updates: thermostat wars, the admin work, and more

It’s “where are you now?” month at Ask a Manager, and all December I’m running updates from people who had their letters here answered in the past. Here are three updates from past letter-writers.

1. Space heaters and thermostat wars

One thing I failed to mention in my original post is that I own the office building as well, so I get to set these perimeters on space heaters as both employer and building owner. The space heater is not disallowed by my building rules (but perhaps should be).

The space heater she uses is very small and does have the safety feature of turning off when tipped over. I am also the last to leave the office every night, so I make sure everything is off (which I’ve never had a problem with her turning it off before leaving). Her space is an office size of about 9×10 or so with 8’ ceilings, so fairly contained. Her office, though, is also attached to my office by a doorway. The heat traveling is definitely a matter of the office configuration.

The building’s thermostat sits on the wall just outside her office. While the heater is heating the space and traveling out of her office, it is also creating a constant use of the AC because of the thermostat reading (which was raising the electric bill while still not cooling adequately).

What I also failed to mention was that during the summer months, she kept her air vent closed in this space so there was no air (cold air) pumping in this space, making it even warmer and more humid. After this post, I discussed the concern over the office temperature with her and that she was the only one that needed the extra warmth (considering it was a sweltering 100 degrees most of the summer), so I would like her to close her doors when using the heater. Although I believe I was very direct but gentle in this request, my request went unanswered and the heater remained running with the doors open, presumably because if I was in another room besides my office, she felt it didn’t affect me while it was running. I would walk back in my office to a rainforest and she would then shut off the heater (as if it was only while it was running that bothered me).

I then had to have a more direct conversation that if that heater was running at any point, the doors absolutely must be shut. I explained the problem lies in the warmth traveling through the office that no one else wanted, as well as the fact she was creating a much warmer area directly in contact with the thermostat, making the AC unit run constantly and the bill going up. She mentioned she understood, and she would be bringing a warm blanket to wrap up in. I don’t mind a blanket at all, although I’m very concerned there is something wrong with her health if it is that severe she needs a blanket when it is 74 degrees. At the direct approach of explaining the effects on the rest of us – both our comfort and my pocketbook – I believe she took that to heart. She began closing her doors at all times when it is running, so the issue is only a small problem when she opens the doors and heat quickly billows out or when we have to go in there and do something that takes longer than 2 minutes while enduring the sauna.

Although now that it is freezing temps outside, she’s still not dressing appropriately warm. I believe that bothers me the most because the issue could be resolved in a very normal way that doesn’t affect anyone else. I have found I am strangely uncomfortable discussing her wardrobe and telling her to wear more clothes. One comment mentioned a rule that additional layers must be added before turning on the space heater. Is that acceptable to require? I do want to mention that just today she finally brought in the blanket she mentioned, so I have high hopes we are making progress!

2. I can’t get out of low-level admin work

Thank you so much for answering my question, and to all the commenters who chimed in! Seeing my letter published gave me the nudge I needed to start looking for jobs. I’ve been avoiding applying for any job that seems like a lateral move or has too much admin work since I don’t want to end up in the same situation again. And because I actually want to use my skills! I wish I had a nicer update, but … I am seven months into my job search and still looking. I’ve applied to about 70 jobs at this point, interviewed with many great companies, gotten second and third interviews, but no offers. I admit I definitely didn’t expect this to take so long.

I’m applying for jobs that usually say they require 3-6 years of experience in the field (I have 6 or 7) and require software skills that I have, so as far as I can tell I feel qualified for what I’m applying to. (Though I have had two different interviewers act surprised and annoyed when I didn’t have web design experience, even though I didn’t claim to have experience in that and the job description didn’t mention that – the job description for both specified graphic design experience, which I do have, so it seems those hiring managers must have thought web coding and graphic design were interchangeable phrases?) I’ve also had two experiences now where I’ve made it to the end of an interview process only for them to tell me they’re pausing the hiring process for the foreseeable future but will let me know if/when they can proceed. I’ve asked a few interviewers for feedback after a rejection and haven’t gotten anything specific, just a couple generic “we hired someone with more experience,” and I’ve been told before that I interview well so I’m not terribly concerned about that, but it’s still hard not to doubt myself at this point. For now, I’m forging on with my search, but I’m also considering whether I need to take a class or start a certificate program in my field if I don’t find something soon.

As for my current job … my boss is kind of a tyrannical mess, so I haven’t talked to her any further about taking on additional responsibilities or what it takes to get promoted. If it helps explain anything, I related so strongly when this letter about a hyper-critical boss was published a few months ago. There’s not much productive conversation with a boss like that. Also of note: another manager recently had to tell my boss that yelling at her direct reports is not a good way to motivate them. (She disagreed.) Unsurprisingly, my motivation is practically non-existent at this point. She’s great at creating baseless drama so I’m just trying to keep a reasonable amount of peace until I can leave.

