. They have croissant muffin things filled with stuff like “cheddar” and jalapenos, and they make cake cups where you pick your cake, frosting, and toppings kind of like an ice cream place. They would make so much money from me if I felt petty (which is always).

      Reply ↓
      1. Dawn*

        Oooooooh, that sounds incredible.

        I’m getting pretty good at making cultured cashew “cheese” nowadays but there’s some stuff that’s still pretty difficult for me, vegan chedder jalepeno stuffed pastries sound so tempting.

        If there’s one thing I really miss, it’s Cheetos…

        Reply ↓
        1. FricketyFrack*

          Yeah, vegan cheese is miles better than it used to be, but it can still be reaaally hit or miss. I definitely took good cheese for granted.

          Reply ↓
  10. YoungTen*

    My MIL worked in a healthcare office and did this. She won a trip to Paris! The only two reasons this was so popular in her workplace were 1) it was the employee’s idea and the job funded the prize and 2) the employees wanted to set a good example in the inner city health community they served. Since they came from the same community they served, they wanted to show that such issues as HBP and Diabetes could be avoided with some lifestyle changes.

    Reply ↓
    1. Bird names*

      Newer research mostly points to genetic factors being the main reason for diabetes. Maybe let’s not propagate this further?

      Reply ↓
      1. Watry*

        1000% and on top of that, I really hope that the organization is differentiating between types of diabetes. A lot of people don’t even know there’s a difference anymore (because news programs and even medical people don’t differentiate), and I hate to think of some kid with T1 not getting their insulin because “you can avoid it with diet and exercise/weight loss”.

        I am T1, and multiple people have told me I should get off insulin by losing weight. Success at explaining that no, I literally have a nonfunctioning organ has been…mixed.

        Reply ↓
      2. Artemesia*

        incidence of diabetes is both genetic and heavily affected by lifestyle/diet. If you have the lousy genes and eat spam and loco moco and rice and sugar — you have a much higher likelihood than someone with those same genes who doesn’t. Genes haven’t changed over a century but incidence of diabetes has skyrocketed with increased obesity and corn syrup laden western diets.

        And yeah bullying people in the workplace is still a terrible idea.

        Reply ↓
        1. Artemesia*

          And of course that is type 2 and not type 1 which is pretty much a different disease except for the blood sugar issues.

          Reply ↓
        2. Calamity Janine*

          “genes haven’t changed over a century” is something that may not be as relevant as you think it is, given things like the field of epigenetics. things like the Överkalix study are helping to illuminate how, despite only the methylated markers on the genes changing instead of the content of that genetic code, people are nonetheless inheriting changes in expression. in the case of this specific study, it turns out that a risk factor for heart conditions and diabetes – many of these “oh, you’ve eaten yourself sick with your terrible food” conditions – may be that a grandparent or ancestor experienced a time of famine. and that’s before we even get to changes in expression that happen over an individual’s lifetime, too.

          given where you’re pulling your examples of unhealthy food – the moco loco is a very specific type of regional cuisine – it might be worth thinking here of how the people who end up with health problems there are also the people who probably had ancestors who experienced some hardship.

          it ends up a bit victim blamey to ignore things like inherited epigenetic markers, especially in that case. sorry, native Hawaiian! your ancestors happened to not eat great due to being oppressed, and that changed the epigenetic markers you inherited! gonna blame your problems on you for eating that trashy moco loco, though…

          Reply ↓
          1. Dogwoodblossom*

            Also, even not factoring in epigenetics, this type of “lifestyle” blaming still targets certain demographics more than others. I once had a boss who paid me as little as possible (she acted like it was a big celebratory deal when she gave me a 10 cent raise because minimum wage went up) and she critiqued every lunch I ate in terms of healthiness. It was generally a lot of cheap starches and nothing else because *that’s all I could afford on what she paid me.*

            So, when people are like “poor people would be healthier if they ate more fresh vegetables,” it’s like, yeah, they know.

            Reply ↓
            1. Calamity Janine*

              the cultural aspect here also really sets my teeth on edge. we all kinda know what “inner city” means, as a euphemism for demographics… so not only does “we’ll show ’em how to eat healthy!” come with seventeen layers of cluelessness and a crunchy center of white saviorism, it’s not effective in the example we’re supposed to be celebrating.

              i am down in the southeast united states, so the issues are pretty obvious. “why are they so fat? they must not know how to eat right, with all of their soul food they hold in cultural high esteem!” is a sentiment that i have seen pushed before by such initiatives. and in the process, exactly zero people used their brains to ponder why, perhaps, soul food came to exist for this demographic. why soul food features very calorific things. and also why it’s full of meats that are either cheap (such as chicken) or cuts of meat that are usually low quality and thus need to be prepared low-and-slow to be tender. and also, to make this really pointed very quickly, why there’s okra and sweet potatoes suddenly showing up in cuisine that’s supposed to be from America and not from Africa, so it’s a real historical mystery how those got here… down in the land of former plantations…

              and yet, somehow, many people look at this and decide there’s nothing more to ponder. the real issue is that these inner city people just need someone to show them that you can eat something other than fried chicken!!

              …then they wonder why their healthcare outreach initiative is as meaningful, profound, and impactful as a sparrow’s fart in a hurricane.

              then they usually blame it on how these inner city populations simply refuse to be civilized – uh, educated, they swear they meant educated…

              Reply ↓
      3. I Have RBF*

        This.

        I haven’t been diagnosed with diabetes yet, but it’s inevitable. My grandmother had it, my mom has it, and I will get it. It usually starts in the late 50, early 60s. Beforehand, we get metabolic syndrome, and a tendency to being intractably fat starting at puberty.

        I have tried “diets”, “lifestyle changes”, etc, and all I got was more weight. It still doesn’t change the fact that I will be diabetic.

        Reply ↓
        1. Bird names*

          Yeah, this. I have a short comment upthread, once the links clear. We are the opposite with not family history of diabetes and my mother still stresses herself out about it (and ignores the stuff we do have in fact a predisposition for… *sigh*).

          Reply ↓
      1. MigraineMonth*

        I had a very frustrating conversation about a decade ago with a couple of nurses who were super excited by the Biggest Loser competition their hospital was hosting and couldn’t see how that was problematic. But at least they were doing it for themselves and weren’t “setting a good example” for an inner city community.

        Look, we know what actually works for health, and it isn’t “personal responsibility” as a mask for victim-blaming. It isn’t blaming pedestrians for getting hit by cars, or smokers for being addicted to cigarettes, or people too money or time-poor to buy healthy food and exercise for not eating healthy food and exercising. If we wanted to actually address any of these issues, there are steps we could take as a society to make communities more walkable and restrict advertising of harmful substances, but we’ve chosen not to. Instead we blame the victims and sell the victims more stuff (gym memberships, nicotine gum, safety vests, diet foods) and charge them to treat the inevitable health issues.

        Reply ↓
    4. Alicent*

      The inner city community that may not have access to an actual grocery store or the money to buy unprocessed foods. That seems pretty performative.

      Reply ↓
      1. Fluffy Fish*

        Or the time/energy/knowledge to cook “healthy” meals. or ovens. or stoves. or occasionally electricity. or mental load.

        so many reasons vulnerable populations struggle to eat “healthy”, it really grinds my gears when people who come from a place of privilege are like “look i can do it so you can too.”

        Reply ↓
      2. MsM*

        And if you do want to help inspire healthy choices, wouldn’t it make more sense to host some kind of community cooking class featuring quick meals on a budget?

        Reply ↓
    5. Chrysoprase*

      This is grim. A healthcare office did this extremely unhealthy thing and nobody pushed back or pointed out what a bad idea it was? And they did it as an “example” to their patient population???

      I’m amazed that it still needs to be said, but lifestyle changes with the explicit goal of “lose as much weight as possible as quickly as possible” are not healthy lifestyle changes.

      I’m sorry if this comes across harsh, but healthcare providers should be held to a higher standard.

      Reply ↓
    6. Dawn*

      Except that they often can’t “be avoided with some lifestyle changes” and that’s why we have healthcare professionals who can prescribe treatment.

      Reply ↓
      1. Chick-n-boots*

        Pshaw – nobody can fix THOSE things. Just eat less cheetos, shop at Whole Foods, and join a gym. Totally gets the same results! And isn’t at all sus or problematic!

        Reply ↓
    8. Caramel & Cheddar*

      Unless they were also providing a grand prize of a trip to Paris for the local community they served, I’m not seeing how this is motivational.

      Reply ↓
      1. Mark This Confidential And Leave It Laying Around*

        Yeah if I was a client I would be pissed. But also: I call bull. Sorry. Inner city health clinics do not send contest winners to Paris. Signed, Long Time Inner City Dweller

        Reply ↓
        1. Anonforthisforsure*

          Eh, it could be a satellite clinic of a big hospital system. That line isn’t worth calling someone a liar.

          Reply ↓
    9. Keymaster of Gozer (she/her)*

      How is losing weight ‘setting a good example’ for anything? And a healthcare office promoting crash dieting and claiming that it is preventing diseases is extremely concerning.

      Reply ↓
    10. DramaQ*

      But the people in the health care office have the luxury and privilege of being able to crash diet to where they can lose a significant amount of weight in a short period of time AND have the backing of their employer to do so.

      The community they serve is likely facing food poverty and don’t work jobs that lend themselves to being able to go to, let alone afford, the gym. Food deserts exist in major cities and if you don’t have the transportation you can’t drive to the “good” grocery store to get all those foods you need to lose weight.

      Then to tie it to winning a trip to Paris!? Because an inner city low income resident is going to be able to reward themselves with a trip to Paris if they lose weight? Ick. What an awful message to an already struggling community.

      If they really wanted to do something to help the community they would work with food banks, social services, activism to encourage building of grocery stores within walking/bus distance of city communities. This was performance theater and virtue signaling at its worst.

      Reply ↓
    11. ShanShan*

      No one needs to set a good example for grown ass adults just because they’re poor. This is patronizing nonsense. If the staff members came from the same community then they should know better.

      Reply ↓
    12. different seudonym*

      I get that these folks considered themselves to be members of the community they serve, but on the individual level this is not very different from unsolicited judgment coming from family or friends. On a systemic level, it still perpetuates pseudoscience and hatred of fat people.

      On a political level, I’m inclined to call it a form of respectability politics, though perhaps in the absence of details that’s more than I can truly say.

      And fundamentally, neither you nor they know what the clients really think.

      Reply ↓
      1. Emotional support capybara (he/him)*

        There’s so much to unpack here we might just be better off yeeting the whole suitcase out the window.

        Reply ↓
    14. Calamity Janine*

      that last sentence is not only factually incorrect, but factually incorrect in a way that has some interesting racial tones to it.

      we all know what inner city demographics are code for, and we also can look at the rates of these diseases in those populations… and notice they are higher for reasons. those reasons aren’t “nobody modeling healthy behaviors”, either. instead they are far more concrete issues that are systemic, like food deserts, and sometimes also genetic predispositions within those communities.

      to turn these issues into ones where the onus to solve it is on the individual, because they can be solved by individual action, is… another way this sort of systemic racism exists, perpetuates, and harms others.

      that isn’t going to solve the problem. it’s just going to do more harm. these are direct excuses which cause medical racism to flourish.

      and it certainly doesn’t show that you’re part of a community to set yourselves apart as the perfect role model who has swooped in to show them all the way, while conspicuously ignoring the issues being faced by that community and instead blaming the community for not trying harder. that’s consciously holding yourself above the community. that’s how to get the community to ignore you, not trust you.

      Reply ↓
    15. Cacofonix*

      I get that weight loss competitions aren’t a great go-to in a work place. I benefited from one myself in a similar manner in that it was an employee led casual one in my work group. It led to a sustained weight loss and healthier lifestyle for me. Similar to other friendly competitions you find in teams. Always optional and ignorable discussion about them during work day – eg separate slack channel.

      Point is, I get that everyone seems to hate them, even for all your good reasons, and even though I agree! But chill out please on commenting so rudely to people who had a different experience. Lots of it going on in here today. Glad it worked out for your Mom, YoungTen. Thanks for sharing a different perspective.

      Reply ↓
      1. The Unspeakable Queen Lisa*

        Nope. Diet culture is terrible. Nobody gets a pass on encouraging it. It’s rude for you and others to keep pushing it. So many terrible things packed in your response. “I did an unhealthy thing, and now I’m justifying it to myself by continuing to push it on others.” Also… sustained weight loss means you are still dieting now. That’s unhealthy. Diet cycling actually causes weight gain.

        Diabetes is not caused by what you eat. Also, fun fact: insulin resistance is what causes the weight gain, not the other way around. And being fat is not unhealthy.

        Reply ↓
        1. Calamity Janine*

          it’s all very “you’re so rude when you’re crying for me to stop hurting you! don’t you know it’s fun for me to hurt you!?”, isn’t it?

          clearly the problem isn’t the public health servants going to an inner city and declaring that the solution is a weight loss competition to show them the way to health, even though that’s not how those diseases even work (and as someone who got ignored while suffering quite a lot from her own diabetes by doctors because “oh you lost weight though” and had to wait until a layperson actually remembered that sudden weight loss is a sign of diabetes too)… especially with the awful classism and racism that comes with this setting, mixing with the ableism already present to create a very toxic brew that literally has a death count that i nearly joined… it’s that we’re awfully mean for pointing it out!

          it’s very mean that we want to, y’know… live, i guess.

