a recruiter I met at career expo asked me on a date — what should I do? by Alison Green on February 14, 2013 This was originally posted in October 2009, but I’m reposting it today as part of our Valentine’s Day extravaganza. Plus, I have some different advice this time. The updated portion of my advice is in bold below. A reader writes wrote: A Big 5 recruiter I met at a career expo asked me out on a date. We met at a career expo in New York. I was looking for a job and networking, he was there as a speaker. He approached me 3 times throughout the daylong conference, once to say hello, the next to say we should talk more, and then the third to tell me I was beautiful, that I made a memorable impression, and asked if he could take me out to lunch. I was caught way off guard, was in super networking mode and said “sure,” not wanting to say no because I didn’t want to eliminate the possibility of a business/networking meeting. I’m feeling it was inappropriate and that he took advantage. Bottom line though is that he works at a Big 5 consulting firm and I need a job. I’m not even sure what question to ask here because I have so many. I guess the most important would be: 1) How do I approach him via email to say that I would like to meet to discuss potential opportunities at his firm? Do I pretend as if he never asked me out? What if he brings it up? How do I address it? Or should I be asking 2) Should I email him to meet and discuss professional opportunities? or 3) I’m feeling it was highly inappropriate for him to be representing his company in such a way. Should I write the company a letter? Disclaimer: It’s possible there’s more to this story than what’s here, but I can only answer it based on the details presented. But I have a feeling it’s going to be controversial. In my opinion, from what you’ve said, it sounds like this guy wasn’t approaching you as a professional in a networking way, but rather was simply asking you out on a date — like any other guy who might approach you in the course of your day who you don’t work with. He just happened to meet you at a career expo. He doesn’t seem to have mixed his messages at all, such as combining romantic interest with business overtures or insinuations of professional help. It sounds like he was pretty clearly making a social overture only. Now, is a career expo the wisest place to do this? No, because most people there are in a business mindset — which, as your experience clearly demonstrates, can lead to confusion and crossed signals. He can think you clearly understand he’s asking you on a date, and you can think that because of the venue in which it occurred, there’s a networking possibility. But aside from not choosing his venue very cautiously, the fact remains that this guy wasn’t approaching you for professional reasons and he didn’t pretend to be. Assuming that he approached you for a date and just a date — not a business meeting — you should handle him like you’d handle any other guy who approached you for a date. If you’re interested in getting to know him socially, go. If you’re not, decline. You should not go out with him just in the hopes that you can spin his romantic interest into a professional opening for you, because that’s kind of gross and unfair. However, you could be straightforward with him about the nature of your interest — in other words, tell him candidly that you’re not interested in a date but that you’re really interested in his firm and would love to talk to him about business. (Of course, be aware that he may tell you he’s fine with that when he really just intends to try to persuade you to change the nature of your interest.) Update: How naive I was three years ago! This guy wants to date you, not network with you. If you say this and this allegedly all-business lunch happens, you’re likely to end up fending off attempts at flirtation anyway. But without that conversation to get aligned on terms, you would be naive to accept his invitation in the hopes of keeping it strictly business, because that’s not the invitation he has extended you. If you want to try to network with him, you can invite him to do so. But the invitation he’s issued isn’t for networking. And no, you should not report him to his employer. Unless he was mixing business with a come-on, this is none of his employer’s business, and it doesn’t sound like he was. He’s not a coworker or your manager, he wasn’t interviewing you, he wasn’t approaching you about business, and it doesn’t sound like he exploited his job to influence you. He’s just a guy coming on to a woman, like a million other guys every day. What do others think? I’m bracing for someone to say that because he was a speaker at a career expo, he was obligated to be in “all business” mode, but in my experience, those events often have a substantial social component to them. You may also like:is networking overrated?office is too drinking-focused, can I complain about a bad interview a year ago, and moreI have a job offer -- but it's been weeks and there's no start date in sight { 35 comments }
