my coworker insisted on inviting her sister to my wedding

A reader writes:

This happened a while ago, but I’m still weirded out by it. I worked in a very close-knit, small office (five people), where I got along very well with everyone except one person, “Gertrude.”

Gertrude was in her first job out of school, so it’s likely she was new to working world etiquette, but it seemed like she constantly tried to put herself as someone who was doing it all, while actually doing very little (she had the lowest output of anyone). She also had a tendency to try and stir drama — she’d say, “I don’t know why Janine (our boss) didn’t put me and you on this project. I think she’s totally unfair, right?” I’d just say that I didn’t know why anything happened and it was best to just focus on my own work and move on.

After two years of working at this office, I got engaged and wanted to invite my coworkers to my wedding. Since I thought it seemed incredibly rude to invite three of them and leave Gertrude out, I included her as well.

Traditionally, wedding invitations in my circle only include a plus-one if the person is married or in a very committed long-term relationship (as in years). The venue has limited seating, weddings are expensive, etc. … It may not be a great system, but it’s what it is.

On the RSVP cards I wrote out the guest name (e.g., Ms. Sally Jones), with a checkmark box for “yes” and “no.” For internal reference, I wrote out the number of guests on the card, so when I inputted the response I could easily write down the number of attendees.

When Gertrude mailed back her response, she wrote a note in the margins saying, “Ms. Gertrude Smith and sister Ellie Smith.” She then crossed out the number where it said “1” and wrote 2, and then in the box where one should check yes or no, she wrote in “yes for me and my sister.”

I am not an etiquette expert so maybe inviting sisters is a thing in other cultures? I told her sorry, but her sister was not invited to my wedding.

She was very insulted and we had this conversation:

Gertrude: I don’t understand.
Me: Sorry, but we are not doing plus-ones
Gertrude (huffy): Why not? I’m going to be bored without anyone to talk to.
Me: Well, you will be seated with everyone from our office, so you’ll have people to talk to.
Gertrude: Well, I want someone I’m close to to talk to.
Me: Okay. I definitely understand, so if you choose not to come, I will understand.
Gertrude: Who’s going to stop me if I bring my sister anyway?!
Me: No one will physically stop you, but it’s assigned seating … so she won’t have anywhere to sit.
Gertrude: I can’t believe you’re not letting me bring a plus-one.

I didn’t even want Gertrude at my wedding in the first place! And I had to navigate a whole mess because I didn’t want to leave her out! (She was rude to me for the rest of the year she worked there, I had to escalate to our mutual boss, and she ended up leaving soon afterwards). But was there something I could have done differently here? I know mixing the workplace and personal lives is always tricky, but I honestly don’t know what I should have done better in this situation.

I wrote back and asked the burning unanswered question: “What ended up happening? Did she go? Did she bring her sister?”

She was unclear if she would be willing to come without her sister, repeating that it’s standard to expect a plus-one. I was equally firm in that there would be nowhere for her to sit.

Whenever I tried to press Gertrude if her sister’s exclusion meant that she wouldn’t come at all, she just repeated that she could not believe I was not giving everyone a plus-one. So I kept Gertrude on the “yes” list.

Gertrude did come, and coworkers didn’t mention her trying to shoe-horn her sister into their table, so I think she got the message. But she was standoffish the remainder of the time we worked together. Her behavior was bizarre with other people too so I’m not sure if it was because of the wedding (for example, at one event where she was assigned to hand out pamphlets, she told everyone she was managing the event and got really angry when people tried to correct that). When she left a few months later, she sent me an out-of-the-blue message on social media saying, “I don’t hate anyone at work, but I needed to grow as a person and out of my comfort zone.”

All in all, a weird experience and I’m not sure what I should have done to make it less weird. Not engaged on my reasons for not including universal plus-ones? Escalated to my boss when she was rude to me before? Eloped?

People are so weird about invitations.

You don’t get to forcibly invite an additional guest to someone else’s wedding. If you’re told you don’t have a plus-one, your choices are either to accept the invitation on those terms or to decline to attend. “I’m bringing a plus-one anyway” isn’t on the table.

The point of a plus-one was never supposed to be “so that you’re not bored.” Rather, it stems from etiquette long treating married couples as a social unit, where it was considered rude to invite one member of a couple to a social event without including both (and later, as it became more common to see long-term relationships without marriage, to view those long-term couples as a social unit as well). There’s certainly a whole conversation that could be had about whether or not that’s the right paradigm to use, but it’s still a very common social convention and it’s not shocking or offensive to limit your plus-one’s that way (particularly at expensive events like weddings where space on the guest list is often at a premium and hosts are having to make trade-offs).

But all that aside, Gertrude was simply rude. “I’m going to be bored at your wedding” is rude. “Who’s going to stop me if I bring a guest anyway?” is rude. Hassling you about a decision you’d already made clear was firm is rude.

You’re looking at this as “is there anything I could have done differently?” when this was really just about Gertrude being rude, which doesn’t sound out of character for her.

That said, you were on the right track with “I understand if this means you won’t be able to attend.”  Ideally you would have taken it a step further and said, “Since I know the lack of a plus-one was a concern for you, I’ll put you down as a no. Although if you do want to attend on your own, let me know today before I finalize things.” (You could also leave off that last sentence if you wanted to.)

And if she still pushed: “Okay, I’ll put you down as a no.”

If it’s any solace, I believe all the best weddings include weird drama. (I was disappointed that mine didn’t have any! Keeping it small was likely our fatal error in that regard.) In your shoes, I would cherish this story for years to come, and I recommend that you do the same.

group member won’t stop talking, snack bar is in a coworker’s work area, and more

It’s five answers to five questions. Here we go…

1. Writing group member won’t stop talking and we can’t get any work done

I work at an academic institution, and am a member of a writing group that includes people across different departments. We meet every few weeks to write as a way of carving out time for this work, and to hold each other accountable. We usually talk a bit right at the beginning of each session, take a break in the middle, and then chat briefly before leaving.