          Reply ↓
      2. Calamity Janine*

        did it actually work for the mom, though? has the weight loss stayed?

        because it certainly did not work for the stated goal – part of outreach to the community to “show them the way”. the ways this is actually actively detrimental are numerous, as are the ways it enforces and enshrines systemic bigotry.

        if your takeaway is that it’s rude to comment on the harm being done to the community meant to be served by this action, as people talk about the active damage it does to individuals as well as reinforcing racism, ableism, etc… then i’m sorry, but this isn’t a useful perspective to add to the conversation. if anything, this is you continuing the damage by deciding that the greater issue than the bigotry is in fact the feelings of people who benefit from that bigotry.

        you don’t have to take my word on that one – i will defer to a much better writer and orator. Martin Luther King Jr. deals with this “oh i totally agree with what you say, but you’re being so rude about it!” attitude definitively in his letter from a Birmingham jail. i would encourage you to read and meditate upon it – especially because when it comes to “showing the way to inner city communities”, this is an issue steeped in race and racism. just because you weren’t harmed by something doesn’t mean it isn’t harmful. just because you weren’t harmed by something doesn’t mean it’s totally fine and the people pushing back with how they were and are harmed are “commenting so rudely” about it.

        you tone policing how people say they have been harmed and dismissing them because of it is not you being brave, bold, or supportive of diverse voices – it’s just you also signing up to do harm.

        as a fat disabled person, i would really rather you not step on my foot and then get upset when i don’t thank you for the bruises you give me. instead you need to get off my foot. and i do not mean that i should sit here as you lecture me for being rude when i told you to get off my foot. it means you need to get off my foot. if you are more worried about your offence because you had a perfectly nice time and various other justifications than the toes of mine you are breaking, you are not paying attention to the actual issue, and you certainly don’t have standing to lecture me and my bruised foot that you’re standing on about how rude i am when i tell you to get off my foot. just… get off my foot. don’t clutch your pearls and try to tone-police.

        after all, if asking nicely worked, if politeness was all that was needed? you wouldn’t be standing on my foot and breaking those toes to begin with. so it’s pretty silly to say that’s the cure, now, isn’t it? the cure is getting off my foot. not saying i need to sing my request to not stand on my foot. the tone policing isn’t useful, nor is it kind, nor is it polite.

        Reply ↓
    2. Calamity Janine*

      fully agreed on the yuck. because my bones! my bones have ejected themselves out of my body! it’s so bad that my skeleton has escaped! and hitting that line made my skeleton send me a postcard from the Caribbean because it has decided it will in fact never be returning to my body! it’s just that gross of a line!

      which is terrible because it’s quite hard to type bonelessly

      Reply ↓
      2. Arrietty*

        I bet you lost a high percentage of your body weight though.

        I’d love it if someone won this by having a leg amputated or something (not specifically for the “contest”, if course, just as a coincidence they were having surgery anyway, and entering was their own way to make a point) to make it clear how stupid it is to assume weight loss is improved health.

        Reply ↓
        1. Shirley Keeldar*

          The visuals on this one are just cracking me up. I love the image of someone striding proudly up on their prosthetic leg to accept their prize.

          Reply ↓
            1. Calamity Janine*

              that’s the perfect opportunity to game the system right there! just get a hollow prosthetic leg… fill it with lead weights… go in for the initial weigh-in…

              come back for final weigh-in with a fancy carbon fiber athletic blade prosthetic that’s built to be as light as possible…

              Reply ↓
        2. Nightengale*

          there is actually a great story online about Josh Sundquist, who had a leg amputated years earlier, having a nurse come to his home because his insurance company thought he was dangerously underweight. He’s a comedian so it’s worth watching him tell the story.

          Reply ↓
        1. Calamity Janine*

          (it’s me having a moment of silliness, as if the thing was so cringeworthy and gave me the heebiejeebies so bad that my skeleton decided to run out of the situation without me. if you re-tune your mind’s eye to pretend i’m in a looney tunes short, that’s about the vibe, lol)

          Reply ↓
      1. ScruffyInternHerder*

        Its very on brand though, in my experience. (Yes, I am currently rolling my eyes about this particular line because I can hear “that department” say it.)

        Reply ↓
    6. Morning Reader*

      Omg I missed that on the first read. What does it even mean? I am feeling insufficiently feminine having no clue… is there some version of math only girly girls are privy to? Should someone alert the physicists?

      Reply ↓
      1. HQetc*

        You can’t alert the physicists, because girls can’t do *real* math, so there are no girls over there to explain it to the menfolks physicists. Duh.
        (/s, obviously, I hope)

        Reply ↓
        1. Oniya*

          We ‘girls’ are busy doing the complex and imaginary math. Things get so much more interesting once you start taking the square roots of negative numbers. ;)

          Reply ↓
      2. Cinn*

        It makes me think of the time the physicist on the team at OldJob told me my graph was “too colourful” (not sure why, the only different colours were for different datasets). So the next time I needed to send him a graphical representation of whatever data it was, I made it exclusively in shades of pink/purple to make a petty point.

        Reply ↓
      3. Dahlia*

        It’s from a tiktok trend. “Girl math” is things like “I already bought this item two weeks ago, but now I’m returning it. So when I get cash for it, that’s actually free money.”

        Reply ↓
      4. Artemesia*

        Why is the word ‘girly’ or usually ‘girlie’ suddenly everywhere? I have never in my long life heard it used except occasionally to describe a child who is into ribbons and bows — suddenly the term is everywhere. Where did that come from?

        Reply ↓
    7. fancy pants math*

      Calculus?

      I’m not too fancy but I was a stellar math student. At a women’s college. Where all the students in all the advanced math classes were women. Not girls, thankyouverymuch.

      Reply ↓
    8. Caramel & Cheddar*

      I assume it’s a play on the “girl math” thing that was a meme for awhile last year, but that meme also sucked, so. For those unfamiliar with “girl math”, it apparently came from a TikTok video and KnowYourMeme summarized it as:

      Her video joked about the wonky math some women use to justify purchases, including “Anything under five dollars feels free” and “If you return an item for $50 and then spend $100 on another item, it’s like only spending $50.

      Reply ↓
    9. Laura*

      I would be really tempted to reply all and say you don’t understand the “fancy girl math” and can they please explain it. Let them just dig the hole deeper.

      Reply ↓
  12. Calamity Janine*

    oh i hate the diction of the announcement so much. this patronizing nagging about how they clearly know your health better than anyone else and bullying you into letting them do it!

    flames. flames on the side of my face.

    probably listen to Alison on how to push back than do what i would do: mark up the announcement in red pen referencing warning signs for orthorexia and disordered eating, and reply all with that attached. make sure to mention the dire effects on health of having an eating disorder. it is healthier every single time to be overweight than it is to be bullied into an eating disorder.

    and crucially, ask with chilly professionalism if the company is sure they want to take on that level of liability. after all, they are already assuming medical histories and giving medical advice by deciding to play dietician by competitive fiat.

    or, if the world was just and true as it should be: respond to this by TURNING INTO GODZILLA AND EATING THEM. JUST EAT THEM. ONE GULP BAM PROBLEM SOLVED THAT’S A WRAP Y’ALL

    Reply ↓
      1. Ashley*

        Is it workers comp when I pass out and hit my head from lightheadedness from not eating during the work day so I can win and avoid comments about my food? Not to mention loss in productivity because I am hungry and obsessing about my food choices.

        Reply ↓
      2. Amber Rose*

        Every now and then I typo and my calorie counting app enters 1 children for a surprisingly small amount of calories.

        Reply ↓
      4. Calamity Janine*

        well, you know how it is… everything in moderation including moderation! it may be a sometimes food but it’s still food!

        godzillas can have little a peoples, as a treat.

        Reply ↓
    6. Oh brother*

      “probably listen to Alison on how to push back than do what i would do: mark up the announcement in red pen referencing warning signs for orthorexia and disordered eating, and reply all with that attached. make sure to mention the dire effects on health of having an eating disorder. it is healthier every single time to be overweight than it is to be bullied into an eating disorder.”

      Fun idea, would go down like a lead balloon at an actual working office.

      Reply ↓
      1. Calamity Janine*

        oh yes. not proper office behavior at all. a nice spot of imagination to bring catharsis, though.

        generally my advice here on professional behavior should come with the same disclaimer that the humorous podcast My Brother My Brother And Me does: “Calamity Janine is not an expert, and should never be trusted”… (well, in this area, anyway. video games and biology basics, that’s what you can trust me for.)

        Reply ↓
  13. PropJoe*

    I’m glad that my employer’s health and wellness efforts are limited to:

    – free bonus day off if you get a physical
    – on site fitness center you can pay for via credit card or payroll deduction
    – a decent EAP
    – excellent insurance coverage

    Could there be more? Yeah, absolutely, but what we have is very no-pressure whatsoever.

    A weight loss contest here would face swift and widespread blowback (and rightfully so).

    Reply ↓
    1. MsM*

      Mine sometimes does hydration or physical activity per day challenges, but they’re always “if you meet the goal, you get some tiny bit of swag like a water bottle” deals with no pressure to participate.

      Reply ↓
      1. I dream of rain*

        Mine does a wellness challenge where everyone self-reports their minutes doing whatever they decide is wellness – could be exercise, a hobby, time with friends, meditation, whatever you want. It’s decently more inclusive except for people who have more stressful/full lives – someone who is a caregiver at home is not going to be able to spend hours a day relaxing – but it’s miles better than whatever tf OP’s company is doing.

        Reply ↓
    1. Georgia Carolyn Mason*

      Yes. The smarmy, saccharine (hey, it’s sugar-free!) hatefulness of this flyer is seriously off the charts.

      Reply ↓
    5. Meow*

      In the span of 2 months, I had a baby, took lasics for some fluid build up from my c-section, and then got a horrific case of norovirus. All the time I wasn’t on the toilet was spent sitting on the couch watching TV and breastfeeding (which also probably took off a pound or two). I would have rocked a weight loss competition.

      Reply ↓
      1. One Duck In A Row*

        I wasn’t figuratively pissed, but I was in a similar situation and *literally* pissed – as in I was on IV fluids for so long during labor, and retained so much of it, that I came home from the hospital weighing close to what I did when I went in. I knew this was a thing that sometimes happens because I’d had warnings from friends, and knew that the usual ways for that extra fluid to make its way out is extreme night sweats (thankfully didn’t have those), or just epic pissing.

        Um, sorry for anyone who came to the comments to join in the rage and accidentally learned about post-partum pissing volume.

        Reply ↓
        2. Perihelion*

          Oooh, maybe that’s why my night sweats have been so bad. I had extra fluids during labor on and off, I hadn’t made the connection. They’ve been awful! Although finally tapering off nearly four weeks later.

          Reply ↓
    7. Retail dalliance*

      Lol, didn’t think of that. I lost 25lbs the week I gave birth (probably 15 the day of, and 10 more later in fluids, yes that’s gross.) I’d crush at this competition hahaha

      Reply ↓
  16. bamcheeks*

    is… “your Vegas body” a well-known saying? Like, I am familiar with the concept of a beach body, but is “your Vegas body” really as blatant as “the body for when you’re stripping in Las Vegas” or is there another connotation here I’ve missed?

    Reply ↓
    2. mango chiffon*

      Have never heard of this either!! Like is this a “vegas showgirl” type of thing, and if so MAJOR ICK!! Because I don’t think there’s a specific body for going to casinos.

      Reply ↓
    3. Hiring Mgr*

      Yeah I’ve never heard that either – I assumed there was a big conference or company offsite or something they’re attending in LV

      Reply ↓
      1. My weight is not your business*

        OP here. That’s exactly it. Company sponsored trip to Vegas in October for the company’s anniversary

        Reply ↓
        1. Calamity Janine*

          i’m afraid i must gift you an incredibly bad idea now because my brain got stuck on terrible Vegas fashion when figuring out what a Vegas body is:

          if you attend this trip and there’s some portion of it that’s a fancy dinner, please please *please* decide to show off your “Vegas body” through accessories. and by that i mean your Vegas body is the exact same as your regular body, but you are wearing a fascinator hat that has a little roulette wheel on it. one plain hairband, some ribbon, maybe a feather, a cheap toy-size wheel from amazon, hot glue, and an irresponsible amount of fashion-related hubris, and you could have the most memorable headwear of the whole event!

          (okay, more likely and more responsibly, take this comment and imagine the contraption described, and then have a really good laugh about it. i think that after your excellent handling of this situation, you deserve that mental victory lap.)

          Reply ↓
      1. Hlao-roo*

        Stuff your pockets with coins for the first weigh-in, spend your weekends playing penny slots in Vegas, and win the competition! Go from your just-arrived-in-Vegas-flush-with-cash body to your leaving-Vegas-because-I’m-broke body in 12 short week! (/joking)

        Reply ↓
        1. Firebird*

          I was looking for this suggestion. Rolls of quarters can be tucked into waistbands, pockets, and moneybelts. You can gradually reduce the number of quarters to simulate weight loss. (Hint: a roll of quarters weighs half a pound)

          Reply ↓
    6. Hey, I'm Wohrking Heah!*

      Hubby is currently in Vegas for work. Lots of very large people in the casinos so yeah, either an inside company joke or AI wrote the whole thing.

      Reply ↓
    9. RVA Cat*

      Wouldn’t your Vegas body be the result of stuffing yourself at the buffets and getting all those free drinks at the table?

      Reply ↓
    11. Calamity Janine*

      personally i would just start looking at novelty tops with built-in roulette wheels

      they’re going to not be work appropriate but they’ll be way more fun than whatever the person writing “your Vegas body” in that letter was thinking of!

      Reply ↓
  17. Nightengale*

    To the list of people this is terrible for (actually all people, really) a specific mention of people with disabilities who can’t “run to the store and back”

    I would also like to add an honorable mention of terrible for “this isn’t fancy girl math” sent to employees of a civil engineering organization?! (No it is math we shouldn’t be doing at all but the gendered math insult is just icing on the cake.)

    Reply ↓
  18. ApocalypseHow*

    “Because nothing says ‘teamwork’ like sweating it out together and pretending the office snacks don’t exist.”

    No! That doesn’t say ‘teamwork’ at all! In any language! Things that do say teamwork: Brainstorming ideas, celebrating the achievement of work-related goals, keeping each other updated on progress, coming together to work smoothly in an emergency.

    Things that don’t say teamwork: Making weight loss a public spectacle, complete with snarky jokes. I could make an entire annotated version to explain why every sentence in this announcement is wrong, but I’m sticking with this one sentence because I don’t have time for this nonsense.

    Reply ↓
    1. EarlGrey*

      It’s the snacks that build team spirit, c’mon, we all know this! Love to stigmatize the one thing that reliably brings everyone together, in the pantry.