my bosses are having an affair with each other, and that’s not the only inappropriate socializing by Alison Green on February 14, 2013 A reader writes: I am a wife and mom who works for doctor who is a specialist and owner of a private practice. I also report to a clinic manager (female). It is a smaller private clinic with just under 20 employees. The doctor and my manager have very recently been caught being physical with each other at a social event at the doctor’s house. The doctor is married with children. Our clinic manager is married with children. I have enjoyed working at the practice and have liked and felt comfortable working with the doctor until recently (in last months) where I have been invited into a small core group of all female coworkers (including the clinic manager) that socialize with our doctor after work. The pattern has become (prior to the two being caught being “physical”) that when the doctor wants to go out for drinks after work, we are “expected” to join him for drinks. He is very insistent and it’s very difficult to say no, plus it was at first nice to be asked to go out and I was honored. The pattern has become: He takes out the clinic manager, and me and one or two other nurses for drinks or an expensive dinner, wining and dining us. We are all married. I have told my husband everything about the doctor’s behaviors, where we go, etc. On several occasions, after drinks at a lounge or restaurant, he will invite us all back to his house, usually when his wife is way, although on one occasion his wife was at home (and I ended up socializing with her more than my coworkers). At his house, we are invited for another drink, and after a drink I usually prefer to leave for home to see my family. During these outings, our doctor can become a little too touchy feely with any one of us, either at the lounge, or at his house when his wife is away. We all have jokingly called this behaviour “sloppy drunk.” My husband has been supportive and tolerant as we are very honest with each other and he respects that I will keep my boundaries intact. Because I have enjoyed working with him in the work environment and have liked him and felt comfortable, and labelled him simply as innocent, child-like, and charming, I never made too much out of his “friendly” advances and just marked it down to alcohol. However, it was on one of the last TGIF occasions, at his house, a trusted coworker caught he and the clinic manager “making out.” I like my job otherwise, and our family needs the income and the benefits. It has now been made clear to me that both my bosses are willing to cross unacceptable boundaries in my view and are clearly being disrespectful and dishonest. Yes, this happens in a social environment, but they are my bosses and it is not so easy to separate what happens socially, with the power they both have in the workplace. I now feel like any of these subtle “sloppy drunk” advances that have happened to me in the past during drinks (him giving hugs, taking hold of my hand, or hand rubbing my back in the guise of being a supportive boss and friend) were really advances to test our boundaries, and as it happens our clinic manager clearly has few. I now see the pattern as being habitually disrespectful to me and to my husband as well as to others. I now dread the next time our boss expects us to go out for drinks with him and I feel I will have to say no, but do fear that I will be on the “blacklist” at work. I have lost respect for both him and our clinic manager in a way that now impacts me professionally. I expect the only way out of this is to quit my job to get out of this toxic environment, but it seems very unfair that my family is paying the price (losing benefits, cost of finding new job, down time, stress, etc.) for their behavior without any consequences to the two who are responsible for creating this toxic environment. Do you have any suggestions? Can you see anyway out other than me having to leave? Not really. This guy owns the business, and the clinic manager seems happy with it too. I would (a) start looking for a job in a more professional environment, and (b) stop attending these happy hours (and definitely stop going back to his house). If asked, invent an activity that you’re now doing on Friday nights — dinner with friends, a date with your husband, after-dark rock climbing, whatever. I suppose it’s possible that you’ll be shunned for not attending, but it sounds like there are plenty of the 20 employees who don’t attend without any penalty. From now on, you’re one of them. Remain pleasant and professional at work, but avoid situations where he or any of your coworkers are likely to be (a) drunk or (b) hitting on you or each other. And move on as soon as you can. Read an update to this letter here. You may also like:is being offered a job too quickly a red flag?do prospective employers expect me to take time off work for interviews?how to respond when someone's manager makes them apologize to you { 55 comments }
how to deal with a coworker who has a crush on you by Alison Green on February 14, 2013 It’s Valentine’s Day, and at Ask a Manager, that means a full day of questions about workplace romance, as well as our speciality: creepy, inappropriate coworker behavior. Here’s the first one (of six!). A reader writes: How does one deal with a coworker who you suspect has a crush on you? I won’t detail all of the reasons why, but he will stare intently at me when we pass in the hallway, and he’s said a couple of not-very-appropriate-for-work things to me. Looking back, I realize I should have called him out on the inappropriate remarks, but I was fairly surprised and couldn’t really think how to react in the moment. I’m married, so I feel it should go without saying that I am Not Interested. I know in the past you’ve advised the direct approach, but it seems like it shouldn’t be necessary for me to march into his office and declare that I have no intention of cheating on my spouse in general or with him in particular. Other than keeping my distance while still being professional, is there anything else I can do? Well, it’s hard to give a perfect answer without knowing a bit more about what he’s doing, but unless he asks you out or makes some kind of pass at you, it doesn’t sound like there’s a need to directly confront him. Instead, the most graceful way to handle it is to simply set and maintain very clear