I remain so grateful to AAM for all the encouragement in this long process. Onward march!

Update to the update:

After almost nine months of job searching, I finally received a job offer that is 1) in an industry I’m passionate about, 2) a step up for me and a good fit for my skills — a mix of things I have experience in and some new-to-me things that I want to learn, 3) has good pay and somehow good benefits … and I happily accepted the offer yesterday and put in my two weeks. But the reason I’m writing this update isn’t even just because of that good news, but because I wanted to share that I successfully negotiated for more vacation time, something I never knew was an option until I read AAM. So thanks, Alison, for publishing letters about how to negotiate — and specifically negotiating more time off!

For context, the only downside of this job offer was that they were starting me off with a week less vacation time than what I currently have. I wrote back and explained how much vacation time I have now, and asked if, based on the experience I’m bringing to the role, they could start me at the amount of vacation time that employees receive after one year of employment, which would have been the middle between how much I have now and what the original offer was. I was afraid to high-ball them since I didn’t want them to pull away all together … but to my very pleasant surprise they responded quickly to say they were happy to match the amount of vacation time I currently have — more than what I asked for! I think it also helped my case that they told me the salary was set and non-negotiable (due to the position being funded by a grant), which they were kindly apologetic about. In general they’ve been very kind and flexible with me in the hiring process and I’m incredibly grateful. It’s already been a breath of fresh air and I have reason to hope things will be better there.

I’m not sure which I’m more excited about – starting my new job or leaving my current job… :)

3. I deeply regret joining my company’s leadership program (#2 at the link)

The short update is, I stuck it out, it blessedly ended, and regained my normal job that I really like.

The long update is, that hearing from you and from comments that I wasn’t doomed to the mailroom if I didn’t do this actually helped me put it in perspective. I definitely needed to get that confirmation that the pants were bananas full of bees. I reevaluated how much time and emotion I was putting into the project, and worked on treating it proportionally to its level of importance. I ended up really impressing some people with my actual contribution to the final product. I made connections in other departments that have been valuable. I was honest in feedback about the experience and found I was in the majority regarding this years cohort, so much so that the future structure is being evaluated. I wouldn’t do it again but I’m proud that I did it and broke my pattern of running from stressors.

Thanks for your support and reassurance, that paradoxically inspired me to get through. My reviews and supervisor check-ins continue to be great and my personal life and wellbeing are back on track.

how to write an out-of-office message

With so many people on vacation right now, it’s time to consider the humble out-of-office message … because there are some really weird ones out there.

Some out-of-office messages offer far too much personal information; your colleagues do not need to know that you’re out for fertility testing or dealing with a particularly terrible bout of diarrhea or on a staycation to recover from burn-out. Other away messages are excessively complicated, listing a dozen different people to contact for various item in the person’s absence. Still others radiate such obvious delight about not being at work that recipients end up wondering if the sender will ever return.

At New York Magazine today, I wrote about what a good out-of-office message does and doesn’t look like. Head over there to read it.

update: I wrote a Glassdoor review and the employer is losing their minds

It’s “where are you now?” month at Ask a Manager, and all December I’m running updates from people who had their letters here answered in the past.

Remember the letter-writer who wrote a Glassdoor review and their former employer was losing their minds? Here’s the update.

I just wanted to say thank you for publishing my letter. I really appreciate it, as well as the advice you gave and the commenters.

I didn’t write the Glassdoor and Indeed reviews out of malice or ill will, I wrote it because this company is genuinely challenging to work with. In my original letter I didn’t even disclose other more ridiculous things that happened at that workplace, such as the fact that leadership would disclose to their employee “inner circle” things they definitely should NOT disclose, such as which employees were on PIPs (!) and even topics like which employees were struggling with things like marriage issues. The company’s leadership has also been vindictive to people who have left the company on platforms like LinkedIn and Facebook, directly asking them why they left and interrogating them with questions like “you think you’re too good for us now?” (which is something I was a direct recipient of when I left). I swear, it’s like a soap opera. My spouse and I used to joke that it was like Days Of Our Lives. It’s a shame because I loved the work that I did there but the drama and immaturity of the leadership was too much and the lack of opportunities for advancement led to me to seek other employment. I feel like it was such an unprofessional workplace. In hindsight, it was a good career “stepping stone” but I am in a MUCH better place now. I don’t even know how that place still functions, and given how transparent the leadership is on social media (a friend sent me a screenshot from the CEO, who made a post the other day on a social media platform about how much she hates being a CEO!!!) it seems like the workplace is hanging on by a thread anyway.