      Reply ↓
  19. Chairman of the Bored*

    These types of contests are also inherently unfair to people who don’t have that much weight to lose, for whatever reason.

    I work with a person who is a competitive triathlete in more-or-less Olympian shape, how is she supposed to lose a meaningful amount of body weight in 3 months? Just stop exercising?

    Reply ↓
    1. Clisby*

      Yes! I’m nowhere near an athlete, but I’m 5’6″ and weigh 130-135 pounds. I would have no idea, short of starving, that I could lose much in 3 months.

      I know my case is different from a lot of people, because I wouldn’t feel targeted by the contest and wouldn’t hesitate to say “Are you out of your mind?” if I were pressured to join in – but you can bet I’d go complain that the office was sponsoring a contest that supposedly was open to everyone but effectively closed to me because I’m not willing to starve myself.

      Reply ↓
    2. Nightengale*

      I mean I’ve spent my entire life being medically advised I need to gain weight. Which was especially great when I was sent to the workplace wellness mandated diabetes person and she agreed I would benefit from gaining weight but also only had weight loss advice in her toolkit for diabetics.

      Reply ↓
      1. Clisby*

        A former FB friend (former for other reasons, not weight loss) somehow got hooked up with an MLM diet program and started tagging people she knew to say she was available to help them with their weight loss goals. The thing is, she knew me in person. She cannot possibly have thought I’d be interested in losing weight. (Plus, she lost enough weight on this plan that I thought she looked scary. Not that I told her that. Hey, if she was happy with it, she was happy with it. But the idea that everyone’s desire is to look skeletal is really lost on me.)

        Reply ↓
    3. Paint N Drip*

      at least it is percentage-based so it’s a little more equitable – losing 5% of your body weight could be a very wide range of pounds (although someone in excellent shape is obviously at a disadvantage for winning – but since they’re engineers or adjacent, I assume they can do that basic math)

      Reply ↓
      1. Clisby*

        Why would anyone in excellent shape be interested in losing weight? Or heck, why would someone like me, not at all in excellent shape but with a pretty normal weight, be interested in losing weight?

        Reply ↓
        1. CityMouse*

          This, I’m in the low end of normal BMI and work out. Me losing 5% of my bodyweight would put me into underweight BMI.

          Reply ↓
      2. HonorBox*

        But percentage actually isn’t any more equitable. As a hypothetical, let’s say @Chairman of the Board’s coworker is 5’5″ and 120 lbs. I’m 5’11” and 185. I might be able to lose 5% (9.25 lbs) with some work and a few changes to my diet. Coworker would need to lose 6+ lbs to beat me. And that puts her dangerously close to underweight for her height, not even considering the fact that she’s an elite athlete.

        Reply ↓
    4. Scooter34*

      I had a coworker who would pack on weight over the holidays so he could win the contest every year. The organizers eventually changed to % lost to defeat him and then abandoned the idea finally.

      Reply ↓
    5. Double A*

      Yeah when I was at my most fit, if I lost weight it was when I wasn’t working out and I lost muscle mass. Which I did not want to lose.

      I always had a very weak upper body, and then I started rock climbing and gained at least 10-15 lbs of muscle. I can now lift things and am generally much happier with my physical abilities and do not WANT to lose that muscle weight. I’m also hauling around a good 20 extra lbs of fat after having babies, and I am indifferent about losing that weight.

      Reply ↓
    6. HonorBox*

      You’re so right. The percentage loss is impossible because people are all built differently. Losing 10% of body weight might make your coworker dangerously unhealthy whereas losing 10% for me, while difficult, would put me right at the low end on the “ideal weight” chart for my height.

      I’m not suggesting this as a valid alternative by any means, but the better “challenge” would be for each person to set a goal and then be rewarded for meeting that goal. For some, the goal might be maintenance. For others, it might mean dropping 4 lbs. And for others, it might mean gaining weight.

      Reply ↓
  20. HonorBox*

    OP, I’m with you. This sucks and isn’t the right way to help people be healthy.

    A couple of thoughts:
    *How do others in your workplace feel? Do you have a sense that others are equally as put off by this?
    *Is this required? Based on the math (and not for nothing, the phrase “fancy girl math” in the rules almost made me spit my water out) it seems like the prize funds are just entry fees divided up. So what if people just don’t participate? Will the owner be adding more to cover the prize fees?
    *I like the idea of pushing back, especially if there are a number of people who don’t like this idea one bit. But also, encourage people to sit it out. If half the office doesn’t participate, that’s going to say something too.
    *When you push back, highlight the fact that there are any number of medical reasons that someone shouldn’t participate. What if someone is dealing with an eating disorder? Or heck, non-medically, what if someone is doing something active and healthy and they’re bulking up? Someone who is doing weight training as part of their normal workout may add weight.

    This sucks, and I’m sorry. I hope you can keep us updated, please.

    Reply ↓
  21. Admin Lackey*

    It’s the most minor sin of this whole idea but I just CAN’T get over the twee fucking language used in the letter… it’s already a bad idea, do you have to be so fucking annoying about it???

    Reply ↓
    2. Csethiro Ceredin*

      Agreed. the cutesy tone is INFURIATING especially combined with all the underlying assumptions (everyone wants to lose weight; losing weight is always healthy; ‘girls’ do cute math not real math; bullying is motivating).

      Any one of those statements get even more annoying if you picture a high-pitched giggle after it.

      Reply ↓
    3. fine-tipped pen aficionado*

      It’s almost certainly Gen AI. At least, that’s very similar to the default voice in several Gen AI apps I have used professionally.

      That doesn’t make it any less grating, but I find it comforting to think a human didn’t sit down and choose every patronizing turn of phrase.

      Reply ↓
      1. Calamity Janine*

        on the other hand, it means that it’s something the AI has trained on enough examples to categorize as acceptable for office use… and it’s coming from someone who didn’t think it was worth contradicting the computer on “girly math” after the computer deemed it a natural part of the conversation!

        so that’s kinda more horrific in some respects lol

        Reply ↓
  22. amoeba*

    Oh wow. Oh wow.

    I mean, the general idea of a weight loss challenge is already pretty horrible in itself, but the way they market this just makes it SO MUCH WORSE.

    And I already thought the “New year, new me” poster our on-site gym put up was a bit tone-deaf and problematic.

    I would definitely push back, but the fact that they thought this extreme version was in any way at all acceptable makes me less than hopeful that they’ll see the problem…

    Reply ↓
    1. CityMouse*

      I’m skinny and I reported my work gym for putting up a sign that said “nothing tastes as good as being fit feels” because that’s straight up from eating disorder “inspiration” pages.

      I want to be clear to posters here: your skinny coworkers don’t want this stuff either.

      Reply ↓
      1. Georgia Carolyn Mason*

        Ha, one of my former instructors posted on their Instagram after new year’s: YOU DIDN’T GAIN ALL THAT WEIGHT IN A DAY, SO WHY WOULD YOU EXPECT TO LOSE IT IN A DAY? I decided against commenting to thank her for reminding me why I switched from Les Mills to Peloton (for all their faults, the instructors I follow don’t do the “earn/burn your food” and weight loss crap). I did unfollow.

        Reply ↓
      2. Calamity Janine*

        oh that’s a phrase i first encountered as someone saying “look out for these because these memes are directly from the pro-ana communities”. it originating there is really all you need to know about how healthy it truly is, and wants people to be.

        Reply ↓
  24. Insubordinate Clause*

    Least favorite wording: “This isn’t fancy girl math.” Nothing like sexism in a truly awful document.

    Reply ↓
    1. learnedthehardway*

      I feel like the OP should do a critique (in big bold marker) beside the flyer, sort of like figure skating, but instead of countries, use categories:

      Score:
      Body Shaming – 10
      Unqualified Medical Advice – 9.5
      Intrusiveness – 9
      Sexism – 8.5
      Legal Liability Potential – 7.5

      Add categories as appropriate.

      Reply ↓
  26. Anon For This Comment*

    When I was in first grade, my “best friend” said to me, “I’m taking gymnastics and you’re not so you’re going to be chubby-fat for the rest of your life.” 40 years later and I still remember this. I have struggled for all this time with my weight, my body image, my ability to shop for and buy clothes, my perceived distortions, my calorie counting, and my general self hatred. I cannot look at the number on a scale without spiraling and I tell my physicians I won’t look when they weigh me. So yeah, I’m perhaps a little messed up about weight.

    I’d probably quit. In a blaze of glory. And because I’m petty and vindictive, I’d let lots of people know why.

    Reply ↓
    1. Kat*

      A classmate called me fat in fifth grade in front of the whole class. That was over thirty years ago and I still remember the shame and horror of it all. There is so much problematic about weight in our society; it should NOT be propagated at work, too.

      I sat there mouth agape reading this entire announcement. So tone-deaf and judgmental!

      Reply ↓
      1. Anonforthisforsure*

        Ugh, not defending the gross friend but (some) gymnastics classes are hotbeds for filling up kids’ heads with disordered nonsense around weight and food. Some are fine, I’m sure, and I hope it’s gotten better.

        –Middle aged woman who still has a bum knee from a partial dislocation I got in a gymnastics class in the 80s, which the “coach” treated with an ice pack and a directive to stop whining and for God’s sake, stop eating so much!

        Reply ↓
        1. Delta Delta*

          I took a gymnastics class in high school and sprained an elbow. I mostly remember the absolutely amazing bruise it left (armpit to finger tip! every color imaginable! Very cool). By that point in my life I was more interested in bruising than gymnastics, but I can see how that might have been devastating when I was younger.

          I also remember being prescribed oxycontin for it, which I took to school and took for pain and no one was any the wiser. The 90s were a wild time.

          Reply ↓
          1. IHaveKittens*

            O, when you break your elbow (which I have done twice, same arm) you also get those spectacular bruises. More than one person asked me if I was “safe at home”. Yeah, at home I’m fine. Walking down the sidewalk, not so much.

            Reply ↓
    2. learnedthehardway*

      I remember someone saying something to me once, and I replied that they would die first if they got sick or lost, so who did they think was better off.

      Seriously – having a little body fat is important to survival.

      Reply ↓
    3. Keymaster of Gozer (she/her)*

      I can’t go near scales for the same reason. It’s taken some time to convince my doctors that okay they can weigh me if they’ve got a reason to but under no circumstances am I to know what the number is nor are they to talk about BMI.

      I despise eating, I know I have to do it but I don’t get any joy out of it anymore. Thanks to the bullies when I was at school.

      Reply ↓
    4. Anon y Mouse*

      I feel for you. I still have hangups from ballet class, aged four. Also from the time a police officer came to teach an intro to self-defence at our high school, and picked me, a 5’5″ teenage girl, as a volunteer saying “You look like a big bruiser.” It didn’t occur to me until twenty years later that this was sarcasm.

      Almost any kind of indication that anyone is paying attention to what I eat or how my body looks is deeply, deeply uncomfortable – even if it’s positive.

      Reply ↓
    5. Burnt Out Librarian*

      These things stick with us– I still remember the first time someone called me fat at school. I had a teacher who kept telling me her weight loss “wins” and I would just nod along because I was a kid– but it was also the 90s and there were Snackwells cookies and Slim Fast shakes everywhere. I beat myself up for years trying and failing to lose any weight, and later just decided to disassociate and neglect my physical existence for decades.

      Now I’m in my 40s and at my “goal weight”– because of medication. It was never a character flaw or “you don’t want it/don’t try hard enough,” it was my metabolism being different from everyone else’s. I can’t say I’m healthy or fit because those years of torturing myself had real life consequences, but at least I know now it was never about me being some kind of failure, no matter what doctors and diet culture told me.

      I really hope you can heal your relationship with your body. It’s a rotten place to be. Sending you hugs.

      Reply ↓
    6. allathian*

      Aesthetic sports like figure skating, bikini fitness and gymnastics should be banned. Or at the very least, you should be a legal adult before you’re allowed to start, which of course would kill the sport because you have to start young to be any good, at least in skating and gymnastics. I don’t think it’s possible to do those sports at pro level without developing an eating disorder, or at least disordered eating.

      Reply ↓
  27. Fotze*

    I don’t know where to start…”fancy girl math” the implication that extra weight is because you’re stuffing donuts constantly down your throat…the idea that pizza is only okay if you burn it off? It’s SO CONDESCENDING!
    and that’s of course, not addressing the sheer awfulness of the idea alone.

    Reply ↓
      2. Slow Gin Lizz*

        Or even “Please explain to me fancy girl math. I am just a plain girl, not a fancy one, so I’m afraid I don’t understand.”

        Reply ↓
  28. ThatGirl*

    And here I was judging the email I just got about this “Virta” program, which also seems like a bad idea, but at least it’s not THIS pile of judgy crap.

    Reply ↓
  30. Never not tired*

    I was just thinking as I read this – I have been working part-time at a branch of the YMCA – an organization for whom a huge component is the gyms/weight rooms/training centers/exercise classes – for about 7/8 months now and not once has anyone ever said anything about weight loss, food habits, pushing people to exercise, etc. The only thing I’ve had to do is the first part of a 3-part ‘gym orientation,’ because I work at the front desk and they want us to be able to tell new members about the program from personal experience. We get a membership as one of our employment benefits but there’s no pressure to actually use it. It’s a remarkably healthy and refreshing attitude now that I’m thinking about it.

    Reply ↓
  31. ZSD*

    This is horrendous.
    It’s also not clear to me whether this is actually sponsored by some part of the company (HR?!), or if one individual employee went rogue and put up the posters. The latter would still show terrible judgment by that employee and should have been immediately shut down by management, of course.

    This is a tiny thing, but in addition to all the shaming and assumptions, you’re micro-managing that I can’t do a double weigh-in the last week? Like, why?

    Reply ↓
  32. DiniGirl*

    I can tell you as HR, I have had to do this, because I worked for a self-insured group and the group that managed our benefits plus the insurance co. Required that we offer x number of health events for employees or the rates increased. The menu of event options was small. Biggest Loser was one. I completely understand all the bad about this, but if it’s required by your insurance it’s very hard for the company to make headway unless they are maybe a very large company. I did try to create new programs to add more options and was successful once or twice with getting them approved.