One member, however, loves to monologue, mostly about their own work, which is in a fairly arcane field, and which the rest of us do not fully understand. This member will often come in late, when the rest of us have started working, and start talking. This is fine, but they will not. Stop. Talking. They talk at everyone else, with little in the way of response, often for 30-45 minutes at a time. Aside from it being extremely draining having to be at the receiving end of this, my time is limited, and I really look forward to being able to write during these sessions, not listen to the nuances of the other person’s work. Any time they reach what I think is the end of what they want to say, I try to turn back to my writing or say, “Okay, time to write now,” but they continue talking. This person has a strong personality, which is why I think other members have neglected to try to stop them as well. It has gotten to the point where, as much as I enjoy the group otherwise, I would rather plan some time to work myself then lose so much to this rambling.

The members would all like to meet again in a few weeks, and I am struggling with how to say that I am happy to meet again, but I really need to buckle down and work. Such a statement would clearly be directed at one person, and I don’t want to start any drama. Beyond that, this person and I had a minor argument over an unrelated manner the last time we met, and I don’t want them to think I am trying to isolate them because of that instance. I don’t have any problem with this person otherwise, I just want my writing group to function as a writing group!

In the discussion about setting up the next meeting, why not say, “I’d love to set up the next meeting, but I really need quiet time to write. We’ve had lots of talking at the last meetings, which makes it tough for me to focus. If some of the group wants to talk and some wants quiet writing time, could we split into two groups so everyone gets what they need from the time?”

And then if the monologuer shows up for the “quiet” group session, you’ll be on solid ground saying, “Like we talked about, I really need quiet writing time. Can we save conversation for the end?”

2. Boss gave me mixed feedback on a task, then framed an interview question for a new hire around that exact task

I have been struggling lately with how my manager, Carrie, communicates with me, and I’m trying to figure out if this is something I should swallow or if it’s worth raising with her, and if so, how best to do that.

A few weeks ago, Carrie asked if I would join her at a meeting with two senior leaders she reports to, to provide an update on a project I’ve been working on but that she is officially responsible for. Later, Carrie decided the meeting agenda was too packed for me to join, so she asked me to prepare two PowerPoint slides to share with them instead.

The project has been to track progress on a high-level organization-wide plan and to document the status of 40 recommendations across four work areas. This is not information that can be meaningfully condensed into two slides. Wondering if she had something specific in mind for how she wanted me to present it, I asked for more guidance on what she wanted me to share. She said, “Just a recap on how things are going – what’s stalled, what’s moving, what hasn’t started, etc.”

I made the call to present the information in five slides – an overall summary, and one each for the four work areas and the recommendations for each. I shared the slides with Carrie and she said over instant message, “Although you went waaaayyyy over 1 to 2 slides, I understand why you did based on the info you provided! Thanks for this — it looks great and I like how you’ve provided the context for each work area diplomatically.”

If Carrie liked what I did and understood why I chose the approach I did, even if it wasn’t within the parameters she initially set out, why belabor the point? It felt unnecessarily petty, and a poor way to give feedback – especially in a written format where any lighthearted tone she may have intended was completely lost.

Then, later in the week, she asked me to review and comment on a draft of interview questions for a new hire for our team. When I reviewed it, I saw one is a scenario-based question framed around exactly the task she asked me to do: “How would you approach creating three slides for a presentation your manager needs to give on a project you’ve been working on but they provided minimal guidance on the content they want?” The qualities the question is intended to explore are “initiative and ability to work with minimal direction, while ensuring the content aligns with project goals. Look for creativity, organization, and proactive communication with their manager.”

Asking this question feels like a dig at me, somehow, given the feedback she gave me on how I handled this exact task. At minimum, she seems wildly unaware of how asking this question in an interview I am participating in would make me feel. How should I handle this? Is it worth talking to her about it? Or should I just let it go?

I think you’re reading too much into it. First, Carrie’s feedback doesn’t sound that mixed; it sounds positive. She noted you produced more than she asked for but also said she realized why, and she said it was great. That’s positive. If anything, though, she might have appreciated an earlier heads-up when you first decided to do additional slides so that she’d have a chance to say, “That won’t work since I already have too many. Can you condense it into three?” It’s always smart to alert your boss in advance when you don’t think you can do something within the constraints they assigned.

The timing of the interview question is, admittedly, a little weird. But I wouldn’t interpret that so negatively either. For all we know, Carrie appreciated what you did and it spurred her to screen for someone who would similar take initiative to problem-solve — or, sure, maybe the mention of “proactive communication” instead is getting at the point above. But it’s also possible that the question has nothing to do with what just happened (especially if she asks for slides a lot).

If it’s bugging you, you can always ask her: “I saw the interview question on X and wondered it stemmed from how I handled the slides the other day. Is that something you’d want me to do differently in the future?”

But I’d bet it’s no big deal at all.

3. Coworkers’ snack bar is in another coworker’s work area

I’ve got a low-stakes question for you. My coworkers have decided to start bringing in different kinds of snacks for people to snack on throughout the day (on their own dollar, which I really don’t think they should be doing on principle, but hey whatever makes them happy). The snacks have been moved around to a couple of different spots, but eventually the snack bar coworkers moved everything next to the mini-fridge in our area. The problem with that is it’s encroaching into someone else’s desk space! (We’re in an open office space. The mini-fridge is in a corner, and someone’s desk is right next to it. They’ve lined up the containers along the windows behind the fridge, but the windows go into this person’s desk space.)

It’s not my desk space, so I don’t really have the grounds to say something. Do I say something to my coworker whose space is being used? She’s relatively new, so she might not want to rock the boat about this. I just feel like this is extremely rude! There are other places to set up these snacks, why are you choosing one that’s already being used?

(Note: the snacks are all either still in their sealed packaging or are in sealable tupperware-type containers. No one’s said anything about any possible issues of just leaving food out and about for weeks at a time, and I don’t think it’s serious enough to raise to anyone.)

Eh. It’s minor enough that it would be completely fine to leave it alone or to say something. If the coworker whose space is being used weren’t new or were known to be reasonably assertive, I’d stay out of it. But since she’s new, it would be considerate to either (a) say, “Hey, can we move these somewhere where they’re not encroaching on Jane’s desk space?” or (b) ask Jane, “Does it bother you that these are being kept here? I can suggest they move them if it does.”