professional boundaries, making more of a point to do that than you might with a friendly coworker otherwise. There’s no need to announce, “Bob, I am not interested in you, so stop it with the soulful looks.” You can simply maintain appropriate boundaries. But you should address the inappropriate remarks if they happen again. It’s sometimes hard to do this in the moment if you’re not prepared for it, so you want to have a couple of phrases ready to use. For instance: “That’s inappropriate.” “Hey, I’m not comfortable with that.” “Please don’t say that to me.” “What do you mean by that?” If it gets to the point where it’s really making you uncomfortable, you might handle it differently — but you don’t mention that that’s the case, so I’m assuming it’s no more than the “I’m the object of a colleague’s crush” discomfort. You may also like:I have a crush on my employeemy employee has to deal with men constantly getting crushes on hermy coworker asked out a coworker, got turned down, and now won't stop badmouthing her { 97 comments }
when a recruiter approaches you about a job but plays games on salary by Alison Green on February 13, 2013 A reader writes: I was contacted out of the blue about a job via LinkedIn message with a job excerpt, a link to the full description, and list of benefits. I responded with: Hi (name), I would like to know more. Is this a senior role? What is the salary range for this position? Thanks, (me) She in turn replied with: Hi (me), Thank you so much for getting back to me. I would love to speak with you further about this role. This role is a Lead role where ideally within the next 6-12 months you would be managing one direct report. The range will vary based on experience and there is some flexibility. What is the range that you are looking for? Thanks! (name) I feel like saying, “I’ve lost interest, because you didn’t answer my salary question.” She has seen my LinkedIn profile, which is a mirror copy of my resume, so she knows my experience or enough of it to give me an answer about salary range. Honestly, I don’t think I will even reply to her at all now. I am a passive candidate, and not really looking. So for me to get this run-around off the bat makes me even less interested. They’ve essentially turned me off from any further communication. Am I overreacting or should I feel annoyed? If hiring managers want to tap into the passive candidate market, why do they insist on treating us the same as candidates who applied directly, with vague responses? No, it’s legitimately annoying to have a direct question ignored, and it shows a lack of awareness about how to recruit employed candidates. And you’re right that it’s especially annoying because you didn’t seek them out; they came to you. To be fair, candidates sometimes play games like this too: An employer asks what salary they’re looking for, and they turn the question around and ask what the planned range is. But that’s different — the candidate has proactively responded to an ad for a position. In this case, you weren’t seeking out the job; they approached you. It’s reasonable to ask about salary and expect to have the question answered before you invest any further time in a position that you haven’t even said you’re interested in yet. In any case, I’d respond with, “Since I’m not actively looking for a new position, I haven’t given sufficient thought yet to the range for my next job. But if you can tell me the range for this position, I can tell you if it makes sense for us to talk.” You may also like:how can I get recruiters to just tell me the job's salary from the start?why ask my salary expectations if you're not going to meet them?can I ask for a higher salary if I agreed to a lower range at the start of the interview process? { 133 comments }
are your job references in order? by Alison Green on February 13, 2013 Job candidates often hand over lists of references without much thought to the people they’ve included. But references can play a big role in hiring, so it’s worth being thoughtful and strategic about who you include. Who makes the best reference? The best reference is someone who managed your work and will speak glowingly of you. A good reference-checker is looking to see how your past managers talk about your work, and whether they’re enthusiastic about you or not. A reference who is unreservedly enthusiastic about you counts for a great deal. On the other hand, a reference who sounds hesitant, uncomfortable, ambivalent, or simply unenthused can raise red flags. So you want references who will champion you and your work. Do references have to be managers? Ideally, yes. People who managed you and therefore were charged with evaluating your work are able to speak to more of what reference-checkers want to know. Peers can talk about you as a coworker, but managers can talk about you as an employee. Plus, if you mainly put peers or other non-managers on your reference list, employers will wonder why you don’t want your past managers contacted. What if you don’t want your current manager to be contacted? Then you’re just like most people. It’s common to ask that your current employer not be contacted, because most people don’t want to tip off their employer to their job search. In fact, doing so can even jeopardize your current job. So it’s normal and reasonable to explain that your current employer doesn’t know about your search and ask that no one there be contacted. If a prospective employer is insistent, you can always offer to allow them to contact your current manager once you have an offer (which can be contingent on a good reference). Do you need to alert references that you’re listing them? It’s smart to alert your references that they might be contacted, because you want