    Reply ↓
    1. bamcheeks*

      Well, yikes. Was there a kind of minimum participation rate you had to hit for it to count, or could you run it in a very voluntary and low-profile way?

      Reply ↓
    2. Acting Ensign Crusher*

      Given how transparently awful the language is, and the possibility that the competition might be required as a “health event” in the manner that you suggest, I’m daydreaming about how it was intentionally written like that in a blaze of malicious compliance by someone who knows full well how problematic an activity this is but might not have the capital to speak up, in hopes that people with more clout will be motivated to push back.

      Reply ↓
    3. pally*

      Just curious: was a Biggest Loser event specifically required by the insurance group? Because, as mentioned above, there are other-better – alternatives.

      Things like gym membership, maybe access to a personal trainer for those who might want to learn proper techniques or get encouragement, making healthy snacks available, access to a registered dietitian for those who might want to discuss eating regimens, setting up a safe walking path onsite for those who wish to take a walk during breaks, maybe offer a few onsite classes during the work week for yoga or other gentle exercise.

      The only advantage I see to offering a Biggest Loser event over the other suggestions above is that it is low cost and low commitment for management.

      Reply ↓
      1. Antilles*

        I agree and I’d also just note that if you have to do, X incentives per year, nothing says you have to do different ones every single year. You can make every March your annual Get Moving For Spring campaign or make every October your Staying Warm over Winter (by exercising) campaign or etc.

        Reply ↓
  33. Mother of Corgis*

    One of my former workplaces did this maybe 15 years ago. Most of us participated because we genuinely wanted to lose some weight (and I was young enough not to realize how problematic this was). Our receptionist, however, took it WAY too seriously. She chugged as much water as she could stomach right before the starting weigh in. The final weekend before Monday weigh in, she literally starved herself for two days. Had nothing but water. Didn’t even have that the day of the weigh in. Bragged about her tactics to everyone. She won, of course. It was only a $100 prize, but the rest of us felt like she’d pretty much cheated any way she could, and the starving herself was definitely problematic and worrying for such a small prize.

    Reply ↓
      2. Hey, I'm Wohrking Heah!*

        Ha yes! “Fergus, do you always carry lead shot around.” “Why yes, I’m a Revolutionary War reenactor and you just never know when someone with a musket will turn up.”

        Reply ↓
    1. mlem*

      A reference to an inane meme from last year (or the year before last, a link to CBS tells me) tying women to irresponsible shopping and economic illiteracy in a “tee-hee!” fashion.

      Reply ↓
    2. ThatGirl*

      An example of “girl math” would be “these $200 shoes are on sale for $150, so if I buy them, I’ve actually saved $50!”

      which of course is just how HUMANS think sometimes, and not specific to women.

      Reply ↓
      1. Jamoche*

        Like those ads for high-end clothing resale websites, with all the actresses (it’s always women) going on about “making” money by selling clothes for less than they paid for them.

        Reply ↓
    4. fine-tipped pen aficionado*

      Ok in defense of girl math, when it was a brand new trend/meme the content I saw was overwhelmingly stuff like “If I buy object X and then use it Y times then it really only costs Z per use which isn’t that much at all” which is a pretty sound way to connect the cost of something to the value it has for you, IMO.

      That said, it pretty quickly became a trash fire of sexism and the usage in this flyer is gross so everyone criticizing it is valid and correct.

      Reply ↓
      1. Calamity Janine*

        like many a fine joke, it’s fun when you’re making fun of yourself for being silly. it overwhelmingly sucks when you’re using it against other people.

        i prefer girl dinner to girl math, though. the charcuterie board is a sign that humanity craves a little pick n mix of goodies for dindins. also, the rebuttal of “boy dinner” showing someone eating an entire costco rotisserie chicken with a can of monster energy, and nothing else (including no napkins, plate, cutlery etc just the rotisserie chicken in its plastic tray), while in the bathtub with the bubble bath clearly having been made with half a bottle of dish soap still on the ledge? i may have laughed a little too hard at it. mostly picturing how eating a rotisserie chicken with your soapy hands would go.

        mind you that has nothing to do with gender at the end of the day. it’s far more a tale of how humans are just little weirdos, and i love that for us, bathtub chicken and all

        Reply ↓
  38. Not on board*

    In addition to all the valid points above – starving yourself and over-exercising do not work long term. Exercise is beneficial for your health but ultimately isn’t all that effective for weight loss.

    The long term health problems attached to this have been documented – looking at the tv show contestants in the years following has shown that this isn’t sustainable, healthy, weight loss. Also, what works for one person, doesn’t work for the next, and it’s much easier for men to lose weight than women both anecdotally and scientifically – so there’s the potential for women being disadvantaged – unless you have a separate category for men and women.

    Bad all around.

    Reply ↓
    1. Hey, I'm Wohrking Heah!*

      Right? Hubby did 2 weeks of dry January and dropped a size. I’m on week 6 of dry January and have lost, wait for it, 1.5 pounds. As I ranted above, whoever invented menopause should be tarred and feathered.

      Reply ↓
      1. Not on board*

        Right? Not to mention that starving yourself for more than a day or two will completely tank your metabolism, send your body into fat storing mode, and guarantee that you will put back the weight you lost plus more.

        Reply ↓
    2. Calamity Janine*

      several metastudies have made it pretty clear – it’s healthier to just steadily remain overweight than it is to yo-yo diet.

      but they tend to get ignored the same way that folks doing this ignore the idea that health doesn’t equal only a number on the scale, and the more that number goes down the more healthy you are…

      (…or, as my disabled self will bitterly note, the entire idea that “healthy” is a state everyone can get to if they put in the effort. y’all, shit ain’t work up in the here that is me. i will never be perfectly healthy. and that’s okay! that’s not a personal failing of my willpower! it just is what it is, and if people could hurry up and not be so weird about it, the world would be a better place.)

      Reply ↓
      1. Not on board*

        No kidding. Being thin does NOT equal healthy. I am slightly overweight and carry it in such a way that with the right clothing, I don’t really look overweight. I am working on a program that is allowing me to lose weight VERY gradually. But I do have some health issues, all of which are autoimmune and have nothing to do with my weight.

        Reply ↓
        1. Calamity Janine*

          ironically to this whole topic, the scariest bit of medical misogyny that i’ve ever endured – the one most likely to have put me six feet under – was also… due to people cheering on my weight loss, too.

          when i was actively being dangerously unhealthy.

          because i was crying in their offices about how i felt awful all the time and could barely eat. i didn’t even twig any “hey, disordered eating? worry about that maybe? maybe the fat depressed girl suddenly losing weight and sobbing in my office is a thing to be concerned about?” worries. it took my mother, months later, to pull out her spare blood glucose meter and put my blood in there instead of her own, and then make alarmed noises at the result before driving me to the emergency room.

          it turns out having a blood sugar of around 500 doesn’t feel good, and it isn’t exactly what one could call healthy! it also turns out that sudden changes in weight, including sudden weight loss, are a big medical red flag for many things including “oops your pancreas has gone on strike”!

          but i was losing weight, so all the doctors – who knew my medical history, who knew the family history of diabetes and the PCOS diagnosis and dozens of other risk factors including taking psychiatric medication – just saw “oh, number go down :) that’s good! no problem here! good job making number go down!”

          to his immense credit, my primary care doctor kicked himself and apologized for missing the obvious. the other doctors who didn’t do that? i do not see them anymore, because they didn’t admit they missed a very basic and important part of their job.

          they just saw number go down. and they assumed that number going down meant health.

          though i know you’re with me, i sure hope some of the people wandering in now saying “well some people enjoy it so it’s totally fine, just don’t participate” will consider this and think about how, in fact, it’s not easy to opt out of these things and not have them bother you. the idea that the number on the scale going down means you’re healthier is one that nearly killed me. it spurred medical neglect that made me miserable for months, and made doctors ignore my pleading for help. all they saw was the number going down. all they saw was that. and they equated it to being healthier. i had already opted out of this idea when i was in their offices sobbing and desperate. i knew i wasn’t healthier. but i couldn’t opt out of the idea hard enough to actually get medical care until we had already done the work of a diagnosis for them.

          i don’t know what those months of my blood vessels being shredded by far too much glucose have done to me. i was lucky in that i was young. the worst part was the weeks of being unable to see clearly, stacking reading glasses on top of my regular ones because of how high blood sugar distorts the lens in your eye and sudden changes, even if that sudden change is a welcome one, means it takes a long time to adjust. i may never know, as i get older, how much of the problems i may have were set up by doctors ignoring me. but folks reading this will note: this wasn’t a “go see your doctor in the morning” problem when the problem was uncovered. it was a “haul yourself posthaste to the emergency room” level issue to my health.

          that’s what this idea of “health = number on scale” gets you. that’s what harm it can do. and i’m a lucky case.

          i’m a lucky case because i didn’t actually die.

          so when folks are out here going “well she can just ignore it! i think it’s fun!”… keep in mind the cost.

          Reply ↓
  39. Kangaroo for Two*

    Reading this letter made me travel back in time to 1994 when I had my first “real” job, a temp agency placement as the receptionist in an office during a summer between college semesters, and someone had put one of those plastic pigs in the shared fridge in the breakroom, the kind that would oink when it was triggered by the light turning on when someone opened the door of the fridge.

    Also because the flyer reminded me of when the ne plus ultra of office flyers was to use wingdings to make whimsical bullet points.

    And the humor reminds me of the pre-widespread internet era, when people used to send “funny office jokes” via fax. Kids, it was a crazy time.

    Reply ↓
    1. Delta Delta*

      And the corollary to the fax jokes is that you’d get in a ton of trouble for that because faxing was expensive and so was that big roll of thermal fax paper. Good times.

      Reply ↓
      1. Hey, I'm Wohrking Heah!*

        And there were special hi-liters for the fax paper. They had striped caps so you’d know the difference I think AI wrote this gross flyer and captured the 90’s, font and all.

        Reply ↓
  40. CheesePlease*

    This is gross and I hope you push back directly

    to HR / coordinators: “I am concerned that this challenge over-emphasizes weight loss as a measure of health, and is not healthy for any employees who have a variety of health conditions that may impact their relationship with food or their ability to lose / gain weight”

    to coworkers “yeah that was major yikes right? I don’t need my coworkers judging my weight or what I eat”

    Reply ↓
    1. HonorBox*

      Adding to HR/coordinators: There are also liabilities that I’m sure you will want to consider, as the company probably doesn’t want to have the financial and PR problems that could occur if an employee is hurt or falls ill because of this activity.

      Reply ↓
  41. A Teacher*

    This stuff irritates me. I’ve lost 60 lbs in about year, but it’s through medical management, portion control, exercise, etc… I don’t want to compete with someone else. Muscle also weighs more than fat so if people are doing stuff correctly they won’t lose as much weight long term. If I were to participate in this, it would really mess with the medical aspect of what I’ve already done–I’m a healthy weight and while I’d like to be down 10 more, it will take time and continued management. Not a stupid competition.

    Reply ↓
    1. HonorBox*

      I’ve told several friends over the years, and have reminded myself, of what you said about muscle weighing more than fat. When I was in the best shape of my life, I weighed more than other times when I wasn’t working out as much simply because muscle weighs more than fat. Did the fact that the scale showed a higher number mean I was not as healthy? Nope.

      Reply ↓
    2. Burnt Out Librarian*

      I kind of want someone with a previously (and of course voluntarily) disclosed medical diagnosis to call their bluff. “Yes I know I’m going through cancer treatment, Karen, but that’ll give me an advantage! Imagine all the weight I’ll lose when I get the tumors removed!”

      I lost my oldest sister to ovarian cancer in 2018 and she would 110% do this to make a point. Miss her.

      Reply ↓
  43. Mktbird*

    I’ve struggled with several eating disorders in the last couple decades and when I became pregnant in 2023, I went to a local doctor connected to the hospital for my confirmation scan etc. tell me why the office staff there had a contest like this going on and it was plastered EVERYWHERE. I never went back. It was so out of touch and offensive

    Reply ↓
  44. leeapeea*

    OP, my small civil and environmental engineering firm (~50ppl) does not do this, so lmk if you’re looking for something new. If you don’t feel comfortable bringing your concerns directly to the owner, is there another leader that the owner trusts that you feel would hear you out? Leadership in my firm has been relatively accessible but I know that’s not the case everywhere. If not, perhaps forming a cohort of colleagues that feel similarly to you and either formally push back directly to leadership, or informally by agreeing to engage with questions about participation by responding with the concerns and issues in Alison’s response. In a firm of 40 people, even a handful of folks explaining why the program is ill advised can sway opinions. Best of luck, OP!

    Reply ↓
  45. Anxious Archivist*

    I got one of these emails when I was working at a very toxic job. I replied with a scathing email about how triggering it was as someone in recovery from an eating disorder and then blocked all possible keywords from my inbox.

    I hate that this is still a thing. Burn it down.

    Reply ↓
  46. CommanderBanana*

    Blrrrrgh on behalf of everyone, could other people please stop spraying their issues with food and weight all over their coworkers with stuff like this? Have your own Biggest Loser (ugh) contest with yourself if that is what brings you joy, but leave everyone else out of it.

    I attended one (1) “social committee” meeting at a previous job and they suggested Weight Watchers; I counterproposed something like a cooking class with no emphasis on weight loss, and I somehow never got invited back to another social committee meeting (a win in my book).

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  48. L*

    My first thought is what if someone is underweight or already very thin?? The “yes, you” part truly seems to be saying everyone should participate!!

    Reply ↓
  49. Cody*

    IMHO, I don’t think there’s anything inherently with wrong having with an optional office weight loss challenge. A lot of people do want to shed some pounds after the holidays and find a competition like this to be a motivating way to do that.

    That being said, the way the rules are written here is really patronizing and tone deaf for all the reasons Alison mentioned.