4. What’s up with the term “grandboss”?

I keep seeing the term “grandboss” on your site, and elsewhere. I have an immediate, nearly physical reaction of disgust to this term. The idea that your boss or your workplace is your family makes my skin crawl, and the idea of my boss’s boss specifically being my “granddaddy” somehow crosses the line even more to the point that it feels really yucky.

I’m confused. Why do you use this term? Why do others use it? I genuinely want to understand, because I can’t even begin to fathom accepting this as a normal thing, it just feels beyond gross and creepy to me.

I love your blog and I nearly always agree with your takes and enjoy your responses, so the use of this term and general acceptance of its use from others really throws me.

It’s just because “boss’s boss” or “boss’s boss’s boss” is unwieldy” and “grandboss” captures the hierarchy quickly in a way that’s easy to intuit.

No one actually thinks of their boss’s boss as a grandparent figure; it’s just easy shorthand. (I would fully agree with your disgust if anyone was actually using “granddaddy,” “grandma,” etc., but no one is using those — they’ve just borrowed “grand.”)

5. Can managers ever really get anonymous feedback?

We are a small team (fewer than 10 employees) at a large hi-tech company. There are plenty of avenues for team leaders and managers to give feedback to their reports, but nothing official in place for employees to give feedback to their higher ups.

My relatively new team leader (a little over a year) wants to institute a way for our team to give him feedback anonymously but doesn’t know how to go about it. When he brought it up at a recent meeting, one of my coworkers pointed out that it wouldn’t be truly anonymous as we are a very small team and it would be easy to figure it out, especially as some issues only apply to one person. Is there a way to ask for and receive truly anonymous feedback from your reports?

If you have a very large team, yes. Although even then, a lot of people will worry the feedback isn’t really anonymous (sometimes it’s really not) and won’t be candid. But on a small team, it’s often very easy to figure out who said what (and even more so if the survey includes any sort of job function or demographics).

It’s better for managers to create an environment where people feel safe giving feedback, even if it’s not anonymous (and which ideally would include cultivating good relationships between the team and the manager’s own boss, so there’s another path for feedback if something is really significant).

Related:
why do managers say they want feedback and then get annoyed when they get it?
how to get your staff to be more honest with you

the avenging COO, the salary fix, and other stories of wrongs being righted

Last week we talked about times you saw someone right someone else’s wrong. Here are 10 of my favorite stories you shared.

1. The COO

My first job out of college was working at a large corporation as an executive admin. There were five of us admins who sat in the open space, outside of the executives’ offices. Our VP of marketing was known for being a not-nice suck-up. Once a week she would come up with some sort of treat and make a big deal of handing them out to the execs, but not the admins. She would also raid the executive kitchen and help herself to any drinks, food, etc., even our own personal stuff that we poor admins brought from home. As admins, we didn’t really feel like we had a voice in the matter. The execs seemed to really like this woman, so what can you do?

One day, the marketing witch came around with cupcakes for the execs. This time, the COO was standing next to my desk and when she handed him a cupcake, he smiled, looked at me, then said to her, “What about the admins?” Marketing witch stammered a little, then stated that she must have run out.

He said, “If you don’t bring enough for everyone, then don’t bother bringing any. Also, the executive kitchen is for people on this floor only (she worked on another floor), you will need to stop taking stuff out of it and helping yourself.” It was all I could do not to laugh.

She stopped everything — she stopped bringing treats to the execs, stopped taking our stuff out of the kitchen, and stopped talking to us admins altogether unless absolutely necessary. I guess she thought one of us ratted her out. I checked with the other admins and apparently none of us had said anything. The COO was just incredibly kind and observant.

2. The salary

A former coworker recruited me to his current company. When he asked me about salary I told him $X. He said: “What I heard you ask for was $X+30k. Hold firm on $X+20k because the recruiter will try and talk you down and you won’t be happy in this role for a lower salary.”

He was extremely right and I’m very thankful for his guidance.

3. The rename

My mum was a Special Educational Needs Coordinator in a mainstream school (commonly abbreviated to SENCO, in the UK at least.) She was really bloody good at her job and ended up being made head of her department. Immediately on appointment, she informed her headmaster that she was renaming the department, and she wasn’t asking. They weren’t going to be “special needs” anymore because every kid knows what “special” means and it becomes a slur. They were going to be “learning support,” because everyone needs support now and again. They still focused 90% of their time and energy on kids who would traditionally be labelled SEN kids, but they also had the time and space for the kids who were struggling with the history homework this week and just needed a bit of occasional extra one-on-one time.

When she retired, the school library was named after her.

4. The Christmas save(s)

My husband was the VP of operations at a small tech company, second in command to the owner (who was not a good dude). The owner sucked at running a business and decided he needed to lay off all the staff except my husband, who would help him rebuild. He was too chicken to do the layoffs himself and made my husband do it. Husband successfully fought for notice and severance for these employees and called recruiters himself to help them get placements.

So husband lays off 14 people in individual meetings over two weeks, and on the second Friday can’t find the owner. Eventually the owner materializes at the end of the day and lays off my husband, effective that day. No severance. Husband also discovers that owner had backdated the last day of employment for a bunch of folks so that he would not have to pay their health insurance for December (one found out because the doctor’s office called to tell him his kids wouldn’t be covered the next week). Husband threatened to report the owner for small business tax fraud among other things and, after sending us a bunch of nasty letters from a disbarred lawyer, owner suddenly restored insurance.

And now husband is without a job or severance — in December, when no one is really hiring. But then! The mother of one of his former employees, who was an IT manager in a very large company in town, was so grateful for how husband treated her daughter that she created a new position for him on her team, called their recruiters and directed them to fast track him, and gave him a raise. This all happened within two weeks. Basically my husband saved Christmas for a handful of families, and then one of them saved it for us.

5. The salary, part 2

One of my colleagues (a man) was leaving the company, and I (a woman) was promoted to fill his role. He was worried they would underpay me. So before he left, he gave me his whole salary history. What they had paid him when he started, and how much of a raise he had gotten each year. It was amazing to have concrete salary data to use for negotiating.

6. The dick

I was a newly hired C-suite leader in a large nonprofit with some really problematic power dynamics, particularly with the super grouchy CFO; he was nasty, ignored anything that inconvenienced him, and everyone in the administrative office was terrified of him.