to verify that they’re still willing to provide you with a strong reference. You also want to make sure you still have their current contact information (you risk looking disorganized if you provide a prospective employer with out-of-date information), and that your reference will be available and not out-of-town or otherwise unreachable. Plus, alerting them is a good opportunity to prep them on any key points that you want them to emphasize with the reference-checker. When is the right time to offer references? The right time to offer references is when you’re asked for them. Don’t offer them before that – such as including them on your resume – because you want to know when your references are likely to be contacted, so that you can give them a heads-up. You don’t want to alert them every time you apply for a job or get called for an interview, only when you’re a serious finalist and the employer is at the reference-checking stage of the process. Can you be sure that employers will only call the people on your list? No. It’s important to realize that employers aren’t limited to just the references you provide them with. They can call anyone at all to ask about you, so if you noticeably omit recent managers from your list, they might call them anyway or ask you to put them in touch. And a lot of reference-checking happens behind the scenes when an employer spots a mutual connection and calls that person to ask their opinion of you. The only reference who is typically considered off-limits is your current employer. But many employers won’t bother going outside your list, so it’s important to choose your list with care. I originally published this at U.S. News & World Report. You may also like:can I refuse a reference check that's taking too long?what to do if your references aren’t availablepushing back on unreasonable reference requests: a success story { 60 comments }
is being a woman something you can use as a “selling point” in an interview? by Alison Green on February 13, 2013 A reader writes: I work in commercial aviation as a pilot. I am currently applying for an internal management position that is seen by managers as a stepping stone to progressing up the company ladder. Every high level manager in my department is a man. I am 28 and have been in the industry for 6 years (first two were for training). I’ve had three jobs so far, due to the recession, and I’ve been in my company for 18 months. I have secured an interview after a tough selection process (a 1,000-word essay, cover letter and resume). My question is… Is it non-PC to say that I believe there needs to be a more equal representation in my department? I’m not saying I want the job because I am woman. I just mean that I believe women need better representation at the higher levels and as a result could influence promotion of my job in the wider world. And how could you articulate this without sounding overly feminist and wanting an easy ride up the career ladder? No, it’s not appropriate, nor is it an argument for hiring you. There might be an argument for hiring more women in general, but that doesn’t mean that you personally should have a leg up. The only argument for hiring you is that you’re a spectacular candidate. And that’s what you should focus on in the interview: demonstrating why you’d be an excellent fit for the position. Any argument you make for hiring you that isn’t about how you’d excel at the job is an argument that will weaken your case (and probably make people uncomfortable, since you’d be asking them to consider something irrelevant to the job). Besides, if they want to hire a more even mix of men and women, the way to do that is to make a deliberate effort to broaden their pool of candidates, so that they have lots of well-qualified women (and men) to choose from. It’s not to hire the candidate in front of them who happens to be a woman. You may also like:did this application process go overboard?will it hurt me to apply for multiple jobs at the same company?interview candidates have stopped giving me their availability when I ask for it { 109 comments }
wee answer Wednesday — 7 short answers to 7 short questions by Alison Green on February 13, 2013 It’s wee answer Wednesday — seven short answers to seven short questions. Here we go… 1. Help! I agreed to recommend two people for the same position I work in a technical services department in a library. There are three sub-departments, each with a coordinator. The three coordinators are managed by a department head. Well, the department head job is currently vacant, and two of my coworkers (both coordinators) are applying for the job. One coordinator asked me to be a reference for her and I said yes. Then last week, another coordinator asked me and I said yes to him as well. I was a little hesitant to say yes to the second guy, but I did anyway to avoid awkwardness. I took the easy way out. Of course after thinking about it, I realize I probably shouldn’t have said yes to the second guy. Did I do the wrong thing or should I ‘fess up to him and tell him it’s a conflict of interest? I know that the first coordinator would do a superior job to the second guy. Well, there’s nothing inherently wrong with being a reference for two people applying for the same job. A reference doesn’t have to mean “this is the absolute best person for the job; there is no one better.” Rather, a good reference is one that speaks with nuance to the person’s experience and abilities — with enthusiasm and praise, of course, but still with detail and nuance. So it’s entirely conceivable that you could give two different references for these two coworkers — both positive, but describing different things. The idea is that you’d share your impressions, and the hiring