Ask a Manager

It’s “where are you now?” month at Ask a Manager, and all December I’m running updates from people who had their letters here answered in the past.

There will be more posts than usual this week, so keep checking back throughout the day.

Remember the letter-writer asking how to tell her boss that his second-in-commands were making it impossible for her to do her job (#5 at the link)? The first update was here, and here’s the latest.

I thought this saga was over, but I have yet another, now definitely final, update to this mess.

YOU WERE ALL RIGHT AND I WAS WRONG BUT NOT FOR THE REASONS YOU MIGHT THINK.

Long story short — I’m no longer working at that company. I was white-anted and thrown under the bus, but not by either of the Goons, in fact, Goon 2 reached out to me after I resigned to send his well-wishes.

The Judas among us was my admin. Who I had hired, trained, and covered for countless times whilst wondering how on earth she was so “overwhelmed” with her workload whilst I was trying desperately to take things off her plate to lighten her load whilst drowning under my own workload. Well, it was because she was spending all her time actively subverting me to my peers and my director.

I could never understand why it was that despite my work being of a high quality, a proven record of saving the company tens of thousands of dollars in my first few months there, and external counterparts singing my praises, I still persistently was being undermined, not listened to, and generally bullied by a few of my colleagues. I then started being “performance managed” by the director, despite my work quality staying the same and still garnering praise from other colleagues. The director could never explain exactly why he was performance managing me, and I was never placed on a PIP, he just made it exceptionally difficult for me to do my job effectively.

It was because my admin had been spreading abhorrent lies about me in an effort to find herself in my chair, without understanding exactly how uncomfortable and soul-sucking that chair was.

I had been asked to find a confirmation email in the inbox that I shared with my admin, but when I searched for it, another email popped up from my admin to my director which was filled with accusations about me which were either greatly exaggerated or outright lies. An example of an exaggeration was her assertion that “MyName demanded I tell her whether I’m planning to have another baby and when, which made me feel intimidated and is illegal to ask.” What had actually occurred was that she told me one day that she was thinking of having another baby, and I had made a joke that she should let me know when so I could get pregnant at the same time and we could have maternity leave together and have a break from work. She laughed, I laughed, I thought that was the end of it. An example of an outright lie was that she said that at an industry awards night, I had gotten so drunk that I attempted to proposition her husband. In reality, I had two glasses of wine that night, and I’ve never met her husband.

She also accused me of taking credit for her work, which had absolutely never happened, in fact, I frequently, in a misguided attempt to help boost her confidence, gave her credit for my work.

The email was about 3 pages long, concluding with, “I don’t even know what she does, but you’re paying her a lot of money to do nothing all day.”

As I finished reading it, everything made sense. I decided then that if she wanted my job so badly, she could have it, and typed out my letter of resignation with immediate effect.

The reason she didn’t know what I did all day was because it was way out of her scope of understanding. I didn’t tell her what I was doing because she was not capable of assisting me with it. Whilst she was dressing up as an office mascot and writing the office newsletter, I was desperately trying to fill all the compliance gaps that if discovered would have the company shut down.

So I left. I told a few of the office big mouths what had happened, and I’ve since heard that the story has gotten out, they have indeed lost an important accreditation (that I initially secured for them), and that their financial situation is not great. Meanwhile, I’m now working in consulting, and am slowly but surely recovering from the horrific burnout and depression that that company left me with.

I never realized just how toxic that workplace was, but your readers did. I should have listened then, and I would’ve saved myself much heartache and ill-health. But things are looking up now, and I hope that if I ever find myself in an environment like that again, I’ll spot it sooner and GTFO.

It’s “where are you now?” month at Ask a Manager, and all December I’m running updates from people who had their letters here answered in the past.

There will be more posts than usual this week, so keep checking back throughout the day.

Remember the professor asking whether to correct students who address her as Mrs. (#3 at the link)? Here’s the update.

I am the college professor who wrote to you about my students addressing me using the honorific Mrs., rather than Ms. or Dr.

The comments and suggestions I received in response to my letter gave me the confidence to view the beginning of the fall semester as an important teachable moment. When I introduced myself at the start of class, I clearly explained not only how students should address me (“Dr. Green”) but also how they should NOT address me. In addition, I included with the course materials a blog post explaining how to address women in the workplace.