    Reply ↓
    2. Somehow I Manage*

      I once offered for work to pay the entry fee to a 5K walk/run for everyone on staff. The event was being organized by a group another employee was part of and money raised went to a charitable cause. But it was optional. I offered. A couple people took me up on it. I nearly puked at the end of the race, a la Michael Scott. That was it. The folks who didn’t participate heard nothing more of it from me.

      Reply ↓
    3. CommanderBanana*

      Noo.

      If someone wants to have a weight loss challenge, there are literally a zillion other options that dragging that ish into work, up to and including finding like-minded people on your own to do that with.

      Reply ↓
  52. Anon for this*

    I had a coworker who suggested this once and she was REALLY pushy about it. I was her only peer; everyone else was junior to her. I flat out told her no, we are not doing that. If you want to lose weight in a competition, I invite you to do that outside of work.

    She was so mad about it! She truly didn’t understand why this was an inappropriate thing to suggest at work. She tried to push back but I held firm (I was the lead on our employee wellness initiatives at the time, and had final say in what we did). Several of her direct reports came to me privately to thank me for shutting it down, because they didn’t have the political capital to. Push back if you can! it is worth it.

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  54. Professional button pusher*

    Good lord. It’s all horrifying, however, I can say that I would dominate this challenge because I’m a cancer patient (also working full time), and I just started a new med with side effects including “life threatening diarrhea”, food aversion and weight loss (on top of the weight I already lost last year due to chemo). Personally, I would tell them it’s unfair for me to participate because of the massive competitive advantage I have due to…cancer.

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    1. Keymaster of Gozer (she/her)*

      Yeah, nothing like losing over a kg a week and being congratulated for it by people while you’re feeling the sickest you’ve ever felt. I’m with you mate.

      Reply ↓
    4. Calamity Janine*

      as ways to do it go, yours would be a very polite way to game the system and shame them by doing so.

      at least, way more kind to the janitors than offering to sell people shots of puke from your kid that caught norovirus at school… that’ll definitely make the number on the scale go down!

      Reply ↓
    5. Madame Desmortes*

      I wish you all the best for your treatment.

      My mother’s body type is mine. She dieted her entire adult life, but didn’t become anything like thin until a few months before cancer killed her. I tell fat-shaming doctors this, and it shuts them up with a quickness.

      Reply ↓
  56. Ann O'Nemity*

    About 15 years ago, my husband’s company tried to run a “Biggest Loser” weight loss competition. It ended with thousands of dollars in workers’ comp claims. One guy passed out from hunger, hit his head, and had to be taken to urgent care. Another tore a ligament from an overzealous weightlifting session—in the break room, of all places. In the end, no one actually lost weight long-term, but the company definitely lost productivity. A total disaster.

    Reply ↓
    1. Hey, I'm Wohrking Heah!*

      Aah yes the Golden Era where Biggest Loser met Cross Fit. It was the best of times, it was the worst of times.

      Reply ↓
      1. Ann O'Nemity*

        That is exactly how my husband described it.

        This company also went out of business—spectacularly. Employees arrived one morning to find the doors locked and a sign that simply said, “Out of Business.” No warning, no email, no HR rep—just radio silence. And, of course, not a single manager showed up, which pretty much confirms they knew it was coming. The “Biggest Loser” competition was one of many red flags about how that place was being run.

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  57. That Library Lady*

    Oh I LOVE going to the gym. Go 4-5 times a week. Favorite place to sit around and eat desserts (sarcasm)

    All jokes aside this is horrific. I’m still trying to undo years of living with a “crunchy” mom and having a complicated relationship with food, all while dealing with medical conditions that make losing weight much more difficult for me. I’d be seeing red if I got this notice. OP I’m sorry you’re dealing with it, and I’m sure there’s others whose flabbers are just as gasted as yours.

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    1. Busy Middle Manager*

      It’s a theory that girls/women view costs as investments. Think Carry from Sex and the City who thinks shoes are an investment because the payoff is meeting more well-off men and moving among richer people, if she portrays a certain image. Or someone who rents an apartment in a nice area they can’t afford, the “payoff” being social opportunities.

      Not an endorsement of the term :-/ but I had to comment, since it annoyed me so much that the term literally doesn’t fit here.

      They’re describing a simple percentage!

      Reply ↓
      1. Resident Catholicville, U.S.A.*

        I don’t think it’s that- I think it’s implying that “girl math” would manipulate the numbers to her advantage, ie: using percentages instead of pounds; the reverse; using weekly numbers instead of over all; etc. It’s obnoxious, as if men don’t manipulate numbers to put themselves in the best light possible.

        I googled “girl math” to see what you were talking about and boy howdy, I wish I hadn’t done that. I think equating Tik Tok trends- which from what I understand are humorous or purposely ridiculous- to actual mindsets that people carry over into real life is dangerous. The way you’re describing it sounds like people ascribing shallow meaning to people’s purchases without knowing or realizing why someone might have an actual decent reason for their purchases (Carrie might have needed a decent wardrobe to maintain a lifestyle consistent with her job, moving to a better neighborhood might be offset with the school system a child could go to, etc).

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    2. Resident Catholicville, U.S.A.*

      Maybe this is why I was so bad at “math.” Maybe I was in “stupid boy math” class instead of “fancy girl math” class all along.

      Reply ↓
  60. iglwif*

    GOOD LORD. What a load of horrendous bollocks!!

    And expressed in nauseatingly condescending language, as if the content of the message weren’t nauseating enough.

    Reply ↓
  61. Jonathan MacKay*

    This would be fine IF (and ONLY IF) it didn’t feel like a mandatory expectation, AND that it was done AFTER getting group input. As an example, a previous job had a social committee, where a couple social events were planned for all staff willing to participate throughout the year. ((I regret passing on the axe throwing event so much!)) This sort of thing is not the kind of event to just randomly announce – but if it was carefully planned out, such that only a few willing participants were involved, and it was essentially treated like the TV show was, and every one else was just there to cheer them on…. it MIGHT be okay.

    Over all though, it seems more like an enforced guilt trip…. It’s almost as bad as the time I was pastoring a church and it was ‘suggested’ (read: demanded) to me by an Elder to put something in a sermon about weight loss – when we had a member of the church who had significant weight issues. I don’t miss dealing with him.

    Even now, I have a coworker who has gotten serious about losing weight, to the point of changing his diet significantly, and the only comments I’ve gotten from him about my own weight is to be mindful of my age, seeing as he’s not quite 20 years older than I am. I will freely admit my diet is about the same as it was in college 20 years ago, so he probably has a point……. and they’re not unprompted comments either,

    But an office culture that is skewed to prioritizing fitness and wellbeing without the recognition of people’s physical limitations is already heading towards toxicity, if not already there.

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  63. Lorna*

    Excuse me? Weight loss at work? Fancy girl maths? What in the “I just dropped my donut in shock” nonsense is this?
    It’s not just rude, the wording is so blatantly obvious aimed at women and I hate everything about it.
    Meh.

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  64. Katara's side braids*

    The “of course everyone is trying to lose weight!” attitude is so disturbingly pervasive. When I had depression as a teen, I would get weighed at my psychiatrist’s office. Every time my weight went down between one week and the next, the receptionist who weighed me would give some kind of “good for you!” reaction. At a *psychiatrist’s* office!! Never mind that one of my symptoms was loss of appetite. In hindsight I wish I’d told my parents or spoken up, but that shouldn’t be up to a child.

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  65. whatchamacallit*

    I had unexplained weight loss a few years ago (during 2020, so, even after running tests to rule out things like thyroid problems, basically we landed on ‘I dunno, stress related?’) and have been struggling to put weight back on. Especially muscle mass. I have largely failed. (I also briefly had to try cutting saturated fat because I had high cholesterol. In case we needed any more points about how thinness is not equivalent to health.) There’s the general grossness of this whole thing but also it’s so ignorant. Muscle weighs more than fat. You could be absolutely jacked and be “overweight” and the rules of this contest would basically dictate you become LESS healthy to win. Being underweight also puts you at risk of other health problems, like stress fractures, which I did not know until I got a stress fracture, and is specifically the type of injury you’d be encouraging if you want people to greatly ramp up exercise in a short period of time. A whole mess.

    Reply ↓
    2. CommanderBanana*

      Right? My sibling was, by BMI standards, “obese.” He was a professional weightlifter and at competition weight and just over 6 feet tall, would push 250 (he did not use steroids).

      Also? Some of the most unhealthy people I’ve known were professional weightlifters.

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  66. Zap R.*

    Buy a sheet cake, bring it to the break room, and eat it slowly while never breaking eye contact with your coworkers. Savour every bite.

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  67. MB*

    The assumption that everyone carrying excess weight is due to poor nutrition/bad habits is extremely out of date information. Macros are important for many medical conditions, and Metabolic Syndrome is a medical diagnosis. Unless you are a board certified weight loss physician (very few in existence until recently) most physicians don’t understand this either. The tone of the flyer is terrible. Let’s make overweight people feel like crap, why don’t we?

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  68. Water Everywhere*

    Reply with some ‘fancy girl math’ about the potential litigation costs should an employee suffer harm while competing.

    Reply ↓
    1. Water Everywhere*

      OR, reply with links to some Maintenance Phase podcast episodes, I’m thinking specifically The Biggest Loser (Jan 2021), Workplace Wellness (Dec 2022) and Is Being Fat Bad For You (Nov 2021).

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  69. Busy Middle Manager*

    My sister’s job did this and she kept commenting on it. Her workplace had consistently ordered heavy Italian American food she couldn’t eat (lactose intolerant) and low quality high sugar grocery store desserts. No veggies. In response to that, her coworkers didn’t eat healthier, they just didn’t eat that much for a month :-/

    Reply ↓
  70. Burnt Out Librarian*

    Yeah, no, this would go into the shredder were it to cross my path. But then again, I’m still seething that my employer has decided to nickel-and-dime us exempt folks out of our PTO if we dare (gasp) go to a doctor’s appointment during the week.

    Employers *do not care* about your health and they need to stop pretending they do with this bullcrap.

    Reply ↓
    1. Burnt Out Librarian*

      Also– as a former fat kid/teen/woman: I have lost 70 lbs over the past two years. I was overweight most my life and nearly killed myself as a teenager trying to starve and exercise the weight off. Turns out I have a metabolic insufficiency and the GLP-1 drugs we have now correct both that and my blood sugar. Starving myself and working out until I fainted didn’t do anything but make me miserable and probably give me the chronic conditions I now struggle with on a daily basis.

      Your employer can introduce a large bag of Richards into their diet as far as I’m concerned.

      Reply ↓
        2. Burnt Out Librarian*

          Wish I had come up with it first, but there’s a wonderful sticker someone sells on Etsy that says “Thou may ingest a satchel of Richards” and it’s wormed its way into my vocabulary.

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  71. Yes And*

    Here’s what OP should do:

    – Get every person in the office to contribute $1.50
    – With the $60 pot raised, pay the entrance fees for 3 people chosen at random
    – Nobody actually do anything to participate in the contest
    – Since there are only 3 entrants, they automatically win the 3 prizes
    – Split the $1,000 evenly between everybody who contributed to the entry pot
    – Everybody makes $23.50 at company expense

    In a company with only 40 employees, this should be possible.

    Reply ↓
  72. C4TL4DY*

    We do the step challenges at work and never had any issues. I’ve heard of an employer doing the weight one and it ended badly (it wasn’t based on percentages like it is here). This looks like an HR nightmare and doesn’t seem like it was vetted by a competent marketing person either.

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      1. Jamoche*

        Brings back memories of the time I was on crutches and used a step tracker to know when I hit my max. Also had a friend who was doing so for a permanent condition. We *really* hated when we’d go over the max and the app would go all “congrats! Keep it up! Have some firework effects!” Oh yeah, we really want to celebrate how bad we’re going to feel tomorrow.

        Apps are much better now, they’re neutral about hitting targets.

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        1. Burnt Out Librarian*

          I’ve been looking into the arm band that tracks your heart rate because of a chronic tachycardia condition (one that I was either born with or gave myself trying to lose weight as a teen… yay) and while my insurance would happily pay for a pedometer or give me a discount on an Oura ring or Fitbit, it won’t touch anything that seems to be aimed at folks pacing themselves or knowing when to sit down and rest. Because of course you’re supposed to be always exercising!!! Get more steps!!!

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      2. Georgia Carolyn Mason*

        If you’re disabled and your company does this, I suggest knitting if you’re able. Some fitness trackers record the wrist movement of each stitch as one or more steps, so you can totally smoke the competition and make a point about how this is ableist BS at the same time.

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  73. Fergus's half brother*

    I have cancer and on chemo and sometimes I have to eat something that is not the healthiest because basically anything else will probably make me vomit uncontrollably. so if I got any flack I would eat something that was healthy so I could throw up on their shoes if I heard a complaint on what I ate

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    1. Salty Caramel*

      If someone gives you a hard time because you’re eating something that will stay down when you’re on chemo, they deserve to be thrown up on.

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  74. ElastiGirl*

    I lost 46% of my body weight over 16 months through taking Mounjaro (results not typical). I did not diet in any way. I did not work out. All I did was take a weekly medication that corrected a previously undiagnosed hormonal imbalance.

    If this contest was promoted at my workplace, I would happily sign up so I could announce when I won that I had done absolutely nothing to lose weight because weight is more about genetics and hormones than it is about behavior, and that the whole contest was a crock.

    I strongly suggest the OP find a way to circulate this AAM post to the appropriate people in their office to let them know how horrendous this idea is.

    Reply ↓
    1. Burnt Out Librarian*

      Same here. Years and years and years of “you’re eating too much” when I was starving myself and “you’re lazy” when I was exercising until I passed out. Then Mounjaro happens and I’m suddenly the size I always dreamed of being. Because it’s not about character flaws, it’s about body chemistry and medical challenges.

      I hope OP can either talk sense into their bosses or can at least avoid the negative morale shift this “contest” is going to cause.