manager would incorporate that info into her overall thinking about each. However, if you don’t think that you could give an honest positive reference to the second guy, you shouldn’t agree to speak on his behalf. You could go back and say to him, “I realized that I’d already agreed to be a reference for someone else for this position and I don’t feel comfortable giving two.” 2. Employer asked if candidate would convert to Catholicism The husband of a friend of mine recently interviewed for an IT position at a Catholic hospital that receives public funding. He was asked the question, “Would you be willing to convert to Catholicism?” as part of the hiring process. He answered affirmatively, but only because he thought his application might be discarded if he answered no. Is this a legal question to ask? Religious organizations are allowed to discriminate in hiring on the basis of religion. But whether or not a Catholic hospital would qualify as a religious organization for the purposes of the law is something I wasn’t sure about, so I turned to employment lawyer Bryan Cavanaugh. He says: “It would be important to examine whether the hospital is truly religious-based. If the hospital is ‘Catholic in name only,’ the exception will not apply. The hospital’s purpose and character must be primarily religious. This would be determined by looking at its charter, its practical interactions with the Catholic Church, and by weighing other religious versus secular characteristics.” (And here’s your regular reminder that the act of asking questions about religion, race, etc. isn’t illegal on its own. Making hiring decisions based on the answer is what’s illegal. Although it’s hard to see how this particular question wouldn’t be taken as evidence of intent to base a hiring decision around it.) 3. Professional reference for a spouse I am in the process of starting up a technology company. Since I am not yet hiring folks for full-time pay (equity only) and I want to devote my time to writing code and my wife has a business background, she has been helping with the business end of things, including incorporation, equity structure, IRS registration, taxation, etc. for the past few months. She recently started applying for full-time jobs, and for one position I provided a professional reference based on the work she has done for my start-up. I kept the reference completely professional, focusing equally on her strengths and weaknesses. I do not have a problem being objective with this since I have about 8 years professional experience, a senior developer at a large technology firm, and do interviews for the company and mentor junior developers. How is this viewed by hiring managers? Badly. Unprofessionally. You’re assumed to be biased where your spouse is concerned and as a result, you really can’t serve as a reasonable reference for her. (And if you don’t disclose that you’re married and it comes out later, she’ll look deceptive.) 4. Did I ruin my chances to negotiate salary? Quick question regarding salary negotiation. The position I will be interviewing for had a pretty large salary range ($36k – 45k). During the phone screening, I was asked what my minimum requirement for salary was. I was caught offguard and said $36k. As soon as I put that out there, I knew I just sold myself short and this number wasn’t going to be enough to make me want to leave my current job and start all over again some place new. Have I lost my chance to negotiate salary with this mistake? Maybe, but maybe not. You can certainly say later, “After thinking it over, I realize that I’d need to earn at least X in order to leave my current job.” This would be harder to undo if you were unemployed, but you have the advantage of being able to use the wording above. 5. Did this hiring manager really mean that I should stay in touch? I recently interviewed with a boutique law firm. Both rounds of interviews went incredibly well. I felt a real connection with many of the interviewers; many remarked on my excellent qualifications, and several were comfortable enough with me to laugh and joke around. But I didn’t get the job. I followed up with a brief email to the hiring partner thanking him for the opportunity, expressing my continued interest in his firm, and requesting that he keep me in mind when the next opportunity arises. He wrote back (copying HR) and called my email “incredibly classy,” said “everyone really liked me,” he’ll “definitely keep me in mind” when they hire next, and that I should “please stay in touch.” Is this just a nice way of saying “good luck with your job search”? Or does this mean that, if I follow up periodically, I could be in the running for the next opening? Take it at face value. He likes you and will keep you in mind when they next hire. Feel free to stay in touch. Very few hiring managers say things like this when they don’t mean them, since that would be inviting a flood of unwanted contacted. 