On the downside, it took less than a week for me to receive my first “Dear Mrs. Green” email. On the upside, now at 11 weeks into the semester, the use of “Dr. Green” has increased significantly, Ms. is used rarely, and Mrs. has almost disappeared.

In addition to my decision to be more clear and direct about my preferences (and provide the blog post), there are two other factors that may have caused the switch from Mrs. Green to Dr. Green. First, my very large class happens to have a great group of students this semester (every class is different and I lucked out this time). Second, I became department chair during the summer, so I may now seem more important.

It will be a few months until I know if my use of the teachable moment will be mentioned in my teaching evaluations. But in any case, I have experienced less annoyance from reading or hearing “Mrs.” this semester and I will definitely continue my crusade with future classes. Also, I believe that I have probably helped some of my students avoid annoying their post-college colleagues, so I feel good about that.

It’s “where are you now?” month at Ask a Manager, and all December I’m running updates from people who had their letters here answered in the past.

There will be more posts than usual this week, so keep checking back throughout the day.

Remember the letter-writer asking if it was OK to vacation with a friend from work (#3 at the link)? Here’s the update.

Thanks so much for your advice on going on vacation with my work friend (as well as all the comments!). I’ve got a quick update for everyone.

I did decide to go on vacation with my coworker Brad, and nothing untoward happened while on the trip. No lines were crossed, we finished the trip cordial but slightly less chatty. I assumed that was because we ran out of things to talk about after a few days by the pool, but it’s clear that wasn’t the case.

It’s been 3 months or so since the trip, and things have been a bit frosty between us. Occasionally I’d texted Brad to grab dinner or something after work, but I always got turned down. All conversations and messages were clipped/rude, including conversations about work topics.

After being in my new department for 6 months now, I’ve picked up some red flags about Brad that I missed before (or chose to ignore due to our friendship). He is consistently rude/uncooperative/unhelpful with the whole department, to the point of people being nervous to talk to him.

I’ve stopped messaging/talking to Brad unless I have a work request, and even then I’m wary of approaching him. Occasionally I’ll get a late night text asking to meet him at the neighborhood bar after he’s had a few drinks, but then he’ll go back to avoiding me the next day.

All things considered, I’m still glad I went on the trip with Brad, it was a nice vacation and it opened my eyes to how he is. I don’t think this strained our work relationship, from what I can tell he now treats me like he treats everyone else on the team (minus the drunk texts!).

Thanks again for all the feedback from everyone in the comment section (and Alison of course!)

It’s “where are you now?” month at Ask a Manager, and all December I’m running updates from people who had their letters here answered in the past.

There will be more posts than usual this week, so keep checking back throughout the day.

Remember the letter-writer whose coworker’s obsession with coffee was an all-day distraction? Here’s the update.

I loved reading your advice and feedback. I sent the email after a day or two that was particularly filled with Bill’s coffee talk on a couple of very stressful morning. It was great knowing I was not alone. A few readers pointed out, I probably used some hyperbole. It is more coffee talk than is warranted but most days are not the multiple hour diatribes. (To some extent, Bill does have quite a few hobbies and interests that I get to hear more than my share about so they add up along with his work chat.) Here are a few updates and things I did to help cope.

1.) Bill is still being Bill. He does have a new boss. His old manager is in another position. It seems quieter now so I’m not sure if his new boss has had some talks about his general time management issues or if he is trying to make a better impression.
2.) An office right next door to mine came open. It puts me one door down so it mutes some of the coffee talk, but I still get to be close to my team. That was a huge help.
3.) I did go ahead and opt to keep my air pods in my office both for after work (de-stressing) workouts and distractions.
4.) Last one is probably not the fun update, but I left out that I had a traumatic experience the year before that had amped up my anxiety at work. (Natural disaster related) I took some time off to finally deal with it over a year after the incident. I learned a lot of coping strategies and have even found a mindfulness meditation podcast that I sometimes close the door to do a mediation when I’m feeling irritable.