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  76. Serious Silly Putty*

    Options:
    “Hi boss- I’m concerned about the negative impact the Biggest Loser challenger will have on our workplace. Here’s a general overview of why they’re a bad idea: [this is the first link I found — perhaps there are others from better sources: https://incentfit.com/wellness-word/this-is-why-weight-loss-challenges-at-work-are-not-good/#:~:text=Offering%20an%20incentive%20for%20employees,and%20their%20overall%20mental%20health. ]
    I appreciate that the flyer was trying to take a light, playful tone, but no good can come of judging people about their eating habits. For many of us this is “cringe” but nothing more. But for anyone with a more complicated relationship to food — from a history of eating disorders to weight fluctuations due to medication to nausea from chemotherapy — this could be really harmful.
    Also, where is the prize money coming from, if fewer than 50 people participate? If the company is paying people to lose weight that could set us up for discrimination.
    Perhaps the powers that be could set up an alternative option? Like maybe a lunchtime walking club? Or gym discounts?”

    Reply ↓
  77. feline overlord's chief vassal*

    This is an appallingly bad idea, see this book for an extended tour of why: https://www.amazon.com/Why-Diets-Make-Fat-Consequences/dp/1591847699

    Yes, DIETS MAKE US FAT.

    Encouraging exercise and eating veggies is fine (if done in a supportive, low-key and non-judgmental way; maybe I’m hurt and just ate salad and need some pizza with chicken to keep working right now).

    Encouraging people to lose weight to win a contest will only make them more fat and more unhealthy in the long run. Gee, thanks!!!

    Reply ↓
    1. Caramel & Cheddar*

      I always think about how 95% of diets fail and people end up gaining back more than they lost. So if you (that is, this terrible workplace) care about my health and you think my health is tied to my weight, why make me do a crash diet that will ultimately end up with me weighing more than when I started?

      Reply ↓
      1. Ama*

        If I recall correctly, the Biggest Loser show was canceled in large part because many of the winners ended up gaining all the weight back and also started talking publicly about all the truly unhealthy things they did to get to a winning weight (like not drinking fluids on weigh in days).

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  78. Somehow I Manage*

    IANAL. But I know enough to know where there are potential legal pitfalls. And this seems like a situation that sets up a lawsuit nicely. As other commenters have noted, there are several reasons that people can’t and shouldn’t actively try to lose weight. If an employee has some sort of medical issue, it won’t take much to connect dots to this flyer, and given the language on the flyer, it would be difficult to defend this as an optional and voluntary thing.

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  80. I'm just here for the cats!!*

    Not only is this problematic on all the reasons that Alison wrote about. But the language itself is REALLY problematic and judgmental.
    “I don’t need this while eyeing the donuts in the office”
    “we promise we wont judge you for that holiday weight.”
    “you can enjoy pizza if you can run to the store and back”
    “no judgement -except maybe if we se you with sweets.”

    This is horrible. How much do you want to bet that the people who participate are going to not only bully each other, but everyone else too. This is not teamwork!

    Reply ↓
  81. Retail Dalliance*

    I would not be about this at all! And I would respond aggressively. It would be a reply-all situation for me, with 3 paragraphs outlining why the language in the flyer is harmful both to office culture and to individual mental health.

    Reply ↓
  83. 653-CXK*

    We had this kind of contest at ExJob, but the more I think of the dynamics of this, having people compete to lose weight and win a cash prize is completely wrong. I would put up a rebuttal flyer pointing out all of the ill effects of this contest, and invite others to add their thoughts to it.

    Reply ↓
    1. 653-CXK*

      Side post…the same thing can be said with any kind of financial incentive to “do better” with daily activities.

      For over 21 years, I worked as a claims processor, and fifteen of those were spent on the “commercial” side of the company (I had transferred from the “senior Medicare Advantage” side.) Claims processors had an incentive program where we were audited on processing, and earned monthly cash bonuses if we kept above a certain quality and production level, and if we failed to meet that minimum, progressive disciplinary action followed, including additional weekly auditing, up to and including termination.

      Upper management, in order to keep the providers happy in their claims payments, had a 94% quality minimum even before the bonuses kicked in. (That meant we could only make three errors per month before we were determined to be deficient.) It was at the caprice of the Quality Assurance department to determine what constituted an error.

      The incentive program went away when everything was outsourced to India…along with the jobs. Those last few months, from what I heard, were fed-up processors telling QA to pound sand.

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  84. WillowSunstar*

    Ugh, I hate things like this. I have hypothyroidism and literally have tried to be thin my entire life. Guess what, unless things like Ozempic are made much, much cheaper than they are, the vast majority of us with thyroid issues are never going to be able to diet and exercise ourselves down to Barbie-doll size.

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  85. Chirpy*

    This competition would legitimately make me gain weight – from stress, even if I wasn’t participating or trying to be petty about it.

    Reply ↓
  87. Aww, coffee, no*

    I’d like to recommend Ewesername*’s comment about how they entered the office cat into a similar weight loss competition as an antidote to this utter tripe issued by OP’s company.
    Link to follow, but look for a Dec-22 column titled “my team is flipping out over a lunch, correcting coworkers who use the wrong words, and more”.

    Reply ↓
    2. Thin Mints didn't make me thin*

      Absolutely worth searching for this. The cat won the contest and got a cat tree and a fluffy bed.

      Reply ↓
  89. Nellie*

    I was asked to participate in a staff organized program of “the biggest loser”. I was HARD into my eating disorder, and talked to my therapist. I somehow found it within myself to decline.

    A year or so later my organization (large, ~20000 people) held a “Be Fit” competition (it was an annual event). It was “opt in”, but there was a lot of peer pressure to participate. Weight wasn’t measured, but number of exercise minutes was. I finished second in the entire organization. I feel so bad about it now, all of those hours burning up the road. Another year later and I ended up in intensive treatment for my eating disorder. I have no doubt that the contest made it more difficult for me to stay healthy. I returned from treatment and I had several teams try and recruit me to the contest for the following year. No thank you!

    I’ve kicked the excessive exercise habit, and don’t work at that organization any longer.

    Reply ↓
  90. Seen Too Much*

    About 10 years ago, maybe a bit longer, I was consulting for a company that wanted to up their employee engagement numbers. Now these people were COMPETATIVE – if you could gamify something, they were IN. I bought a bunch of dollar store trinkets to give out to 2nd and 3rd place and some really cheap trophies and medals for 1st. We also had a Winner’s Circle, where we would put 1st place winners.

    We had a survey asking what types of events/competitions people would like to see. We had a few to choose from and a box to write your own. There were about 50 people in the office. 100% wrote in who can lose the most weight (weight loss contests, who’s skinnier at the end of the month -etc). I was appalled.

    I explained why this was not a good idea – some of what Alison said and also the fact that men tend to lose weight faster/easier than women and that muscle weighs more that fat, so if you are working out you may see a gain instead, etc, etc.

    They insisted. I told them that the company would not sponsor it, but if they did it on their own I couldn’t stop them. I told them there would be no prizes and no pictures on the wall.

    Almost everyone dropped out by the end of the first week. By the end, there were only 2 employees competing. I don’t know which one was the winner, because they never said. They had met up at the gym to do a weigh in and never mentioned it again.

    After that, they listened to me if I told them something wasn’t a good idea. Don’t know what happened after I left. Covid put them out of business and I lost touch.

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  91. boof*

    uhasdfljsdf
    OK in grad school I participated in one of these and lost all my stress weight that I’d hoped to when I aborted my phd for a masters – for me it was healthy but it was very much optional/student run and had none of this awful language, and I was premed and kind of knew what I was supposed to do for weight loss.
    So, yeah, I think there can be a place for some of these things but… not like this, dear me.

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  92. One Duck In A Row*

    As a cancer survivor (who once almost had to skip an infusion because of how much weight I’d involuntarily lost since the previous infusion) I would be so forking ranging mad. While this would have been directly triggering for me back in the days when weight loss was objectively bad and scary for me, it wouldn’t be now. But on behalf of everyone I know for whom this would be not only medically frowned upon but likely also triggering, I would absolutely march into HR, put on the crocodile tears, and shame them into shutting this down.

    I keep typing and deleting further rants because I’m so enraged. I happen to know a couple of folks who are in recovery from EDs right now, and feel so protective of them, and I guess maybe I am feeling triggered on behalf of them, even if not because of my own medical history. ED recovery is such intense, grueling work, and for many is a lifelong journey. And for folks who don’t know (it feels like common knowledge, but I’m not sure), having an ED isn’t just about being too skinny or engaging in certain behaviors around food and exercise. They can literally be fatal, and can often cause temporary or permanent organ damage.

    Reply ↓
  93. Rebecca*

    One of the first symptoms of my father’s cancer was that he rapidly lost a third of his body weight. He didn’t look truly ill, though, until he was well into chemo.

    People kept asking him what his weight loss secret was. At first, he had the energy and sass to look them dead in the eye and say ‘cancer’, but it got old, fast.

    This is so gross on so many levels. Leave people alone about their weight.

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    1. Keymaster of Gozer (She/Her)*

      This is exactly how I was diagnosed – I dropped over half my body weight really fast. Loose skin everywhere. Got real old having people ask what my secret was when the doctors were frantically scrambling to figure out what was going on.

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  95. Ms. Whatsit*

    I object outright on principle. It’s intrusive, it’s a topic with a lot of sensitivities around it, and it’s likely to reinforce unhealthy approaches to food and health and even exercise. Also, there are so many different factors involved in people’s weight that it can’t possibly be fair. You could probably go to the first meeting and pick out the likely winners; they’re likely to be younger, male, and not parents.

    The only thing I can think of that, *if done well*, could work is encouraging physical activity (which has a lot of benefits, regardless of whether one loses weight or not). Allow the use of work time (within reason), let people choose any activity they like (including modified exercises), and set a goal for consistency (like, “I’ll walk for 15 minutes 3 times a week” or “I’ll do 5 modified push-ups every day”) over a set time period. No weigh-ins, nothing but encouragement and everyone who meets their goal gets a small prize. I guess for companies big enough to have swag stores, they could also make branded athletic clothes from a size-inclusive brand available (emphasis on available – not promoted).

    Also, I really just wish people wouldn’t really discuss weight in a professional context, and even most social contexts. You never know what someone is really carrying, and diet culture is so toxic. It hurts a lot to hear people who seem relatively fit despising their bodies when you’re an overweight person. Now after years, I’m on the other side and I don’t want to “share my secret” with professional contacts I see a few times a year confessing their “need” to lose X amount of weight. I don’t mind discussing in a limited way with some people that I’m closer to, but try not to dwell on it.

    “That looks delicious.” “If you’re hungry, have more.” “You look great.” “I love your X” “that’s a great color on you.” <–what I try to stick with.

    Reply ↓
    1. L*

      I’ve seen one other “healthy spring” campaign thing work out well.

      It was a bingo card with 12 things on it every week. You could do up to four of them to get entries into a raffle, and then at the end there were some number of prizes (all of them the same, I think they were $25). Everyone that signed up got one free entry per week, and then you “earned” your other entries by posting a filled-out bingo card to a slack channel once a week. Entirely honour system, and afaik no one gamed the system.

      The “challenges” were a variety of things, and no more than four of them were exercise related on any given card. There was also stuff like “hug someone close to you” or “spend 30 minutes outside” or “drink one more glass of water than you usually do”. Absolutely none of them were weight related, and the only food ones were things like “eat an extra vegetable” or “cook something healthy” with no specifications on what that meant. The intent was that literally anyone could participate and get their weekly raffle entries, though it was still opt-in.

      Reply ↓
  96. CityMouse*

    I’m someone who worked with my Dad to help him lose weight following his heart attack, so I do believe in certain programs and the cardiovascular benefits of exercise and diet.

    And to all this: nope. This is not how you lose weight in a healthy sustainable way. This is not how you improve fitness. The crash diet biggest loser yo yo diet stuff can be very hard on your heart.

    Reply ↓
  97. Former Retail Lifer*

    I’d bring cookies, donuts, and the most calorie-laden Starbucks drinks to work for every day of this challenge.

    Reply ↓
  98. Kristin*

    As someone who tended to abruptly drop weight (which caused health problems), I also had to hear “you’re so lucky” at work.
    I can keep quiet about some things, but I never let that go. Not once. And people didn’t want to hear it. Sad that this hasn’t improved.

    Reply ↓
  99. Clown Eradicator*

    My employer is doing this for the second time since I’ve been there. This is sadly the least problematic thing I’ve dealt with here, though. I’m currently fighting regarding ADA stuff…

    Reply ↓
  100. Lady Ann*

    Our culture’s obsession with weight loss is so ingrained, I recently mentioned to someone I was trying to get my cat to gain weight (she went through a few months of being sick and lost a lot of weight), and their response was “surely you don’t want your cat to be obese?” Yes actually, I would prefer that to skeletal.

    Reply ↓
  101. Mesquito*

    “sorry, I can’t participate, I need to fax in my weigh-ins and amazingly enough that’s explicitly forbidden by the rules”

    Reply ↓
    1. Hey, I'm Wohrking Heah!*

      Mic Drop. Also, what engineering office still has a fax? It’s like someone found a flyer in their retired mom’s file cabinet.

      Reply ↓
  102. Hey, I'm Wohrking Heah!*

    My reply all “What’s a fancy girl? Oh, you mean like the ones in Vegas- Vegas body- putting it all together… Oh, so you want us all to go to the Mustang Ranch as a work activity?- Wow! But I don’t think my husband will want me to do that.”

    Malicious Naivety, a close cousin to Malicious Compliance- works great if you can pull it off with a straight face.

    Reply ↓
  103. Insulindian Phasmid*

    The godsdamned audacity to end that cheeky, gross, over the top cutsey message with “no judgement!” Except for when we judge you! On your weight and food! Because that’s the whole point!

    The existence of the contest is bad enough without this particular copy. If you HAVE to do it, you don’t. But if you had to, just matter-of-fact announce it, this is just under my skin cringeworthy

    Reply ↓
  105. My Brain is Exploding*

    Am I the only one who thinks that a $500 prize will not only bring about the worst in people (NOT camaraderie) but may also pose a real health hazard to someone who does it only for the money?