Thank you and the commenters for the reassuring words regarding that I didn’t do anything wrong, and rather that my previous employer’s antics regarding the witch hunt were wrong. I had multiple moments where I was seriously considering contacting those services to take the review down or delete the review, but I’m holding firm — the review is staying up.

While I still do feel a little bit weird that my reviews caused some internal chaos, the positive that’s come out of this is that many of my friends who worked there have had enough. The witch hunt was the final straw of a bale of hay that was already breaking the camel’s back. Four out of the five friends that have worked directly with me have received new positions elsewhere AND have left their own reviews of the company, with similar commentary. The remaining one is somewhat holding out for a leadership position — one whose job description she even wrote! — although leadership has repeatedly told her that they’re not going to promote her because they do not feel that she is qualified to lead. We’re all going to be working with her later this week to spruce up her resume, tidy up her LinkedIn, and take her out for a “you can do this!!” brunch so she can hit the job market.

Again, I appreciate the kind words and advice!

coworker has her husband on video chat all day long, manager told me to stop wearing see-through blouses, and more

I’m on vacation. Here are some past letters that I’m making new again, rather than leaving them to wilt in the archives.

1. My coworker has her husband on video chat all day long

I work for a religious organization, and I am having a hard time because my coworker is always on a secret video chat with her husband during work hours. He can see her or us any time we are around, and he has his camera covered so we won’t see him. Her phone is always propped up and he can hear us and all of the confidential information we work with. It makes me uncomfortable and it makes me feel unsafe.

I don’t think my manager knows. She’s seen her cellphone out on her desk, but my coworker is very vigilant when she is around and she closes the app.

We do have office security cameras, which we are all aware of, and there are notices posted everywhere for them. I do not know how to talk to my coworker about it. Please help.

You can start with your coworker if you want, but really, this is problematic enough that I’d go straight to your manager.

If you want to start with your coworker, you could just say, “Jane, I don’t feel comfortable having your husband hear and see me all day while I’m working, and overhearing confidential information. Could you stop leaving him on video chat all day long like that?”

But really, skip that and go to your boss — both because it’s worth escalating and because you’re going to have to do that anyway if your coworker refuses. To your boss, you can say, “I’m concerned that Jane has her husband on video chat literally all day long, which means that he can hear and see anything the rest of us do, including hearing confidential information that might be discussed. I’ve noticed she quickly closes the app when you’re around, and I figured it’s something you’d want to be aware of.”

2018

2. My manager told me to stop wearing see-through blouses

I’m a secretary in a office. I’ve been asked not to wear tight-fitting skirts and see-through blouses to work because you can see my bra and it’s distracting my coworkers. They are blouses you wear to the office; the fabric is silky polyester. To be honest, I like the feel and look of them against my skin and feel sexy wearing them, and my friends in another department wear them with no problem. Yes, my bra shows, but it’s nothing outrageous. Can one individual manager tell you this?

Yes.

It’s totally reasonable to tell you that you need to come to work dressed professionally and without your underwear showing. If another manager chooses not to enforce that with their team, that’s that person’s call — but your manager is absolutely entitled to set this standard and enforce it. And once that has happened, refusing to comply is a pretty big deal.

For what it’s worth, it’s generally better for your career if you strive to feel professional at work, not sexy.

2014

3. Coworker keeps showing up at meetings she’s not invited to

Our local office consists of only 10 employees, mainly software developers. Our office is not too big and the front conference room, where most meetings are held, is the only way to exit the office. So, people occasionally will walk past a meeting taking place to exit the office. That is fine. However, one employee here regularly walks into a meeting in progress and stands there or sits down and begins to listen, occasionally giving comments. All of our meetings are scheduled in Outlook with the proper people officially invited. How should I approach this person and ask them to stop inviting themselves to meetings that they should not be a part of (has not received an official invite)?

I am a manager, but this person is under another manager (who is at the same level as me).But I’m also the office manager as well, so somewhat responsible for everyone in this office from that point of view.

That’s rude! And weirdly out of touch with how meetings generally work.

The next time she starts lurking in a meeting that she wasn’t invited to, stop the meeting and say, “We’re in the middle of a meeting. Did you need one of us?” If she says she just thought she’d join in, then you can say, “Oh, this meeting is just managers” (or “just the people working on the X project” or “just the four of us” or whatever). If doing that a couple of times doesn’t solve the problem, talk to her manager about it and ask her to put a stop to it.

2018

4. Can I use the same answers in multiple interviews?

I have recently completed interviews for a couple different companies where the group of interviewees are rotated between 5-7 different interviewers for 30-45-minute interview sessions. Many of the questions that are asked either exactly the same or similar. Is it better to have different answers to the same question or is it more effective to use the same scenario so that you are consistent. I am aware that the interviewers discuss the applicants right after we leave. How in depth does it actually get?