A few weeks into my time there, one of his sweet, bubbly and well-loved fiscal analyst employees was notified that her ex-husband, the father of her three kids, had unexpectedly passed away. While they were no longer close, she was super concerned about how her kids would react and desperately wanted to go home to be with them before they got the news from social media. Grouchy CFO wouldn’t let her. There was an upcoming deadline of hers for that evening only he could sign off on, and he was refusing to even look at it, saying, “I’ll get to that by the end of day, you can wait.” She tried to explain the situation, but he wouldn’t budge.

My office was across the hall from Super Grouchy CFO, so she drifted in, collapsed into a chair, and started crying. I felt awful for her. Our always-absent CEO wasn’t there to do anything. I knocked on CFO’s door, but he wouldn’t get up to respond to me. So I went and got the spare key and let myself into his office, asking him to finish the task they were working on so she could go home. He was belligerent and shouted at me that he would get to it when he would get to it, to mind my own business, and to get the &$#@ out of his office.

I marched right up to him as he sat on his computer (playing solitaire, no less) and said, “I have decided that this is my absolute top priority for the day, so I will stand right here and give you all the support you need, until you are able to finish this task and she can go home.” I then stood right next to him, silently, for about 10 minutes while he huffed and sputtered at me. He got so irritated that he grabbed the documents, signed them, and then shouted, “FINE, JUST GO AWAY.” The sweet analyst was so grateful and relieved, she rushed off to her car and sped home to her kids.

It’s been 15 years since then. She and I are still the best of friends.

7. The customer

I was working as a cashier and I had stepped away from my lane very briefly (I’d been asked to turn a four-hour shift into a 12-hour shift and had to flag for the front end manager that I’d need a lunch break) and a customer ended up in a different lane with one person in front of her as a result. This added no more than 90 seconds to her wait time, but she proceeded to spend the entire 90 seconds pointedly complaining to her daughter loudly enough that her intent was clearly for me to hear her talking about how I “didn’t know how to act” and she couldn’t believe I’d been so rude. It’s worth noting that I had scurried back to my register and the people who’d walked up to it after her offered to let her go first, but she ignored them (I guess she didn’t want to move her cart?).

I will never, ever forget how the person who I was ringing up said, just as pointedly and at the same volume, “Well, I think it’s rude to be a BITCH.” The complaining customer was sooooo mad but couldn’t say anything without acknowledging her own behavior. I’ve been riding that high for over a decade.

8. The course

The summer after my freshman year of college, I was enrolled in a public speaking course. It was required for graduation. After my first attempt at a speech for a class assignment, the instructor was devastatingly unkind in his public feedback, including telling me that I had failed. I did my best not to cry in front of everyone, but I’m sure that they noticed how upset I was.

At the next class, the professor publicly apologized to me for the way he had spoken to me.

I found out later that close to the entire class (it was summer, so a small group) banded together, went to his office, and scolded him.

9. The library

I work in a public library and we have to input lots of information for new library cards, including patron names. I noticed that our system had a space for preferred names and that if you used that slot, the preferred name would pop up on the screen instead of a person’s legal name. This is a HUGE benefit for trans and nonbinary folks and also for others for a whole host of reasons, so I changed our paper form to include the preferred name slot and trained my staff on how to navigate adding and using a preferred name for a patron.

The last time this came up, a teen patron was at the circulation desk with their parent, and my staff member did a fantastic job adding the teen’s preferred name. The parent looked at the teen and said, “See? I told you this was a safe place.”

10. The salary, part 3

I (a woman) started a new job. A man at my exact level started a few weeks later. About a month later, our entire group was out for drinks when we discovered the man was making $20,000 more than me for the exact same job. A senior woman in my group marched into the partner’s office first thing the next morning and read him the riot act. I immediately received a very sheepish apology, a $20,000 raise, and retro pay to my start date.

This is the value of talking about salaries with your colleagues – and of standing up for your colleagues in situations of injustice.

employee is sending risqué photos of himself to his coworkers

A reader writes:

My small company has a very laid-back culture — sometimes too laid-back. A lot of the employees are friends outside of work or follow each other on social media. A team of seven employees sits outside of my office in an open floor plan space. They often talk throughout the day and sometimes I think they forget that I can hear what they are saying.

This afternoon I overheard them talking, when one of them mentioned that an employee who doesn’t work in their department regularly sends naked pictures with animal filters on his private parts. They were talking fairly loudly so I asked, “Are you talking about so-and-so? Who works downstairs?” and they went silent. Nobody denied it and I’m fairly confident I heard correctly.

I don’t know what to do with this information. On one hand, it’s the employee’s private social media account, so if he wants to post naked pictures on there, that’s his prerogative. On the other, if they were looking at the picture in the moment, it leads me to believe that the photo was possibly taken during work time. Do I ask for more details privately, speak to the employee about it, or let it go and hope he’s got more sense than to do it on company time?

I answer this question over at Inc. today, where I’m revisiting letters that have been buried in the archives here from years ago (and sometimes updating/expanding my answers to them). You can read it here.

our coworker lied about having a sick child and a rich fiance

I’m off for a few days (probably back tomorrow), so here’s an older post from the archives. This was originally published in 2017.

A reader writes:

I’m really curious about what you would have done in this situation.

I’ve worked for a company for a little over 10 years and there is a person, who we will call Lysa, who started soon after me. We worked in a semi-small and close department (20 people or so) and about a year after she started she ran into a streak of bad luck. Her husband asked for a divorce and it was discovered her young daughter had cancer. The children’s hospital was an almost two-hour drive, so she was in the car a lot. She was tired and we, as a department, came together to do what we could to help. People would bring her lunch and coffee and everyone pooled money and bought her a gas card.

Her luck started to improve with her daughter’s health improving, and she met a new boyfriend. She was always gushing about him, showing everyone pictures and having loud phone conversations. It was annoying, but we gave her slack because she had such a hard last few years. It became worse when he proposed because any conversation with her was about her wedding in Italy and how this weekend she was flying to Italy to check on the wedding venue and next weekend was a trip to New York for the dress fitting. (Her fiance was wealthy so he was paying for everything.)