In a moment of profound growth, I even complimented one of the new coffees last week and told him how good it smelled. For now, I’m not going to let it break my peace of mind and I’ll learn to let little things go whether its hearing about the coffee, the importance of Star Wars: the Clone Wars lore, random facts about obscure Holidays, or Premier League Football. He is very good at certain types of mundane tedious work that most of us hate. He’s just got a lot of chronic insecurity that is a roadblock for him. I’ll have the talk with his manager if it becomes an issue as it pertains to my team’s work.

It’s “where are you now?” month at Ask a Manager, and all December I’m running updates from people who had their letters here answered in the past. Here are five updates from past letter-writers.

There will be more posts than usual this week, so keep checking back throughout the day.

1. Our custodian says we have fleas but we do not (#2 at the link)

I wrote in asking about how to deal with the alleged flea infestation that only our custodian could see.

Around the same time I wrote to you, Flea Man [in my head I say this the same way one would say He-Man like from the 1980s cartoon] met me at the staff door as I came in to work. He had waited for me specifically so he could show me evidence of the fleas.

He had drowned several fleas in one of the library toilets and had left them there intentionally so I could see there really were fleas in the library. I told him that although I did indeed see the drowned fleas, that no one else had reported any flea activity at all and even our exterminator hadn’t found any evidence of fleas.

He apparently decided I wasn’t taking him seriously enough and left a note for our business manager, explaining again that he thought we had fleas. His letter ended with the line, “My hair can’t take that chance.”

Because his work was so poor and his absenteeism so frequent, we fired him shortly thereafter and he and his fleas have not been seen again in our building.

2. I heard alarming information from a coworker’s old manager — should I tell our boss? (#3 at the link)

Thank you for replying to my letter! I did apply your advice regarding tone, but thankfully, the situation worked itself out regardless.

To clarify something that came up in the comments: I had left this out for brevity, but Juan actually texted Emma himself to tell her he was working with me. So: he commented on her post, I asked how he knew her, and he texted her like they were friends. Then I got the call from her, which is why I found the whole thing particularly odd.

Shortly after your post, my boss’s role was split into two. Although Juan and I were still on the same projects, we had different roles, so Juan got a new boss while I stayed with mine.

I learned from my boss that Juan’s new boss had immediately flagged these issues and put him on a Performance Improvement Plan. There were even complaints from clients about him. My boss asked me to keep an eye out for any issues Juan might cause and let leadership know immediately, which gave me a chance to casually share my concerns. I told him I had it on good authority that Juan had had similar issues before and had even been fired over them. My boss was unfazed and just said, “Oh, I’m sure he has.”

Juan was let go a month later, on good terms.

Here’s the funny part: a few days after that, Emma called me again to say Juan had reached out to her, asking if she knew of any openings! (The very person who let him go—I’m honestly bewildered.) Emma was really concerned that he might have jeopardized my job as well by trying to shift blame onto me or generally make me look bad, but fortunately it wasn’t.

Juan is still liking and commenting on all of Emma’s posts—and now on posts from my company’s leadership, too. It seems like he’s over-representing his connections just as he does with his technical skills, or maybe he just lacks self-awareness. In any case, I’m glad it all resolved with minimal drama.

3. My company let me buy a house, then laid me off — then pulled the rug out from under me again (#2 at the link)

Ultimately, the move worked out in the end. I had moved in part for more opportunities and one came up for an internal transfer to a different department. I got a decent pay bump and some other incentives, enough so that I ended up in a better position than if I had taken the original position. I was a bit concerned about the transition since it is to a new department — and moving to a customer-facing role, when my prior team was internal-only — but I’m working on a lot of the same projects and regularly asked to consult on questions about the old team and their processes. There’s been a lot of adjusting to what is an entirely new role, but the trial period went through fine and my new team is thrilled to have me. We work a lot with my former team on projects, and my operational knowledge has helped speed some things along that they had been struggling with for months). I’m also quite happy with the move. I had reasons to move states beyond the job, the biggest being the political climate, and I probably would have moved regardless of the work situation.