Well, you want to be consistent in the substance of your answers, but it’s fine to use different examples to illustrate them. For instance, you obviously don’t want to give each person a different explanation for your interest in the job, or tell each person a different “greatest strength,” but it’s completely fine to draw on different examples as you discuss your past experience.

Discussion of applicants afterwards rarely comes down to a question-by-question comparison; it tends to be more along the lines of “I really liked her experience with ____, and I got the sense that she has a pattern of getting things done that someone else in her role might not have” … or “I don’t think her critical thinking skills are strong enough for this role” … and so forth.

2010

what does “polished” mean in job postings, I’m not allowed to bring in food to share if I don’t bring enough for everyone, and more

I’m on vacation. Here are some past letters that I’m making new again, rather than leaving them to wilt in the archives.

1. What does “polished” mean in job postings?

I’m office temping and looking for a full-time job. I was at first focusing on nonprofits, but after some great experiences temping in the corporate world, I’m expanding my search. Every now and then I see in a listing that they’re look for a “polished” assistant.

The first time I saw this, it was for work with a luxury brand, and I immediately imagined a conventionally attractive woman with sleek hair and freshly manicured nails. I suspected that luxury brand work was not for me — I dress tidily and professionally, but don’t want to work someplace where the tweezedness of my brows might come under scrutiny.

Now I’ve been temping someplace a month, and one of their temp-to-term postings also used that word. I know this company isn’t like that — they’re corporate, but clearly not judging admins on pore size or whatever. So: what does “polish” mean? How is it different from “professional?”

Sometimes “polished” does mean what you’re envisioning — a particularly high level of attention to grooming, clothing, and physical presentation.

But often it is used to mean a high level of professionalism — for example, that you’re going to handle even difficult callers smoothly, that you’re not going stand in a VP’s office fumbling through papers for five minutes rather saying “let me find that for you and I’ll bring it right back,” that you’re going to greet visitors warmly even when you’re feeling harried, that you’re not going to complain about work while you’re at the front desk, that you can competently juggle multiple things without getting flustered … overall, that you’re going to be highly competent, make the job look easy and be a calming presence in the office rather than a stressful or chaotic one, and not need coaching on professionalism.

2016

2. I’m not allowed to bring in food to share if I don’t bring enough for everyone

For over 10 years, I’ve prepared lunches and set up a table with food to share with my shift. Everyone is happy! I sent a batch of cookies with my husband, telling him to make sure three people got some for sure and that I didn’t care who had the rest. A person or two who didn’t get some of whatever I brought complained to HR that they felt excluded. I was shocked that they would do that. Moreover, I was shocked that management would intervene. They said if I couldn’t make enough to feed everyone, I wasn’t allowed to bring food in.

There are no rules on this in the handbook, but other departments bring in food for their department. The supervisor who told me that was carrying out a dish at the end of the day. I asked had he brought enough for everyone, and he was very angry. That is discrimination, is it not?

Not in the legal sense, no. Illegal discrimination must be based on race, sex, religion, disability, or another protected class; simply treating people differently when those elements aren’t a factor isn’t illegal.

But assuming that you are working with adults and not children, it’s pretty silly of your company to try to manage who you bring in food for. And it’s incredibly silly that some of your coworkers complained to HR (!) about not getting the food. But your company does indeed have the right to do silly things like this if they want to.

2016

3. Having a parent call in sick for you

Recently, I caught a virus and totally lost my voice, to the point where my mom had to come to the doctor’s office with me to help explain some of my other symptoms (I still live at home, so she knew what my other symptoms were). Thankfully, this occurred over the weekend and I was able to return to work on Monday.

However, I have to ask: How bad would it have been if my mom called me in sick? My voice was gone to the point that you couldn’t hear me talking in person, and it would have been impossible to hear me over the phone. Due to the nature of my job, neither I nor my boss have work emails, and I don’t feel comfortable sending a text to let her know I wouldn’t be able to make it (I’d be afraid that she wouldn’t see it).

This is one of the very few situations where it would be okay to have your parent call in sick for you. You literally couldn’t make the call yourself, so someone else would have needed to relay the information on your behalf. She wouldn’t have been doing that as “your mom” but as “a person aware of the situation and able to communicate when you were not.” (You’d want to have ensured that she made it clear she was calling because you literally had no voice, not just because she was your mom and taking care of you.)