When the wedding day was closing in, a group of coworkers decided to throw a bridal shower at the office and decided to invite her friends and family as well. So one lunch, they headed to her mother’s house. They invited her to the bridal shower and asked if she would invite any of Lysa’s friends. The mother’s response: “What are you talking about? She doesn’t even have a boyfriend…”

She lied … about all of it. Her daughter was never sick. She was never married. She never met the rich man of her dreams, but she told us that. The long phone conversations were her talking to herself, not connected to anything (we checked the phone log). We believe the flowers and gifts she sent to herself.

When she was confronted, she said her mother doesn’t like him and doesn’t acknowledge his existence. It was the same with the daughter’s illness. She pretended it was real but it didn’t fit. She had already told us that her mother had gone with her to Italy to check out the venue and was excited. And during her daughter’s illness, she talked about how her mother was so helpful and supportive. We started catching her in little lies.

We reported it to management. Since it didn’t affect the business, they said there wasn’t anything they could do, but now we have a department with an outcast. The only people who will talk to her are those who like to stir up trouble. Even management doesn’t believe her. When her daughter was in an accident, they asked her to bring in the police report (the difference between taking care of a child or an unexcused absence) when before they would have just believed it. It hasn’t reached an unprofessional level. Even those who won’t even say hello will work with her on work-related items, but it’s curt and cold and they turn their backs when its done.

What is your opinion of what should be done?

Well, it’s not quite right that since it doesn’t affect the business, there’s nothing that your management can do. They may decide they don’t want to do anything, and reasonable people could disagree on whether or not they should do something, but they could if they wanted to.

And if the situation is impacting Lysa’s ability to be effective in her job, then it’s work-related anyway.

My first question, though, is how absolutely sure you are that Lysa lied. It’s one thing to suspect her of lying and another to be sure — and when you’re accusing someone of lying about a child with cancer, you really, really don’t want to get it wrong. It sounds like you do have enough info to be confident, but it’s worth taking a hard look at that. (For example, if you’re just going on her mother’s word, it’s possible that her mother is troubled or otherwise not giving you correct info. You shouldn’t necessarily believe the mom over the coworker, unless you have other reasons to consider the coworker not credible.)

If you’re not 100% sure, I’d put this in the “wow, that seems really suspicious, and I’m taking everything she says with a large grain of salt” category. That’s different than the “my coworker is a horrible person and I will shun her” category. It’s more like the “I’m giving her a wide berth and not going out of my way to help if she reports future crises” category.

But if you are sure, then it wouldn’t be unreasonable for Lysa’s manager to intervene. What that would look like could vary, and probably should come down to the type of role that Lysa has, how much she needs to interact with colleagues to get her work done, and what the impact has been on the office as a whole. If she can go on being perfectly effective in her job while having people dislike her, the appropriate consequence might simply be A Serious and Unpleasant Conversation (“your coworkers are upset because they sacrificed their own time and money to help you out when they thought you were in need — what is your plan for repairing those relationships?”). But there are other contexts where you could reasonably argue that it would be too disruptive to keep her around (again, assuming there’s no chance you’re wrong about what happened).

Whatever the resolution, it’s worth noting that while what Lysa did was very wrong, it’s also something that happy, healthy people don’t do. So something’s going on with her — mental illness, deep insecurity, or something else — and keeping that in mind might help if you do have to keep working with her.

my office thinks I insulted a coworker, someone threw away my shoes, and more

I’m off for a few days (probably back tomorrow). Here are some past letters that I’m making new again, rather than leaving them to wilt in the archives.

1. My office thinks I insulted a coworker but I didn’t mean it like that

I work for a small nonprofit. I have one boss and about 14 coworkers with whom I’m “office friendly,” meaning I don’t socialize outside of work/discuss personal matters. Though I’ve been employed the longest, I know very little about people’s personal lives.

The other day my coworker “Susan” came into the office carrying a rock she’d found on a hike. She showed it to me saying that she thought it was a fossil and wanted to ask “Nancy,” our volunteer coordinator, what it was. Without thinking, I laughed and said, “Whatever would Nancy know about fossils? That’s not her background.” Susan gave me a strange look and walked away.

Later that day, our boss called me into her office, shut the door, and told me that “accusing a coworker of falsifying information on her resume is a serious issue.” She then asked me for proof that Nancy had lied. Apparently, Nancy has advanced degrees in paleontology and had taught at our local junior college before switching fields and joining our team. I confessed that I had no idea; what I said to Susan was based my not knowing Nancy’s background. The idea seemed ridiculous: Nancy coordinates volunteers at a nonprofit that has nothing to do with science. How was I to know her background? My response didn’t go over well. I received a verbal warning as well as “advice” about being more aware of how my words came across.

I was also asked to apologize to Nancy – which I reluctantly did. She accepted my apology, but seemed strangely hurt. I still feel that I did nothing wrong. I was merely responding to something that sounded silly to me; the others blew it all out of proportion. My boss said that my words had come across as “dismissive and sexist” because I’m a man and it sounded like I’d assumed Nancy wasn’t really a scientist. I did assume that, but not because she was a woman, because she’s working in a field that has absolutely nothing to do with her scientific background. What say you? Was I out of line? I want to return to friendly terms with my boss and coworkers, but I don’t want admit unwarranted guilt.

Yeah, your original comment was rude. If you didn’t know anything about Nancy’s background, it doesn’t really make sense that you scoffed at the idea that she could know about fossils (as opposed to saying something like, “Oh, I didn’t realize she knew about fossils”). And that does play right into some sexist tropes, even if you didn’t intend it to.

That said, your boss characterizing it as “accusing a coworker of falsifying information on her resume” is weird. That makes me wonder if this might be part of a pattern where you’ve been perceived to be dismissive or sexist before. If you’ve had that kind of feedback before, or gotten the sense people were taking you that way, I’d take this as a flag that it’s a serious problem with the way you’re perceived and your relationships with coworkers.

If not, and this is genuinely the first time this has come up, I’d still apologize. The comment was insulting, even if you didn’t intend it to be, and that alone warrants an apology. You could add that you realize now that it played right into a particular type of sexism that women in science have to deal with and that you’re resolving to be more thoughtful about that in the future.

2019

2. Can public support of a fired employee hurt that employee?

I regularly attend shows at a local theater, and know many of the staff and performers there. Recently, the theater announced that their beloved creative director would be leaving. This appears to be a firing. The news article about it mentioned that said director could not comment on advice of his lawyer.