6. Blind job postings on Craigslist I recently read an article that recommended staying away from blind job postings on Craigslist. I admit that I’m wary of them; I don’t like the idea of someone knowing a good bit about me, when I know absolutely nothing about them. On the other hand, I don’t want to miss out on legitimate opportunities when the company just doesn’t want to be swarmed with applicants doing clumsy and unwanted follow up calls and messages. What’s your take on blind ads in general, and Craigslist in particular? Lots of them are scams, but some of them are for legitimate jobs. You can usually recognize the scams pretty quickly, so if you’re interested in the legitimate jobs there, there’s no reason to be scared of by the bad ones. 7. Update from the reader with the abusive boss I had emailed you quite some time ago about resigning with an abusive boss (who had physically pushed me, among other things). Your advice was very helpful! Funnily enough, when I resigned, both my boss and her boss and her boss’s boss (wow, getting long) all acted completely shocked, and started telling me how important and valuable I was to the department, and if they could counter offer, and how much they didn’t want to lose me. I politely reiterated my need to move on for my career, and I mentioned to my boss’s boss the pushing incident. I don’t know how much weight it carried, because the general tone around the office was one of “oh, that’s just how ______ is!” I was approached several times over my three week’s notice to ask, again, if I would consider staying. They even offered to move me internally to a different position in the same department! However, the money they were willing to offer was not near what I was offered for my new position, and they were not in a budgetary position to offer me more. My new job is wonderful. I’m busy, but not overwhelmed. The emails stop at 5, and everyone seems to have balanced work and life very well. My skills are employed well, nobody belittles me, and certainly nobody pushes me! That’s great. Congratulations! You may also like:I'm too sick to do a volunteer job -- but they're insisting I attend anywayspeed round -- submit your questionsspeed round -- submit your questions { 74 comments }
alerting your new office that you have food allergies by Alison Green on February 12, 2013 A reader writes: I start a new job on Monday, and part of my “orientation,” I guess you can say, will be lunches in order to get to know people better. I am having a bunch of anxiety about this. I have Celiac Disease, which means I cannot eat gluten (which is in wheat, barley, rye) and I also have an allergy to most dairy. Most of the time this is okay, as I cook most of my meals myself and can prepare lunches ahead of time and bring them in. But I’m starting a new job, and I don’t want to come across as an ill, food freak. I don’t want my first impression to be, “Oh, she’s the one who can’t eat anything” or have awkwardness when/if the company wants to buy me lunch and brings in a sandwich or pizza or something else I can’t eat. I don’t really know the details of what is planned; the HR Director (who has been my primary contact this whole time) just casually mentioned it over the phone. I have thought about sending her an email about it, but 1) she hasn’t been the most responsive to emails and I can only guess she’s super busy and 2) I don’t want to overwhelm her (“You mentioned there might be a lunch or two. Just a heads-up, I can’t eat anything with gluten or dairy. So, good luck with that!”). Any idea on how I could handle this with the least amount of awkwardness and inconvenience? I think you’re probably over-thinking it (although understandably so). I’d just send a matter-of-fact email to either her or your new manager, saying something like, “I realized that you mentioned there will be a series of lunches when I start. I have a bunch of boring food allergies that often make it hard for me to eat out — is there a way for us to do those meetings in a context other than lunch? Alternately, if they’re in the office, I can bring my own stuff in to eat, which is what I normally do — but I wanted to mention it to prevent you from going to any special trouble to arrange food for my benefit!” (I don’t mean to really call your food allergies boring, by the way. But I think referring to them that way is a good way to downplay it and not come across as “I’m a hugely picky eater, and you should prepare yourself to be hearing about it all the time from me.”) Also, normally, you’d send this sort of thing to your new manager rather than HR, but you probably have a better sense than I do of who’s running this particular stuff and thus who would be appropriate to email about it. Alternately, though, you could also just go to the lunches and not eat stuff that you can’t eat. It’s totally fine to say, “Oh, I’ve got allergies that make it hard for me to eat a lot of this,” and just order a beverage or something. Just treat it like it’s not a big deal — don’t keep talking about it and don’t say it apologetically, and it’s very unlikely that anyone will think much about it. People only get labeled as problem eaters when they turn it into a big topic of conversation or inconvenience for everyone else. Treat it like a minor thing, and most other people will too. You may also like:my team excludes me from lunches because of my dietary restrictionsI don’t want to explain my allergies at workmy coworker is always dieting -- do we have to accommodate her? { 90 comments }
internship won’t let me use my work samples in a portfolio by Alison Green on February 12, 2013 A reader writes: I intern at a high-end design company where we create one-of-a-kind visual art. I am an unpaid intern. The studio manager has told me that despite me creating artwork for the company, I have no rights to use it in my portfolio ever. She also said that many of the techniques I’ve learned at the internship I cannot use when I move on. This was when my internship was ending and I wanted samples for my print portfolio. Is this true? I obviously would steer away from copying work I’ve done to use at another company, but as far as my portfolio goes, I feel like I should be able to show people photographs and samples of what I’ve worked on while I was at the company. It isn’t really possible for me to recreate the work I’ve done outside of the studio because I don’t have the resources. They are using painting and drawings that I created with my own hands and then used their resources and guidance