2019

4. My office book club always starts really late

About 20 or so employees in various departments at the company I work at belong to a book club. All employees regardless of position can join and they only need to commit to attending a week in advance. We read a book a month and get together on the final Sunday morning of each month at a diner for brunch where we talk about the books. I think it is a good way to build camaraderie in the workplace and partake in an enlightening hobby together.

My problem is that about 40% of the people who agree to come on any given week show up at least 30 minutes late (sometimes over 45). Last time, I was stuck sitting in the parking lot for over an hour, first because one person showed up 40 minutes late, then because we had to wait 20 minutes for the diner to set a large table.

I am upset about this. I posted on the group’s Facebook page that it was not respectful of my time to show up so late after having agreed to come at 10 a.m. The facilitators of the group privately agreed with me but they refuse to go ahead and eat until without waiting for the late coworkers. My best friend, who has less patience than I do, said she would have left after waiting 10 minutes. I am afraid that doing so would create a lot of tension at work, but it would stop my time from being wasted. What do you think?

I think you are in a book club with people who don’t arrive on time, at least not on Sunday mornings, and that if the facilitators aren’t willing to do anything about that, there’s not much you can do yourself. You could try raising it with the group (in person at the next meeting, not over Facebook) and ask if people have ideas to address it — for example, is 10 a.m. too early for people, would it be better to do it over lunch during a workday, etc.?

But if that doesn’t solve it, then … well, this is a group of people who want to to get together but aren’t going to commit to a rigid start time. Some people prefer a more relaxed gathering, and that might be this group. If that’s the case, then you’ve got to decide if you still want to participate, knowing that people take the start time very loosely. If you do, then you might decide to start coming late yourself, or just expect it’ll start late and bring a book to occupy yourself while you wait, or even see if the on-time people want to branch off into a separate wing of the group.

2018

Read an update to this letter here.

it’s your Friday good news

It’s your Friday good news!

1.  “I’ve been an AAM reader since at least 2009. In the intervening years, I was laid off in the Great Recession, floundered in Unemployment Land for almost two years, took a series of low-wage jobs, went back to school, finished my bachelor’s and got a master’s, and embarked on a new career.

Thanks to the advice I’ve read on AAM over the years, I have learned that not only should I negotiate, but that I was expected to negotiate salary and benefits. I also learned that it was okay to apply for stretch roles, because that’s what men have been doing all along. And I internalized the concept that interviews are a two-way street; like, for real, I need to make sure that I’m a good fit or both the company and I will be miserable and disappointed.

Since I’ve graduated, I accepted three jobs, each one better than the previous one. The highest-paying one was a house full of evil bees, though, so I again got to practice everything I’ve learned on the site during the offer stage of the next job I took. I was able to increase my salary by $10,000. And, the following year, when I figured out that “merit” increases at the new company were really just [sub-par] COLAs, I negotiated for an extra week of PTO, something the company normally only awards after half a decade of employment.

Recently, that second job’s new CEO forced everyone back into the office Mon-Thu, and took away all flexibility in WFH, even flexibility in things that existed pre-pandemic like letting parents leave early to pick up their kids and then logging in from home to wrap up the last couple of hours of work. All authority regarding work location and hours was stripped from management and handed to HR.

So I started job searching, knowing I was interviewing from a position of strength: I’m damned good at what I do and I could take my time finding the right role. I may not have liked the new policies, but I still had a decent paycheck with good benefits.

In the end, I had two companies — one fully remote, one a 3/2 hybrid — bidding against each other (though they didn’t know that). I just kept pushing back on each thing they both presented to me in the offer stage. (“I’ve been interviewing for 100% remote roles that pay the same as what you’ve offered; I can’t see myself driving into an office three days a week for the same pay as staying at home.” … “I understand that you’re at the top of the pay band I’d be in, but surely there’s some other piece of the offer that can be adjusted?” … “Your benefits are more expensive than what I currently have and what I’ve seen from the other companies I’m interviewing with. We’ll need to come up in salary to bridge that gap.”)

I ended up getting the fully-remote company to go even higher in salary than the 3/2 hybrid company, giving me a 35% increase over what I was making at the company with the backwards-thinking CEO.

I just did the numbers and figured out that I’ve increased my pay by 66% since that first job at House of Evil Bees back in May of 2019. If I’d stayed there and had only received the typical corporate annual increase of 4%, I’d be making $87,000 now. Instead, my annual salary will be $125,000 when I start my new job. I realize that’s small potatoes for a lot of people, but it’s “OMG” money for me.”

2.  “I’m a long-time reader, and have always been jealous to see other people posting about finding a way out of their Hellmouth jobs.

I left my Hellmouth in December of 2019 for what appeared to be a better opportunity. The new company was toxic, to say the least, and nepotism was rampant. We all know what happened three months later, and who was one of the first people they laid off? The person who spearheaded all the onsite pandemic safety measures, while the higher ups worked from home.