The local arts community is pretty upset about this. There are planned rallies and boycotts of the theater, claiming he was wrongfully terminated and demanding he get his job back. Obviously, neither party is publicly commenting. My assumption is that it was something routine, like performance on non-artistic parts of his job — there’s nothing to indicate a scandal, and he’s a genuinely kind and good person.

My question is this — could this outpouring of public anger hurt his ability to get another job? My fear is that it will make him seem like a high risk to take on, or make a company think he’ll be vindictive if he ever left. (Or at least not willing to stop friends who are vindictive.) Or, could it potentially impact an employment case? And, is there ever any BENEFIT to this kind of outrage over a firing, at least if there’s no evidence of discrimination or illegal activity?

Oooh, that’s a really good question. I’d think the fact that other people are protesting it is unlikely to impact any legal action he pursues as long as he continues to follow his lawyer’s advice. But whether it could affect his ability to get a future job is murkier. Depending on the tenor of the protests, it’s possible that it could. At a minimum, it will certainly cause attention to his firing, which he might have otherwise been able to be more low-key about. And if a reference-checker learns, for example, that he was fired for legitimate performance issues, they might worry about how he’d handle critical feedback from them if they hired him (because no employer wants to deal with a public boycott over a fairly handled but private personnel issue). So I think it partly depends on what really happened and on whether the cause of his firing warrants the outrage or not (and also on whether the protesters have the full story, which they may not).

Even if it does warrant the public outrage, though, there are certainly employers who will see it as a risk to hire someone who was at the center of something like this, figuring that he’s more likely to rabble-rouse than someone else. He might be happy to screen out those employers though. And that might be canceled out by the employers who get more interested in him as a result of this — because they find his situation sympathetic (although it’s hard to do that when no one will say what happened) or they see it as a PR move to hire him or they just find him interesting and so are more likely to give him an interview.

2018

3. Someone at work threw away my shoes

I work as a server for a widely known corporate food chain. Last night, a friend of mine dropped off my shoes that I had previously worn a time out. And today an employee threw my shoes away and only one was recovered. $150 shoes that I had only worn once. My manager’s response was, “You should know not to leave your stuff here.” Are they responsible for this? Please help!

They’re not responsible for your shoes, but your manager should have been nicer about how she explained that to you. There’s a difference between “You should know not to leave your stuff here” and “Oh no! I would hate to lose shoes too. We can’t be responsible for items people leave here because there are just too many people coming through, but that really sucks and I’m sorry it happened.”

2015

4. My coworker uses all-caps for everything

My team recently hired a new employee to help pick up some of the slack when it comes to the admin tasks we deal with on a day-to-day basis. Our new employee (Sansa) is enthusiastic about the job, a quick learner, and well liked by everyone in our organization. Her work is also very consistent and accurate. However, she does have one habit that drives me and my counterpart absolutely mad — she prefers to TYPE IN ALL CAPS.

Now, this wouldn’t be a huge concern if it was just on internal communication (emails to staff, messages on Slack, etc.), but one of her tasks is to draft the letters and memos that go out to our clients and the public. All of the letters she drafts use templates where the writer can fill in the blank on the particulars, meaning random words will be capitalized in the middle of a paragraph. There is nothing about the details she’s entering that warrants the use of all caps (or even bold, underline, or italics). Ultimately, this means either my counterpart or I have to re-do all the work she’s just completed (defeating the point of bringing her on the team) or the letter is sent to the client looking sloppy or poorly generated by a computer.

My counterpart and I discussed this with Sansa early on. We gently questioned if Sansa prefers to write this way because it’s easier to read, hoping we could find a way to adjust her computer screen to increase the font size. She told us that it’s just her preference. I’ve even made a joke (it was appropriate in context of the conversation) about how Sansa “yells” at me through email; to which she giggled, said that’s just how she types, and that I know she’s not trying to be “shouty.” The way I see it, it is an understood rule for anyone using electronic communication THAT ALL CAPS MEANS YOU MUST BE UPSET OR YELLING OR TRYING TO DRAW ATTENTION TO THE MESSAGE.

I hope that we’re not making a bigger deal out of this situation than need be – maybe we need to hear from an outside perspective that this isn’t a big deal and we should move on. But if you think our concerns have some merit, can you offer any advice on how we can address this with Sansa? I know from reading your articles that the next step is to very directly discuss this matter with her. However, I’d hate to go into the conversation where my only defense for asking her to change is “because it’s not how you should do it” or “it looks more professional to type normally.” To me it seems like we’re trying to push our stylistic preferences on her even though our way is the conventional format. Any advice or feedback would be greatly appreciated!

This isn’t stylistic preference. If she were just doing this in internal emails, then maybe — although even then, it would be reasonable to ask her to stop because it’s harder to read. But doing this in materials that go to clients and the public? No. That’s not okay, and it’s not just a stylistic preference. It’s the same as if she’d decided to send all your materials out in white font in pink paper — you would presumably simply tell her to stop. And you need to do that here too — without the hints and the jokes — just a clear, direct “we need you to do X instead of Y.”

I suspect you feel like you can’t say that so bluntly because you’re not her manager, but actually you can! She was hired to take work off your plates, and you’re having to redo it for her. You 100% have the standing to say to her, “We do need you to stop using all caps so that our materials are consistent and professional and easier to read. Please start using standard case on everything you’re producing for clients and the public.” Then, if she gives you any more work in all-caps, tell her that you can’t use it that way and ask her to re-do it. Not only do you have the standing to say that, but I’d argue you have an obligation to say it — because right now you’re wasting your own time cleaning up her work (which your organization and your manager surely don’t want) or allowing materials to go out looking like they were created by a hostile loon (which they also surely don’t want).

Talk to her today, and enjoy the soothing feel of standard case on your eyes tomorrow.

2019

5. My employee’s boyfriend asked for my permission to marry her

The boyfriend of one of my reports recently contacted me because he said he had something important to discuss. He said he was planning on proposing to my report and wanted to get my permission before he did. I had no idea why he would ask me, and he explained that his girlfriend was raised by her mother after her father divorced her when she was pregnant and her mother only had help from her unmarried sisters and widowed mother and said I’m the closest thing she has to a father figure. My report and I have a manager/employee relationship but that’s as far as it goes. We aren’t involved in each other’s personal lives (to the point where I didn’t even know she was raised only by her mother with no involvement from her father), I can’t recall a time when we have spoken outside of work, and we have never been alone in the same room outside of the building we work in.