    Reply ↓
  106. Emily Byrd Starr*

    Never lose weight unless your doctor tells you to lose weight, and even then you need a weight loss program that is tailored to your specific needs. And it should never be a contest to see who can lose the most weight. If you lose more weight than you need to lose, then you’ll be underweight and be at risk for other health problems.

    Reply ↓
  107. Tracy*

    Note for Allison (adding a link on purpose, though it is relevant): https://www.askamanager.org/2022/05/is-it-ok-to-say-jesus-christ-as-an-expression-of-frustration-at-work.html

    There’s no reason to say “year of our lord”. While it’s only marginally offensive in itself, it trivializes a more severe issue which is people casually blaspheming or misusing a name that others find very offensive and disrespectful. And honestly, I do expect better of you – you’re normally very good about things like this!

    Reply ↓
    1. Kevin Sours*

      That’s *literally* how dates work. 2025 AD is 2025 Anno Domini which literally mean “in the year of our lord”. Unless you are advocating for the change to the Common Era nomenclature.

      Reply ↓
  110. Cai*

    I’m recovered from an eating disorder as a teenager/young adult AND I have a medically restricted diet. It’s a very bad mix and I work hard to keep my medical needs from impacting my mental health.

    This shit could trigger a relapse. “YOU YES YOU NEED TO LOSE MORE WEIGHT” Yeah my brain screams that a lot. I don’t need an employer joining in.

    Reply ↓
  111. My weight is not your business*

    OP here. So this happened about 2 weeks ago. After a few hours of reflecting and consulting reddit (where I was directed here as well), a kind redditor and myself composed the following email:

    Formal Complaint Regarding “Biggest Loser Office Challenge”
    Dear {company} Admin,

    We are writing to express our concerns regarding the recently announced “Biggest Loser Office Challenge.” While promoting health and wellness in the workplace is commendable and we’re sure was implemented with good intentions, this particular initiative raises several issues related to employee rights, inclusivity, and potential legal implications.

    Concerns:
    Mandatory Weigh-Ins and Privacy: Requiring employees to participate in weigh-ins can infringe upon personal privacy and may violate laws protecting the confidentiality of health information. Such practices can lead to discomfort and a sense of intrusion among staff.
    You can find more information here: https://www.shrm.org/topics-tools/news/inclusion-diversity/laws-policies-can-counter-weight-discrimination-work
    Potential for Discrimination: Weight-focused programs can inadvertently promote weight discrimination. The Society for Human Resource Management advises against informal practices like weight-loss competitions, as they can foster a discriminatory environment.
    This is another good read: https://www.shrm.org/topics-tools/news/hr-magazine/upping-losses
    Impact on Morale: Competitive weight loss challenges can lower office morale and discourage participation in wellness programs. They not only may trigger those who have struggled with or are struggling with eating disorders, but may also lead to unhealthy behaviors, such as crash dieting, which are counterproductive to long-term health goals.
    This link has excellent alternatives to improve Employee Health: https://incentfit.com/wellness-word/this-is-why-weight-loss-challenges-at-work-are-not-good/

    Alternative Recommendations:
    To foster a healthier and more inclusive workplace, consider implementing the following wellness initiatives:
    Flexible Work Schedules: Allowing employees to adjust their work hours can help them manage personal responsibilities and reduce stress, contributing to overall well-being.
    Onsite Health Services: Providing access to health services within the workplace can encourage employees to engage in preventive care and health education, leading to improved health outcomes.
    Healthy Meal Options: Offering nutritious meals and snacks can promote better eating habits among employees, supporting their physical health. Even putting together a recipe book with recipes provided by employees to encourage a balanced diet.
    Employee Assistance Programs (EAPs): Providing access to personal counseling services can support employees’ mental and emotional well-being, addressing issues that may affect their work performance and overall health.
    Mindfulness Challenge: Encouraging employees to create mindful choices to better their physical and mental health through things like meditation, group walks, abstaining from social media or phone use for a set period of time, drinking more water, etc. Creating a sort of “menu” of wellness/mindfulness activities that employees can choose from to “compete” against others if a challenge is really what the company wants to create.
    Our new insurance provider, {insurance company} has a rewards program that allows you to track various health related data and thus earn rewards and it keeps all information private. None of the metrics have to do with weight.
    This link is the FAQs for the rewards program: {link}

    By adopting these alternative approaches, the company can promote health and wellness in a manner that respects individual privacy, fosters inclusivity, and aligns with best practices for workplace wellness programs.

    Thank you for considering these concerns and recommendations. We are confident that, with thoughtful adjustments, we can create a wellness program that benefits all employees.

    Sincerely”

    I then messaged a few people who I thought might also have issue with the competition this message along with the email draft:
    “I have put together an email to send to admin regarding the office weight loss challenge that was announced yesterday (see attached). I believe that a “health” challenge that only tracks weight is very inappropriate in a workplace, much less with monetary prizes that are more than double of any prize I’ve seen offered for other work competitions.

    I am sending this message to multiple people to see if others are as taken aback by this challenge as I am and if you would like me to include your name in my email. If not, no worries, you don’t even have to reply to me. I will be sending the email by the end of the day.

    Additionally, if you have any other ideas of alternative wellness initiatives or edits to the email before you’re willing to sign your name please let me know.”

    I was able to get 2 coworkers to sign their names.

    I sent the email to our 3 admin. Within 24 hours, I got a call from one of the owners (not the one who wrote the flyer) that he loved the email I sent. He had been out sick that week and didn’t get to review the flyer before it was sent. He said this idea has been brought up in the past and he had voiced concerns similar to what I had in the email. A few hours later, admin emailed the company
    “After further review, the company sponsored “Biggest Loser Office Challenge” is not going to take place. We will be researching new employee wellness programs for possible implementation. Stay tuned!!”

    Reply ↓
    2. Hlao-roo*

      Good for you (and the kind redditor and your two coworkers)! I am very happy you drafted and sent that email and that the company decided not to go forward with the “Biggest Loser” challenge. Hopefully the company will implement some of the positive workplace wellness recommendations from your email!

      Reply ↓
    4. Cacofonix*

      Nicely done. I don’t think weight loss competitions should ever be company sponsored. With a group of friends or work friends…well that’s up to the group.

      Reply ↓
    5. Calamity Janine*

      flawless execution! please know that if we could put animated gifs in comments, you would be receiving a standing ovation – and specifically the one from the Apollo 13th movie. we’re at the “houston, we’ve done it!” level of applause here is what i’m saying.

      i am also absolutely relieved, for your sake, that this is not actually as supported by the upper management as it first seemed! this popping up when the owner who had expressed objections in the past was out sick is… interesting, but it’s interesting in a way that i think means it’s already being very much handled by those above you.

      Reply ↓
    7. Hey, I'm Wohrking Heah!*

      Nice! And here I was thinking that I’d figured it out. The flyer was written by the people who brought you the Peleton ad right before Covid. Anyway, congrats!

      Reply ↓
    9. ILikeFreeFruitAndICannotLie*

      I don’t agree with many commenters here and think that broadly, weight in the US is a problem to address.

      But, these challenges don’t help in the long run, can encourage extremes, and hurt people. Any weight loss should be sustainable and the person’s decision.

      I’ve been losing slowly for a year and am down about 17% overall. Like, glacially slow. But, I’m still able to eat most things, live my life, etc., and I’m not stressing about every tiny food item.

      Work has helped by giving everyone access to a gym a few floors directly above the office (with a full nice locker room), free fruit and cold/hot tea at the office, flexible hours, and ordering boxed lunches of wraps or salads instead of pizza for catering. Not a challenge. It’s stupid.

      Reply ↓
  112. Harper*

    Ewww, this whole thing is so cringe-y. The lame jokes, the sexist reference to “girl math”, the threats to actively shame people.

    Reply ↓
  113. Hell in a Handbasket*

    There’s an episode of the great podcast “Maintenance Phase” about The Biggest Loser TV show. Spoiler alert that will surprise no one: it was both horrific and counter-productive for the contestants (in terms of sustained weight loss).

    Reply ↓
  114. AthenaC*

    Once upon a time, a local newspaper decided to run an area-wide Biggest Loser competition where local employers would each sign up with a team of 4 people. It was a whole thing – our company decided to do it in order to get our company name in the local newspaper for basically free. I volunteered to be the team captain for our company so I was in charge of collecting reflections from our team members and sending them into the newspaper. I tried to be witty and it seemed to work because they often quoted our team!

    Anyway, for our company it was great because:

    – Very small group of very optional opt-ins (four people out of maybe 60ish). Everyone else at the company just went on with their lives.
    – We had just merged with a smaller firm, and one of the people from that smaller firm joined the team. It legitimately was a good bonding experience.
    – Part of the deal was if you were a participant, you got free / reduced price (can’t remember) access to different gyms and personal training, so that was a nice perk.
    – At the end they had a big local reception and some fun networking

    So in that scenario it seemed to be an overall positive experience but it seems that’s different from what this company is doing.

    Reply ↓
  115. TheActualA*

    Ugh. A company I used to work for did this.

    The person who did the weigh-ins was built like Olive Oyl and had a thyroid condition which meant she was literally unable to gain weight. She was brightly overly enthusiastic and we all felt judged by her.

    The first year we did it, things were kind of okay, I ended up in a little group that did “healthy” potlucks and just broadly encouraged each other.

    After that, it was awful. There were a lot of complaints about how the cis men had an unfair advantage so the groups were divided into two genders and Aaron had started. Every week after weigh-in Aaron would drop by the office of each person in the contest and badger them about their progress. If folks were not able to get him out of their offices he would stay and describe his diet in excruciating detail. It was clear that he was leaning on some pretty disordered eating to lose the weight and there were a couple times I had to go comfort the woman who used to have an eating disorder after he stopped by her office. There were rumors about whether the weigh-in girl was reporting our results to the guy in the company she was dating, not to mention corporate.

    The third year none of the men competed except for Aaron because they didn’t want to deal with him. All of the accounting team also opted out the third year because they didn’t want to deal with Aaron.

    The fourth year corporate took over and did some subscription-based competition where folks got points for things like meditation or workouts. Aaron was very upset but he finally got fired later that year for a number of reasons. I had left by then but my old boss was quite gleeful about telling me that Aaron was finally out.

    Reply ↓
  116. Cranky Old Bat*

    If you ever want some inside dope on The Biggest Loser, look up former contestant Kai Hibbard. She exposed some of the methods that the contestants were subject to for the show.

    Reply ↓
  117. Not your typical admin*

    So much ick! There’s just so much wrong with this. It has the potential to be triggering to so many people. I’m a little extra sensitive since we just went through a season where my teen daughter (who is athletic and naturally thin) started to obsess over what she was eating because several of her friends were dieting. Thankfully that seems to have passed, but I’m still side-eyeing anyone who pressures others over what they’re eating.

    Reply ↓
  118. Pizza Rat*

    When I was diagnosed with cancer, someone said to me, “Well, maybe the treatment will help you lose some weight.”

    I was caught early enough that I didn’t need chemo, but still…..

    Reply ↓
  119. Pita Chips*

    One day, workplaces will stop equating wellness with weight loss and we’ll all be happier for it.

    This won’t happen in my lifetime, but I have hope for those that come after me.

    Reply ↓
  120. Count von tshirt's phone*

    oooo we did this a few years ago. The winner would be the highest % of body mass lost.
    To protest the absolute absurdity of the whole thing, I entered the office cat. (who, to be fair, was told by the vet to lose some of the post Christmas treat fluff). She lost 2 lbs which put her at 20%.
    She got a new cat tree and a fluffy bed with her winnings.
    the person organizing (a fitness and keto fanatic) never organized something like that again.

    Reply ↓
  121. Pomodoro Sauce*

    The teachers did this at my grade school in the ’80s — at the instigation of a principal who was certain he would win — and the teachers conspired and had all other competitors wear weight vests* under sweaters at the first weigh-in and then spent the interim time eating cheesecakes in the break room, only to all magically lose 40-odd pounds at weigh-in.

    *Mountain community, lots of wildland firefighter pack test equipment. And thick outerwear.

    Reply ↓
  122. Crip Walk With Me*

    If it’s not for you don’t do it? Yeah it sucks that it still happens, but maybe just don’t do it.

    Also, I know I’m on AAM so the thought of this is foreign to some of you: SOME PEOPLE ENJOY THESE THINGS. That’s for emphasis, not yelling.

    Also, these competitions come from people above them. People don’t invent wheels when wheels are given to them.

    I don’t participate bc I don’t want to. but I’m not going to stop others from participating. Their participation doesn’t harm me.

    Reply ↓
    1. AMH*

      People enjoy all sorts of things that are nonetheless not appropriate for a work setting. It is pretty clear from the wording used on this flyer that it isn’t as easy as “don’t do it” in this office, as well. Obviously plenty of people enjoy this kind of challenge, but it remains inappropriate to be a work sponsored event.

      Also, “their participation doesn’t harm me,” is great for you, but it can be harmful for lots of others, as mentioned explicitly in the comments above.

      Reply ↓
    2. Toledo Mudhen*

      I’d say it does harm people who aren’t participating because it perpetuates diet culture and encourages unhealthy behaviors that will permeate an office culture.

      An office I worked in did Weight Watchers with group weigh-ins every week. If some individuals knew they lost weight, but the group weight went up, we had upset people instead of supportive ones. I didn’t participate, but I couldn’t escape the crap that was all over the office.

      Reply ↓
    3. Calamity Janine*

      many people enjoy many things. but if those things perpetuate harmful ideas and general bigotry, some people enjoying them does not matter in the face of people’s continued existences.

      people enjoying a thing also doesn’t make it suitable for the workplace. i am sure you can think of many things people enjoy that aren’t workplace appropriate, and that we often see come up as shockingly bad behavior in memorable ways discussed in notable letters here.

      Reply ↓
    4. Undine Spragg*

      In this particular instance, this could actually deeply harm someone with disordered eating. Disordered eating can kill! Even if it doesn’t go that far, it can cause severe and lasting damage to someone’s health. Many people with disordered eating have to struggle to eat the way that’s healthy for them, and this kind of public focus on weight with a side of shaming is a great way to fall back into the disordered eating trap.