I landed back on my feet a couple months later by taking a chance on a contract position, which quickly became a full-time hire. My new boss was awesome; the president of the company, not so much. Co-opted onto the leadership team six months later (after they fired the President), it quickly became apparent the company was in dire financial straits. I made it through four rounds of layoffs before my position was eliminated.

After job hunting for a month, it quickly became clear there were limited decent-paying positions in my field in my area. I ended up boomeranging back to Hellmouth, only to find all the assurances of how things had changed were untrue — they just got better at hiding it. After a year, I couldn’t stand it anymore and started looking again.

I was scrolling through job postings, and one caught my eye that was an interesting conjunction between my career and one of my research passions. I took a chance and applied. Three months later, and I will be putting in my notice at Hellmouth! My offer almost doubled my current salary, and I get to live somewhere I have always wanted to see. I would have never taken a chance on this if it hadn’t been for reading Ask A Manager and learning how to advocate for myself. I never thought I would ever be able to share some Friday Good News, but please know, those of you who are reading this, Hellmouth is not forever!”

3.  “Your advice saved me a lot of stress/embarrassment recently, and I am so grateful for that. I have been slightly considering leaving my current role, so when a fantastic old manager reached out with a good opportunity, I jumped on it. The job description was basically written for me. I was so excited!

The interview process went smoothly and very quickly, and I was just waiting on the offer before telling my boss. I felt terrible about not telling her, but I kept thinking of your warnings not to, that it was just business to not give more than two weeks, and stayed quiet.

Well, it turned out that the job fell through because of a frustrating reason I won’t get into, but it just wasn’t possible. My old manager tried to get me approved anyway but it wasn’t happening.

While I am disappointed, I do still like my current job well enough, and I’m so glad I listened to your advice and didn’t jump the gun. A sure thing really isn’t a sure thing until you have a concrete offer. Lesson confirmed!”

open thread – December 22-23, 2023

It’s the Friday open thread!

The comment section on this post is open for discussion with other readers on any work-related questions that you want to talk about (that includes school). If you want an answer from me, emailing me is still your best bet*, but this is a chance to take your questions to other readers.

* If you submitted a question to me recently, please do not repost it here, as it may be in my queue to answer.

manager says my raise means my coworkers won’t get raises, colleague lies about attending meetings, and more

I’m on vacation. Here are some past letters that I’m making new again, rather than leaving them to wilt in the archives.

1. Manager says if I get a raise, fewer of my coworkers will get raises

I have a salary that’s presumably on the higher end of non-management in the department I’m in. I also have about a decade or more development experience than those I work with, so my spot in the range seems justified.

What’s your opinion when a manager says “You’re near the top of the range. If we give you a raise then that means fewer of your coworkers can get raises too,” as a reason for me not getting a year-end raise?

Part of me thinks it’s fair and makes sense, but part of me thinks that my employers defined my salary to fit my experience, and I shouldn’t be penalized for what I’m being paid because it’s in line with what I bring to the table.

That response from your employer is manipulative, whether intentionally or unintentionally so. They’re distracting you from the question of what’s a fair salary for your work and raising the specter of taking money from your coworkers. It’s entirely reasonable for you to ask to be paid a salary that’s commensurate with your value and the market price for your skills; it’s not reasonable for them to make their ability to pay your coworkers your problems.

I’d ignore their statement entirely and bring the focus back to what your work is worth. If they bring up the coworker thing again, say this: “I can’t speak to that, but I think my work is worth $X because ____.”

2015

2. My coworker is lying about attending meetings

I am a director in a big company (meaning there are lots of managers with that title). My fellow coworker, who is also a director in my unit, is supposed to attend a weekly meeting on marketing and report back to our staff. I have noticed that this director really couldn’t answer many of my questions about the marketing meetings when I would follow up with her reports. I met with the head of Marketing to get some specific questions answered regarding a project I was working on. The head of Marketing told me that no one from our unit has attended the weekly meetings in six months.

The head of marketing said they weren’t in a position to reach out unless it started hurting others peoples work. I encouraged them to reach out to her supervisors — but nothing yet. I even thought it may have something to do with my coworker’s team being cut and her being too busy. I offered to attend a few weeks if she couldn’t make it. She told me to my face she goes every week and doesn’t need me to jump in.

I don’t want to make a big stink and it isn’t hurting our day to day work — yet. But should I confront my coworker or bring this to our supervisor?