I certainly care about my report as much as I do everyone I work with but I have no feeling beyond that. I know she has lived with her boyfriend for a while and she has brought him to company picnics and Christmas parties before. He even showed me texts where they discussed getting married in the future and she mentions me being like a father to her and saying my blessing would be great. But to me it feels awkward and weird since I hardly know either one of them. My report has never told me she considers me like a father or attempted to have a relationship with me besides a professional manager/employee one. I want to gently let them down. How should I handle this without making the situation even more awkward than it already is? Especially since the proposal is meant to be a surprise and I don’t want to ruin it.

This is super weird.

Tell him that you think your employee is great but as her boss it’s not your place to get involved, although you wish them both much happiness.

2017

open thread – October 4, 2024

It’s the Friday open thread!

The comment section on this post is open for discussion with other readers on any work-related questions that you want to talk about (that includes school). If you want an answer from me, emailing me is still your best bet*, but this is a chance to take your questions to other readers.

* If you submitted a question to me recently, please do not repost it here, as it may be in my queue to answer.

coworkers won’t help me cut expenses, colleague owes me money, and more

I’m off for a few days. Here are some past letters that I’m making new again, rather than leaving them to wilt in the archives.

1. My coworkers won’t help me cut expenses

A few months ago we received an email from the Big Boss (head of our business unit) that we are entering a “cost cutting” exercise due to business needs and they need everyone to make efforts to ensure our costs/expenses are “as close to zero as possible.”

I’m in an internal role that doesn’t deal with contracts, purchases, software licensing, travel, etc. so there’s only a limited amount I can contribute to that cost cutting. But I’ve done what I can — e.g. I walked five miles with heavy equipment rather than take public transport which the others did. I “forgot” to claim for overtime payments that I should/could have claimed (not in U.S. so those laws don’t apply), didn’t claim mileage for driving two hours out of my way multiple times, etc. It’s galling every month the department admin sends out the emails asking for “overtime forms” and “travel expenses” and I know I have a lot I could claim and don’t.

We have to work late a couple of times a month due to client deadlines (the company usually orders food in) and I’ve gone on “hunger strike” conspicuously refusing to eat or order, and working through while others eat the company-paid pizzas, etc. (we know in advance when we’ll have to stay late – why didn’t they bring their own food?!) because I don’t believe that’s a legit business expense. I’ve tried to convince the others but without success.

I’ve now asked to reduce my retirement contributions (matched by the company) which will save them thousands a year. I’ve indicated to HR that I want to opt out of the healthcare insurance at the next renewal date.

I’ve done pretty much everything I can at this point other than asking for a pay cut (which I could — I’m senior, single and have enough money but I realize this could affect my prospects in the future) but I’m becoming more and more resentful of coworkers who haven’t even considered the things I’ve done. They still submit overtime, travel expenses, etc. At some point we all have to pull together but I feel like I’m the only one pulling.

Whoa, you are making way too many sacrifices here. You should not be walking five miles with heavy equipment or not getting paid for time you worked, and conspicuously not having a slice of pizza isn’t going to make any practical difference. As for reducing your retirement contributions and opting out of health insurance (!!) — NO. Is it too late to undo that?

“Help us cut costs” means “watch for extraneous spending and be frugal with business expenses.” It does not mean “take on great personal sacrifice for the benefit of a company someone else owns.” What you are doing is way beyond the realm of anything that would be expected, some of it won’t even matter (the hunger strike), and the rest of it is so extreme as to be entering the realm of the absurd unless this is your own personal business and you get all the profits.

You should of course respect requests to watch expenses, but it’s actually not helpful to do what you’re doing because it creates a false idea of what various projects cost. It’s also going to look incredibly weird to your coworkers, especially when you pressure them to join you, to the point that it could reflect on your judgment long after this is over.

Leave your retirement account and your health care alone. Submit for the money that you’re owed. Quit the hunger strikes. Be responsible with expenses, and leave it there.

2019

Read an update to this letter here.

2. Inviting all coworkers except one to a personal party

I’m the manager of a small retail team, there are nine of us including myself, and we mostly get on really well. Recently we were struggling as we were understaffed and couldn’t find anyone suitable, so I took on the best candidate that had applied, let’s call her Sam. Even though she was far from ideal, we were really that desperate.

Although Sam’s performance hasn’t been great and she hasn’t integrated into the team at all, that’s not why I’m writing. Another of my team, Cat, has recently got engaged and is throwing an engagement party with her fiancé. Cat is excellent at her job, is well liked by everyone, and would like to invite the team, except for the fact that she cannot stand Sam and doesn’t want her there. I have a feeling I already know the answer, but is there a way to invite all but one of the team? (This isn’t a work event. It’s a personal event, but she’ll probably give out the invites when she sees us at work.)

Because it’s Cat’s own personal event outside of work, you can’t dictate who she does and doesn’t invite. But inviting everyone but one person is a pretty unkind act, and it has the potential to be a toxic act, by making Sam feel clearly excluded and making others feel that excluding Sam is now a thing that happens.

While Cat can invite anyone she wants to her private event and you can’t control that, you do have standing to point out the problem to her and ask her to consider handling it differently. You could, for example, say something to her like, “Inviting the entire team except one person is exclusionary and is the sort of thing that could impact the team dynamics here in a negative way. It will look like you deliberately singled out Sam, and that’s unkind, even if you don’t intend it that way. I’d ask you to take that into account when deciding how to handle your invitations.” And certainly if she proceeds with her plan, you can tell her she needs to keep it out of the office.

2018

3. My rude coworker owes me money and won’t pay me back

A coworker owes me a not insignificant sum of money and won’t pay me back. I realize it’s not wise to lend money to your coworkers but our situation was a little different in that I haven’t technically given her anything directly. Let me explain.