to reproduce. Many of these samples are what they show to clients to give them a sense of the studio’s capabilities. Essentially, my question is, what can an unpaid art studio intern expect in terms of being able to show physical representation of the work they’ve done? It’s true that the work that you create for your employer belongs to them, and they say how it can be used. But it’s pretty unusual for an employer to refuse to let you use samples of your work in a portfolio, particularly when it’s artwork (as opposed to, say, confidential company documents that could contain trade secrets or sensitive client information). Unusual, but with in their rights to do — because, again, they own the work you produced while employed by them. (Of course, I’m not sure how they’d know if you included samples of your work in your portfolio, as long as you don’t put it online — so you might choose to go ahead and put it in a hard-copy portfolio to show to prospective employers anyway.) But as far as owning skills and work techniques that you developed while working there? I’d need to know more about exactly what those techniques are, but in most cases they shouldn’t be able to prohibit you from using those again — unless the specific techniques are patented or you signed an agreement to that effect at some point. (There might be other exceptions to that; lawyers, feel free to weigh in.) Overall, the situation sounds shady. If they have good reason for these unusually strict requirements, they should have filled you in before you took the internship so that you could have decided if you were interested in working on such atypical conditions. You might not have taken the position if you’d known. Or maybe you would have, but I’m sure you would have felt better about the whole thing if you’d agreed to it up-front, rather than having it mentioned to you afterwards. Oh, and hey, while we’re on the subject of what they can and can’t do, if they’re a for-profit company, they probably can’t have unpaid internships, at least not the kind it sounds like you have. Unpaid labor at for-profit employers is illegal unless the net benefit is to the worker — and it sounds like they’re profiting quite a bit from your labor. (Of course, this law is broken all the time, generally without consequence, but it’s worth being aware of, particularly if they’re going to jerk you around on other issues.) You may also like:I'm not a recent grad -- can I still intern?I have nothing to do at my internshipwhy didn't I get a full-time offer after my internship? { 132 comments }
tiny answer Tuesday — 7 short answers to 7 short questions by Alison Green on February 12, 2013 It’s tiny answer Tuesday — seven short answers to seven short questions. Here we go… 1. Asking about start time at a new job Last week, I was offered a job (after being unemployed for nine months) that I’ll be starting this week! I have a small question but one I want to make sure I approach correctly. I work out with a trainer a few days a week in the morning (6:00 – 7:00 AM), which makes it hard to arrive at the job by 8:00 but not hard to be there by 8:30 or 9:00. When is the best time and what is the best way to bring up daily start time with my new boss? My position doesn’t require a specific start time, such as a receptionist, to open office doors or anything like that. The first day, I need to be there at 8:00. I worked at this company once before, for a six-month contract (same department, different manager this time) and it seems like the managers have some leeway in terms of granting different start times for their employees (last time we had team members showing up anywhere between 7:30 and 9:30). It’s a health insurance company, if that helps. I’d show up at the same time as everyone else for at least your first week. Skip your trainer or reschedule the appointments for that week; your priority this week is getting off on the right foot at your new job. After that, it’s fine to ask your boss about coming in at 8:30 or 9 and explaining why. Just be sure that you’re asking if it’s okay, not announcing that you’ll be doing it. If your boss seems in any way uncomfortable with it, I’d reschedule the training appointments. 2. Disclosing that I’m colorblind I’m a student in public relations, seeking my first full-time job. In my internships, I’ve sometimes had to design marketing items, which I enjoy doing. However, I recently found out that I’m partially colorblind. I can only see three shades of purple. A friend showed me a sheet of Pantone purples because she couldn’t decide which she liked — it looked like a solid color sheet to me, but she insisted there were 24 distinct squares of color. Most people can see about 100 shades, and most designers can see 150 shades. (I can see 150 shades of orange.) Do I need to disclose this to interviewers? No. It’s not something that’s going to perform your ability to perform the essential functions of the job, so you can wait until you’re on the job — at which point you can mention that you’ll need a second pair of eyes when purple is involved. It’s not going to be a big deal. 3. Applying for a job with organizations that fund my current employer I’m on the job hunt but I have not told my current employer. The nonprofit I work at is completely grant-funded. I found two job positions I am interested in submitting applications for. The first position is at the organization that provides the grant funds for my salary right now. The second position is at the organization that I just submitted a grant proposal to (for projects at the nonprofit I work at). Is this okay ethically and professionally, or do you recommend avoiding these organizations due to the ties I have with them through my current position? There’s no ethical issue in applying, but you’d need to be prepared for the fact that they might mention to your current employer that you applied. If you have contacts there, you can try reaching out informally first to gauge if they’d be willing to treat your application confidentially. 