Since your coworker has already lied to your face about this, explaining to her that you know she’s lying and hasn’t actually gone to the meetings risks introducing tension into your relationship that you might rather not deal with. If that’s the case, I think you’re perfectly in the clear to go straight to your manager. You’d want to keep the focus on work impact — as in, “Jane told me that no one from our unit has attended the weekly marketing meetings in six months. I’d thought it was Tangerina’s responsibility so I checked with her — but she told me she’s been going. I have to say that I don’t think she has been — based both on what Jane said and on the fact that I haven’t been able to get any of my questions about the marketing meetings answered. We do need someone going to those, so what’s the best way to proceed?”

But if you’d rather start with your coworker, you could say it this way: “I think there’s been a miscommunication somewhere. Jane says no one from our unit has attended the marketing meetings in six months. I’m not sure what to do to get answers when I have questions come up about stuff that’s been covered in those meetings.” (But I think it’s highly likely that your coworker will get defensive — she’s being called out on a flagrant lie — so you’ll probably have better luck talking to your boss instead.)

2017

3. Explaining I was fired for ethical disobedience

I’m a college student, hopefully graduating in May. I’m in the middle of job applications, and there’s one issue I’m not sure how to handle. I was fired from a previous job for ethical disobedience. It made actual international news and is easy to find on Google (here’s an article about it), particularly since I have an uncommon name. I’m not embarrassed about what I did, but I’m concerned about what employers will think. On the one hand, that episode demonstrates my dedication to ethical behavior, on the other, it shows that I’m willing to disobey my boss if I think what they’re asking me to do is morally wrong and go to the press about it. How can I best explain this to possible employers and where? I feel like a cover letter is the best spot, but I’m not sure how to frame it as a positive.

[For anyone who can’t read the article: The letter-writer was an ecological director at a scout camp,  found an injured bald eagle in bad condition, texted her boss for permission to call wildlife services or transport the bird herself, and was told no and that she could be fired for doing it. She called  the local Wildlife Center anyway and, following their advice, carefully transported the bird there for care. When she returned to work, her boss berated her and fired her for insubordination.]

First, kudos to you for what you did. I don’t think this article is anything to worry about at all — you come across sympathetically and while some people might side with your old employer, plenty more will side with you, or at least not be terribly concerned by it. A lot of people in your shoes would choose to help a suffering animal (and that’s a good thing), and it’s not the kind of disregard for instructions that’s likely to translate into most office jobs, where you won’t typically be running into injured animals.

You don’t need to address this in your cover letter at all! It might come up in an interview, at which point you can answer questions about it, but it’s very unlikely that an employer would see this and choose not to interview you because of it. As for explaining it if you’re asked about it, you can say something very simple like, “I felt strongly that it was the right thing to do, and that Scout law backed that up.”

2018

4. My sister might apply for a job in my two-person department

I’ve got a dilemma and I feel like I can’t be objective. My mid-sized company is hiring another person with my job title due to company growth. My sister is considering applying. She has the same (really rare) degree I have, from the same school, but had always been more interested in another focus within our degree. At first when the topic came up, she wasn’t interested but now she is after weighing things out. To be clear, neither of us would be managing each other and we would be working on separate projects. My problem is that we would be the only two people in my department. My sister just graduated and needs more job experience, and a little more confidence her work (she is very talented), which she may find here. We wouldn’t be the only ones who have relatives here at work. One salesperson had a sister here for the summer, and we have a mother and son pairing who are in different departments.

We worked together last summer at my company on the same project, but with different but similar roles. The project was a mess due to poor planning, a short deadline, and the inexperience of the salesperson who was handling it. My sister feels miffed that a chunk of her work wasn’t used, but in all honesty, this salesperson wasn’t willing to try to clearly communicate with us and the client and that affected the outcome. I did explain to my sister that was the case, and I often do work that isn’t used and it’s just part of this industry. To be fair, my sister and I worked well together. My manager has also asked about how her schooling has gone and when she graduates, so I do not think he’s opposed to the idea as he has hinted that he would consider hiring her after graduation.

I do have some influence in the hiring decision, and it was always going to be someone from my alma mater in the first place. Now I feel very conflicted because A) if she doesn’t get the job I will feel guilty and B) if she does, I don’t want the perceptions of her work output (good or bad) to be tied to mine. I don’t feel like I can tell her not to apply either. I don’t know what to do. Please help!

I don’t think you should work in a two-person department that will just be you and your sister. That’s not like having a relative in another department. It’s much more fraught with the potential for all sorts of complications. For example: what would happen if your sister’s work wasn’t great and if you felt pressured (either by her or yourself) to cover for her? Or if you got tainted by association, or if there were problems that you could resolve with a coworker that will be harder when it’s your sister, or if there’s competition for projects or other rewards/recognition, or if your sister has a problem with someone else (would you feel obligated to take on her beef as your beef, or would she by annoyed if you didn’t), or if you feel like you’re not able to escape each other, and so much more?