      Reply ↓
    5. IHaveKittens*

      If someone enjoys it, they can do it outside of work. And just because you personally are OK with it – congrats for you – does not mean that others are. Some people are very damaged by this BS and it should not be in the workplace, full stop.

      Reply ↓
    6. Crip Walk With Me*

      No one forces anyone to eat pizza, yet there are pizza parties all over the place, and people who can’t/won’t eat pizza.

      My point is there are tons of activities that aren’t for everyone. Opt out if you don’t like it.

      And honestly, I don’t disagree that it’s problematic. I dislike and roll my eyes whenever this type of challenge comes up.

      Because it has come up in every work place, and will probably continue. I don’t need my job telling me how to live. But I’m also secure enough that I know that this is another ::thing:: from ::a company:: and it’s not making me think this is the only way to be healthy. If that’s what you think, well, feel free to think differently.

      I don’t participate bc I know it’s unfair, unhealthy, and all bodies are different and would be affected differently. But this isn’t something that is going to change anytime soon. So just opt out. If everyone opts out, perhaps they will think of something else that will get folks up in arms.

      Things that we can worry about: hiring practices that expand DEI so that the folks in charge implement activities folks will appreciate. -Education and training people for a thriving and intelligent workforce. -Getting rid of faux-artistic AI so artistry and creativity –creating being the highest level of intelligence–can be enjoyed by humans. But ‘our company implemented a HR driven “challenge” to boost morale because they refuse to boost pay by wanting us to walk more and I don’t like it’ is an immediately solvable solution.

      Reply ↓
      1. Calamity Janine*

        unfortunately, you can’t ignore systemic bigotry and then have it not effect you because you ignore it. the idea that health is equal to the number on the scale going down is a dangerous one for good reasons. if you are insulated with enough privilege to be okay with it, fair dues – but understand that you’re in the minority there.

        and perhaps also understand that the same logic of “nothing’s going to change so why bother” absolutely applies to the rest of the things you consider priorities, too. if you think that an issue of ableism is never going to change so why bother, then why do you expect a company to actually listen to DEI concerns? you’ve just told them the perfect excuse: nothing’s going to happen, so why bother. if people are upset by it, they can just ignore the bigotry instead of promoting the idea that DEI is a thing to be interested in to begin with.

        Reply ↓
    1. Pizza Rat*

      I find it incredibly invasive. Plus I’ve heard the Biggest Loser did some pretty awful things to get participants to lose weight (and most of the contestants gained it back).

      Reply ↓
    2. Cacofonix*

      It’s not great, but compared to everything (*waves arms expansively*) undermining workplaces, going on a rampage were it you seems an outsized reaction.

      Reply ↓
      1. Calamity Janine*

        can you please explain to me where, exactly, you became the arbiter of what people can and cannot be upset by? :)

        this mindset already gave me harm via medical neglect. should i wait until it actually kills me to be upset by it, or is that still going to be an “outsized reaction” because it’s a thing you like and you liking it is the most important part?

        Reply ↓
        1. Calamity Janine*

          aw dang i sure hope so, otherwise i’m gonna have to figure out how to actually turn into a godzilla

          i dunno what category fundraising for that would even be… do i just call make-a-wish and hope?

          Reply ↓
    1. Cacofonix*

      Exactly so. Maybe the change the LW could seek besides opting out is to seek to tone down the judgemental humour and educate on the impact of how this lands, should any demand to cancel the competition outright isn’t worth the capital.

      Reply ↓
    2. Calamity Janine*

      unfortunately there’s not really a way to opt out of the harm that the systemic bigotry being promoted here does. if the ableism and fatphobia don’t move you, perhaps the misogyny of the “fancy girl math” would?

      Reply ↓
  125. giga*

    I worked for a hospital system that did this, and our VP was really into it so I felt obligated to take part in a stressful way. and then I won??? I still did not enjoy it and winning involved having my picture taken, which was so embarrassing. This was a few years ago. Maybe if it happens again, the behavioral health department will speak up!

    Reply ↓
  126. Beveled Edge*

    LW, I’m so sorry. I hope the comments here give you some feelings of support, because yes, this is insensitive, ableist, hate-filled BS. If you have HR worth its salt and. you want to try to push back, you could point out that it’s ableist and discriminatory against anyone with a physical disability, recovering from surgery, fighting cancer and other illnesses, or dealing with an eating disorder. Also, that from the language used, this type of program is likely to stir up discontent against and foment bullying and discrimination of people who are unable to participate for the above-listed reasons. If the person spearheading this is so determined to lose weight, they can run a competition at their gym, and if the sugar in the break room is bugging them this much, tell them to steer clear of that room.

    Reply ↓
  128. Dogwoodblossom*

    I’m gonna bang this drum till I die, but sometimes people aren’t unhealthy because they’re overweight, they’re *overweight because they’re unhealthy.* I’ve known many people with disabilities that limit their mobility, or necessitate medication that promotes weight gain, or one million other things that mean fatness is just a side effect of other stuff they have going on.

    We have a cultural idea that medicine can fix everything, and it just can’t. I want to live in the Star Trek reality where you can take a pill and regrow a kidney as much as anyone, but we don’t live there and acting like perfect health is a thing we can all achieve if we just *try hard enough* is so hugely harmful.

    Reply ↓
  129. Last tiger of Tasmania*

    I’m obviously going against the grain here, but I do not see the issue with this. It’s an optional contest. No, this program isn’t suitable for everyone, but neither are many office initiatives. My company sponsors many optional webinars, trainings, awareness weeks, team-builders, charity drives, etc that don’t apply to me, don’t interest me or are based on causes I don’t agree with. I ignore them and move on because what my workplace is doing is not actually that relevant to my life.

    Yes, the tone in the flyer is obnoxious and grating, and it was obviously written by an AI. No arguments here. However, I don’t see the need to get up in arms about this contest being offered to those who are interested. If you are not interested, there’s no need to participate.

    Reply ↓
    1. In the Minority, Obviously*

      I once worked in an office that sponsored these contests, albeit with a far more respectful and supportive attitude. I found having the support of my coworkers and the mild competitiveness helped me shed some unwanted pounds. We had a co-worker with the opposite issue (he couldn’t gain weight) and we cheered for his gains while he cheered our losses. No one was forced to enter, no one was mocked if they had a bad week and gained a pound or two, and no one lost or gained an unhealthy amount of weight for the time frame. I can see where all of those things could happen, but they didn’t in my office.

      Reply ↓
    2. Calamity Janine*

      no, we can absolutely object to systemic bigotry being promoted in the workplace. after all, we have a stunning example of misogyny in the copy. it doesn’t mean it’s nobody’s fault just because an AI wrote it and they merely had to agree with whatever the computer said.

      so is there a reason why you think that the misogyny gets a great big pass? do you think women get to opt out of misogyny if they ignore it and move on and declare that it’s “not relevant to their life”?

      if the misogyny doesn’t get a pass, why does the ableism?

      or to use your own logic against you on this one… clearly, the people having discussions about how this is harmful isn’t particularly relevant to your life. or at least that’s what you’re stating here. so why, then, have you joined the conversation to tell this discussion that everyone’s overreacting and there aren’t problems and nobody needs to be offended? why haven’t you been able to follow your own advice to simply not participate?

      is it because, perhaps, it’s not actually good advice, hence why you give it but don’t follow it?

      Reply ↓
    3. Jasmine Clark*

      I really think it’s important to understand why this is such a problem. So I’ll say why, and I’m saying all this as someone who has always been skinny my entire life. I’ve never been judged for being “fat” so it would be really easy for me to look at this flyer and say “this is no big deal” and not care about this. But it is a big deal.

      – There is an enormously judgmental attitude in this flyer, and that attitude will spread throughout the company. Larger-sized people who don’t want to participate may be looked at by their coworkers with a “you should be ashamed” vibe, because they supposedly don’t have the self-control to stop eating donuts or whatever. But weight is so much more complicated than “this person is lazy and has no self-control.” Larger people have to deal with so much judgment in general. Now they have to go to work and deal with this attitude from their company. Because it’s their workplace, they depend on it to support themselves so they can’t just quit if they feel uncomfortable and don’t want to be in that environment.

      – There may be some people in this workplace recovering from eating disorders who have been obsessed with the pressure to lose weight, in an unhealthy way. So this would be triggering for them.

      – The entire idea of encouraging people to lose weight for money is horrible, because people who don’t have much money may feel more pressure to participate, even if weight loss actually wouldn’t be the best thing for them. For some people, losing a lot of weight fast would be bad for their health! If someone wants to lose weight, it needs to be because it was recommended by their doctor for health reasons, not recommended by their company for monetary prizes. And their doctor should advise them on the best strategy to lose weight, instead of them just participating in a workplace program because they want to do what their coworkers are doing.

      – The whole letter treats the idea of weight loss like something funny. But for many people, it’s a serious issue that causes deep emotional problems, not something to laugh about and treat like a game.

      So this weight loss challenge is a HUGELY offensive and problematic idea, for both physical and mental health reasons!

      Reply ↓
      1. Calamity Janine*

        as someone who’s been on the other side of the blade – medical fatphobia very much cuts both ways! as a fat person, i got a serious medical condition brushed off because “oh you’re losing weight, though, that’s good!”…

        …and i have heard plenty of stories from skinny friends about how, with health defined as numbers on the scale And That’s It, they go and beg doctors for help just like i did only to be told, well… “but your weight is perfect! look how thin you are! you’re fine, you’re probably just imagining it!”. they very much weren’t. they were having real problems. often those problems got worse, sometimes causing permanent damage, before they were taken seriously. all because health was the numbers on the scale, and that’s exactly the same mindset that these competitions promote, enshrine, and push.

        it cuts both ways. i am so glad to have you as my skinny comrade-in-arms in the fight.

        Reply ↓
    4. Daria grace*

      Nobody is getting judged because they don’t show up to a webinar (I rarely would even know which ones my coworkers attend). With a contest like this going on so conspicuously and publicly people are most likely getting judged for not participating (or for participating and not doing well) especially if they’re larger

      Reply ↓
  130. K Smith*

    OP I really, really (really!) hope you can figure out a way to anonymously email a link to this post to the company owner. Bonus points if the anonymous email address is something like “LOLmathIsHardImJustAdumbWoman@aol.com”

    Or maybe just a print-out under the owner’s office door, with some key comment highlights.

    Reply ↓
  131. Jasmine Clark*

    I’m shocked and appalled by this, and those words aren’t even strong enough. Someone actually thought this was a good idea?! And the judgmental tone of this letter is absolutely disgusting. I feel so sorry for anyone who works here who has deep emotional triggers related to weight loss and body image.

    I’ve always been skinny so I don’t know what it’s like to be judged for being “too big.” I recognize that I’m fortunate for not having to go through that. The idea that this workplace would treat weight loss as a game, something fun to laugh about, when so many people have serious emotional wounds because of this topic… that’s what’s so horrifying to me.

    Also… losing weight for money? This just incentivizes people who have less money to try to lose more weight, regardless of whether or not the weight loss would be healthy for them. This could be dangerous for some people. (Btw, why do people have to pay to enter???)

    This company deserves to be named and shamed. This is not okay. This is not anywhere near okay. Whoever’s idea this was should be embarrassed about what they’ve done.

    I could understand this if this were some kind of fitness company. That would make more sense. But the company is unrelated to that, so this is just bizarre.

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  132. Lurky McLurkface*

    This is genuinely hilarious. I’m not kidding, if this showed up in my inbox I’d get a good laugh out of it, maybe show it to some friends who have my sense of humor, and then pop it into the trash and go about with my day.

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  133. Daria grace*

    This is so so wildly inappropriate. Even beyond the fact that it involves inappropriate employer and coworker meddling in very personal things and some people having good reasons for weight loss attempts being unwise, despite what the horrible shows said a fair weight loss contest is not a possible thing. Will they give adjusted scores to people with conditions like PCOS that interfere with weight loss? Will Ozempic be considered doping? Will they monitor to ensure people don’t drink a stack of water before the start weigh in? Will they factor in that muscle weighs more than fat so people pursuing fitness over calorie reduction are disadvantaged?

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  134. Raida*

    No Judgement!

    Except for all the snide jokey judgements! Hahahaaaa

    Honestly… this makes me want to bake. Like, every weekend bake and bring in trays of bikkies and slice and tartlets and cakes.
    Because f———————————-ck yoooooooooooooooooooooooooooooou

    And then, of course, there’s the analyst part of my brain which says “Well the methodology for calculating the winners is percentage of body weight change” And from there we’d definitely all calculate what are reasonable percentages of fat loss viable in the time period per person, rank them, then sliding scale the results based on assumed muscle weight gain…
    And on paper show there’s no point in me engaging because I’m not joining this snide bullshit if I’m not in line to WIN.

    If you *would* like to get the office moving, check out things like the Push Up Challenge, where teams can see their totals, and see how over the course of a month everyone can do more pushups and just create some collegial and *only positive* engagement.

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  135. Calamity Janine*

    it’s taken me until now to finally figure out what truly sets my teeth on edge about the diction of this letter. (yeah, it’s been a bit. apparently we only torture metaphors while-u-wait, other services have to be sent off to the main office)

    it reads like the start of an MLM sales pitch.

    the “hey girlie!” over-familiarity, the cutesiness, the tone of mean girls declarations that they know better than your life than you… my teeth were on edge because i am expecting very much for the next paragraph to be all about how you could try this great product they happen to be selling. and after you’ve discovered how amazing the smoothie wrap vitamin mascara tea timeshare is, guess what, you’ll be ready to hear all about how this is an amazing opportunity to be a boss babe and –

    anyway, i’m not saying that the person who sent this email out is waiting to spring sales pitches on participants… but i would also not be surprised to hear it. it’s a stretch, yes, but not a stretch i would be shocked by. especially given the (extremely excellent) update the letter writer has already given us in the comments, with the details about how one owner had already shot down this idea when suggested earlier and was out sick when this email went out, and the initiative here has been swiftly canned as the owner returned to the office.

    in the dramatization, though, i would pitch this behavior as Bananapants: Origins.

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