One of our office mates (we share an office with four other people) was celebrating a major professional accomplishment and invited us all over to her house. The Rude Coworker suggested we all spring for a nice gift for her and suggested a sum each of us should pay. I won’t give you the dollar amount since we’re not in the U.S., but it was about a week’s worth of groceries per person. It was quite a lot for my budget but I wanted to be a good friend to my friend, the celebrating coworker, and so I agreed. So the four of us agreed on a gift, and it so happened that it was available in an online store I have an account with, so I was the one who ended up ordering it. The other two coworkers paid me back immediately but the Rude Coworker didn’t. I asked her twice about it. The first time she said she didn’t have any money. I suggested she could pay me back with her next paycheck but we have since been paid, and still nothing. I asked her a second time and she said she didn’t have the money, in a bored and dismissive tone of voice. For context, she is well paid, wearing designer clothes and going on fancy vacations. She also buys takeout coffee every day. We are peers but because she’s so abrasive and at times bully-ish that most of our colleagues walk on tiptoes around her.

How do I get my money back? We do not really have a manager — we are all professionals who technically report to a coordinator but are left alone to do our work 99% of the time. I could really use the money right now, and it makes me really angry to essentially have to beg her to do the right thing.

Ugh, she’s being horrible. It’s possible that you may not get your money back because there’s no way to force her to pay you, but you can up your chances by being even more direct. Instead of just asking her for the money, say something like this: “Jane, that money was a week’s worth of groceries for me. I need you to pay me back as you agreed. Can you Venmo me right now?” If she says she can’t, then say, “I really need the money paid back; I have bills I need to pay. Can you pay it tomorrow?” And then you have this conversation with her every single day until she pays you back. There’s a decent chance that she’ll get sick enough of having to talk about it that she will, in fact, pay you back. (Right now, I think you’re using too light of a touch for the situation. You need to follow up on it every day; make it uncomfortable for her not to pay you back.)

If that doesn’t work, you can also try enlisting your other coworkers in shaming her. If all three of you sit down with her and say, “We agreed to each pay $X for a group gift, and Jane, we still need your contribution — it’s really unfair to stick to Miranda with the bill for your share,” she may be sufficiently shamed to actually pay you.

Jane sucks.

Read an update to this letter here.

2018

4. Explaining religious Plain Dress in a job interview

I have a question about interviews and my unusual clothing. I’m a member of a church that practices Plain Dress (think Amish or Old Order Mennonites). However, I’m interviewing for jobs where my clothing stands out. Most people have only seen Plain Dress during the obligatory Amish episode of their favorite TV series, and have a lot of wildly inaccurate ideas regarding people who dress like me.

Because of my beliefs, I won’t be showing up in traditional interview clothing, but my clothing is still businesslike. I’m worried that some will think I’m just dressed down. I also wear a hat, which I don’t remove. Do you have any suggestions for diffusing the situation without coming across as a “religious nutter”?

I’m actually not so concerned about you needing to explain your clothing, which still reads as fairly conservative. It’s the hat that I think you might need to explain, since it will stay on during the interview. For that, I think you could simply say, “I leave my hat on for religious reasons,” and that should be enough. Even if people aren’t familiar with Plain Dress in particular, they’re probably familiar with the idea of religious head coverings, and I think you should be fine from there.

And I don’t think you have to worry about the “religious nutter” thing. People will usually take their cues from you, and if you’re low-key and matter-of-fact about it, it shouldn’t be a big deal.

Read an update to this letter here.

2017

my coworker is setting toilet paper on fire in the bathroom

I’m off for a few days, so here’s an older post from the archives. This was originally published in 2019.

A reader writes:

I work in a small office (about 20 people at this branch of our company) and we have two individual restrooms (as opposed to stalls) in our central hallway. There is certainly a smell situation because the hallway leads to all major sections of the office, but in general, people try to control this with air fresheners, PooPourri products, etc. Sometimes a book of matches is left there, which seems to help the most.

In the last few months, however, a coworker has begun to — from what we can best understand — light clumps of toilet paper on fire, throw the burning toilet paper into the toilet, and flush. Ashes often skitter down the hallway, like smoky tumbleweeds. The whole office begins to smell like a poop barbeque. This has begun happening at least twice a week, often more.

Now, I thought people understood that matches work to mask odor because of the sulfur released, not because of the fire. Clearly, this individual does not realize this. We all know who it is, because he’s one of the few smokers (i.e., carries around a lighter) and also has been seen walking away as the ashes go flying.

I have asked my boss (not this person’s direct boss) to speak to him, but he deflects and says we don’t actually have proof, and nothing wrong has technically happened yet. This person’s actual boss is the least confrontational person in our company, so I know he won’t do anything either. My boss said, “We’d have to email the whole company and ask them to stop lighting toilet paper on fire,” and I said, “That’s fine! It’s dangerous and disgusting! Explain the science of matches to them!” but my boss keeps deflecting.

Do I need to just let this go, or should I continue pushing my boss to do something? I’m seriously worried this person is going to accidentally set our building on fire from the bathroom out.

I am picturing your coworker striding out of the bathroom with smoke and ashes billowing around him as strobe lights flash and Metallica plays.

It is magnificent.

But only because I do not smell the poop barbecue.

I don’t see any reason you can’t just say something to this guy directly the next time you see him emerging from the bathroom in a cloud of ash. Like, it’s totally reasonable that you might comment on that! In some ways, it’s actually weirder not to say anything when you see that.

You could say, “Holy crap, did you light something on fire in there?” or “Whoa, are you okay? What’s with all this smoke and ash?” … followed by, after whatever weird response he gives you, “You’re not actually lighting anything on fire in there, are you? That would be dangerous. The matches aren’t intended to start fires, they’re just supposed to be lit and immediately blown out.”

Your boss’s reluctance to address this in any way is weird. You don’t need “proof” to say to someone, “Hey, are you setting toilet paper on fire in the bathroom? Please don’t do that if so; it’s dangerous.” (And this wouldn’t be based on just a hunch; you have seen the ashes.)

In many offices, if you hadn’t already talked to your boss about this and explicitly been told that he doesn’t want something sent to the staff email list, you could have just sent that message yourself (assuming your office is small enough that it wouldn’t have been bizarre for it to come from you rather than an official facilities spokesperson or so forth). But now that your boss has vetoed it, that’s more complicated.

Really, though, if no one around you is willing to take this on, you can just say something to the guy yourself.