It’s just an awful lot of complications and potential for problems. Since this isn’t the only possible job out there for her, it’s hard to see a compelling argument in favor of doing it.

2016

updates: the “mom energy,” going to a conference with a cold, and more

It’s “where are you now?” month at Ask a Manager, and all December I’m running updates from people who had their letters here answered in the past. Here are four updates from past letter-writers.

1. How do I avoid “mom energy” with my younger employees? (first update)

Mini Annie update:

Annie accepted our offer of severance and asked if she could say goodbye to our team, so I set up a Teams meeting for the five of us.

She legit gazed sweetly into the camera and said, “It’s been a pleasure working with some of you.”

2. Going to a conference with a cold (#3 at the link)

You published my question a couple weeks after I sent it in, so by that time, the conference had come and gone. I had arranged with the conference organizers to get a room for myself so as not to spread my cold to my roommate or to keep her up with my congested tossing and turning, and had planned on wearing a KN95 mask the rest of the time. Unfortunately, I started feeling much worse in the middle of the night before the morning I was supposed to leave, so I ended up staying home that weekend. I’m glad I did, because I felt, looked, and sounded terrible that weekend and would have been in no position to network, learn, or socialize.

There was a lot of discourse in the comments. As to whether what I had was Covid, both my partner and I tested negative multiple times all throughout our respective illnesses, so we’re pretty confident it was just a cold. I still didn’t want to spread “just a cold” to anyone, hence the precautions I was going to take at the conference, but if there was reason to believe it was actually Covid, I wouldn’t have even considered trying to go.

As to the concept of sharing a hotel room with a stranger, people were truly horrified. It was a worker’s side labor law conference, and most of the attendees (myself included) were law students who were recipients of the organization’s labor law summer fellowship. If you’re deep enough into the workers’ rights legal world to attend the conference, you probably already know that you’re never going to be wealthy or have the sort of resources of a lot of fancy law firms or big, powerful corporations, so sharing rooms wasn’t a surprise. Plus, we’re all students and that’s just sort of how it is a lot of the time. (In college, I was heavily involved in a political organization that had its annual conference in D.C. My senior year, I was on the national student board, and they put all eight of us board members, of mixed genders, in one tiny hostel style room with bunk beds while other attendees got put in hotels. So in comparison, sharing a room with one other person in a reputable hotel didn’t seem so bad.) A month or two leading up to the conference, we had the opportunity to select a single room, but we had to pay the difference between the cost of the single and the double room. At the time, I had no idea I’d be sick, so I didn’t feel like paying extra for a room to myself, so I declined the offer.

So anyway, it was a bummer to miss the conference, but at least I didn’t spread my germs to anyone there. Thanks for the advice, Alison, and thank you to the commentariat for keeping me well entertained on publication day!

3. How do I come to terms with giving up on my dream job?

I appreciated all the answers, and it was really helpful to read and consider when thinking about my job. I actually ended up leaving the position I wrote in about for unrelated reasons and have moved to a similar position at a university! It’s been about four months, and I’m loving it. Working at a university gives me the ability to access and participate in academic discussions related to my “dream job” (and importantly, get paid a livable salary!). It’s still not what I imagined myself doing when I was in college/graduate school, but it’s something that I now can see myself doing for the foreseeable future. As an added bonus, the university I’m working at has great tuition benefits that I’m looking forward to taking advantage of.

The commenters on my original post really helped me to re-evaluate what “dream job” means, and the ways that I can still engage with the field I trained in and love AND keep it separate from my work life. Extra-special thanks to commenter Les, whose comment I remind myself of sometimes.

Thanks again to everyone (and to this blog … it’s been great to read while I navigate the beginning of a career).

4. The winner of the bad interview answer question from 2009

Hey, remember when you ran a contest 14 years ago for the best answer to the “If you were an animal, what kind of animal would you be and why?” interview question, and someone won with an answer about E. Coli?

It was me! And I still have the floor lamp I got! It only kinda goes with the furniture I have now. And it got broken somehow in an interstate move a few years ago and doesn’t turn on anymore. But I don’t care. I love it and I’m never getting rid of it. In a way, it’s the first time I ever got paid to write.

Unfortunately, the company that supplied the prize, CSN Office Furniture, appears to be out of business. Double unfortunately, my hours just got cut in half at my job, and my spouse was laid off two months ago. Worst of all, no one has ever asked me in an interview about what kind of animal I would be and why. So I don’t have a victorious story about how being funny and clever about intestinal bacteria has led me to personal fulfillment, financial stability, and the respect of my peers.

But I still have my Ask A Manager lamp, and a great story for parties.