4. Negotiating pay when managers want you to transfer to a new location My brother is almost 30 and has worked in the restaurant business his whole life, primarily as a bartender within walking distance to work. He’s been at the same restaurant for about 9 years and the owners really like him. The owners of the restaurant are in the process of opening a new one in the city and keep asking my brother to be the lead bartender there. My brother might be interested if the pay was worth it. The problem is the commute into the city would be long, costly and might require him to move closer to public transportation. My brother has no experience in negotiating, so how should he go about negotating that raise for that position? Or do you think it’s worth asking for an arrangement that wouldn’t require my brother moving, such as a bonus in exchange for doing the training? The new lead bartender can be trained at his current restaurant for a few weeks, then work the rest of the time at the restaurant in the city. He can certainly lay out what he wants and why. If they really want him to take the new job enough, he probably has some negotiating power. 5. Should I list my work as a stay-at-home-mom on my resume? I have been searching for work for a little over a month, and I am starting to get interviews. I have military experience before my kids were born and that was the last full-time position I had. With being out of the professional workforce, what is the best way to handle an interview with that 4-year gap on my resume? Should I list my stay at home mom experience as it really is a full-time job? I get a lot of “it’s going to be tough to find a job with your lack of experience for the last 4 years” and “do not put that on your resume”. . . Do I refer to the challenges of being a stay-at-home mom, or should I just stick to my past professional employment? Don’t list being a mom on your resume. As much as it’s hard work, it’s not professional work, and it’s going to come across as a little naive to most employers. (Here’s a good article that talks about why.) Your best bet is to network and do some of the other things described in this post. 6. I accidentally asked a job candidate a taboo question My husband is in academia and, as you know, it’s common for the people being interviewed to have day-long interviews with a lot of people. We just got back from a department dinner with the newest candidate. There were plenty of people at this dinner that weren’t on the interview committee and just meeting this candidate for the first time, including my husband and me. So if one of us happened to be chatting with the candidate and asked him a taboo interview question, is that a problem? I asked him if he is married. Of course, I have no say whatsoever if he is hired, but my husband will probably be asked his opinion whether or not he thinks the guy meshes well with the department. I’m just worried that if he isn’t hired, now he will have a possible discrimination action because of my big mouth. I wouldn’t worry too much about it. The question itself isn’t illegal; choosing not to hire him because of answer would be. Plus you’re not even involved with the hiring. And he’d need to prove that his answer to the question was the reason he wasn’t hired — fairly unlikely in academic hiring, where (a) many people have spouses and (b) the hiring process is often rigidly documented. If your husband is worried, he can mention to the hiring manager that this happened, but I wouldn’t give it too much thought. 7. Applying for a job with an employer when I backed out of their internship a year ago About a year ago to the date, I was offered an unpaid internship with a great company. The day after I accepted it, I received an offer for a (temporary) full-time job filling in for someone who was going on maternity leave. I decided it was best to take the paying full-time job. As soon as I had made this decision, I called the woman I was to work for at the internship and while I’m sure she wasn’t happy, she said she couldn’t blame me and would have done the same thing if she were in my situation. Now, a year later, this company is hiring for an entry-level position that I want to apply for. The woman who offered me the internship still works there, but is not the hiring manager for this position. Should I reach out to her with a “no hard feelings? I still like this company and want to work here” message? Do I address this in my cover letter to the actual hiring manager, saying something like, “it was a mistake to pass up an internship with this company but your agency did want to hire me before, so please consider me again”? Or, since it’s been a year, would it be best not to bring this up at all? Do I have a chance at being considered for this job? I’d definitely mention it, since if the hiring manager knows about it and sees you haven’t even acknowledged it, she may assume you’re being weirdly ham-handed about the situation. I’d say that you were offered an internship last year that you ultimately had to turn down in favor of full-time work, but that you’ve remained eager to work with the company. As for whether you have a chance or not, I have no idea — but you don’t have anything to lose by trying. You may also like:my boss said sick days aren't something you can announce in advancewas my interviewer in the wrong ... or was I?a company rescinded my job offer after I asked for more time to think it over { 79 comments }