The biggest factor for me in deciding whether to stay or look elsewhere was thinking about prior experiences. I also considered some of the comments that suggested it might have been something that Sara was fighting for and other managers or higher ups ultimately made the final call over her objections. I still don’t know exactly who made the call or when, nor when Sara knew officially. But before everything that happened in July, management and I had a great relationship. I had been promoted and assigned some major projects. There were some extra development opportunities that I was selected for. This was really the first time being blindsided at work. And in the aftermath of the first position falling through, Sara arranged for me to start some new projects that ultimately are how I got referred to this new department. I’m more willing to write off what happened in July as a bad judgment call — they didn’t want to share bad news until it was final, even if I really needed to be in the loop before then. Certainly something I will keep in mind if I ever find myself in a managerial role.

In retrospect, I’m even somewhat thankful the first position fell through. I’m in a better position now at work, and my new team is well managed. Moving departments has allowed me to train on new subjects and get some new opportunities, and I’m still early enough in my career that I can afford to move around. From what I’ve heard through the grapevine, the first position had (and still has) a lot of growing pains and the manager overseeing it still hasn’t quite worked out what they want it to be. I get a sense as well from the stories I’ve heard that this manager is not the most organized or considerate.

4. Navigating small social/networking circles as a manager (#4 at the link)

Thank you for reassuring me I was reasonable in my decisions and didn’t need to feel guilty. Iris didn’t invite Petunia and I’ve kept going as often as I can to the dinners. Petunia’s home challenges has continued though and she’s back and forth on reconciliation vs divorce all of which is very stressful for her and affecting her mood at work. I feel for her and as a manager have offered appropriate support, but am still deeply grateful I can keep my outside life dinners separate.

5. My employer wants us to list our dietary restrictions publicly (#3 at the link)

I emailed the person who set up the catering privately to share my concerns, and they recorded my dietary needs privately. We haven’t had another catered meeting since so I’m unsure if the procedures changed, but I got my needs across without having to share them in public.

Now if only I can convince them that cross-contaminated utensils and a single salad isn’t enough gluten-free food…..

It’s “where are you now?” month at Ask a Manager, and all December I’m running updates from people who had their letters here answered in the past.

There will be more posts than usual this week, so keep checking back throughout the day.

Remember the letter-writer who was buying a business and needed to tell an employee that she wasn’t keeping her on? Here’s the update.

To answer one thing from your reply back in March, Sue is also an old friend of the previous owner so I did not see him letting her go any sooner with or without severance as a possibility. He was also a very hands-off manger in general and many people who should have been let go stayed on for much longer than I would put up with personally.

So here’s what happened: I set up a formal interview with Sue and one other coworker 1.5 months before the purchase with the clear messaging that I was definitely keeping on every member of the team who had been there longer than one year but wanted the opportunity to meet with the newer hires to decide if they would be a good fit to bring to the new practice. I also tried to open my mind up to the possibility that Sue would actually surprise me in her interview and possibly didn’t realize how she had come off in the past.

The interview confirmed my feelings that Sue saw going right to management as the best way to handle everything despite saying she craved a “team player” environment, and she denied every instance I pointed out of her going against her coworkers’ training and advice (I had personally witnessed or overheard the ones I presented). There was also a clear disagreement between Sue and me on when it is appropriate to take on others’ tasks without being asked first and a clear unawareness of her propensity to make mistakes. Therefore, I met with Sue a few weeks later to officially let her know that I did not see her being a good fit and she would not be starting work at the new practice.

She did end up buying and renting out the property next door and other than a few dumpster-sharing issues that in the end are still the old owner’s problem (it’s his dumpster as I rent the practice building from him and he is the one who sold her this adjacent property), her having a close proximity to the practice at times has not been an issue yet.

I will add that she reached out about a month into the new practice to ask to return and reported how blindsided she was by my reasoning to let her go and that she thought I had been misled by what others said about her. She also asked for a meeting. I declined to meet with her and let her know I was not considering bringing her on to the practice, reminded her I have never been her employer, and offered as a courtesy to write up a short summary to remind her of what we discussed in that final meeting which had nothing to do with gossip. She accepted this and despite a reply to my written statement that she disagrees with my read on the situation (I did not reply) I have not heard from her since.

Her daughter and I appear to still have a good relationship but she has still been unable to return to work due to her family situation. I could see us making space for her in the future if it works out later, but am also okay with the outcome of her not returning.